DIYAPASON-L Digest #484 - Sunday, January 6, 2002
 
Re: Changing Bourdon Cutups
  by <Jess4203@aol.com>
Re: Pipe Cleaning
  by <Jess4203@aol.com>
test
  by "Daniel Hopkins" <danielwh1@ns.sympatico.ca>
My Update
  by "Daniel Hopkins" <danielwh1@ns.sympatico.ca>
Pipe Cleaning & painting tips.
  by "The Schneider Family" <arpschneider@starband.net>
Changing Bourdon Cutups
  by "The Schneider Family" <arpschneider@starband.net>
Wooden pipes upper lip lowering
  by "Pieter Smit" <pieter@cadence-engineering.co.za>
Cleaning Ivory Keys
  by "F. Richard Burt" <dorian.organs@verizon.net>
Re: [Residence Organs]  Re: Pipe Cleaning
  by <GRSCoLVR@aol.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Changing Bourdon Cutups From: <Jess4203@aol.com> Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2002 12:20:52 EST   Hi Group:   On 1/5/02, Richard Schneider wrote that changing cutup would increase the = overtones, lower the possible wind pressure and possibly provide "chiff." = He also noted that this might not be desirable in the bass octave, but = might be charming in the treble. (I'm paraphrasing here because I'm = having trouble with cut and paste on this computer).   My Bourdon has mouths that are arched in all but the lowest three or four = pipes, and the cutup is about 1:2. It is a 16-8-4-2 affair. The = fundamental in the bass is quite satisfying and I wouldn't want to lose = it. However, I wouldn't mind a keener sound (more overtones, a little = more definiteness in pitch). In the treble the sound is very hollow, and = I might want to change that when I get the whole thing playing. I am not = sure about the chiff, I find it charming, but I'm told flutes are useful = for running passagework and I wouldn't want to lose the ability to do = that. I suppose just a little chiff would help delineate it, though. . .   Anyway, I get the idea that what is being suggested by Richard's post is a = bit of "variable scaling," at least as far as the cutup is concerned, = higher in the bass and lower in at least parts of the treble. Does this = sound right to anybody? Also, does anyone have a good way of = experimenting with lowering the cutup without having to carve permanent = lips or drill holes? Seems I've heard of using thick card stock glued on.   TIA, Roy Kersey In Knoxville, where it's snowing!  
(back) Subject: Re: Pipe Cleaning From: <Jess4203@aol.com> Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2002 12:31:24 EST   Hi again, pipers:   I have read Al Sefl's posts on pipe cleaning and Richard's mesage of = today. I have about 20 of what appear to be original Haskelled Estey = pipes (they have the patent date stamped on them and are marked either = "Oboe" or "Dul.")and they have been painted with silver paint. I am = guessing that they are a high lead content alloy that would look rather = dull if clean. Al's message indicated that his pipe cleaning method only = works on unpainted pipes --- I would have to use paint stripper first. = Richard, does using your method mean no need for stripping first (I'm = guessing no such luck)? I have thought about not cleaning the exterior of = these pipes and just painting and stenciling them instead. I would really = rather au naturel if possible, but don't want something ugly and I don't = relish all that stripping either. Opinions?   Thanks again, Roy Kersey It's still snowing here!  
(back) Subject: test From: "Daniel Hopkins" <danielwh1@ns.sympatico.ca> Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2002 13:59:22 -0400   I am having real problems getting my email set up. I have formatted my = com Hopefully the email will work now Daniel      
(back) Subject: My Update From: "Daniel Hopkins" <danielwh1@ns.sympatico.ca> Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2002 14:19:23 -0400   Anyways, Now that I see my email is working again. I will update you on = what I did this week. I went to Lunenburg earlier thsi week. There isnt much difference in the = scene other than it is cleaned up some and the walls of the church have been stabelized.THe coccoon supposed to = arrive thsi week to protect what is left standing from the elements.I was to the Church office and had a nice chat = with the Secretary. They are very pleased that we have taken such an interest in them with the determination = to get a Pipe Organ. They will settle with nothing other then the real thing. once the time comes to think of = such a thing. they need all the encouragement they can get. P.S. I am having a few pictures scanned of the church in its former Glory. One = of the exterior and one of the interior. To anyone who is interested please let me know . I will email them to = anyone who may want them. It will be sometime within the next week   Hope you all had a good Holiday season .     Danielwh        
(back) Subject: Pipe Cleaning & painting tips. From: "The Schneider Family" <arpschneider@starband.net> Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2002 13:07:31 -0600   Jess4203@aol.com wrote: > Hi again, pipers: > I have read Al Sefl's posts on pipe cleaning and Richard's mesage of > = today. I have about 20 of what appear to be original Haskelled Estey > = pipes (they have the patent date stamped on them and are marked either > = "Oboe" or "Dul.")and they have been painted with silver paint.   > I am guessing that they are a high lead content alloy that would look > = rather dull if clean.   Most likely, if they're Estey Haskells, they're zinc pipes.   Al's message indicated that his pipe cleaning method only works on unpainted pipes --- I would have to use paint stripper first. Richard, does using your method mean no need for stripping first (I'm guessing no such luck)?   My method is really meant for spotted metal, Hoyt metal (tin-plated common metal) or common metal (20% tin; rest lead) pipes.   For Zinc, all we do is take them down the soak tank and wash them with Brillo pads.   > I have thought about not cleaning the exterior of these pipes and just > = painting and stenciling them instead. I would really rather au > naturel = if possible, but don't want something ugly and I don't relish > all that = stripping either. Opinions?   Try washing them with Brillo pads and very likely, most of the paint will come off, especially if it's a poorly-done job. Estey didn't paint their zincs, although some builders did. Otherwise, if you're going to re-paint them anyway, just sand them down with 220 grit sandpaper and then wipe them down with automotive pre-paint cleaner, such as DuPont's "Prep-Sol". This gets rid of the surface contamination that makes it hard for paint to properly adhere to the pipes.   You can get a nice silver pipe lacquer from OSI and after properly prepping the pipes described above, can paint them. I've also used chrome-silver spray aerosols for bad appearing zinc pipes. Just take your time and don't expect the first coat to cover all, because it can't. Otherwise, if you apply it too heavily, you'll get runs.   The BIG secret is: PREPARATION! If there is any pipe metal, such as upper and lower lips or toes, we mask them off and don't paint those, but polish them up instead. If they were painted before, clean them off and polish them up instead. Makes the finished product look much more professional.   Stenciling is a waste of time, unless these pipes are in the facade.   Faithfully, Richard Schneider, PRES/CEO SCHNEIDER PIPE ORGANS, Inc. Pipe Organ Builders 41-43 Johnston St./P.O. Box 137 Kenney, IL 61749-0137 (217) 944-2454 VOX (217) 944-2527 FAX mailto:arpschneider@starband.net HOME EMAIL mailto:arp@schneiderpipeorgans.com SHOP EMAIL http://www.schneiderpipeorgans.com WEB PAGE URL  
(back) Subject: Changing Bourdon Cutups From: "The Schneider Family" <arpschneider@starband.net> Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2002 13:23:10 -0600   Jess4203@aol.com wrote: > Hi Group: > On 1/5/02, Richard Schneider wrote that changing cutup would increase = the overtones, lower the possible wind pressure and possibly provide = "chiff." He also noted that this might not be desirable in the bass = octave, but might be charming in the treble. (I'm paraphrasing here = because I'm having trouble with cut and paste on this computer).   Essentially, that's what I was saying. > My Bourdon has mouths that are arched in all but the lowest three or = four pipes, and the cutup is about 1:2. It is a 16-8-4-2 affair. The = fundamental in the bass is quite satisfying and I wouldn't want to lose = it. However, I wouldn't mind a keener sound (more overtones, a little = more definiteness in pitch). In the treble the sound is very hollow, and = I might want to change that when I get the whole thing playing. I am not = sure about the chiff, I find it charming, but I'm told flutes are useful = for running passagework and I wouldn't want to lose the ability to do = that. I suppose just a little chiff would help delineate it, though. . .   Enunciation (read: "chiff) is more controlled by the amount of nicking rather than cut-ups. You can "experiment" with this by using wax to fill in the nicks and if you don't like the results, carefully remove it again with an X-acto knife. > Anyway, I get the idea that what is being suggested by Richard's post is = a bit of "variable scaling," at least as far as the cutup is concerned, = higher in the bass and lower in at least parts of the treble. Does this = sound right to anybody? Also, does anyone have a good way of = experimenting with lowering the cutup without having to carve permanent = lips or drill holes? Seems I've heard of using thick card stock glued on.   More accurately: variable cut-ups! And you can use (as I think I suggested in that post!) pieces of spotted pipe metal glued on, rather than cardboard. For one thing, the metal gives much needed ability to adjust the upper lip so that it is in plane with the Wind-sheet emanating from the Windway for correct speech, because that's about the only way you have to adjust the speech on such a pipe! You can't do that with cardboard! If you find the cut-up is too low, you can always cut it up a little bit with that same X-acto knife, and if you REALLY don't like the results, then simply remove them and revert to where you were before.   We use an adhesive called "E-6000" to attach the Pipe Metal. It's also available under the brand name of GOOP in squeeze tubes and is about the most excellent adhesive for this purpose.   Hope this helps!   Faithfully,   Richard Schneider, PRES/CEO SCHNEIDER PIPE ORGANS, Inc. Pipe Organ Builders 41-43 Johnston St./P.O. Box 137 Kenney, IL 61749-0137 (217) 944-2454 VOX (217) 944-2527 FAX mailto:arpschneider@starband.net HOME EMAIL mailto:arp@schneiderpipeorgans.com SHOP EMAIL http://www.schneiderpipeorgans.com WEB PAGE URL  
(back) Subject: Wooden pipes upper lip lowering From: "Pieter Smit" <pieter@cadence-engineering.co.za> Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2002 22:08:35 +0200   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0022_01C196FE.AFB32F60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   Hi,   A neat way of lowering the upper lip of wooden pipes is to use copper or = =3D brass sheet (even shimstock - but then anneal it by heating it to =3D red-hot and dumping in cold water to remove the springyness so that it =3D can be manipulated in voicing the pipes). It is cut to size and =3D polished. Hydrochloric acid (pool acid) can remove the heating marks if = =3D desired. A coat with clear lacquer prevents oxidation. It is secured =3D to the upper lip with brass screws if the wood is thick enough as in the = =3D lower octaves. It can look very neat if done properly and need not =3D degrade the artisanship of the rank.   If desired, the sheet can be fitted to the inside of the pipes so that = =3D only the downdrop is visible, but then small countersink bolts with nuts = =3D on the inside is used. The upper lip can be very thin in the upper =3D octaves, but for them the sheet can be fixed further above the mouth =3D cutout area. This is not recommeded for the lower octave as the sheet = =3D can then vibrate. The sheet can also be glued to the wood - epoxy =3D works well but then the process is not reversible !   Another way is to cut out the upper lip completely and to insert a new =3D wooden upper lip cut exactly to size. It can also look very good, even = =3D if made from another type of wood.   Pieter Smit.   pieter@cadence-engineering.co.za   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0022_01C196FE.AFB32F60 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type content=3D3D"text/html; =3D charset=3D3Diso-8859-1"> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 5.50.4912.300" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>Hi,</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>A neat way of lowering the upper lip = of =3D wooden=3D20 pipes is to use copper or brass sheet (even shimstock - but then anneal = =3D it by=3D20 heating it to red-hot and dumping in cold water to remove the =3D springyness so=3D20 that it can be manipulated in voicing the pipes).&nbsp;&nbsp; It is cut = =3D to size=3D20 and&nbsp;polished. Hydrochloric acid (pool acid) can remove the heating = =3D marks if=3D20 desired.&nbsp; A&nbsp;coat with clear lacquer prevents oxidation.&nbsp; = =3D It is=3D20 secured to the upper lip with brass screws if the wood is thick enough =3D as in the=3D20 lower octaves.&nbsp;&nbsp; It can look very neat if done properly and =3D need not=3D20 degrade the artisanship of the rank.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>&nbsp;If desired, the sheet can be = =3D fitted to the=3D20 inside of the pipes so that only the downdrop is visible, but then=3D20 small&nbsp;countersink bolts&nbsp;with nuts on the inside is=3D20 used.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;The upper lip can be very thin in the upper =3D octaves, but=3D20 for them the sheet can be fixed further above the mouth cutout =3D area.&nbsp;&nbsp;=3D20 This is not recommeded for the lower octave as the sheet can then=3D20 vibrate.&nbsp;&nbsp; The sheet&nbsp;can also be glued to the wood - =3D epoxy works=3D20 well but then the process is not reversible !</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>Another way is to cut out the upper = lip =3D completely=3D20 and to insert a new wooden upper lip cut exactly to size.&nbsp;&nbsp; It = =3D can=3D20 also look very good, even if made from another type of =3D wood.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>Pieter Smit.<BR><BR><A=3D20 href=3D3D"mailto:pieter@cadence-engineering.co.za">pieter@cadence-engineeri= =3D ng.co.za</A></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0022_01C196FE.AFB32F60--    
(back) Subject: Cleaning Ivory Keys From: "F. Richard Burt" <dorian.organs@verizon.net> Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2002 15:47:28 -0600   Good afternoon, Listers: While we are talking about cleaning, I have gone blind and can't find any information from previous listings about cleaning ivory keys. I have a three-manual Schantz console (ca. 1966-ish) that I am rebuilding with a new control system. The old ivory keys are just a bit on the yellow side. I have heard that we should not try to bleach them. The results supposedly are unpredictable. Using a damp cloth, I went over them about six months ago until they were clean. The keys now appear to be grimy again. Some of that may be from shop dust, but the grease component is unexplainable. Am I correct in assuming that the next step should be a mild solution of soap and water or detergent and water? Is there something better that won't harm the ivory? Does ivory like being covered with "lotion, polish, or cleaners that leave a shine?" Would like to hear what you think. Appreciatively, F. Richard Burt ..  
(back) Subject: Re: [Residence Organs] Re: Pipe Cleaning From: <GRSCoLVR@aol.com> Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2002 18:19:21 EST   Roy---- My haskelled Oboe pipes and the Dulciana pipes (lower octaves) that came with my 1928 Estey organ are anything but strongly lead flavored = pipes,,they are Zinc. as are the Haskell tubes that are in them.... However,,the upper =   pitch pipes are common pipe metal in both cases. ---Roc