PipeChat Digest #665 - Thursday, January 21, 1999
 
Cheap Hammond/2 tone cabinets
  by <JCarington@aol.com>
test
  by <danbel@earthlink.net>
Frantic stories
  by "B. Durden" <brendadurden@franticorganist.com>
Re: test
  by "Stanley King" <seking@inforamp.net>
DJB'S "test"
  by "Kevin Cartwright" <kevin1@alaweb.com>
Haskellizing Pipes
  by "Nicholas A Hall, Jr." <tremulants@juno.com>
Frantic Story
  by "Nicholas A Hall, Jr." <tremulants@juno.com>
Re: Frantic Story
  by "Robert  Eversman" <highnote@mhtc.net>
Re: Frantic stories
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: Frantic stories
  by "Travis Evans" <tle6399@seward.cune.edu>
Re: DJB'S "test"
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: Haskellizing Pipes
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Re: Frantic Story
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@truelink.net>
Re: Frantic Story
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
Frantic stories
  by "Judy A. Ollikkala" <71431.2534@compuserve.com>
Ray in Sugarland
  by "bruce cornely" <cremona84000@webtv.net>
 


(back) Subject: Cheap Hammond/2 tone cabinets From: JCarington@aol.com Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 09:42:09 EST   Let my need for space be your good fortune.   I need to get rid of a nice H-182 with two Series 10 tone cabinets. Series 10's have vertical louvers a la X-66 but in a smaller package.   The organ works fine. I do not have connectors for the tone cabinets, but they all came from the same source.   The organ is located in Chesterton, Indiana and I will deliver it to your curb, with the tone cabinets, anywhere around Chicago for $500 OR BEST.   Act now and I'll throw in the owner's manual and a campy Model H color sales brochure.   You unload.   John Carington JCarington@aol.com (NIGHTS & WEEKENDS) john@inemanltd.com (DAYS)  
(back) Subject: test From: danbel@earthlink.net Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 17:05:09 -0500   test    
(back) Subject: Frantic stories From: "B. Durden" <brendadurden@franticorganist.com> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 16:05:12 -0800   Hi, I am looking for real life stories of church musicians for my web site/catalogs and also a book I am compiling of Frantic stories. Here is a sample: My good friend was turning pages for me at my masters recital. I was playing the Toccata by Guillou. In one section I pressed the sw to gt couplers with the toe stud and it didn't work so I yelled (for the organ was full) "swell to great". My friend thought, "how odd for Brenda to say how swell and great everything is in the middle of a piece.   I will send stories I use on my web site a free frantic mug. (logo can be seen at www.franticorganist.com)   Thanks so much, I look forward to your stories. Brenda Durden Publishing The Frantic Organist Music Shop www.franticorganist.com any music always 10% off    
(back) Subject: Re: test From: Stanley King <seking@inforamp.net> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 21:29:13 -0500     ok           At 05:05 PM 1/20/99 -0500, you wrote: >test > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > > > >    
(back) Subject: DJB'S "test" From: Kevin Cartwright <kevin1@alaweb.com> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 20:32:07 -0600   Wonderful Stan! I almost sent something like that myself. Dan: the list seemingly works fine. Why not create some constructive bull---- to talk about, and use that as a test, not "djb's one-worder?"   krc   Stanley King wrote: > > ok > > At 05:05 PM 1/20/99 -0500, danbel@earthlink.net wrote: > >test    
(back) Subject: Haskellizing Pipes From: "Nicholas A Hall, Jr." <tremulants@juno.com> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 19:57:34 -0700   Quite some time ago on PipeChat, I was learning quite a bit about using the Haskell priciple to shift the frequency of a pipe down.   I was wondering if any of you have done this OR if you can point me in the direction of some kind of reference. OUr head of music at the church is interested in learning about this and I can't discuss it with him with my limited knowlege.   Thanks, ....Nick   Theatre, Baroque or Cathedral... The pipe organ is God's gift to His children ----- Tremulants@juno.com -----   ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]  
(back) Subject: Frantic Story From: "Nicholas A Hall, Jr." <tremulants@juno.com> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 20:33:29 -0700   First of all, let me point out that, in the grand scheme of things, I am NOT a church organist...   In my late teens, I played organ at Ft. Brag, NC at three (3!!!!) different churches, comprising 9 services, each Sunday. I played a three manual pipe organ at one, a Wurlitzer electronic at another and a Hammond C3 at the last (assuming you accept the postulate that a Hammond is an organ!). These were Catholic services and I had NO idea what the hymns were supposed to sound like. All I was given was a melody line in a "Misselette" (sp?).   Each Thursday, I would go to one of the churches and get the misselette and come home and practice - basically using the melody line as if it were a poor man's fake book. I guessed at the accompaniment (and managed to fool most of the people most of the time!).   I was at the Hammond and was playing as the priest was leaving the sanctuary. Basically, I was improvising and there was no singing involved.   Two young men (roughly 12 years old) were approaching me with the goal of using their "snuffers" to extinguish the candles. Apparently one of them had not completed basic walking classes.   As he walked by me, his foot became entangled in the power cord leading into the console of the C3 and he yanked it out of the wall plug!!! Sensing disaster, I ran over to the wall, plugged it back in, and raced back.   Now - those of you who have had the pleasure of playing a pre-electronic Hammond know that they consist of a motor that turns tone wheels. This motor is synchronous and must "sync" to the 60-cycle AC current to maintain a nice, steady pitch.   As I returned to the console, I remembered this and hit the "start" switch and listened as the motor came back up to speed. However, I didn't guess quite right and flipped the "run" switch before it had actually "synced"!!!   As soon as I hit the first note, I knew I should have called in sick. Imagine being incredibly drunk and either listening to or playing a Hammond. The motor was trying to do its best to sync, but kept "hunting" - speeding up and slowing down. You can experience my horror by putting an Eddie Layton record (remember Eddie Layton? Remember RECORDS???) on a turntable, but don't put the hole on the spindle - let it run off-center and listen to it.   The congregation exploded into laughter.   Now - if this wasn't enough, my intrepid candle-killer, totally embarrassed by what had happened, turns around and runs headlong into the 6-foot tone cabinet with - you guess it - REVERB SPRINGS!!!   Pandemonium broke out! I've never seen so many people laughing to the point of tears. Talk about going out with a bang!!! As they were retreating from the sanctuary, they were regaled with the sounds of a drunk organist playing in a severe thunder storm.   No THAT, my dear friends, is a frantic experience!!!!   ....Nick   Theatre, Baroque or Cathedral... The pipe organ is God's gift to His children ----- Tremulants@juno.com -----   ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]  
(back) Subject: Re: Frantic Story From: "Robert Eversman" <highnote@mhtc.net> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 22:09:10 -0600   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=_NextPart_000_01BE44C1.815D39E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   wow, I'm glad my Wicks can't do that !!   ---------- > From: Nicholas A Hall, Jr. <tremulants@juno.com> > To: pipechat@pipechat.org > Subject: Frantic Story > Date: Wednesday, January 20, 1999 9:33 PM > > First of all, let me point out that, in the grand scheme of things, I am > NOT a church organist... > > In my late teens, I played organ at Ft. Brag, NC at three (3!!!!) > different churches, comprising 9 services, each Sunday. I played a three > manual pipe organ at one, a Wurlitzer electronic at another and a Hammond > C3 at the last (assuming you accept the postulate that a Hammond is an > organ!). These were Catholic services and I had NO idea what the hymns > were supposed to sound like. All I was given was a melody line in a > "Misselette" (sp?). > > Each Thursday, I would go to one of the churches and get the misselette > and come home and practice - basically using the melody line as if it > were a poor man's fake book. I guessed at the accompaniment (and managed > to fool most of the people most of the time!). > > I was at the Hammond and was playing as the priest was leaving the > sanctuary. Basically, I was improvising and there was no singing > involved. > > Two young men (roughly 12 years old) were approaching me with the goal of > using their "snuffers" to extinguish the candles. Apparently one of them > had not completed basic walking classes. > > As he walked by me, his foot became entangled in the power cord leading > into the console of the C3 and he yanked it out of the wall plug!!! > Sensing disaster, I ran over to the wall, plugged it back in, and raced > back. > > Now - those of you who have had the pleasure of playing a pre-electronic > Hammond know that they consist of a motor that turns tone wheels. This > motor is synchronous and must "sync" to the 60-cycle AC current to > maintain a nice, steady pitch. > > As I returned to the console, I remembered this and hit the "start" > switch and listened as the motor came back up to speed. However, I > didn't guess quite right and flipped the "run" switch before it had > actually "synced"!!! > > As soon as I hit the first note, I knew I should have called in sick. > Imagine being incredibly drunk and either listening to or playing a > Hammond. The motor was trying to do its best to sync, but kept "hunting" > - speeding up and slowing down. You can experience my horror by putting > an Eddie Layton record (remember Eddie Layton? Remember RECORDS???) on a > turntable, but don't put the hole on the spindle - let it run off-center > and listen to it. > > The congregation exploded into laughter. > > Now - if this wasn't enough, my intrepid candle-killer, totally > embarrassed by what had happened, turns around and runs headlong into the > 6-foot tone cabinet with - you guess it - REVERB SPRINGS!!! > > Pandemonium broke out! I've never seen so many people laughing to the > point of tears. Talk about going out with a bang!!! As they were > retreating from the sanctuary, they were regaled with the sounds of a > drunk organist playing in a severe thunder storm. > > No THAT, my dear friends, is a frantic experience!!!! > > ...Nick > > Theatre, Baroque or Cathedral... > The pipe organ is God's gift to His children > ----- Tremulants@juno.com ----- > > ___________________________________________________________________ > You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. > Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html > or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > ------=_NextPart_000_01BE44C1.815D39E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><p><font size=3D2 = color=3D"#000000" face=3D"Arial">wow, I'm glad my Wicks can't do that = !!<br><br>----------<br>&gt; From: Nicholas A Hall, Jr. &lt;<font = color=3D"#0000FF"><u>tremulants@juno.com</u><font = color=3D"#000000">&gt;<br>&gt; To: <font = color=3D"#0000FF"><u>pipechat@pipechat.org</u><font = color=3D"#000000"><br>&gt; Subject: Frantic Story<br>&gt; Date: = Wednesday, January 20, 1999 9:33 PM<br>&gt; <br>&gt; First of all, let = me point out that, in the grand scheme of things, I am<br>&gt; NOT a = church organist...<br>&gt; <br>&gt; In my late teens, I played organ at = Ft. Brag, NC at three (3!!!!)<br>&gt; different churches, comprising 9 = services, each Sunday. &nbsp;I played a three<br>&gt; manual pipe organ = at one, a Wurlitzer electronic at another and a Hammond<br>&gt; C3 at = the last (assuming you accept the postulate that a Hammond is an<br>&gt; = organ!). &nbsp;These were Catholic services and I had NO idea what the = hymns<br>&gt; were supposed to sound like. &nbsp;All I was given was a = melody line in a<br>&gt; &quot;Misselette&quot; (sp?).<br>&gt; <br>&gt; = Each Thursday, I would go to one of the churches and get the = misselette<br>&gt; and come home and practice - basically using the = melody line as if it<br>&gt; were a poor man's fake book. &nbsp;I = guessed at the accompaniment (and managed<br>&gt; to fool most of the = people most of the time!).<br>&gt; <br>&gt; I was at the Hammond and was = playing as the priest was leaving the<br>&gt; sanctuary. = &nbsp;Basically, I was improvising and there was no singing<br>&gt; = involved.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Two young men (roughly 12 years old) were = approaching me with the goal of<br>&gt; using their &quot;snuffers&quot; = to extinguish the candles. &nbsp;Apparently one of them<br>&gt; had not = completed basic walking classes.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; As he walked by me, = his foot became entangled in the power cord leading<br>&gt; into the = console of the C3 and he yanked it out of the wall plug!!! <br>&gt; = Sensing disaster, I ran over to the wall, plugged it back in, and = raced<br>&gt; back.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Now - those of you who have had the = pleasure of playing a pre-electronic<br>&gt; Hammond know that they = consist of a motor that turns tone wheels. &nbsp;This<br>&gt; motor is = synchronous and must &quot;sync&quot; to the 60-cycle AC current = to<br>&gt; maintain a nice, steady pitch.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; As I returned = to the console, I remembered this and hit the &quot;start&quot;<br>&gt; = switch and listened as the motor came back up to speed. &nbsp;However, = I<br>&gt; didn't guess quite right and flipped the &quot;run&quot; = switch before it had<br>&gt; actually &quot;synced&quot;!!! = &nbsp;<br>&gt; <br>&gt; As soon as I hit the first note, I knew I should = have called in sick. <br>&gt; Imagine being incredibly drunk and either = listening to or playing a<br>&gt; Hammond. &nbsp;The motor was trying to = do its best to sync, but kept &quot;hunting&quot;<br>&gt; - speeding up = and slowing down. &nbsp;You can experience my horror by putting<br>&gt; = an Eddie Layton record (remember Eddie Layton? &nbsp;Remember = RECORDS???) on a<br>&gt; turntable, but don't put the hole on the = spindle - let it run off-center<br>&gt; and listen to it.<br>&gt; = <br>&gt; The congregation exploded into laughter.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Now - = if this wasn't enough, my intrepid candle-killer, totally<br>&gt; = embarrassed by what had happened, turns around and runs headlong into = the<br>&gt; 6-foot tone cabinet with - you guess it - REVERB = SPRINGS!!!<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Pandemonium broke out! &nbsp;I've never seen = so many people laughing to the<br>&gt; point of tears. &nbsp;Talk about = going out with a bang!!! &nbsp;As they were<br>&gt; retreating from the = sanctuary, they were regaled with the sounds of a<br>&gt; drunk organist = playing in a severe thunder storm.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; No THAT, my dear = friends, is a frantic experience!!!!<br>&gt; <br>&gt; ...Nick<br>&gt; = <br>&gt; Theatre, Baroque or Cathedral...<br>&gt; The pipe organ is = God's gift to His children<br>&gt; ----- <font = color=3D"#0000FF"><u>Tremulants@juno.com</u><font color=3D"#000000"> = -----<br>&gt; <br>&gt; = ___________________________________________________________________<br>&g= t; You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet = e-mail.<br>&gt; Get completely free e-mail from Juno at <font = color=3D"#0000FF"><u>http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html</u><font = color=3D"#000000"><br>&gt; or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO = [654-5866]<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &quot;Pipe Up and Be Heard!&quot;<br>&gt; = PipeChat: &nbsp;A &nbsp;discussion List for pipe/digital organs &amp; = related topics<br>&gt; HOMEPAGE : <font = color=3D"#0000FF"><u>http://www.pipechat.org</u><font = color=3D"#000000"><br>&gt; List: <font = color=3D"#0000FF"><u>mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org</u><font = color=3D"#000000"><br>&gt; Administration: &nbsp;<font = color=3D"#0000FF"><u>mailto:admin@pipechat.org</u><font = color=3D"#000000"><br>&gt; Subscribe/Unsubscribe: &nbsp;<font = color=3D"#0000FF"><u>mailto:requests@pipechat.org</u><font = color=3D"#000000"><br>&gt; </p> </font></font></font></font></font></font></font></font></font></font></f= ont></font></font></font></font></font></font></body></html> ------=_NextPart_000_01BE44C1.815D39E0--    
(back) Subject: Re: Frantic stories From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 23:30:02 -0500 (EST)   >I am looking for real life stories of church > musicians for my web site/catalogs and also a > book I am compiling of Frantic stories. Oh, hehehehe...... so now you're going to cause trouble on THIS list, too! ;-) I remember when I was playing in a church on a "3-slice toaster". On this particular model there is a little copper pin that holds the piston buttons in place. During the 11am worship one of the pins came loose and began "hopping around" as keys were released. Each time it would "hop" it would somehow make contact with the combination action and stops would be miraculously changing at will. I was almost a wreck, but the congregation just thought I was being creative.   Mug Please!!!!! ;-)   bruce cornely cremona84000@webtv.net    
(back) Subject: Re: Frantic stories From: Travis Evans <tle6399@seward.cune.edu> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 22:39:47 -0500 (CDT)       I have a friend who was playing for a service, and because he is quite tall, had to put 2x4's under the bench to make it high enough, well during the last verse of the last hymn he went to reposition himself on the bench and didn't realize thatone of the blocks were not perfectly under the bench, he started falling backwards, having to take his hands off the manuals to grab onto the console to keep himself from faling over the balcony railing. He was a little upset at the friend who had put the 2x4's under the bench, but was more scard of falling into the congregation.   Travis Evans   tle6399@seward.cune.edu tlevans@shawneelink.com   "When I hear music, I fear no evil"    
(back) Subject: Re: DJB'S "test" From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 23:58:47 -0500 (EST)     >At 05:05 PM 1/20/99 -0500, >danbel@earthlink.net wrote:   >test   OK! 2+6 = ?   hurry!   bruce cornely cremona84000@webtv.net    
(back) Subject: Re: Haskellizing Pipes From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 00:09:21 -0500 (EST)     >Quite some time ago on PipeChat, I was > learning quite a bit about using the Haskell > priciple to shift the frequency of a pipe down.   >Our head of music at the church is interested > in learning about this and I can't discuss it > with him with my limited knowlege.   If you have a pipe organ at your church it would be very easy to do (I think). I haven't tried this myself, but don't see why it wouldn't work. Select a pipe such as low C of the Principal 4, and get a cylinder roughly 2/3 the diameter of the Principal and about 3' long (you may have to experiment with the length). Seal off the end of the cylinder so that it's airtight (come to think of it, PVC probably would work quite well and the end cap is probably air-tight enough and could be easily made air-tight... anyway). While the pipe is playing (a carefully placed pencil at the console will do it!!) very carefully lower the cylinder into the pipe and notice the change of pitch. If the pipe quits speaking, carefully place your finger in front of the pipe mouth and move the cylinder gently up and down, being careful not to touch the pipe, AND DON'T DROP IT, THAT WOULD BE VERY VERY BAD!!! Good luck and let me know if it works. Organ builders types please opine on this from an experimental point of view; don't both sending "you're full of @^#$&# messages, as I have quite an adequate collection already!) ;-)   bruce cornely cremona84000@webtv.net    
(back) Subject: Re: Frantic Story From: Bob Scarborough <desertbob@truelink.net> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 1999 21:23:11 -0800   Yes, I remember how an unsynched Hammond could really put a "spell" on things coming out of the tone cabinets!   I attended a Catholic high school, and being the only organ student in the lot, the priests always tapped me for playing for student body Masses. This barrel-ceilinged church was a big barn, but...for an organ, it had nothing more than a Hammond RT-3 with some HR-40 tone cabinets. These were installed in the semi-useless "chambers" that the architect had provided, and there were the guts of two more mounted in the wall high above the altar. I learned Hammond basically by practice and usage of Stevens Irwin's "Dictionary of Hammond Organ Stops". I got pretty good at using the drawbars to my advantage, and could pull off a fairly good organ tone with any Hammond.   Well, unfortunately, one day the student body had assembled in the nave, along with many parishioners for an Advent weekday Mass. The weather was frightfully stormy that day. It was communion time, and I was noodling a (what I thought until later) a nice improvisation based on "Veni veni, emanuel", when all of the sudden, a blinding flash and a ZZZZZZZ-BOOM!   The lights in the nave faltered, dimmed, then came back up. However, the poor run motor in the Hammond had been given just enough interruption to lose synch and did the most curious pitch-bending I'd heard to that time. Instinctively, I used the left hand to jam up the start switch, but, as was reported in an earlier post, didn't give it quite enough time to settle down. The pitch of the organ wandered drunkenly down, then slowly up, wavered around, then slooooowly back past union pitch and finally "latched in" about 20% too fast! Yup, they'll do that. I just kept playing, amid the titters, chortles and guffaws coming from the reverberant space below, until I could semi-gracefully end the mess and restart properly.   Afterwards, an indignant assistant pastor came to me and said, "And what do you think you were doing up there, anyway??" I calmly retorted, "Messiaen...like it?"   DeserTBoB          
(back) Subject: Re: Frantic Story From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 00:23:38 -0500 (EST)     >First of all, let me point out that, in the grand > scheme of things, I am NOT a church > organist... Well, after reading this I can't imagine why you would WANT to be... That is a scream... a three-snort-milk-through-the-nose belly-laugher. If you don't get a cup, NOBODY should!!! Those are two of the most wonderful things that Hammonds do. I used to have so much fun with the thunder-biz at wedding rehearsals: "If anyone knows any reason why these people cannot be joint in matrimony...." foot hits reverb unit.... "brumbleumblebulembule" and hysterical laughter through the room! ;-) The half-on effect was especially appreciated for the wedding processional rehearsal for the bride!   >These were Catholic services and I had NO > idea what the hymns were supposed to sound > like. No problem. It's been years and people still don't know what they're supposed to sound like! >All I was given was a melody line in a > "Misselette" (sp?). Normally it would be a Missalette, but on a military base I suppose Misselette would be appropriate! ;-) (it must be really late, all of those Missal, Missel, Missle words look wrong... time to hit the Nyquil!)   >using the melody line as if it were a poor > man's fake book. very poor... you don't even get CHORDS!!   bruce cornely cremona84000@webtv.net    
(back) Subject: Frantic stories From: "Judy A. Ollikkala" <71431.2534@compuserve.com> Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 00:27:33 -0500   I was playing services at two churches on Christmas Eve. part of a semi-combined parish. I was also Chair of the Flower Committee and had to bring all the poinsettia plants from one church to the other in between services, so people could take most of them home after the second service. The temperature was around 5 degrees, so I wrapped them up in plastic, put them in my warm car, and kept my car in my semi-heated garage for an hour or so until time to take them to the second (midnight) service. I was trying to be very careful not to get them chilled, and set them up in the sanctuary very nicely. About halfway through the service I went down to take Communion with the rest, and was aghast to see ALL of the poinsettias drooped and limp, they looked awful. I didn't know what I would tell the people who had paid for them, except the truth of the matter. They were so nice about it, and said "don't worry, it's OK". However, there were four people who had said they would leave their plants until Sunday morning before picking them up. The morning after Christmas I called the flower shop to see if they had any left, and they did, so I took the four that they had, they gave them to me for a pittance. You can imagine the people's faces on Sunday, when they found their plants to be almost as big as trees, four and five feet high, with tons of flowers!! They thought they had really gotten a bargain!!  
(back) Subject: Ray in Sugarland From: cremona84000@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Thu, 21 Jan 1999 02:01:18 -0500 (EST)   Sorry, lost Ray's e-mail address. Ray... please contact me! TY   bruce cornely cremona84000@webtv.net