PipeChat Digest #607 - Tuesday, November 24, 1998
 
Re: "Classical Diaphones"
  by "Robert  Eversman" <highnote@mhtc.net>
Re: Thanksgiving and Diaphones
  by "Kevin Cartwright" <kevin1@alaweb.com>
Kevin / Thanksgiving
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
Re: ivory keys
  by "Cliff Benham" <cbenham@bellatlantic.net>
Diaphones
  by <KriderSM@aol.com>
Re: Diaphones and Literature
  by <WRansomeJr@aol.com>
Re: A&E America's Castles (x-posted)
  by <WRansomeJr@aol.com>
Diaphones
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
Re: Diaphones
  by "Kevin Cartwright" <kevin1@alaweb.com>
Re: A&E America's Castles (x-posted)
  by "Kevin Cartwright" <kevin1@alaweb.com>
Classics on TO
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
Re: Classics on TO
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: Diaphones and Literature
  by <GRSCoLVR@aol.com>
Re: Classics on TO--Loud Diaphones----
  by <GRSCoLVR@aol.com>
Re: Diaphones and Literature
  by <WRansomeJr@aol.com>
RE: Diaphones and Literature
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
 


(back) Subject: Re: "Classical Diaphones" From: "Robert Eversman" <highnote@mhtc.net> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 05:15:55 -0600   This has been done at least at one church I know about, Holy Innocents in Manatowac WI but I was not able to hear it. The 16' decorates the rose window in the gallery quite nicely. I am told that it is quite successful.     Robert   ---------- > From: Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> > To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Subject: "Classical Diaphones" > Date: Sunday, November 22, 1998 5:51 PM > > About the Diaphones in classical music thing. When mentioning that > someone should try using diaphones in classical organs, I intended the > statement to refer to classical ORGANS having diaphones, not theatre > organs playing classical music, and using the diaphones. I've heard > theatre organs playing classical pieces, where the diaphones "come > bustin' through the door," and I liked it. Therefore, I think someone > should actually add the rank to a strictly classical organ, and see what > happens. > > Kevin C. > kevin1@alaweb.com > > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >  
(back) Subject: Re: Thanksgiving and Diaphones From: Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 16:26:09 -0600   VEAGUE wrote: > > Hi all... In regards to Kevin's remarks on thanksgiving, yes, it should be > every day , and prayed to God , how ,in His Infinate Glory and Mercy, has > given us all these days, and all that is therein. To diaphones in a   I believe it should be only one day, or a few days throughout the year...unless you can change the thought process of the whole human race. If it were every day, it would become another meaningless habit, and that would only take away the one day we already have to put things forth and be thankful for them. That's like making every day an "Sunday." Then, worshiping God (or whover others might worship), would become "another good habit" that we really wouldn't pay attention to. I think God arranged things this way for a reason. It might not be my idea above, but it is that way for a reason. If He saw it any other way, he would have it that way.   krc        
(back) Subject: Kevin / Thanksgiving From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 18:01:19 -0500   Hi, Kev... My remarks on Thanksgiving were merely my own views. I, myself, give thanks every day for another day, and my guardian angel watching over me. Didn't see any comments on the diaphones. Your friend, Rick    
(back) Subject: Re: ivory keys From: Cliff Benham <cbenham@bellatlantic.net> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 19:13:29 -0500   Ivory Soap? <tee-hee>    
(back) Subject: Diaphones From: KriderSM@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 18:52:46 EST   Hi List,   Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> wrote:   <snip>Therefore, I think someone should actually add the (Diaphone) rank to a strictly classical organ, and see what happens.<snip>   At first the hair on the back of my neck flared at the comments Kevin made about a Diaphone in a classical instrument. I interpereted it to say classical compositions could not be played properly on a theatre organ. Am I wrong?   I have several thoughts to share: 1) the Diaphone would be too loud for smaller classical instruments (it IS a theatrical stop, remember). 2) the Diaphone's quick speech would add extra punch to organ literature written for majesty and power. 3) larger hybrid Wurlitzers such as the Organ Stop Pizza's and the 5/80 Sanfilippo's completes its stop list with many classical ranks. I suspect that most classical literature could be played on solely on the classical ranks contained therein. (flame resistant suit is on)   Let's try some Wurli Diaphones on the organ at West Point, St. Patrick's in New York City or St. John's the Divine. Let those 32' footers provide the awesome musical foundation these cathedrals deserve!!!   WurliStan    
(back) Subject: Re: Diaphones and Literature From: WRansomeJr@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 20:31:54 EST   In a message dated 11/23/98 3:55:56 PM Pacific Standard Time, KriderSM@aol.com writes:   > > At first the hair on the back of my neck flared at the comments Kevin made > about a Diaphone in a classical instrument. I interpreted it to say > classical > compositions could not be played properly on a theatre organ. Am I wrong?   Well, If we can play works intended for a very orchestral organ on a neo baroque screamer, then for sure classical literature can be played on a theatre organ. The success of the performance depends on the talent of the performer and the ability of the instruments to adapt to literature that was not necessarily meant for them. As a classical organist who is very much in love with theatres, theatre organs, and theatre music, but who just doesn't have a handle on the style: why play ANY literature on an instrument that isn't suited to it?? Some music can be played on ANY instrument successfully, but not all. Food for thought?? Something that doesn't need mixtures ought to work pretty well on a theatre organ. One of my organ profs. told me about a student of hers that was in the Miss Alabama pageant, which was held at the Alabama, in Birmingham. The girl played one of Bach's "Eight Little" for her talent on the WurliTzer. I just wonder if she rose up out of the pit during a pedal cadenza?!!?   Randy Terry  
(back) Subject: Re: A&E America's Castles (x-posted) From: WRansomeJr@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 20:34:55 EST   In a message dated 11/22/98 10:48:59 AM Pacific Standard Time, orge@dreamscape.com writes:   > `America's Castles'' will cover Great Movie Palaces.   I watched an enjoyable program with just a snippet of the mighty "mo" at the Atlanta Fox, but it was still a great program with lots of interesting info and photography. Thanks for letting us know about it!!  
(back) Subject: Diaphones From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 21:42:51 -0500   Friends and Fellow Organ Nuts... In all the comments on the diaphone, I am happy to see not one remark against them. WurliStan made a good point of said stop being a good foundation stop in large cathedral instruments. To that, I say," Let the rattling windows begin! " Rick    
(back) Subject: Re: Diaphones From: Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 21:03:41 -0600   KriderSM@aol.com wrote: > > Hi List, > > Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> wrote: > > <snip>Therefore, I think someone should actually add the (Diaphone) rank to a > strictly classical organ, and see what happens.<snip> > > At first the hair on the back of my neck flared at the comments Kevin made > about a Diaphone in a classical instrument. I interpereted it to say classical > compositions could not be played properly on a theatre organ. Am I wrong?   You're absolutely right. BUT, I am talking about someone loosing their mind here and putting one on a larger church instrument. Please see further statements below.   > I have several thoughts to share: > 1) the Diaphone would be too loud for smaller classical instruments (it IS a > theatrical stop, remember).   Oh WOW, someone's actually sticking up for smaller organs! That's funny, I couldn't get any support...especially when I say "I have a problem with a 2/19..." I technically get laughed out of the room every time.   > 3) larger hybrid Wurlitzers such as the Organ Stop Pizza's and the 5/80 > Sanfilippo's completes its stop list with many classical ranks. I suspect that > most classical literature could be played on solely on the classical ranks > contained therein. (flame resistant suit is on)   Yes, they contain classical ranks, and can play classical music, but one *expects* a pizza organ that size to have a diaphone anyway...I am just repeating what I said before, please refer to previous mails. If someone plays Tocatta and Fugue in D m by Bach on a theatre organ, they might get cursed by the pro's for adding theatre ranks. However, they might not when applied to a non-theatre/symphonic instrument. Trust me, I've been cursed for using theatre ranks in classical pieces before... I think I'll make a CD: "Breaking Tradition-Your Classical Favorites on the Theatre Organ-Trems and All" > Let's try some Wurli Diaphones on the organ at West Point, St. Patrick's in > New York City or St. John's the Divine. Let those 32' footers provide the > awesome musical foundation these cathedrals deserve!!!   You're talking sense now!   Kevin C. kevin1@alaweb.com        
(back) Subject: Re: A&E America's Castles (x-posted) From: Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 21:08:04 -0600   WRansomeJr@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 11/22/98 10:48:59 AM Pacific Standard Time, > orge@dreamscape.com writes: > > > `America's Castles'' will cover Great Movie Palaces. > > I watched an enjoyable program with just a snippet of the mighty "mo" at the > Atlanta Fox, but it was still a great program with lots of interesting info > and photography. Thanks for letting us know about it!!   Was the recording of "In a Persian Market" recorded on the Mo, or not? I know the silent film sample after that scene was a "toaster" all the way...   krc      
(back) Subject: Classics on TO From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 22:26:16 -0500   A good, novel idea there, Kevin. However, I doubt if old J.S. would appreciate his toccata's and fugue's on full trem. His Jig Fugue would really have one jiggin'. Years ago, violinist Herr Fritz Kreisler ( a fellow country-man ), did recordings with theatre organ. Several light classics with TO were recorded in the 20's...very enjoyable. As regards full-fledged, long hair, nose in the air, european continent, serious stuff with TO, well, that would take imagination, and cooperation between all parties concerned. Rick    
(back) Subject: Re: Classics on TO From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 23:03:40 -0500 (EST)   Just curious.... why does a Diaphone have to be loud? Is it out of necessity or tradition?   ........................bruce cornely........................ o o o o ______________ o o o o d o g s ______________ o o h o o a o o ______________ o o p s   ............. cremona84000@webtv.net ............     I had rather be a dog, and bay at the moon, Than such a Roman. -- William Shakespeare    
(back) Subject: Re: Diaphones and Literature From: GRSCoLVR@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 23:16:12 EST   Hi List---   I gotta put my 2 cents worth here on the Diaphone/classical discussion. I am reminded that the Austin Co. put a diaphone (their name Magnaton) in at least one municipal auditorium organ,,,that being Portland Maine. That was certainly NOT a theatre installation by any means. Regards playing more classical literature on TOrgans, why not? Yes,,,a previous post alluded to a lack of mixtures,,but my readings and experience over the years have indicated that many many pipe organs of the early part of this century had no mixtures, my practice instrument in my church,,an Austin product of the early teens, had no stops above 4 foot,,and it did just fine on classical literature. I would think that classical literature on a theatre organ,,sans trems,,,,,would sound very good. I also have observed that as a general statement,,,tuning and regulating is done to a much higher standard today on theatre organs than was done 40 years ago on the first of the "rebuild- relocate" instruments. In those early days I think we felt that the trems would cover up a multitude of sins in the tuning -regulating department. I can vividly recall a relocation and rebuilding where the crew chief felt that releathering of the trems was of the first importance, even before chest internal examination-------   Regards, -Roc  
(back) Subject: Re: Classics on TO--Loud Diaphones---- From: GRSCoLVR@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 23:24:53 EST   Bruce--- No reason at all that a diaphone cannot be tamed. Smaller beater,,,smaller scale resonator,,lighter wind,,,,ought to do it...I think its tradition in the form of "if we'uns is gonna use THAT much lumber,,lets make it a real diaphone,,,the plaster be damned."   -Roc  
(back) Subject: Re: Diaphones and Literature From: WRansomeJr@aol.com Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1998 23:55:13 EST   In a message dated 11/23/98 8:18:32 PM Pacific Standard Time, GRSCoLVR@aol.com writes:   > Regards playing more classical literature on TOrgans, why not? Yes,,,a > previous post alluded to a lack of mixtures,,but my readings and experience > over the years have indicated that many many pipe organs of the early part > of > this century had no mixtures   Of course you can play a piece that needs mixtures without them. What I am trying to point out is that MANY works can be brought to life successfully on a variety of instruments. However, we also need to realize that certain instruments, whether they be pipe (theatre or "classical") or electronic, simply cannot make some music attractive, and if that is the case we can try to stay with something that can be successfully brought off. This being a matter of personal opinion, but a valid one, I feel!   RandyT  
(back) Subject: RE: Diaphones and Literature From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1998 00:56:43 -0500   Many pieces may be successfully played on, lets say, a theatre organ. With such an instrument, a vast array of orchestral effects can be utilized. Keeping with the score,various instrumentational possibilities are available on all manuals. Many old-timers did this very well. Rick