PipeChat Digest #924 - Wednesday, June 16, 1999
 
Salve Mater misericordia in English
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
this 'n' that
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
OOOPS! Concordia's URL
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
Re: CONSOLE AVAILABLE -- ACT FAST!!
  by "Jason D. Comet" <bombarde8@juno.com>
Re: this 'n' that
  by "STRAIGHT" <STRAIGHT@infoblvd.net>
Re: Salve Mater misericordia in English
  by <CHERCAPA@aol.com>
Re: this 'n' that
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
Re: church musician as servant
  by <DRAWKNOB@aol.com>
Re: Salve Mater misericordia in English
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
dust-up over inadequate organ spec
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
Re: this 'n' that
  by "B. Durden" <brendadurden@franticorganist.com>
Re: this 'n' that
  by "STRAIGHT" <STRAIGHT@infoblvd.net>
Re: church musician as servant
  by <DRAWKNOB@aol.com>
Re: this 'n' that
  by "Stanley E Yoder" <syoder+@andrew.cmu.edu>
Re: Drinking and driving the organ
  by "bruce cornely" <rohrschok8@webtv.net>
Re: Drinking and driving the organ
  by "bruce cornely" <rohrschok8@webtv.net>
Re: this 'n' that
  by "bruce cornely" <rohrschok8@webtv.net>
Re: this 'n' that
  by "bruce cornely" <rohrschok8@webtv.net>
Apologies
  by <KriderSM@aol.com>
Re: Few!
  by "N Brown" <Innkawgneeto@webtv.net>
Re: Drinking and driving the organ
  by "N Brown" <Innkawgneeto@webtv.net>
Re: Drinking and driving the organ
  by "Karl E. Moyer" <kmoyer@marauder.millersv.edu>
Re: Drinking and driving the organ
  by "N Brown" <Innkawgneeto@webtv.net>
RE: Drinking and driving the organ
  by "Dennis Goward" <dgoward@worldnet.att.net>
 


(back) Subject: Salve Mater misericordia in English From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 12:30:47 -0700   OK, here's one for the RC organists over a certain age (grin): I need the text and the chant for "Salve Mater misericordia" (Carmelite melody) in English. I know it exists; we used to sing it at Holy Rosary in Cleveland, but I'll be darned if I can find it. The English starts "Sing to Mary, Mother most merciful", or something like that. I can remember the words in LATIN (of course), but not in English.   Thanks!   Bud    
(back) Subject: this 'n' that From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 15:07:18 -0700   Spent lunch time reading new catalogs ... Pepper Music http://www.jwpepper.com or satisfaction@jwpepper.com for e-mail just sent me a catalog called "Music Technology" that seems to bring together in one catalog ALL the music software I'VE ever heard of. Those of you who are considering notational or other music software might want to get a copy.   Concordia Publishing House http//www.cphmall.com or cphorder@cph.org for e-mail "Organ, Keyboard, and Instrumental Music" catalog has BUCKETS of short voluntaries (for those who were looking), both with and without pedals. And don't discount the ones without pedals ... a lot are pre-pedals English voluntaries that require considerable manual dexterity.   The choral catalog, with typical German thoroughness (yes, I know, there are other words for that ... grin) is a virtual encyclopedia of what the stylin' LCMS cantor needs in order to do church.   I finally decided to bite the bullet and buy Sibelius for music notation .... Finale causes me distress in the lower gastric tract (grin), along with the Gregorian notation (!) font from St. Meinrad Archabbey.   Anglican and RC musicians might want to look at their website,   http://www.saintmeinrad.edu/   .... there's lot of stuff that Collegeville DOESN'T offer in the way of liturgical music ... might even be some stuff that I can use at St. Matthew's. Leave it to the Benedictines to invent a computer typeface to write Gregorian Chant (grin)!   Cheers,   Bud    
(back) Subject: OOOPS! Concordia's URL From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 15:21:01 -0700   Doesn't seem to want to take what I posted ... try this:   http://www.cphnet.org/   Cheers,   Bud    
(back) Subject: Re: CONSOLE AVAILABLE -- ACT FAST!! From: "Jason D. Comet" <bombarde8@juno.com> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 07:18:02 -0400   I have always wanted a pneumatic console, however, It is just too far away. I am in Watertown, NY. How far is it from Denver, CO? I have relatives that live there. Maybe they could pick it up? I doubt it.   O Well, Good luck. I hope it isn't thrown out. If they are going to throw it out, If you can possibly store it, I'll see if I can possibly get it.     Jason Comet bombarde8@juno.com |\ Organist/Choir Director | | 2/22 M.P. Moller pipe organ O ~20 member choir   ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.  
(back) Subject: Re: this 'n' that From: "STRAIGHT " <STRAIGHT@infoblvd.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 19:36:07 -0400   Bud, what are the 42 volumes of hymn preludes? 42 volumes at 7.50 each? Concordia. Diane S. (straight@infoblvd.net)    
(back) Subject: Re: Salve Mater misericordia in English From: CHERCAPA@aol.com Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 19:46:17 EDT   Dear Bud, I've got it. Page 85 of the Pius X Hymnal. To the melody of = Salve Mater Misericordiae. Holy Mary, O Mother Merciful,/ God's Own Mother, O Mother Bountiful,/ Sinless Mother, O Mother beautiful,/ Joyous Mother, our =   gladness plentiful/, Holy Mary ! #2 stanza Virgin Mother, Immaculate thou art,/ O sinless Maid, most dear to Christ's Heart/,O Heaven's Queen, thou hast alone remained,/ Of all mankind. unsullied and unstained,/ Holy Mary! =   (repeat refrain) #3 stanza. Mary, fairest flower that e'er the world has seen,/ Thou Heaven's joy, O angel's lovely Queen; /All hearts be thine, O Mother of all grace;/ Bring them to God, O blessed of our race,/ Holy = Mary! (repeat refrain) I assume you have the music to this. Geez, you really are =   going Roman LOL. Sincerely, Paul. PS. How about the litany of the = saints in chant and in Latin???Te Rogamus audinos.  
(back) Subject: Re: this 'n' that From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 16:44:52 -0700   Yep, sure are. I don't know the series ... if you're interested, buy one = of the seasonal ones and see what it's like, and/or ask some of the Lutheran organists hereabouts.   Cheers,   Bud   STRAIGHT wrote:   > Bud, what are the 42 volumes of hymn preludes? 42 volumes at 7.50 each? > Concordia. > Diane S. > (straight@infoblvd.net) > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org    
(back) Subject: Re: church musician as servant From: DRAWKNOB@aol.com Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 19:54:12 EDT   In a message dated 6/14/99 4:52:52 PM Central Daylight Time, dougcampbell@juno.com writes:   << The Dir of Music ( PhD - Music) and the other choir dir (MMus) both express their severe concerns that this "new" spec is inadaquate. The Minister then accuses them of insubordination ! >>   Were they terminated also? If so, this sounds very familiar to me.   John  
(back) Subject: Re: Salve Mater misericordia in English From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 16:55:00 -0700     Think I might have to edit the text just a WEE bit, even for HIGH-CHURCH Anglicans (grin) ... I'd forgotten it was quite THAT flowery. Oh well, = it's a pretty melody ... I'll find SOMETHING to sing to it (grin).   Just finished writing the music for Sung Mattins ... the seminarians are = going to sing it every Friday at 6 a.m. (!). I'm SURE it'll be interesting (grin) = ... these guys sing like Teddy Roosevelt and the Rough Riders ... very = authentic, I'm SURE.   Interestingly enough, the obligation to say Divine Office (shortened = Anglican version: Mattins and Evensong) is still canon law in the Anglican = Catholic Church, at least for clergy in major Orders. The Rector has extended that = to the seminarians studying for the diaconate and/or the priesthood. They work = full-time during the day and meet for classes at night, so they only sing Evensong = on Wednesdays before class and Mattins on Fridays before their weekly = breakfast get-together; the rest of the time they say it privately. At least SO far = ... God help us! He'll probably want it DAILY before too long (grin).   I don't mind ... I'm up that early, and it's free breakfast.   Cheers,   Bud    
(back) Subject: dust-up over inadequate organ spec From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 17:06:13 -0700   If the Directors of Music WEREN'T terminated for "insubordination", it sounds to me like the best way to smooth feathers is to pay an outside consultant (perhaps there's a college nearby?) to sort things out.   The old rule of thumb was 200 seats, 20 ranks; 300 seats, 30 ranks ... but that's not very exact ... 20 might be too little for 200 seats; 30 is pretty generous for 300 seats. And extending it upward, you're not likely to get 50 ranks for 500 seats (grin).   But, as somebody pointed out, the issue is not number of ranks but placement, acoustics and VOICING. I have played old organs in CAVERNOUS RC churches where 20 ranks filled a church seating 700-1000 adequately if not earthshakingly. As long as there's a generously-scaled principal chorus 8-4-2-mixture and a really SOLID 16 in the pedal, and as long as the organ isn't buried in chambers, AND as long as the church doesn't have a 10-foot ceiling with wall-to-wall carpeting, all should be well. There IS a point beyond which 20 ranks can't be pushed and still be musical, but 20 ranks will do a LOT if the scaling and voicing is done to match the room.   I've found over time that the Powers That Be at St. Matthew's are a lot more likely to pay attention to an opinion they've had to PAY for, even if it only confirms what I've already told them for nothing ... we're doing that right now ... paying an acoustical consultant to tell them exactly what I told them two years ago. And when the time comes to do the organ, I'm sure it'll be the same. Oh well ... at least it gets DONE, and I'm proven right, eventually.   Cheers,   Bud    
(back) Subject: Re: this 'n' that From: "B. Durden" <brendadurden@franticorganist.com> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 17:17:07 -0700   Hi, The 42 Volumes differ in price. Some are $7.50, $8.00, $8.50, $11.50 = (v.11) thanks, Brenda Durden The Frantic Organist Music Shop brendadurden@franticorganist.com   -----Original Message----- From: STRAIGHT <STRAIGHT@infoblvd.net> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Tuesday, June 15, 1999 4:37 PM Subject: Re: this 'n' that     >Bud, what are the 42 volumes of hymn preludes? 42 volumes at 7.50 each? >Concordia. >Diane S. >(straight@infoblvd.net) > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >    
(back) Subject: Re: this 'n' that From: "STRAIGHT " <STRAIGHT@infoblvd.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 20:01:09 -0400   I'd like to find some sources for Protestant music of the same type. Baptist, Presbyterian, Methodist, etc. Either they're not online with the same presence as some other denominations, or I just haven't found them = yet. I have 4 volumes of the Parish Organist, but they're not quite the = same hymns. Close, similar, but just not the same. And some are the same with different names, and vice versa. Anybody have any sites I haven't found? Diane S. (straight@infoblvd.net)    
(back) Subject: Re: church musician as servant From: DRAWKNOB@aol.com Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 20:28:27 EDT   In a message dated 6/14/99 11:19:56 PM Central Daylight Time, ray_ahrens@hotmail.com writes:   << Just started at a church where the membership was ca. 900 two years ago, now it's down to 250. Better start checking the = AGO ads, have a feeling the checks will be bouncing any minute now. >>   Run for the hills and FAST !!! Does anyone on this list know of Mano Hardies and his shafting? He was at a then very large downtown church in Lansing, Michigan. He even fought for and got the old pipe organ replaced = by a new Jaeckel, only then to be fired after over 20 years of service when = the new senior pastor came in. Since then the music department is now = composed of five or six part time employees and TRYING to do the jobs that he alone =   did. The music program now sucks, the music quality sucks, the various choirs have either folded or diminished so much in size it's not even = funny, and the permanent endowment fund for the music program (big bucks) was drained my the new demon in the pulpit! Also, membership has dropped from =   nearly 1,000 to just under 600 (if my stats are still right). Some clergy =   just need to go back to Hell, from whence they came!   Sorry to wane on, but this thread has just brought back some bad, bad memories! Mano was my organ teacher when I was in high school and it just =   burns my bum the way they rewarded/stood by him ( tongue in cheek ) after over 20 years of excellent service...   John  
(back) Subject: Re: this 'n' that From: Stanley E Yoder <syoder+@andrew.cmu.edu> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 21:38:44 -0400 (EDT)   This may have been mentioned already: the CPH 42-vol. Hymn Prelude Series includes a prelude and intonation for every tune in LBW and LW, and published shortly after these two books were published. Of course, a great many of these tunes are a) not Lutheran in origin, and b) found in hymnals of many other denominations.   I've used the set for twenty years, especially for offertories (which in our parish need not be more than a minute or so), and for the intonations. It's decent gebrauchsmusik. Stan Yoder Pittsburgh  
(back) Subject: Re: Drinking and driving the organ From: rohrschok8@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 22:58:39 -0400 (EDT)     >Well, I have to take exception here, perhaps a > geographical or climatic exception. Here in > AZ, it is possible to lose body moisture just > sitting in an air conditioned room. Humidity is > usually in single digits, and most folks around > here are in an early state of dehydration.   >Many people (including me, now) carry a > bottle of water with them, and take a "plug on > the jug" frequently through the day. It's just a > fact of life here. Hmmm! Must be global warming! Have people always done this in AZ. I know in Fl it's a yuppieism of fairly recent origin. People are getting to soft. I remember when people could sit all the way through church without a drink of water or trip to the loo. ;-)   Bruce & the Baskerbeagles ~~+~~+~~ rohrschok8@webtv.net ~~+~~+~~   Barking dogs don't bite, but they themselves don't know it. -- Shalom Aleichem    
(back) Subject: Re: Drinking and driving the organ From: rohrschok8@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 23:09:19 -0400 (EDT)   >I agree, and find myself, to my astonishment, > in disagreement with Bruce C. for the very > first time ever. (sigh) Lost another one! ;-)   >Bruce, do you really think it looks bad to drink > water from a glass during a service? Absolutely! Even though I'm seldom seen without a cup of coffee (ask anyone at OHS) I wouldn't dream of having a cup at the console.   >Don't pastors/parsons/priests/clergypersons > often keep a glass of water at the pulpit (on a > concealed shelf, but available when they > need it)? Operative phrase being "when the NEED it". Besides, clergy are talking for twenty minutes straight, usually; although I've seen few clergy actually take a drink during a sermon. A former pastor of mine had the initials W.H.Y, and I got him a ceramic cup with the inscription WHY Holy Water on it. He would occasionally sneak a sip, but I never saw him do it in view of the congregation. I just don't think it's proper.   > I should think that many choristers would sing > better if they could drink a little h2o from time > to time, too. I think that's why God invented spit, er, saliva!   >Take a lesson, Bruce, from your dogs. If they > are anything like mine, they know their bodies > need constant liquid replenisment. They also get rid of it when they want to! Except in the house where it is inappropriate.   >I'm sure you keep water by them at all times. Noop! They do not have water available when they sleep out of their crates at night or when we travel in the car (we stop for water/pee brakes when travelling).   Bruce & the Baskerbeagles ~~+~~+~~ rohrschok8@webtv.net ~~+~~+~~   Barking dogs don't bite, but they themselves don't know it. -- Shalom Aleichem    
(back) Subject: Re: this 'n' that From: rohrschok8@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 23:15:58 -0400 (EDT)     Spent lunch time reading new catalogs ... Pepper Music http://www.jwpepper.com or satisfaction@jwpepper.com for e-mail just sent me a catalog called "Music Technology" that seems to bring together in one catalog ALL the music software I'VE ever heard of. Those of you who are considering notational or other music software might want to get a copy. Concordia Publishing House http//www.cphmall.com or cphorder@cph.org for e-mail "Organ, Keyboard, and Instrumental Music" catalog has BUCKETS of short voluntaries (for those who were looking), both with and without pedals. And don't discount the ones without pedals ... a lot are pre-pedals English voluntaries that require considerable manual dexterity.   Sibelius for music notation .. Finale causes me distress in the lower gastric tract (grin), along with the Gregorian notation (!) font from St. Meinrad Archabbey. Anglican and RC musicians might want to look at their website, http://www.saintmeinrad.edu/ ... there's lot of stuff that Collegeville DOESN'T   Bruce & the Baskerbeagles ~~+~~+~~ rohrschok8@webtv.net ~~+~~+~~   Barking dogs don't bite, but they themselves don't know it. -- Shalom Aleichem    
(back) Subject: Re: this 'n' that From: rohrschok8@webtv.net (bruce cornely) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 23:18:58 -0400 (EDT)   sorry for resending bud's "this n that" post. I was sending it to my printer, but his the send hey before changing the address. duh!   Bruce & the Baskerbeagles ~~+~~+~~ rohrschok8@webtv.net ~~+~~+~~   Barking dogs don't bite, but they themselves don't know it. -- Shalom Aleichem    
(back) Subject: Apologies From: KriderSM@aol.com Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 23:36:57 EDT   My apologies to the list for accidently sending two notices about the organist at the Ohio Theatre's Summer Movie Series. Fifty lashes with a wet noodle, and all that sort of thing!!! Stan Krider  
(back) Subject: Re: Few! From: Innkawgneeto@webtv.net (N Brown) Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 23:52:14 -0400 (EDT)   Now Bruce, Bruce, Bruce, doesn't your pastor have a glass of water on the pulpit in the unlikely event he gets dry? I didn't say I have a gargantuan disgusting plastic monstrosity advertising the latest fad to hit the stores. Just a small mug (given me by my choir, mind you, for such purposes), conveniently sitting to the right of the manuals in that open space where stop jambs would be, were I to have stop jambs (our organ has tabs, so the space is there). What a sacrifice this is, Bruce. I don't go anywhere without my Big Gulp of Diet Soda, but I won't bring myself to have it sitting at the organ during service. So, a polite mug of water must do. And, yes, Bruce, a couple of my choir members have been known to sneak water bottles into the chancel. I've never seen them use them--I'm very observant of chancel activity, you know. OUr chancel is very hot with little air circulation. It's either water in a mug, or organist in the mud about 6 feet or so. Enough for now. I'm sure you'll have a comeback 8-). --Neil    
(back) Subject: Re: Drinking and driving the organ From: Innkawgneeto@webtv.net (N Brown) Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 00:07:51 -0400 (EDT)   >> Many people (including me, now) carry a bottle of water with them, and take a "plug on the jug" frequently through the day. It's just a fact of life here. . . In this area, it's just good sense. <<   It would seem to make good sense in Florida, too. --Neil    
(back) Subject: Re: Drinking and driving the organ From: "Karl E. Moyer" <kmoyer@marauder.millersv.edu> Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 00:08:22 -0400 (EDT)     Perhaps others saw the article about the rebuilt Hill/George Sisxmith organ in St. Paul's at Newcastle-under-Lyme that, among several other curious things, has a stop called Tibia Liquida. To quote the article: "Draw the [stop] and a miniature cocktail cabinet is revealed, complete with essentials!" A picture shows two glasses and 6 small bottles. Hmmm.   The article was in the March '96 _Choir and Organ_. Yeah, O.K.; it takes a warped mind like mine to save such an article!! :-)   Drink & drive an organ??? Cordially,   Karl E. Moyer    
(back) Subject: Re: Drinking and driving the organ From: Innkawgneeto@webtv.net (N Brown) Date: Wed, 16 Jun 1999 00:24:26 -0400 (EDT)   Richard, been there, done THAT too. When I played at Big Large Baptist Church, sermons were always 45 minutes long at least--plenty of time for breakfast and be back for "Just As I Am." How amazing that you can do that across the pond, too!! --Neil    
(back) Subject: RE: Drinking and driving the organ From: "Dennis Goward" <dgoward@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 23:29:43 -0700   > Have people always done this in AZ.   Yeah, they've always been more water concious here. You can sweat without knowing it.   Dennis