PipeChat Digest #267 - Monday, February 23, 1998
 
Pipes to digital connector
  by Richard Schneider <arpncorn@davesworld.net>
Re: Organ {Dead or Alive}
  by <MWORGLBAU@aol.com>
Re: Airport codes
  by <MWORGLBAU@aol.com>
Re:  Lenten Prelude
  by John L. Speller <jlspeller@stlnet.com>
Airports & Acoustics
  by <danbel@earthlink.net>
Re: Music Choice
  by <SCoonrod@aol.com>
Re: Pipes to digital connector
  by Emutek Systems, Inc. <sales@emutek.com>
Re: I Sing a Song (was Re: Lenten Prelude)
  by <wmcree@InfoAve.Net>
Re: I Sing a Song (was Re: Lenten Prelude)
  by <ComposerTX@aol.com>
Re: Funny hymn references
  by <ComposerTX@aol.com>
Good Acoustics
  by Judy A. Ollikkala <71431.2534@compuserve.com>
Re: Organ {Dead or Alive}
  by Russell Greene <russg@cyberspc.mb.ca>
Re: I Sing a Song (was Re: Lenten Prelude)
  by Jack R Hooton <jhooton@darientel.net>
Re: I Sing a Song (was Re: Lenten Prelude)
  by Vox Celeste <voxceleste@mailexcite.com>
Re: A position at last!
  by Douglas A. Campbell <dougcampbell@juno.com>
Re: ReRe:  The first Hammond Organ (thought to be)
  by Gordon Lucas & Larry McGuire <stops@globalnet.co.uk>
Theater Organ Recordings
  by Dick Beery <dbeery@rbbsystems.com>
Re: LENTEN POSTLUDE--Get This!
  by Mark Huth <mhuth@rodgers.rain.com>
Re: LENTEN POSTLUDE--Get This!
  by Stanley Lowkis <nstarfil@mediaone.net>
Re: Music Choice
  by Karl E. Moyer <kmoyer@marauder.millersv.edu>
Re: JUST BE GLAD YOU CAN PLAY, DARN IT!!!
  by Jason D. Comet <bombarde8@juno.com>
Re: Funny hymn references
  by bruce cornely <cremona84000@webtv.net>
 


(back) Subject: Pipes to digital connector From: Richard Schneider <arpncorn@davesworld.net> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:04:36 -0600   On Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:11:42 EST Ron <Ronnymn@aol.com> wrote:   > Briefly, I am purchasing a home soon to be constructed. There is a location > in the home that I can easily envison placing a pipe organ chest. I would > want it connected to my midi compatable electronic organ counsel.   <ahem, that's "Console">   While MIDI is great for interfacing organs to other instruments (and the other way around), most people doing pipe organs use one of three or four different proprietary systems. Each has its own wiring specifications, but in the final analysis, one can presume for one magnet per pipe, and thus one "analog" wire per magnet to control them.   The most "idiot-proof" way would be to have your electrician run 1" pvc conduit (with access to junction boxes left at all times from where you plan to put your pipes to where you plan for your console to take up real-estate. That way, your options are limitless within the parameters of the diameter of the conduit. One system, for instance, uses fiber-optic cables, while another one uses a 25-pair connectorized telephone cable, while still others use multiple pairs, so there are a lot of choices to contend-with.   Unless you already know what (or more accurately: who's) system you intend to use to control your pipe valves, this seems the best option to me.   Hope this helps   Faithfully,   "Arp", who's in Fort Worth, Tx tonight and heading for Louisiana tomorrow (in case anyone's really interested!)   P.S. With the departure of Jerrell Kautz with his Tuba and Tibia ranks, the truck is a LOT lighter now!      
(back) Subject: Re: Organ {Dead or Alive} From: MWORGLBAU@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 06:26:12 EST   Dear Robert and List,   "PS: I love this thread -- even though I'm not able to participate because I'm aeronautically challenged.   And the abbreviation would probably be SNO!"   Except SNO has not been assigned to any airport!     Michael R. Williamson Williamson-Warne & Associates Hollywood Ca. (Based out of BUR & VNY)  
(back) Subject: Re: Airport codes From: MWORGLBAU@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 06:26:17 EST   Dear Bruce and List,   "Thanks for the info Michael. Somehow I'll find a use for these. I remember when I first moved to Gainesville, there was an item on the news that a plane couldn't land because there were cows on the runway!"   You mean runways. Gainesville airport has 2 runways. I'll send you a .jpg personally of the airport diagram. Never-the-less, very amusing.   "Too bad there aren't some airports with nice organs in them. They generally have such good acoustics"   If memory serves me correct, that there was (and I'm not sure it is still there) a pipe organ located in the chapel at New York's JFK airport. I was speaking several years ago to an organ technician from Brooklyn who was talking about this organ in the JFK chapel. Don't remember what it was or how large it was, or if it is still there. Would be interested in finding out.     Michael R. Williamson Williamson-Warne & Associates Hollywood Ca.  
(back) Subject: Re: Lenten Prelude From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@stlnet.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 07:40:22 -0600 (CST)   At 10:30 PM 2/22/98 -0500, Judy Ollikkala wrote: >I understand from my three former choirboy sons that the line in "I Sing a >Song" gets twisted to a "fierce wild priest" when they sing it in church! >John Speller, what is the story of the grandfather and the bear?   My wife can always relate to the line "one was killed by a fierce wild beast" since her great-great-great-great-grandfather, the Rev. Findlay McNaughton, a Presbyterian missionary in upper New York state was killed by a bear in 1785. According to the written account left by his son, the Rev. John Findlay McNaughton, D.D., and handed down in the family, his father "had never seen a bear before and did not know they were dangerous."   John.      
(back) Subject: Airports & Acoustics From: danbel@earthlink.net Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 06:06:59 -0800 (PST)   Along this line,   >Too bad there aren't some airports with nice organs in them. They >generally have such good acoustics.   True! And then there is the upstairs mens room at Warnor's Theatre in Fresno. It almost has better acoustics than the auditorium! :) True!   Then there is the wonderful acoustic in LIU at Brooklyn!   djb    
(back) Subject: Re: Music Choice From: SCoonrod@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:14:15 EST   I found out by experience that you do need to be careful. I played the lovely slow movement from Hendemith's Sonata II one time (I do not consider it far out at all) and someone remarked on all of the dissonance. I have also found out that you can get away with more contemporary colorings if a familiar hymn- tune is sounding loud and clear in the musical texture. People need something they can "get their claws into," as one of my former profs. remarked, and this is so true. I also agree that if a selection is worth it if you repeat it often enough congregations will become more responsive.   RandyT  
(back) Subject: Re: Pipes to digital connector From: "Emutek Systems, Inc." <sales@emutek.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:10:53 -0000   Without wishing to be too forward, may I introduce my company, Emutek Systems, inc. We manufacture a pipe organ relay system that accepts MIDI inputs and only requires a simple power connection and communicationwire (twisted pair) wire to the pipe chambers. A few details of the systen are:   Our Relay Systems is based on distributed processing. Rather than one large cpu controlling everything, each of our driver boards has it's own cpu. This means that you can hot plug any driver board and the system will keep on running. There are three board types in the systems. Inputs boards have 128 inputs and the system supports 15 inputs boards. The Controller board handles combinational memory and general house keeping. Your configuration generated using free PC based software is downloaded to the controller. The output boards have 128 driver pins (common positive or negative) with up to 255 driver boards per system. The price of each board if $245.00. A minimal system if one of each. Also, the system comes complete with PC programming software, free initial setup and all connectors. The system also has as standard, reiterate, pizicato, sustenuto, transpose, indicator support, swell, crescendo, blind, reversible, bass/melody plus others.   Please call or email your street address so that I may send a more detailed info kit.   Thank you again,   Ulric Gordon-Lewis President.         ---------- > From: Ronnymn@aol.com > To: pipechat@pipechat.org > Subject: Pipes to digital connector > Date: Monday, February 23, 1998 12:11 AM > > Briefly, I am purchasing a home soon to be constructed. There is a location > in the home that I can easily envison placing a pipe organ chest. I would > want it connected to my midi compatable electronic organ counsel. I would > like to plan in advance, by having the contractor "wire" that place through > the walls to another location. My question. Is there a common enough "cable" > I could have them place that would be compatible with or easily adapted to and > what is it called? Or to be on the safe side are there two seperate types of > "umbilical cords" I should have placed just to be on the safe side?? tia > Ron > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >  
(back) Subject: Re: I Sing a Song (was Re: Lenten Prelude) From: wmcree@InfoAve.Net Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:06:07 -0500 (EST)       Along with Percy Dearmer's wonderful lyrics, another favorite in _The Hymnal 1940_ is Hymn 313, "We thank you Lord of Heaven" which gives thanks for, among other things, "dogs with friendly faces."   Bill McRee    
(back) Subject: Re: I Sing a Song (was Re: Lenten Prelude) From: ComposerTX@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:50:55 EST   Lesbia Scott WAS a male. Careful about your assumptions!  
(back) Subject: Re: Funny hymn references From: ComposerTX@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:52:29 EST   the hymn from which the text "Here I raise mine Ebenezer" is taken is "Come, Thou Fount of Every Blessing."  
(back) Subject: Good Acoustics From: "Judy A. Ollikkala" <71431.2534@compuserve.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:50:47 -0500   The favorite place that my son and his girlfriend like to sing in is the Elm Street Parking Garage in Worcester. I slammed the car door in there one night and they said "Oh, listen to that!" Then when we went to leave, and noone was around, they launched into the Lloyd Webber "Pie Jesu" duet! Later on, several times, they went back there just to sing!  
(back) Subject: Re: Organ {Dead or Alive} From: Russell Greene <russg@cyberspc.mb.ca> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:30:47 -0000   >>On this subject, just got my copy of the 1997 Grolier Multimedia >>Encyclopedia. Their single photo and sound bite of an "organ" features >>the original one-manual Hammond. What a shame! > >The original one manual Hammond was a Hammond Chord Organ I believe. Was >this the instrument pictured? > >Not to be taken the wrong way, but what would the shame be?   No, the original one manual Hammond was the very first Hammond built in the 1930's. Nothing wrong with Hammond organs, per se, the shame is that this picture and soundbite are the only organs included in this reference CD-ROM for the children of the 90's. No pipe organs. No digital organs. Nothing to whet the appetite of prospective young organists.   Regards, Russ  
(back) Subject: Re: I Sing a Song (was Re: Lenten Prelude) From: Jack R Hooton <jhooton@darientel.net> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:31:04   At 10:50 AM 2/23/98 EST, you wrote: >Lesbia Scott WAS a male. Careful about your assumptions!   If she was a male, then how did she marry John Mortimer Scott, a naval officer, in 1917? After she married him, she had three children, for whom she wrote her "Everyday Hymns".   --- Jack R Hooton St Simons Island, GA mailto:jhooton@darientel.net mailto:72613.3620@compuserve.com  
(back) Subject: Re: I Sing a Song (was Re: Lenten Prelude) From: "Vox Celeste" <voxceleste@mailexcite.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:15:03 -0700   On Mon, 23 Feb 1998, ComposerTX@aol.com wrote:   >Lesbia Scott WAS a male. Careful about your >assumptions!   And what is he/she now?     Sincerely,   Vox Celeste (Not nosy, just curious)       Free web-based email, Forever, From anywhere! http://www.mailexcite.com  
(back) Subject: Re: A position at last! From: dougcampbell@juno.com (Douglas A. Campbell) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:30:04 EST     On Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:11:38 -0600 "Kevin M. Simons" <Kevin.M.Simons-1@ou.edu> writes: >Howdy List, > >I had to share my excitement with the list, so excuse my exuberance! > >First things first. Richard Schneider came to check over the organ at >St. Thomas More here in Norman and fixed some things up for me. I >couldn't be more grateful, and its sounding good. > >Secondly, I became the official organist at St. Thomas More this >afternoon! I start the first Sunday of Lent (OY! What a time to >start). I'm thrilled and excited about all the possibilities and >opportunities I'll have. Thank you all for your encouragement and >help >over the years. It is much appreciated. Be assured, there will >probably be many more questions from this neck of the woods in the >weeks >and months to come! Dear Kevin,   Congratulations ! I glad to hear of your success.   Also, I would be interested in exactly what Richard did to your organ and what the results were. (I kinda feel somewhat responsible, since I recommended him to you!)   Please keep in touch !     Douglas A. Campbell Skaneateles, NY   _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]    
(back) Subject: Re: ReRe: The first Hammond Organ (thought to be) From: Gordon Lucas & Larry McGuire <stops@globalnet.co.uk> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 18:42:09 GMT   At 11:03 AM 2/22/98 EST, GRSCoLVR@aol.com wrote: >SNIP >Continuing on that thread,,,,the first Hammond organ of one manual was the >Novachord,which, by later definition of chord organ,,,was NOT. In today's >vernacular, and more appropriately, it was a very early synthesizer! >Soooooooo, since the Novachord was a 1939 product,,,and,,had 72 keys ....   I played an original Hammond Novachord recently, still in superb working order, and I would actually have defined it as an electronic piano, as it was designed to be a 'percussive' instrument, complete with touch sensitive keyboard, which, if one 'detuned' all of the users controls to maximum(or minimum) settings as the case would be, one could get to sound like a very realistic bowed violin, complete with subtle sustain and touch sensitive vibrato.   Not bad for 1939,   Mind you, John Compton here in Britain, had invented a real bowed and 'electronic' string quite a few years earlier, not to mention the same man having invented the electrostatic tonewheel generator a few years prior to Mr Hammond using them!!   How's this for a new thread.......   Larry    
(back) Subject: Theater Organ Recordings From: Dick Beery <dbeery@rbbsystems.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:58:42 -0500   Greetings.   First I am cross posting this to three different lists so my apologies if you get multiple messages. My question is about theater organ recordings. Is there a web site or published list of sources for such recordings? The main stream CD houses seem to not have much available in this area. I know a lot of artists tend to publish their own recordings which means a lot of different addresses. Any information you might have would be greatly appreciated. Especially looking for Walt Strony.   -- Dick Beery President RBB Systems, Inc. 330-567-2906 Fax 330-567-3925 http://www.rbbsystems.com dbeery@rbbsystems.com      
(back) Subject: Re: LENTEN POSTLUDE--Get This! From: "Mark Huth" <mhuth@rodgers.rain.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:55:08 PDT     > On the chimes? Oy! And doesn't that theme only last 30 seconds or > so? maybe a minute? you'd have to play it at least three times > through. What goes through some priests' minds?! Oh my! > > Ken Sybesma   Tacky? Watch what you say, bucko!!! I actually play this!   Of course, that's at the local hockey games when the refs are all gathered around deciding which penalty to call . . .   I hadn't thought about using it for Lent. Of course, I know what happens at Easter, so it's probably not that appropriate. :-)   For the record, the music actually has the theme four different times -each time modulating up a minor third - - - first in F, then Ab, then B, then D. All in all, it's about a minute long.   Also, I do it via MIDI on pizzicato strings . . .   For church, huh? What am I missing here?   Mark       Mark Huth Rodgers Instrument Corporation mhuth@rodgers.rain.com http://www.rodgerscorp.com   ==========================   There is no dark side of the moon. Really.    
(back) Subject: Re: LENTEN POSTLUDE--Get This! From: Stanley Lowkis <nstarfil@mediaone.net> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 14:25:02 -0500   Mark Huth wrote: >   > > Also, I do it via MIDI on pizzicato strings . . . > > For church, huh? What am I missing here? > > Mark > > Mark Huth > Rodgers Instrument Corporation > mhuth@rodgers.rain.com > http://www.rodgerscorp.com       A REAL ORGAN  
(back) Subject: Re: Music Choice From: "Karl E. Moyer" <kmoyer@marauder.millersv.edu> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 15:18:34 -0500 (EST)     "Assigned reading" for anyone carrying on such discussion is that marvelous book _Lexicon of Musical Invective_ by Slonimsky. It's a record of one "expert's" negative opinion after another of compositions, sometimes expressed in vehement terms, works which have long since stood the test of time for their quality AND their acceptability to music listeners.   The social, cultural and intellectual circumstances today are somewhat different from many of those stated or implied in Slonimsky's book, but the essence of the issue remains unchanged: that ignorant response to a given work or style reflects more the ignorance of the respondant than the insufficiency of the work or style itself. We need to watch our mouths, our pens and a computer keyboards, lest history prove us terribly ignorant and incorrect.   Having said this, the implications for music within the context of public worship differ in important ways from those uses Slonimsky's book has in mind. If music is to be a useful adjunct and support to people's worship experience, edification, etc., perhaps an additional set of evaluative standards need to be met, not the least of which is (perhaps) that the AVERAGE of a given congregation can use a fairly high percentage of the music in that place for worship purposes. On occasion we might do well to play something of lower stature than many appreciate but which the lesser-educated--find whatever words you see fit here--do find useful in worship.   Conversely, on occasion, we might also do well to play something that is beyond the appreciation of many of the people, hopefully with some sort of program note in the worship folder about its deeper meaning, so as at least to give some awareness that such a deeper meaning does exist, even if it's not very self-evident to many or even most of the people. After all, how many of even the "well-cultured" people will make any sense of Bach's chorale prelude on "Vater unser in Himmelreich" from _Clavieruebung, iii_? So a program note, especially dealing with the inherent spiritual values and/or messages of the piece, might at least help the situation.   The 20th-century stuff falls into the same discussion. Yes, DO PLAY IT; but, yes, DO TEACH ABOUT IT AND EXPLAIN ITS MEANING when you play it, so the people can at least have some sense of why you're playing it. And not too much of the time for the "average" parish!   Cordially,   Karl E. Moyer Lancaster PA   On Mon, 23 Feb 1998, karencl@worldnet.att.net wrote:   > Jonathan Orwig wrote: > In addition, many of us play stuff that is > > only palatable to other organists. As dear as the 20th century stuff is > > to some of our hearts, as much as those composers were and are geniuses, > > MOST CHURCH PEOPLE COULDN'T GIVE A FLYING RIP! I only developed a taste > > for the tonally astringent Messian, Guillou, Alain, etc. after PLAYING > > some of it or repeated listening. Some of it is still not my favorite > > genre, but I can appreciate it better now. > > Friends, I learned many years ago that many pieces of music come to > be appreciated by repeated listening. There are many musical selections > that I have come to love and treasure. But in selecting music for > service playing, my rule of thumb is this: If I don't like it the first > time I hear it, then curtains for it. The congregation is only going > to hear it once (every year or so). > Do you folks agree or not? There's certainly such a thing as > educating a congregation, but you can't do the same piece over and > over..... or can you? Many years ago we would introduce new hymns by > having a Hymn of the Month. Sang it every Sunday for a month. > Prelude of the Month, anyone??? > Karen > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >    
(back) Subject: Re: JUST BE GLAD YOU CAN PLAY, DARN IT!!! From: bombarde8@juno.com (Jason D. Comet) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 22:09:34 -0500   >I've noticed that more and more people have little or no knowledge of >music, >having learned everything they know from watching MTV or listening to >CDs. > >I lose more friends because they are sharply critical of my "strange" >interest >in theatre organ music and yet the only reason they can give for their >interest in certain popular music is due to an artist's latest video >on VH1, >or their "look" or what radio station their music gets played on. The >assumption is that if it gets played on VH1's prime time alternative >music >show it must be good. ********************************* Where would today's music be if there had NEVER been any organ. OR Panpipes as the first insturments ever built and thought of????? ********************************* >What I've noticed that is that we are increasingly living in an era >where >people are becoming trained to be passive "listeners" and >"experiencers" who >are conditioned to hear only 2-minute songs or even shorter segments >as point- >and-click .wav files on the Internet. > >Is it no wonder that they can't hear a whole Sonata when a long song, >to them, >has more than four 64-beat verses in 4/4 time? > >When people grown up from infancy with such short attention spans, all >reinforced by a channel surfing remote-control mentality, is it any >wonder >that our kids get diagnosed with Attention Deficit Disorder and eat >Ritalin in >order concentrate on one textbook for a whole semester? > >My advice to all who feel insulted when people can't listen to them >for more >than a minute or two: > >Try to find the gift even in what feels like a negative. You have a >dual gift >of being able to both CREATE beautiful music AND appreciate it in its >entirety. Your audience cannot. Pity them. ************************************** I guess we could *accuse* these short attention spands to the "Easiness of Living" product they have out today. WeI can get along fine without these CD player, or automatic transmitions, or computers that work at the speed of light and make people inpatient when it comes to other things because they are use to having things appear in a matter of milli-seconds. Lazyness today is brought with RF remote controls that can turn a TV channel from next door when your not even around to see it. **************************************** >I am a firm believer that my musical abilites give me access to parts >of my >soul and my emotions that I could not get at any other way. Playing >piano or >theatre organ helps me access memories, deal with my past, feel my >emotions, >feel extreme joy, even cry. > >Without my emotions, which are an expression of my truest and highest >self, I >will die young. So pity the people who feel they need to block their >emotions >by taking pills, smoking cigarettes or ignoring or negating their own >God- >given musical skills. ********************************* I've been known to cry during a service during the prelude because it was SO beautiful and I had had a terible week and ended up thinking about it during ht eprelude and stopped playing and started to cry over my Great manual because I felt it was a great joy to have something so good happen to me for the first time in several weeks. ********************************* >When I look at the tragedies like this unfolding before me, I have a >hard time >listening to ongoing threads like the one trying to compare >electronics to >pipes (apples and oranges). At least the people are playing >SOMETHING!!! > >As a former trucker, I try to avoid looking down my nose at drivers >who >"cheat" themselves out of the raw experience of driving by spoiling >themselves >by: > >- using electric power windows instead of the hissy air-powered >window/guillotines found on big Peterbilts. > >- driving down a highway in "Drive" with automatic transmissions (as >opposed >to double-clutched, unsynchronized, 15-speed transmissions), or > >- missing out on valuable road-rage by pushing a little button on >their >steering wheel to activate a tinny horn instead of yanking on an >overhead cord >and sending 120 lbs. of compressed air through a five-tone, >Amtrak-style "Cm6" >trumpet air horn. > >Now THAT'S living folks!!!! *********************************** That's why I prefer standard transimission trucks and/or cars and tracker action organs. You feel in control of it and don't feel like you are doing nothing and fall asleep at teh wheel and have a major accident or sit during a service and have a pipe cipher on you and there is nothing you can do about it but thurn the organ off or go up to the pipe chambers and look for the pipe and do a 'pipe'ectomy until you can tear apart the chest and fix a diode or releather a pouch instead of reattaching a screw and your off again. *********************************** >Either way, the important thing is that we get out of the house and >away from >the TV sets and DRIVE, in much the same way that I turn on my 300-watt >LOWREY >and the 300-watt extension speaker and make my little cottage on a >sand dune >sound like the House on the Rock instead of sticking Lyn Larsen CDs in >my >stereo changer and calling myself a professional organist. ************************************* I know people who play any-kind of notes that sound good together when there is music in front of them and say that they know all there is to know about playing the organ. ************************************* >God isn't America AWESOME??? ************************************* YEAH!!!!!! *************************************   _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]    
(back) Subject: Re: Funny hymn references From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:48:59 -0500   >it doesn't say why (ebenezer) is not >always capitalized   Maybe it was a supply house ebenezer??   bruce cornely o o o __________ o o o ago (dean) ohs o o __________ o o