PipeChat Digest #818 - Thursday, April 29, 1999
 
RE: Just Curious ............
  by "Charles Brown" <clmoney@cybernex.net>
Re: solos for pedals
  by "domenico severin" <dseverin@club-internet.fr>
St cke fur die Fl tenuhr
  by "Carlo Pietroniro" <concert_organist@hotmail.com>
St cke fur die Fl tenuhr
  by "Carlo Pietroniro" <concert_organist@hotmail.com>
Organ samples
  by "Matthew J. Baker" <poinsettia@netxn.com>
Re: Organ samples
  by "Adam and Christine Levin" <levins@westnet.com>
dream teams
  by "Carlo Pietroniro" <concert_organist@hotmail.com>
Re: just curious...........
  by "Russell Greene" <russg@cyberspc.mb.ca>
Re: just curious
  by "John Vanderlee" <jovanderlee@vassar.edu>
Re: dream teams
  by <DRAWKNOB@aol.com>
OT: Finale98
  by <douglas@blackiris.com>
Re: Stucke fur die Flotenuhr
  by "Richard Pinel" <rpinelchat@musicman123.freeserve.co.uk>
Re: Relays & switches, reeds
  by "John Vanderlee" <jovanderlee@vassar.edu>
Re: OT: Finale98
  by <ComposerTX@aol.com>
Re: Organ samples
  by "Jason McGuire" <jason@johannus-norcal.com>
dream teams
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
music peformance
  by "domenico severin" <dseverin@club-internet.fr>
Re: OT: Finale98
  by <douglas@blackiris.com>
 


(back) Subject: RE: Just Curious ............ From: "Charles Brown" <clmoney@cybernex.net> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 06:12:31 -0400   I am a concert organist, pianist, and classical guitarist. I have a 4-manual Allen in my home and a Baldwin SD-10 piano.   Charles E. Brown http://www.classicalcorner.com   > -----Original Message----- > From: pipechat@pipechat.org [mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org]On Behalf Of > Ron Pearcy > Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 1:32 PM > To: PipeChat > Subject: Just Curious ............ > > > Hey all, > > I'm a little curious as to how many of you are church > organists, concert organists, choir directors or organ enthusiasts. Also, > out of the organists, what type of instruments do you have in your home to > practice on? > > Carlo > > P.S. I have a Rodgers 960 (3-manual) > > ----------------- end copy ----------------- > > Greetings Carlo, > > What a good response you have had .. .. > I too use a Rodgers, an 805B, but would prefer a 960 if I could > afford it. > Have configured to Theatre and Classical Organ and use a slaved Roland > digital piano. > Also use 3x Kurzweil K2500 rack synths and feed in 191 ranks of > classical/theatre samples from the Kurz to the organ's eight channels. > Have already spent over 4000 hours programming this so far and the task is > still not complete. > The combined sounds are quite magnificent. > > No, I am not a church person .. .. .. :-) > > Ronnie > > -- > ----- Ron Pearcy <ronniep@clear.net.nz> 17 Donegal > Crescent, > Greenswood, Greenmeadows, > Napier, New Zealand ------- > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >    
(back) Subject: Re: solos for pedals From: domenico severin <dseverin@club-internet.fr> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 16:14:22 +0200   I have a copy of variations on a theme by paganini. Novello Editions I can send it to you if you want. domenico SEVERIN  
(back) Subject: Stücke fur die Flötenuhr From: "Carlo Pietroniro" <concert_organist@hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:31:56 EDT   Hey gang,   say   Carlo     ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com  
(back) Subject: Stücke fur die Flötenuhr From: "Carlo Pietroniro" <concert_organist@hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:32:00 EDT   Hey gang,   say   Carlo     ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com  
(back) Subject: Organ samples From: "Matthew J. Baker" <poinsettia@netxn.com> Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 07:59:52 -0700   I posted a while back on a digital organ I'm working on (which has gotten nowhere since then) and samples. I too am rather badly in need of and have done quite a lot of searching for samples of stops and ranks but have found nothing really useful.   What I would really like to do is start up a project on the Web for collecting samples of as many different kinds of stops as possible, for the benefit of those wanting to make samples for their synths as well as for non-organists who want to know what certain individual stops sound like (such as myself). A while back I ran across the Sound Canvas Pipe Organ Project ( http://www.scpop.de/ ) which involves collecting samples but it's (infuriatingly) a specialized project only for the Roland Sound Canvas. I want to do something like this and put together what will be a totally exhaustive NO-NONSENSE collection of INDIVIDUAL samples of (ideally) EVERY single organ stop invented (of different styles as well, such as French, English, etc) that can easily be used for/with ANYTHING and isn't dependent on any one synth/setup (ordinary .wav's or mp3's). What I'd like to know is how feasible you think such a project is and how many of you would like to see such a collection or be willing to help out in putting one together. Personally I'd think there's a lot of organists and organ-enthusiasts who at one time or another would like to know the difference between a Trumpet and a Trompette, or a Premier Trompette and a Deuxieme Trompette, or a Spillfl=F6te and a Spitzfl=F6te = and a Starkfl=F6te, and so on, or wants to know what a Kinomoco or a K=E4lberregal or a Kinura or a Krumet Horn (you get the idea) actually sound like and would like a source where they can easily LISTEN for themselves instead of going by near-useless verbal descriptions. But as far as I've been able to tell nothing of the like exists, which is extremely unfortunate. What such a project would entail is getting a bunch of people to go to a bunch of different organs, setting up a mike or two (in different places to compensate for acoustics and nodes and antinodes) and a recorder and spending a couple hours at the organ recording one note at a time for 3-5 seconds each (just the C's and G's would probably be sufficient) with a few seconds of silence between each, one stop at a time, or at least those stops not already in the collection (by way of example, it's doubtful we would need samples from 50 different 8'-principal ranks, although I would like samples of any one stop from at least 3 different organs of each nationality/style to allow for differences in room acoustics and organ-builder and stuff). In a couple months or so I'll be getting samples from a 102-rank organ here in town (and maybe a 133-rank one in town also), which would make a good starting point with a lot of the more common stops (I have specs for each organ if you're interested). These samples wouldn't have to be anything mega-quality, just something with decent quality you can listen to to learn what a stop sounds like, or use as a decent basis for preparing a sample (see below).   I'm interested in what any of you think about such a project and if you'd be interested in helping out with getting samples. Personally this is something I would really like to see happen. Feel free to email me directly if you want. I only get the digest version of the list once a day so my responses to any posts on the list will be delayed a day or so.     I've been in contact with someone who has made a digital organ-of-sorts using synths, PC's and software synthesis. What he did (instead of using raw samples of pipes) is record some samples and separate the periodic (main tone and harmonic structure) and nonperiodic (the "chiff" or noise, I think he calls it "quasiperiodic") components of each sample and then manually reconstruct them, which according to him allows a lot of control over the quality of the sample and sounds better than a raw sample would. For those of you who use plain samples it's something you might be interested in.   One more thing--I might as well answer this question: Carlo Pietroniro wrote:   > Hey all, > > I'm a little curious as to how many of you are church organists, concert organists, choir directors or organ enthusiasts. Also, out of the organists, what type of instruments do you have in your home to practice on? > > Carlo > > P.S. I have a Rodgers 960 (3-manual)   Right now I'm not an organist (or a musician--yet), just an enthusiast. I've been interested in organs since I was 4--I'm now 25--I think it's time I started playing... I don't have an organ so I'm building a digital one which will be made of ordinary PCs and use software synthesis (in other words most of it will just be programmed). Now if only I had samples...   -- < Transmit src: poinsettia@netxn.com ID1 LCARS Channel 1 Lineout >   <YuSeEkMeAtNo31101993 http://www.netxn.com/~poinsettia/index.html>        
(back) Subject: Re: Organ samples From: Adam and Christine Levin <levins@westnet.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:11:33 -0400 (EDT)   On Thu, 22 Apr 1999, Matthew J. Baker wrote: > What I would really like to do is start up a project on the Web for > collecting samples of as many different kinds of stops as possible, for [...] > What I'd like to know is how feasible you think such a project is and > how many of you would like to see such a collection or be willing to > help out in putting one together.   I'd love to have something like this at my disposal. I'd also love to help out. However, here are some issues:   1) Copyright/patent -- organbuilders work hard to create their instruments, and the sounds that they voice the pipes with are their own. They might not take kindly to you making those sounds available free. 2) Usefullness -- just how usefull will these samples be? It's nice to have lots of samples for your (or anyone else's) digital instrument, but if 500 different people sample 500 different ranks with 500 different microphones and 500 different recorders and so on, you may not end up with a large enough useful set of *uniform* samples. Acoustics and such will also play a large role in what these samples will sound like. Probably you'd want samples as close to the organ pipes as possible and as directional as possible so that they're as dry as possible. Then you could add the effects you need later.   > recording one note at a time for 3-5 seconds each (just the C's and G's > would probably be sufficient) with a few seconds of silence between   That again depends -- if you're going to go to the trouble, the *right* way would be to sample every note. Pitch shifting is good, but it's not great.   > for each organ if you're interested). These samples wouldn't have to be > anything mega-quality, just something with decent quality you can listen > to to learn what a stop sounds like, or use as a decent basis for > preparing a sample (see below).   To prepare a sample for use in a digital instrument, the samples *must* be better than just "decent quality". To just hear an example, decent quality is good enough.      
(back) Subject: dream teams From: "Carlo Pietroniro" <concert_organist@hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:22:20 EDT   Hey all,   this thread should be a lot of fun! I'm interested in knowing who your "dream team" would be. Basically, any organist, pianist playing with/for any soloist, instumentalist or orchestra. I'd like to see:   1) a trio featuring Power Biggs, Virgil Fox and Diane Bish 2) a duet featuring Diane and Simon Preston (although it's been done before, I'd like to see it again) 3) Diane and Zamfir (it's also been done) 4) Marie-Claire Alain & Gillian Weir 5) Marice & Marie-Madeleine Duruflé 6) Fred Swann & Peter Biacchi (it's been done before) 7) Virgil & Liberaci (it's been done too) 8) Van Cliburn & Liberaci 9) Catherine Crozier & Virgil 10) any organist with the Boston Pops!   We know that most of these will never happen, but it's good to dream.   Carlo   ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com  
(back) Subject: Re: just curious........... From: "Russell Greene" <russg@cyberspc.mb.ca> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:32:24 -0500   Carlo wrote: > I'm a little curious...   -------- I've been a church organist and choral director most of my life. Coming out of the Cathedral boy's choir, I was mentored by a wonderful choirmaster who quite literally changed my life when he decided I should learn to play the organ. Got my first church, with a 13 rank, 13 stop "Canadian Pipe Organ Co." organ at the age of 13. A year later, became choral director as well, with a 30 voice, large repertoire choir.   Forty years and six parishes later, I've played a wide variety of pipe and digital organs both in Winnipeg and, facilitated by one of my day jobs, in over forty countries on every continent except Antarctica.   At home, I have an Allen 301 organ (MIDI-ized), a Kurzweil 2500 sampler, Kurzweil PC-88 and Pro1200 synthesizers as well as several older keyboards, all networked to a Macintosh G3 running, mainly, Mark of the Unicorn MIDI software, including DIgital Performer, Mosaic, Unisyn and FreeStyle. I've also used Finale (in fact, was the first Coda dealer in Manitoba, but that's another story...). I've been a MIDI user since its inception and was a Registered Macintosh Developer right from 1984. By the way, I use PC's and Windows in various aspects of my day jobs but long ago concluded that for anything creative, specifically music, multimedia, web design and publishing, PC's are simply more trouble than they're worth. Mac's are easy, consistent, use less keystrokes, have a faster learning curve and now are more powerful as well.   My current church, two blocks from home, has a decent Allen and a more than decent choir, as well as a Kurzweil PC-88 for happy clappies. I'm in the process of mounting the Kurzweil on top of the Allen, rebuilding the music rack, etc. I'll let you know how that goes.   All in all, the organ and choirs have been a wonderful adjunct to my life. I've been able to do it all these years while achieving considerable success as a "high-powered" executive, with all the stress and time pressures that come with such positions. It was my part-time job when I was paying my way through college, it was how I met my wife and got to know her, it has been my creative outlet. What a trip!  
(back) Subject: Re: just curious From: John Vanderlee <jovanderlee@vassar.edu> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:55:24 -0500   Well, let's see now.   I love Music and I am an organ enthusiast of the hobby variety. My playing skills are not suitable for public consumption, but an interest (and career) in Electronics, Audio and Mechanics led me to rebuild a Wurlitzer for a theater, and am currently doing a second one for a high school. I love organ music of all varieties and built speakers especially to be capable of reproducing 32' stops. (I play the CD player extremely well).   Secondarily I am a very vocal proponent for anything related to pipe organs and the propagation/preservation there-of. In that vein I am on the board of Directors of the New York Theatre Organ Society , and have been its chairman in the past. I subscribe to almost all organ publications.   And, oh yes, my wife is an organist.   'nuf tooting my own horn,   John V      
(back) Subject: Re: dream teams From: DRAWKNOB@aol.com Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:55:57 EDT   In a message dated 4/29/99 10:23:28 AM Central Daylight Time, concert_organist@hotmail.com writes:   << this thread should be a lot of fun! I'm interested in knowing who your "dream team" would be. Basically, any organist, pianist playing with/for any soloist, instumentalist or orchestra. I'd like to see: >>   J.S. Bach vs. G.F. Handel in an organ duel!   John  
(back) Subject: OT: Finale98 From: douglas@blackiris.com Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 11:38:43 -0500   Does anyone use Finale98? I have a rather esoteric question - when you choose the "page view" option - is there any way to display in legal landscape mode on the screen rather than portrait letter? I know you can change the printing options to print such, but can find no reference to changing the page display mode in any of the docs.   Thanks - Douglas McMurry <douglas@blackiris.com>   "Minds are like parachutes, they only function when open"  
(back) Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_St=FCcke_fur_die_Fl=F6tenuhr?= From: "Richard Pinel" <rpinelchat@musicman123.freeserve.co.uk> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 18:21:00 +0100   >Hey gang, > > I just love the "Flute Clock" pieces by Haydn. With all the 'big' pieces played in concert, it's always nice to take a break from the massive strains of Widor, Bach and Vierne, and play the delicate music of these tiny little instruments. I always play them in concert (usually 4 or 5 selections). The audiences love them, and so do I. Do any of you play them? They're becoming harder and harder to find. As the years go on, more and more "gems" vanish off the face of the earth. It kind of makes me wish I was born 20 years earlier. I'd love nothing more than to have lived at a time when the 3 gurus were concertizing (Biggs, Fox and Bish). Can you imagine if Biggs & Fox were still with us? WOW!!! What a rush! I can see it now....."Organ Concert featuring Power Biggs, Virgil Fox and Diane Bish". Talk about a trio.........Can you imagine a stage with 3 organs side by side, with all 3 of them playing together? Now THAT would be a concert to end all concerts. Needless to say > >Carlo >     Well how about a concert of trio improvisations with Vierne, Dupre and Cochereau (I know it would need some sort of handy time machine!!!)   Richard. =========================================================   This message was sent to you by Richard Pinel. rpinel@musicman123.freeserve.co.uk   If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.      
(back) Subject: Re: Relays & switches, reeds From: John Vanderlee <jovanderlee@vassar.edu> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 13:35:00 -0500   >>Do you still have the three Klann gang switches available. Sincerely, Paul >>P. Valtos > >Yes, we do. > >John V. >   would you like to have them?   John V      
(back) Subject: Re: OT: Finale98 From: ComposerTX@aol.com Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:01:20 EDT   Douglas, simply change your page size to 8 1/2 by 14. Danny Ray  
(back) Subject: Re: Organ samples From: "Jason McGuire" <jason@johannus-norcal.com> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 12:17:11 -0700   Hi Matt,   I have some thoughts to share with you on this:   - I want to do something like this and put together what will be >a totally exhaustive NO-NONSENSE collection of INDIVIDUAL samples of >(ideally) EVERY single organ stop invented (of different styles as well, >such as French, English, etc) that can easily be used for/with ANYTHING >and isn't dependent on any one synth/setup (ordinary .wav's or mp3's). >What I'd like to know is how feasible you think such a project is   A collection as large as this, if you really mean every organ and pipe ever built, would probably be impossible to do. Some churches just won't let you do it. I know of a few attempts that were not accepted by the church involved. As another writer also posted, the equipment used (microphone, recorder) as well as the sampling rate has a lot to do with what the end result is as does WHERE the sample is taken (how close to the pipe). It might be useful, for a project like this, to determine a what a manageable number of organs would be and which ones would give the best representative cross-sampling of sounds. It would also be important to determine the criteria for taking the samples: microphone, recorder, sampling rate, etc., so things are done consistently. It should be about 5 seconds in length, maybe 6, and should result in a sample that would allow whoever wants to us= e it to choose the manner in which he wants to use it: i.e., an exact reproduction of the sound produced by the pipe or a digital synthesis of it= ..   Personally I'd think there's a lot of >organists and organ-enthusiasts who at one time or another would like to >know the difference between a Trumpet and a Trompette, or a Premier >Trompette and a Deuxieme Trompette, or a Spillfl=F6te and a Spitzfl=F6te and >a Starkfl=F6te, and so on, or wants to know what a Kinomoco or a >K=E4lberregal or a Kinura or a Krumet Horn (you get the idea) actually >sound like and would like > The big challenge here is that the stop name may or may not correspond to the pipe. For example, a Trumpet and a Trompette may be almost the same thing or may be entirely different, depending on the builder and the country. Trumpet could be an American Trumpet, an English Trumpet and a Trompette could be French as built by a French builder or as built by an American builder. They could and most likely would all be different. "Trompette" is French for "Trumpet." Even if ten American builders set out to build a French Trompette you could easily have TEN different ones. Havin= g samples of all may not be worth the effort. One has to be careful which ranks are combined with other ranks when building an ensemble or the result= s could be awful. Premier and Deuxieme Trompettes simply means 1st and 2nd Trumpets. It just means one is probably of a smaller scale than the other o= r perhaps that one is English in tone and the other French. It all depends on the builder and what he was trying to accomplish. How each one sounds will depend on how the builder constructed and voiced the pipes and one builder'= s concept will likely be different from another's ... that's not a right or wrong, just that we have a relatively limited number of names for what really amounts to a very vast range of tonal possibities within any given stop name.   >I've been in contact with someone who has made a digital organ-of-sorts >using synths, PC's and software synthesis. What he did (instead of >using raw samples of pipes) is record some samples and separate the >periodic (main tone and harmonic structure) and nonperiodic (the "chiff" >or noise, I think he calls it "quasiperiodic") components of each sample >and then manually reconstruct them, which according to him allows a lot >of control over the quality of the sample and sounds better than a raw >sample would. For those of you who use plain samples it's something you >might be interested in.   While I do not have access to recording equipment at this time (who knows what the future holds) I could be interested in a library of high quality samples using top notch recording (DAT) equipment and high sampling rate (a= t least 20MBit). Keep me posted on how you proceed with this and I'll be happ= y to contribute where I am able to.   Jason McGuire >  
(back) Subject: dream teams From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 14:56:56 -0500   I didn't know Virgil Fox and Liberace performed together. That must have been amazing. Tell me more. When...where? I came along in 1951. I for one would have liked to see George Wright and Virgil Fox together, but perhaps ego's would have clashed.   Rick dutchorgan+AEA-svs.net Cuckoo clocks make great wedding gifts      
(back) Subject: music peformance From: domenico severin <dseverin@club-internet.fr> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 22:00:32 +0200   Dear pipelist friends, I wish to have a concert tour in USA or/and Canada for next year, 2000 ! I'm concert organist and church organist near Paris . If you want to know more about me (studies, performances, ....) you can go to the WEB page http://perso.club-internet.fr/dseverin/ You can contact me in e-mail for any request or information: dseverin@club-internet.fr I hope that it will be possible to have this GREAT experience... because I think that the american public is very nice!! For the concert tour i suggest this programms: For the concert tour i suggest this programms: PROGRAMMA N. 1 : IL VIRTUOSISMO ALL'ORGANO PROGRAMMA N. 2 : DEUX MAITRES DE L'ORGUE FRAN=C7AIS Franck; Messiaen PROGRAMMA N. 3 : LES GRANDES " VIRTUOSO " FRAN=C7AIS PROGRAMMA N. 4 : LE POEME SYMPHONIQUE POUR ORGUE : Franck, Liszt, Reubke PROGRAMMA N. 5 : MARCO-ENRICO BOSSI (75=B0 ANNIVERSARIO DALLA MORTE)=20 PROGRAMMA N. 6 : JOHANN SEBASTIAN BACH (250=B0 ANNIVERSARIO DALLA MORTE) PROGRAMMA N. 7: LE ROMANTISME ALLEMAND : Mendelssohn, Brahms For more specifications, please contact me DOMENICO SEVERIN dseverin@club-internet.fr  
(back) Subject: Re: OT: Finale98 From: douglas@blackiris.com Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 15:09:02 -0500   I tried that but it didn't change the full page screen view - only the printing.   > > Douglas, simply change your page size to 8 1/2 by 14.     - Douglas McMurry <douglas@blackiris.com>   "Minds are like parachutes, they only function when open"