PipeChat Digest #73 - Tuesday, September 16, 1997
 
Memorable First Service Playing Experience
  by Jim Zimmerman <zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu>
Memorable First Service Playing Experience
  by <Roy.Gutfinski@ptbbs.dhs.state.me.us>
Re: This is my first posting.. -Reply
  by <SCoonrod@aol.com>
Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist)
  by <SCoonrod@aol.com>
Wedding Music - HELP
  by KARL W KELLER <kwkeller@juno.com>
Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist
  by <Roy.Gutfinski@ptbbs.dhs.state.me.us>
Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist)
  by John L. Speller <jlspeller@stlnet.com>
Re: Conn electronic pipes and other speakers
  by Otto Pebworth <opebwrth@gte.net>
Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist)
  by <Lewwill@aol.com>
Re: First Posting
  by bruce cornely <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: Hymn Festival
  by <KeithBWill@aol.com>
Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist)
  by Shirley <pnst@itw.com>
Re: Hymn Festival
  by <KeithBWill@aol.com>
Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist)
  by Sheridan Mascall <sheridan.mascall@visionet.com.au>
Re: Wedding Music - HELP
  by Sheridan Mascall <sheridan.mascall@visionet.com.au>
Re: Wedding Music - HELP
  by <Lewwill@aol.com>
Re: This is my first posting.. -Reply
  by bruce cornely <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re:your wheezy WICKS
  by Paul F. Stapel <pstapel@spectra.net>
Alex. Fiseisky, Russian organist
  by Stanley E Yoder <syoder+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist)
  by bruce cornely <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: Wedding Music - HELP
  by Patricia R. Maimone <patmai@juno.com>
Sneezing at the Console
  by <rnickel@itol.com>
Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist)
  by Ken <mewzishn@spec.net>
Re: Alex. Fiseisky, Russian organist
  by <DudelK@aol.com>
Re: This is my first posting.
  by Tom Jones <tomj@netpath.net>
 


(back) Subject: Memorable First Service Playing Experience From: Jim Zimmerman <zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu> Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:31:12 -0500   Jane Cane writes: >My mother reported afterward that the minister had been standing silently >in the pulpit, waiting for latecomers to seat themselves. I was a nervous >wreck. I'll never forget it. Anyone else have memorable first services? >   Although it wasn't my first whole service playing experience, my first prelude experience was very memorable. I played the prelude at our Maundy Thursday service last spring. It was just a 20 minute long hymn medley made up of the Passiontide hymns with some other goodies thrown in. It went off without a hitch and I played everything well and note-perfect. After I was done with the prelude, I went out and sat down with the rest of the congregation and our regular organist took over. A few minutes after I sat down, somebody came over to me and said that my mother was seated in the back of the church and had been there for the whole prelude. Folks, my jaw dropped at that point. I came in through another door and didn't see her. My mother has been bedfast in a nursing home for 16 years with very advanced Multiple Sclerosis. She had been an organist practically all her adult life until MS ended her career as an organist. She and the nursing home staff arranged to get her to church in order to surprise me. It was certainly a surprise and one of those evenings that I and she will never forget.     ** Jim Zimmerman zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu **    
(back) Subject: Memorable First Service Playing Experience From: Roy.Gutfinski@ptbbs.dhs.state.me.us Date: 15 Sep 1997 18:20:44 EDT   PI>Jane Cane writes: PI>>My mother reported afterward that the minister had been standing silently PI>>in the pulpit, waiting for latecomers to seat themselves. I was a nervous PI>>wreck. I'll never forget it. Anyone else have memorable first services? PI>>   PI>Although it wasn't my first whole service playing experience, my first PI>prelude experience was very memorable. I played the prelude at our Maundy PI>Thursday service last spring. It was just a 20 minute long hymn medley PI>made up of the Passiontide hymns with some other goodies thrown in. It PI>went off without a hitch and I played everything well and note-perfect. PI>After I was done with the prelude, I went out and sat down with the rest of PI>the congregation and our regular organist took over. A few minutes after I PI>sat down, somebody came over to me and said that my mother was seated in PI>the back of the church and had been there for the whole prelude. Folks, my PI>jaw dropped at that point. I came in through another door and didn't see PI>her. My mother has been bedfast in a nursing home for 16 years with very PI>advanced Multiple Sclerosis. She had been an organist practically all her PI>adult life until MS ended her career as an organist. She and the nursing PI>home staff arranged to get her to church in order to surprise me. It was PI>certainly a surprise and one of those evenings that I and she will never PI>forget.     PI>** Jim Zimmerman zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu **     PI>"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PI>PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics PI>HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org PI>List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org PI>Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org PI>Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org   Hi Jim,   The experience you relate when your mother came in to hear the prelude was one of the nicest stories I've heard in a long time. I would wonder which of you was prouder that day. Your mother of you or you of your mother? Bet it was pretty much even.   Stories like that we need more of to replace complaints, criticism, etc.   Roy Gutfinski Organist, St. Joseph's Catholic Church Gardiner, Maine  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. -Reply From: SCoonrod@aol.com Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 20:01:04 -0400 (EDT)   What kind of voicing/adjustments Bruce?? I am interested.....   RandyT  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist) From: SCoonrod@aol.com Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 20:06:20 -0400 (EDT)   In a message dated 97-09-15 15:14:21 EDT, zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu writes:   > I've always wondered what the rest of you do if you feel a > sneeze coming on while you're playing? Do you just cut loose all over the > console? <BG>     Sneeze while playing by all means :-)  
(back) Subject: Wedding Music - HELP From: kwkeller@juno.com (KARL W KELLER) Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 20:08:51 EDT   Hi Chatters,   I am sure someone on the List can help me. My daughter is being married in November and would like to have the processional the same as was used for the Royal Wedding of Princess Diana and Charles. It is my belief that this was "Trumpet Voluntary in D" by Henry Purcell but I have a recording of wedding music by Virgil Fox in which he plays "Trumpet Voluntary in D" composed by H. Purcell or his younger brother Daniel Purcell. This is the same music which I identify with "Trumpet Tune" by J. Clarke. I hope one of our distinguished church organists can help us out.   The music chosen so far is:   "Riguadon" by Campra for the procession of the brides attendants "Trumpet Voluntary in D" by Purcell (?) when the bride and I take the long walk "Jesu, Joy of Man's Desiring" by Bach as a flute solo "O Perfect Love" by Barnby as a soprano solo "Allegro Maestoso" from Handel's "Water Music" as the recessional "Through the Years" by Youmans ( trying to work this in as a soprano solo with flute)   Any comments ( pro or con ) will be appreciated.   Thanks.   Karl   Musica est Dei donum optimi  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist From: Roy.Gutfinski@ptbbs.dhs.state.me.us Date: 15 Sep 1997 20:24:08 EDT   PI>In a message dated 97-09-15 15:14:21 EDT, zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu writes:   PI>> I've always wondered what the rest of you do if you feel a PI>> sneeze coming on while you're playing? Do you just cut loose all over th PI>> console? <BG>     PI>Sneeze while playing by all means :-)   PI>"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PI>PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics PI>HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org PI>List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org PI>Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org PI>Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org   Hit the sforzando or tutti toe stud just before you sneeze and go into a little (BIG) improvisation. They'll never know the difference (or what hit them!!!).  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist) From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@stlnet.com> Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 19:30:34 -0500 (CDT)   At 08:06 PM 9/15/97 -0400, S. Coonrod wrote: >In a message dated 97-09-15 15:14:21 EDT, zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu writes: > >> I've always wondered what the rest of you do if you feel a >> sneeze coming on while you're playing? Do you just cut loose all over the >> console? <BG> > > >Sneeze while playing by all means :-)   Like trills and other ornaments, good sneezes should be rhythmic and consistent. Olivier Messiaen was, of course, particularly noted for having had a Vision while Sneezing in Church, his "Apparition de l'Eglise Eternuelle" :-)   John    
(back) Subject: Re: Conn electronic pipes and other speakers From: Otto Pebworth <opebwrth@gte.net> Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 20:38:52 -0500   I believe that the the box "pistons" are fired by MIDI, also (was playing a large 3-manual Galanti with the box, and was changing settings all over the place)  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist) From: Lewwill@aol.com Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:18:38 -0400 (EDT)   Hey John -- When you feel a sneeze coming, just bite your upper lip really hard. This is quite good at distracting the sneeze reflex -- to say nothing of the concentration on what you're playing or reading at the moment.   Been there . . . blew that.  
(back) Subject: Re: First Posting From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:20:10 -0400   Rick, I don't remember you telling your age; but there are different levels of membership in AGO for students, senior citizens, etc. Don't let the amount scare you. Also. if the money is a problem for membership, check with your chapter regarding scholarship type assistance.   Bruce Cornely, organist (OHS & AGO) University United Methodist Church and Student Center Wicks ('56) 3/16r Gainesville Florida Dean, Gainesville Chapter AGO  
(back) Subject: Re: Hymn Festival From: KeithBWill@aol.com Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:48:00 -0400 (EDT)   Please send your "Nicene Carol Service." I have an Easter Lessons and Carols service if you are interested.   Keith Williams (St. Paul's Church in Troy) 38 Columbia Ave Nassau NY 12123  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist) From: Shirley <pnst@itw.com> Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:08:25   At 20:06 09/15/97 -0400, you wrote: >In a message dated 97-09-15 15:14:21 EDT, zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu writes: > >> I've always wondered what the rest of you do if you feel a >> sneeze coming on while you're playing? Do you just cut loose all over the >> console? <BG> > > >Sneeze while playing by all means :-)   ....but just be sure it's on pitch, in the correct rhythm, and in a loud section of the music. :) Nothing like a unique percussive effect! :D   --Shirley    
(back) Subject: Re: Hymn Festival From: KeithBWill@aol.com Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:49:06 -0400 (EDT)   Please send your "Nicene Carol Service." I have an Easter Lessons and Carols service if you are interested.   Keith Williams (St. Paul's Church in Troy) 38 Columbia Ave Nassau NY 12123  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist) From: sheridan.mascall@visionet.com.au (Sheridan Mascall) Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 11:49:08 +1000   John L. Speller wrote: > > At 08:06 PM 9/15/97 -0400, S. Coonrod wrote: > >In a message dated 97-09-15 15:14:21 EDT, zimmerman@chem.purdue.edu writes: > > > >> I've always wondered what the rest of you do if you feel a > >> sneeze coming on while you're playing? Do you just cut loose all over the > >> console? <BG> > > > > > >Sneeze while playing by all means :-) > > Like trills and other ornaments, good sneezes should be rhythmic and > consistent. Olivier Messiaen was, of course, particularly noted for having > had a Vision while Sneezing in Church, his "Apparition de l'Eglise > Eternuelle" :-) > > John > Goodness me, don't we go strange places and still manage to remain organ-ically relevant! :)   I'm glad to say I have never actually sneezed whilst in a service, but I have occasionally been surprised by a sneeze whilst rehearsing. It's good practice - and I now know that if I Do sneeze, I can keep playing without missing a beat.   However the question comes to mind - does a really wet sneeze rust out an electronic organ???   ~S~  
(back) Subject: Re: Wedding Music - HELP From: sheridan.mascall@visionet.com.au (Sheridan Mascall) Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 11:54:16 +1000   KARL W KELLER wrote: > > Hi Chatters, > > I am sure someone on the List can help me. My daughter is being married > in November and would like to have the processional the same as was used > for the Royal Wedding of Princess Diana and Charles. It is my belief > that this was "Trumpet Voluntary in D" by Henry Purcell but I have a > recording of wedding music by Virgil Fox in which he plays "Trumpet > Voluntary in D" composed by H. Purcell or his younger brother Daniel > Purcell. This is the same music which I identify with "Trumpet Tune" by > J. Clarke. I hope one of our distinguished church organists can help us > out. > > The music chosen so far is: > > "Riguadon" by Campra for the procession of the brides attendants > "Trumpet Voluntary in D" by Purcell (?) when the bride and I take the > long walk > "Jesu, Joy of Man's Desiring" by Bach as a flute solo > "O Perfect Love" by Barnby as a soprano solo > "Allegro Maestoso" from Handel's "Water Music" as the recessional > "Through the Years" by Youmans ( trying to work this in as a soprano solo > with flute) > > Any comments ( pro or con ) will be appreciated. > > Thanks. > > Karl > > Musica est Dei donum optimi > >   Karl!! How ya gunna walk down the aisle AND play???   Don't tell me you're getting a sub to play for your daughter's wedding?   ~Sheridan~  
(back) Subject: Re: Wedding Music - HELP From: Lewwill@aol.com Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:11:55 -0400 (EDT)   The Trumpet Voluntary attributed to Purcell has been more recently authenticated to Jerimiah Clarke. It is frequently referred to as being by either composer, but the Purcell item is usually called Trumpet Tune and Air, rather than just voluntary.  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. -Reply From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:21:17 -0400   The organ suffers from gross unification which has left the chorus deficient in the middle.   The Great is fine with an 8 4 2-2/3 2 straight Diapason chorus The Choir was five 8' stops: Harmonic Flute 8 4, Viola, Gemshorn 8 4, Dolcan 8 4 2-2/3 2 1-3/5, Dolcan celeste tc. The H Flute & Gems also play on the Great at 8 & 4. The Swell was six stops: Geigen principal 8; Stopped Flute 16 (tc) 8 4; Gamba 8 4, Gamba celeste tc; Spitznazard 2-2/3 2; Trumpet 8 4 The Pedal has 16 Open from gr 8 (16 8 5-1/3) Bourdon 16; Lieblich Gedeckt 16 8 (sw); Bass Flute 8 (ch); cello 8 (sw)   The altered ranks are: spitznaszard : cut to 2' spitzflute Dolcan celeste : cut to 2 2/3 or 2 Gamba celeste : cut to 4 principal   The 2' spitzflute is now in the choir dolcan celeste holes and is a 4 Spitzflute (tc) which now provides an independent 4 for the choir The dolcan celeste will probably be cut to 2-2/3 and will replace the spitznazard & piccolo in the swell, or will be cut to 2 (depending upon how it sounds) The Gamba celeste will be cut to serve as a 4 principal (tc) in the swell providing an independent 4 for that division. I am considering scaling the cut gamba to place in the geigen rank, and moving the geigen pipes to 4. the geigen is unbelievable ugly and is less objectionabe at 4' -- but this needs to be tested.   I realize that tc 4' stops are not the most desirable, but it's better than nothing; the choir 4' has now been used for two choir rehearsals and two services, with very positive results. The altos can now hear their part!   The other tonal adjustment was lowering the cut-up on the Stopped Flute in the Swell to get rid of the "hooty" sound; it is now more of a firm Bourdon which blends much better with the string.   My original plan was to purchase used pipes for these changes so that the original configuration of the organ could be preserved (God knows why??). The sound of this organ is very close to ugly and is saved only by a very nice trumpet which provides nice English colour.   The revised stoplist will be: GREAT: 8 Open Diapason, 4 Octave, 2 2/3 Twelfth, 2 Fifteenth; Harmonic Flute 8 4 & Gemshorn 8 4 from Choir. CHOIR: 8 Harmonic Flute, Gemshorn, Viola, Dolcan, 4 Traverse Flute (ext), Gemshorn (ext), Spitzflute, 2 2/3 Dolcan, 2 Dolcan , 1 3/5 Dolcan SWELL: 16 Bourdon tc, 8 Geigen Principal, Stopped Flute, Gamba, 4 Principal tc, Flute d' amour (ext), Gambette (ext), 2 2/3 Nazard, 2 Piccolo; Trumpet 8 4 PEDAL: 16 Open Diapason (gr), Bourdon, Lieblich Gedeckt (sw); 8 Octave (gr), Bass Flute (ch), Flauto Dolce (sw), Cello (sw), 5 1/3 Quinte (gr), 16 Trombone (sw)   Then the whole business will be removed and replaced by a new or relocated tracker (probably new) since part of its function is to be a teaching organ. Our building is scheduled for renovation in a couple of years.   Hope you are still awake!!   bruce   Bruce Cornely, organist (OHS & AGO) University United Methodist Church and Student Center Wicks ('56) 3/16r Gainesville Florida Dean, Gainesville Chapter AGO  
(back) Subject: Re:your wheezy WICKS From: "Paul F. Stapel" <pstapel@spectra.net> Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:18:57 -0400   At 01:26 PM 9/14/97 -0500, you wrote: >I'm in St. Paul, MN at a small LCMS church. We have a very wheezy old Wicks. The poor old dear really needs some work. I haven't yet joined the AGO, planning to do that soon. Mond 9/15/97 Although WICKS instruments can get wheezy (old leathers, felts, etc, the probability is good that most of the Direct Electric valves are still working reasonably well -- could that be true?? You might want to contact your local WICKS rep about what the company can do to update and de-wheeze!! Ca;; 618 654 2191 and ask for Jack Jenkins, National Sales Director and a fine fellow organist.   Paul Stapel, Sales for WICKS in up-state NY 607 773 1495    
(back) Subject: Alex. Fiseisky, Russian organist From: Stanley E Yoder <syoder+@andrew.cmu.edu> Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:25:02 -0400 (EDT)   Has anyone heard this person play, either in concert or on disc? He apparently played in May this year at the DC National Cathedral. He has also concertized extensively in the UK, and has made a number of recordings. Private email for opinions. Thanks is advance.   Stan Yoder Pittsburgh  
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist) From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:25:24 -0400   Sneezing has only occurred once in my career (in spite of my terrible allergies) and fortunately it was during a hymn. I managed to stifle it until the end of a stanza, at which time I simply held the final chord with my right hand, covered my nose with my cotta using my left hand, and nearly blew my brains out . . . released the chord, and began the next stanza accompanied by much congregational chuckling (Episcopalians are so understanding!) I don't know what I would do now. We don't wear vestments.   Bruce Cornely, organist (OHS & AGO) University United Methodist Church and Student Center Wicks ('56) 3/16r Gainesville Florida Dean, Gainesville Chapter AGO  
(back) Subject: Re: Wedding Music - HELP From: patmai@juno.com (Patricia R. Maimone) Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:22:08 -0400   Dear Karl,   Best wishes on your daughter's wedding.   >I am sure someone on the List can help me. My daughter is being >married in November and would like to have the processional the same >as was used for the Royal Wedding of Princess Diana and Charles. It >is my belief that this was "Trumpet Voluntary in D" by Henry Purcell >but I have a recording of wedding music by Virgil Fox in which he >plays "Trumpet Voluntary in D" composed by H. Purcell or his younger >brother Daniel Purcell. This is the same music which I identify with >"Trumpet Tune" by J. Clarke. I hope one of our distinguished church >organists can help us out. For many years the famous tune in D with the melody numbers 1 2(with a trill)123 43 2 1 2 3 2 1 2 (lower octave - 5 5) (l. o. - 5) 1 2 (with a trill) 123 4 3 2 12 12 2 (with a trill) 1 1 was attributed to Henry Purcell. Thus it was listed on the Wedding Music recording by Virgil Fox.   However, scholars determined that the piece was indeed composed by Jeremiah Clarke, and known primarily as "The Prince of Denmark's March," although it is sometimes listed as "Trumpet Voluntary" by Jeremiah Clarke.   Hope that helps you sufficiently! >The music chosen so far is: > >"Rigaudon" (please note slight change in spelling for the program ;-) by Campra for the procession of the bride's attendants >"Prince of Denmark's March" by Clarke when the bride and I take the >long walk >"Jesu, Joy of Man's Desiring" by Bach as a flute solo >"O Perfect Love" by Barnby as a soprano solo >"Allegro Maestoso" from Handel's "Water Music" as the recessional Everything up to here sounds fine to me..   >"Through the Years" by Youmans ( trying to work this in as a soprano >solo with flute) This one I do not know.. It has not been requested in the hundreds of weddings which I have played since the first one in Teaneck, NJ, back in the late 1950's. What is the text?   Pat  
(back) Subject: Sneezing at the Console From: rnickel@itol.com Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:48:35 -0500 (CDT)   I also learned the hard way when I subbed two weeks ago to NEVER take an antihistamine before playing. The result was disastrous. I went brain-dead at the console and every note was a struggle at the early service. I was so well prepared, yet I played miserably until the drug effects wore off. I would have been better off sneezing. BTW, as a hay fever sufferer, I've always wondered what the rest of you do if you feel a sneeze coming on while you're playing? Do you just cut loose all over the console? <BG>   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I thought God always protected us from sneezing while playing. Hmm. I'm a hayfever sufferer, too, and I take Bromfed. It does not make me drowzy. Perhaps you could check into that for Sunday mornings.   >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I do, however, remember one very, VERY bad cold I had last winter. It was one of those where the sneezes would sneak up on you, and without a tissue or something (dish towel!!) available, the results could have been quite embarrassing ... anyway, I toted a box of tissues with me during the service. A friend of mine cracked up when she saw me climb on the bench and plop my box down next to me. Rule No. 1: Always be prepared.   Bob Nickel    
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting.. (Beginning Organist) From: Ken <mewzishn@spec.net> Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 23:47:43 +0000   Sheridan Mascall wrote:   > I'm glad to say I have never actually sneezed whilst in a service, but > I > have occasionally been surprised by a sneeze whilst rehearsing. It's > good practice - and I now know that if I Do sneeze, I can keep playing > > without missing a beat.   I've had nose bleeds spring up on me unexpectedly (like they're expected, Ken?); try pinching your nose closed and continue playing that hymn uninterrupted. It happened once in the middle of conducting the choir in a choral work from the console. They did a good job keeping together with the elbow kind of waving, sort of, and fortunately a member of the choir stepped over and turned pages. I don't often register things with the crescendo pedal, but it sure came in handy that day.   Ken Sybesma        
(back) Subject: Re: Alex. Fiseisky, Russian organist From: DudelK@aol.com Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 00:03:47 -0400 (EDT)   I don't remember seeing anything about him playing at the Big Top (Cath. Ch. of SS. Peter/Paul) but I believe he played within the last 2 or 3 years at Chevy Chase Presbyterian. Ken Lowenberg can probably provide details.      
(back) Subject: Re: This is my first posting. From: Tom Jones <tomj@netpath.net> Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 01:12:49 -0400   What Jane describes used to strike terror in my soul. It was one of the most nerve-wracking problems. My outlook has changed, however, and the prospect no longer bothers me. Now, I'd just stop playing when I reached the end of the prelude, and if the minister wasn't ready, they'd just have silence until he got ready. I mean, it's not background music. Stretching it out in some way would be just as perverse as asking the minister to preach awhile longer because I wasn't ready to play the offertory when he finished his sermon! I reached an all-around solution for my own church, though: While we were between ministers, I managed to institute the practice of ALL the worship leaders -- ministers, lay leaders, choir, organist -- going in together. When we hired a new minister (18 years ago now; I haven't been organist there during all this time, though), he cooperated with his new church's "custom," continuing it even after he reworked the order of service. So if the prelude is 8 minutes long, EVERYONE goes in about 9 minutes till. Since then, not only have we never had the service fail to start at the end of the prelude, but everyone coming in together gets the congregation's attention, too, and they stop talking and listen. Of course, if there's nothing but music in the service up through the first hymn (e.g., Prelude, Hymn; Prelude, Introit, Hymn), the problem takes care of itself: You can rest assured that the minister would get there by the time the hymn's finished. No minister would dare fail to!   Regards,   Tom Jones Organist/Choir Director Mebane Presbyterian Church, Mebane, N.C.