PipeChat Digest #392 - Friday, May 29, 1998
 
Darn!
  by <Trackerbkr@aol.com>
Re: DARN!!!!!
  by <KZimme7737@aol.com>
Re: DARN!!!!!
  by <DudelK@aol.com>
Re: PipeChat Digest #391 - 05/28/98
  by "Lynne Lauderdale" <llauderd@uwf.edu>
Locked consoles - (was PipeChat Digest #391)
  by "Terry Charles" <tcorgan@ibm.net>
Re: Darn!
  by "Kevin Cartwright" <kevin1@alaweb.com>
Re: PipeChat Digest #391 - 05/28/98
  by "Kevin Cartwright" <kevin1@alaweb.com>
Re: Darn!
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: DARN!!!!!
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: Darn!
  by "Terry Charles" <tcorgan@ibm.net>
The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access
  by <TonyIn219@aol.com>
Re: PipeChat Digest #391 - 05/28/98
  by <GRSCoLVR@aol.com>
Re: Darn!
  by "Peggy C. Bie" <peggyb@gate.net>
Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access
  by "Terry Charles" <tcorgan@ibm.net>
Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access
  by "Roger Pariseau" <grinder@west.net>
Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access
  by <Prestant16@aol.com>
Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access
  by "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com>
new Music e-mail list
  by "Nelson and Tracy Denton" <ndenton434@bigwave.ca>
Test- Please ignore
  by <ScottFop@aol.com>
New Email list
  by "Beau Surratt" <beaupiano@earthlink.net>
Re: New Email list
  by "Shirley" <pnst@itw.com>
Re: New Email list
  by <GRSCoLVR@aol.com>
 


(back) Subject: Darn! From: <Trackerbkr@aol.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 08:18:32 EDT     Bruce Cornely wrote:   "Something I've learned from experience which has helped keep my mind at ease in such situations: The more protected an organ is....the less likely it is to be worth playing."   I was going to make this same point, but Bruce's flying fingers beat me to it. Here are a couple of examples to support this thesis: I had to get a key from the secretary when I subbed at a service in a small chapel once. The organ was a small, thirty- something TOASTER. I subbed for another friend and knew in advance that the instrument had to be terrible because elaborate details were necessary to get the key to me. Sure enough, it was a five-rank, 1960s Wicks. Finally, a few years ago I gave a noontime recital on an undistinguished instrument at a NAPALM convention. The organist there not only kept all 32 levels of memory locked during my practice sessions, but did not see fit to unlock them until 3 minutes before I was to begin the concert. He apologized for the oversight...   It should be pointed out that there are, of course, certain places where organs absolutely have to be made secure, such as on college campuses and in other spaces where traffic is high. But in other more secure spaces the benefits of being gracious can reap high returns, not the least of which is good will.   Finally, visiting organists should try to remember the following when playing someone else's instrument: do not erase over the keys, try to put the bench back the way it was, leave the swell shades open, cancel the stops, and do not rearrange any of the organist's props on the console.   Laurie Ryan Huntsville, Alabama  
(back) Subject: Re: DARN!!!!! From: <KZimme7737@aol.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 08:51:51 EDT   Others have written:   > Oops... sorry for sending a private message to the list.... hit the send > button too fast! > > Sand > >Don't worry about it. It happens to most of us on this list. >It is called "Prematuture Transmission"   What do you call it if you can't get your "send" key to work? I can't wait to hear Bruce's answer to this one.  
(back) Subject: Re: DARN!!!!! From: <DudelK@aol.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:05:57 EDT   In a message dated 98-05-28 08:53:20 EDT, you write:   << What do you call it if you can't get your "send" key to work? >> Sounds like a "solid state" problem!  
(back) Subject: Re: PipeChat Digest #391 - 05/28/98 From: llauderd@uwf.edu (Lynne Lauderdale) Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:18:35 -0500   Dear List, Regarding Kevin's disappointment over non-accessible instruments: I feel it is perfectly appropriate that unattended organs in churches be kept locked for some very important reasons, not the least of which is to protect the instrument from damage or accidental injury by someone who has no experience with pipe organs. The only proper way to be allowed access to any instrument in a church which is not your own is to contact the organist and arrange an appointment. I have no problem with any qualified person playing the organ in our sanctuary, but to expect carte blanche in any church you may visit is asking a bit much.   It is highly proper to seek permission before visiting an instrument. In fact, rules concerning such practices are referred to in the AGO code of ethics. There is no reason to think that a locked instrument means the organist is possessive. Our organ is locked for its protection. I would rather have it in working condition when I open it than find that someone has come in a changed all of the generals, left the instrument on, broken a key, etc. With the daily traffic through our sanctuary, including hundreds of preschoolers, I feel more comfortable not inviting disaster.      
(back) Subject: Locked consoles - (was PipeChat Digest #391) From: "Terry Charles" <tcorgan@ibm.net> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:25:28 -0400   Locked consoles...what's the big deal here? Guests are more than welcome to see the Kirk and see/play its pipe organ - just don't expect to do so without an appointment.   Lynne has it spot on: ""...it is perfectly appropriate that unattended organs in churches be kept locked...""   and: ""... to expect carte blanche in any church you may visit is asking a bit much.""   ""...AGO code of ethics."" The guild codes are not the point - simple consideration is!   TC    
(back) Subject: Re: Darn! From: Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:10:52 -0500   > Finally, visiting organists should try to remember the following when playing > someone else's instrument: do not erase over the keys, try to put the bench > back the way it was, leave the swell shades open, cancel the stops, and do > not rearrange any of the organist's props on the console.   Tee-hee-hee... That sounds like a tracker I play every now and then in Montgomery. Neither the organist nor the church has a problem letting people play it, and the organist has a notice on the console (I guess it's a pretty popular organ) spelling out the musts before leaving (push shades open, set that coupler like this, close all stops, set the other coupler like that...). It makes good sense, and doesn't offend anyone. I wish all organists were like that.   Thanks,   Kevin C. kevin1@alaweb.com      
(back) Subject: Re: PipeChat Digest #391 - 05/28/98 From: Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:20:30 -0500   > It is highly proper to seek permission before visiting an instrument. In > fact, rules concerning such practices are referred to in the AGO code of > ethics. There is no reason to think that a locked instrument means   I keep our organ locked, but everyone knows where the key is. AND, I did talk to the music director before we went to the church. This is because she is also a member of our handbell choir. She says the organist is very specific about who plays the instrument, and she would "get" me if I were to play it (I think this might refer to the teenage organist topic as well). The organist was not even there that night, and the director said if she let me play the organ, she would be the one that was "got." So, basically, this woman was afraid of the organist.   Who cares now? There are several organs "bigger and better" than that specific one, including the one I play every week. Why should I care about an 11 rank 1982 organ that is protected by a lion?   K.    
(back) Subject: Re: Darn! From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:26:06 -0400   Sorry Laurie.... I'll try to be slower next time!! i do recall (once) going through proper channels -- several committees over two or three days, the pastor, and a couple of secretaries, and of course the organist -- to gain access to an organ which had been recommended by a non-organist friend as woooooooonderful. After all that trouble I was severely peeved and to my great delight when we walked into the room, I recognized the "work" of that particular builder and was pleased to announce to all within earshot, "Oh! It's a _______! No thanks. I've already played one. My sympathies." Of course, I was veeeeeeery young at the time, and I would neeeeeeeever do that now (but in a few more years when I have reached the age of "free speech", who knows!!) heh heh heh cough   bruce o h s __________ a g o cornely o o __________ o o ........... cremona84000@webtv.net ...........    
(back) Subject: Re: DARN!!!!! From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:30:49 -0400   What do you call it if you can't get your "send" button to work??   Um... insendsative???   Actually, i don't have this problem, as my "send" button is automatically time activated so that I have to keep writing messges while the machinery is on or it will just "send", "send".   How sendful!   bruce o h s __________ a g o cornely o o __________ o o ........... cremona84000@webtv.net ...........    
(back) Subject: Re: Darn! From: "Terry Charles" <tcorgan@ibm.net> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:13:07 -0400   A previous post: ""...do not erase over the keys..."" Amen, we don't allow that here, part of the organist job description. Sorry, but no paper clippy stuff either.   ""...leave the swell shades open..."" CLOSED is the order of the day here. Anything to be different! The Kirks shutter sets CLOSE as the organ is switched off. In our case, all enclosed divisions remain isolated...their separate humidity and temp controls are effective even tho the Sanctuary is air conditioned through the week.   I realize this system is different from the norm...however, as a mechanician, it's interesting to visit a Church where the norm is organ off/open shutters...but where the shoes were left "closed" - see the organist come in before service, turn on the organ - see shutters closing - organist places feet on shoes and away they go again.   TC - who wants you all to come to Florida - hear its best kept organ secret! (Brought to you by the Florida Organ Chambers of Commerce)    
(back) Subject: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access From: <TonyIn219@aol.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:16:43 EDT   Kevin:   Organists who lock their consoles usually carry a secret tattoo on their= =0Aforeheads. Next time you find a locked console, check out my theory. F= ind the=0Aorganist and see if they don't have a BIG RED "L" tattooed on t= heir forehead.=0AIt stands for: LOSER!!!!!   A locked console tells me that the organist is probably a perfectionist, = if=0Anot an elitist =97 with major trust and control issues =97 who is i= nsecure about=0Atheir authority. Also, a locked console says a lot about = the mood of the=0Achurch.   In my childhood, the organist at St. Paul's By The Lake Episcopal Church = in=0ARogers Park (Chicago), left the console unlocked. He was rebuilding = the organ=0Ain the church basement -- rank by rank, and wanted the kids t= o help him and=0Alearn how pipe organs worked. He figured that organs wou= ld die if young people=0Aweren't encouraged to play and maintain them.   Cast-off pipes were used creatively, like the 1- and 1-3/5 foot strings t= hat=0Awere mounted under the hood of our station wagon, operated by an el= ectric air=0Acompressor and a toggle switch on the dashboard. Since there= was no air tank,=0Athe compressor's pumping action created a tremulant, = too.   St. Elizabeths in Glencoe was similar. The organist was the choir ministr= y=0Adirector, too and wanted people to be interested in the musical minis= try so we=0Awere welcomed at the organ before and after church =97 and en= couraged to take=0Alessons.   St. Lukes in Evanston (where I was baptized), and Christ Church Catherdra= l in=0AHouston (where I was an acolyte) were different. THOSE organists w= ere prima=0Adonnas who hid from view, tipped the chalice at communion to = get a bigger swig=0Aof the wine, and never, EVER smiled or showed up to r= eceive the 8th sacrament=0A(Coffee Hour). I figured they should be playin= g at a funeral home or on Dark=0AShadows.   Those consoles were always locked. And the organists were losers.   My Lowrey doesn't have a rolltop cover. Every day is open console at my h= ouse.=0ABesides, the more my Lowrey is played, the better it works and th= e less=0Amaintenance it needs.   John Carrington Chesterton, Indiana    
(back) Subject: Re: PipeChat Digest #391 - 05/28/98 From: <GRSCoLVR@aol.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:41:00 EDT   Hey List-----"There is no reason to think that a locked console means that the organist is possessive" quoting one of the responses. When I was a young man studying organ in my small home town, I was asked to sub at a small church,,,,,however,,,the "note" taped to the console when I arrived to practice advised that "due to my inexperience" would I please just use the piano both for practice,,choir rehearsal,,,and the Sunday service as well. I had only been taking lessons for 6 years at that point,,, AND the Vicar,,,when approached, could not be swayed. So the piano got played. Many years later I found the sacred instrument to be a 2/5 DE monster. Referring to rules of conduct when at a "guest" console...seems to me that all the rules enumerated are just good common sense,,,along with a good dollop of respect for others. Regarding 32 zillion registrations in memory and being sacred, is no one taught to register ahead of each composition,,and to change on the fly anymore? I certainly never have had any problem doing that on as large as 3/65 or so. And I can vividly remember the original Wanamaker organist in Philadelphia, a rather short lady with a rolled up newspaper on the bench alongside her to "swat" at tilting tablets. A paper width bunch is as good as one, right? HeHeh   Roc  
(back) Subject: Re: Darn! From: "Peggy C. Bie" <peggyb@gate.net> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 13:12:52 -0400   My favorite wit (Bruce) wrote:   > Of course, I was veeeeeeery young at the time, and I would neeeeeeeever do that now > (but in a few more years when I have reached the age of "free speech", who > knows!!) heh heh heh cough   When you do, try it, and you'll like it. I do! ;-) Free at last! Free at last!   Rev. Peggy C. Bie "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." -Anais Nin http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Senate/1095  
(back) Subject: Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access From: "Terry Charles" <tcorgan@ibm.net> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 13:19:26 -0400   Saw this post: ""Next time you find a locked console, check out my theory. Find the organist and see if they don't have a BIG RED "L" tattooed on their forehead. It stands for: LOSER!!!!!"" Man, they are out today, aren't they?   And it went on: ""A locked console tells me that the organist is probably (snip) - with major trust and control issues =97 who is insecure about their authority."" I'm only insecure, after reading this - that we might NOT have locked the organ!   ""Also, a locked console says a lot about the mood of the church."" Allright, this has to be a late sent April Fool - thankfully, I don't know anyone with this kind of mentality!   ""...the more my Lowrey is played, the better it works and the less maintenance it needs."" Give it another hour or two.   TC      
(back) Subject: Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access From: Roger Pariseau <grinder@west.net> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:20:34 -0700   Terry Charles wrote:   > > ""...the more my Lowrey is played, the better it works and > > the less maintenance it needs.""   > Give it another hour or two.   As a "toaster" repairman, I can affirm the original poster's facts -- the more an organ is played, the better shape it tends to stay in. I know this is true for theatre organ traps as well as for electric/electronic controls in pipe organs. But I cannot speak for the pipes themselves. Do they wear out from overuse?   Short of determined mischief, an organ's greatest hazards are cigarettes, coffee, whiskey and soda pop. In a lifetime of fixing these things, I've replaced four keyboards from "overuse." These were on cocktail lounge Wurlitzers and Hammonds.   The remainder of the repairs I've made have been due to factors having nothing to do with using an instrument. In fact, the "Christmas Crunch" comes for us mainly due to organs not being used: cruddy key and stop contacts.   Next batter up!   -- Roger  
(back) Subject: Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:39:02 -0400   John Carrington has tested my memory of days at Christ Church Cathedral--Houston. The organ was locked because the on/off switch was one of those old key switches that had a key that looked like a "fork". Bill Barnard, I believe, was responsible for removal of the rolltop. As a student I had no difficult gaining access to the organ and there were several others who practiced there as well. And, being one of the nicest organists/people I have ever met, I can certainly attest to the fact that he was not a loser in any sense of the word, neither personally nor professionally/musically.   bruce o h s __________ a g o cornely o o __________ o o ........... cremona84000@webtv.net ...........    
(back) Subject: Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access From: <Prestant16@aol.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:20:34 EDT   In a message dated 98-05-28 12:18:48 EDT, you write:   << A locked console tells me that the organist is probably a perfectionist, if not an elitist — with major trust and control issues — who is insecure about their authority. Also, a locked console says a lot about the mood of the church. >>   I usually lock the console or at least the door leading up to the choir loft. I was told by the pastor that the door should be locked or the organ should be locked up when there is a service without music because of the following story:   Fr. C. was saying his sermon at a sunday morning mass, when from the organ came (as I was told) A VERY loud noise, and it did not stop. A few kids were bored and decided to play the organ in the middle of the mass. I guess they hit some buttons and threw a few stops on and probably the sfz. button too. I really don't mind anybody using the organs in the church, I just don't want to have to hear a story again like that, or find stop tabs broken off again. We also have another organ in the lower church which HAD a locked top (unfortunatly it was broken off and left on the floor for me to find) It is an older tracker organ that now has broken keys, missing ivories, pictured hung on the ears of the facade pipes, broken and non functional draw knobs. The reason for the condition of the organ is that it is located at the back of the lower church at floor level where anybody can get to it. I have been repairing the organ slowly, actually I am fixing the locking top first.   "He who locks the top is PERFECTLY smart"   I am hoping this like this are a rare case. If it were up to me and I could trust EVERYONE I would leave the church open and have an "open console" 24 hrs. a day for 365 days a year.   -W  
(back) Subject: Re: The Dark Truths Behind Kevin's Thwarted Organ Access From: David Scribner <david@blackiris.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:38:42 -0500   >St. Lukes in Evanston (where I was baptized), and Christ Church Catherdral >inHouston (where I was an acolyte) were different. THOSE organists were >primadonnas who hid from view, tipped the chalice at communion to get a >bigger swigof the wine, and never, EVER smiled or showed up to receive >the 8th sacrament(Coffee Hour). I figured they should be playing at a >funeral home or on DarkShadows.   As a former of St. Luke's Evanston I take great offense at this statement. St. Luke's has had over the years some very fine musicians including Richard Webster who is the incumbent currently. And I have never had any problems of getting access to the organ but then I have always made arrangements previously to use it. And when you have the responsibility for a historic instrument as the 1922 E.M.Skinner at St. Luke's is, then you need to maintain some sort of accountability for the use of the instrument.   I have to agree with Lynne Lauderdale's viewpoint. That as the parish musician, organist, whatever, we have the responsibility to the parish/congregation to look after the instrument. And that sometimes means maintaining some control over the access to it. But in the last 35+ years I have never had a problem trying out an instrument anywhere. But I have always ASKED permission, I don't take it as a God given right that I can walk into any church and just go try out the instrument at any time I please.   But what if something happens with the organ because of someone just walking in off the street and playing it? Who is responsible then? I know that most of us on this list are knowledgable enough not to cause any problems. But what about someone that say jams the combination action by pushing two pistons at once, or drops a hymnal on the keys and one of them jumps out of place causing everything on that manual to cypher? And then walks away leaving it? WHo is going to have to pay the organ technician that has to come out and fix the problem? And what happens if this "accident" takes place late on a Saturday afternoon and the organist doesn't discover it until Sunday morning? Who is the pastor/rector/vestry/session/council going to hold responsible? Not that person walking in but the organist. Think about it folks.   And before someone jumps up and down about my not doing anything to encourage a new generation of organists you might as well hold your flames. I. by all means feel that we all need to encourage and bring the organ to more people. But we need to do it in a responsible manner.   David  
(back) Subject: new Music e-mail list From: Nelson and Tracy Denton <ndenton434@bigwave.ca> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:49:54 -0400   A new list for music and organ jokes and other humour has been formed @   http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/oh   Organic Humour List     There are no rules and nothing is off topic.   Enjoy.   ( be warned some jokes and comments may be offensive to some if not all)   Adult content may be posted so be warned!!!!!!!!!   This list has been formed for those who can't get enough laughs in their lives. Any postings of humour or off topic threads from any list can be sent here to be passed around.   Onelist.com and the Moderators ( who shall remain nameless) are not responsible for any messages posted.   Do your own thing. +(:-P)   Above all have fun. :-)))))))       P.S. A organistic gripe list will be formed soon. This will be for flames and complaints about everyone and everything you wish to complain about that is off topic on other lists.   "Organ Fireworks"? or whatever?   Any suggestions?     Nelson E. Denton R. A. Denton and Son Pipe Organ Builders Hamilton Ontario, Canada   The Pipe Organ Tracker Project http://www.freeyellow.com/members/radentonson The worlds "second" largest collection of organ related links   KEYBOARDLINKS e-mail list http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/keyboardlinks A mailing list about Keyboard Musical Instument Website Links  
(back) Subject: Test- Please ignore From: <ScottFop@aol.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:11:55 EDT   just a test  
(back) Subject: New Email list From: Beau Surratt <beaupiano@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:27:20 -0500   Hello, I have created a new Email list for church organists. To subscribe, go to this url:   http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/churchorganist     Beau Beau Surratt beaupiano@earthlink.net Organist, Bemis United Methodist Church Student, South Side High School    
(back) Subject: Re: New Email list From: Shirley <pnst@itw.com> Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:44:06   At 21:27 05/28/98 -0500, you wrote: > Hello, > I have created a new Email list for church organists. To subscribe, go to >this url: > >http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/churchorganist     ANOTHER church music list? Sorry, Beau, but I don't think it'll get a whole lot of support.... lessee: There are at least 4 or 5 church music lists I can name off the top of my head..... And now there's YOURS? Hmm....   --Shirley  
(back) Subject: Re: New Email list From: <GRSCoLVR@aol.com> Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 00:23:55 EDT   Not room for one more list,,,,,,perhaps yes,,perhaps no,,,,,,who is to say,,,,,? I think its a great idea Shirley! Never know what you dont try!   Roc