PipeChat Digest #939 - Saturday, June 19, 1999
 
Half-trained organists vs. no organist
  by <KriderSM@aol.com>
Re: virtuosic hymn-playing, etc.
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@post.queensu.ca>
Re: treatment of choirs
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
Re: [organchat] choir versus organ (NOT!)
  by "Mark Checkley" <xcs53@dial.pipex.com>
Re: choir versus organ (NOT!)
  by "Mark Checkley" <xcs53@dial.pipex.com>
Re: St. Sulpice
  by "antoni scott" <ascott@epix.net>
Re: Hyfrydol
  by "Richard Scott-Copeland" <organist@x-stream.co.uk>
Re: Royal Wedding Music
  by "Richard Scott-Copeland" <organist@x-stream.co.uk>
Re: virtuosic hymn-playing, etc.
  by "Mark Checkley" <xcs53@dial.pipex.com>
volunteer vs paid organists
  by <KriderSM@aol.com>
 


(back) Subject: Half-trained organists vs. no organist From: KriderSM@aol.com Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 07:48:34 EDT   IMHO -I'd rather have Amy Grant than nothing at all. :-) Some cannot afford the Beverly Sills quality, and some youngster (in an = out of the way venue) hearing for the first time the Messiah sung by Amy Grant =   (the music often transcends the performer) might become so moved that they =   will want to learn more. They may even become an opera singer themselves.   I service the organ (a beautiful small Skinner) in a little country = church. Hard times has reduced the congregation to a few elderly folk, withn the youngest being in her fifties. The organ is quickly falling into = disrepair, yet it is THEIR organ. Their organist, likewise in the late 60s, does her best to work around the failing notes. A young fellow, grandson of one of = the parishners, volunteers his time whenever he is home to playing for the services.   I can imagine that Amy Grant singing the Messiah would be a great treat = for them. I, however, can afford front row loge seats at the local theatre whenever Beverly Sills come to town. Both experiences are equally grand, however.   Worship as with beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.   Stan Krider       ray ahrens recently wrote:   <snip> I'd rather hear Beverly Sills (most certainly Jewish) sing the soprano arias from Handel's "Messiah" over Amy Grant (most certainly CCM) = any day. Would even prefer Sandi Patti over Ms Grant. While it's important = that our hearts are in the right place, and that worshipping God is our primary =   goal, you need to have the musical skills if you're the one responsible = for the music leadership. <snip>    
(back) Subject: Re: virtuosic hymn-playing, etc. From: Bob Conway <conwayb@post.queensu.ca> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 07:49:17 -0400   At 11:13 AM 6/19/99 +0100, Mark Checkley wrote: >Boil your head. > >Mark Checkley.   Mark and others,   This sort of posting is unseemly and not needed by the list.   I have decided that I no longer want to read Mr. Checkley's blatherings, and he is now in my Filter list along with some others of similar = verbosity.   Bob Conway    
(back) Subject: Re: treatment of choirs From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 04:45:28 -0700       Mark Checkley wrote:   > How very insecure you must be, to need to launch > such a tirade !!   No, Mark, I'm not. As a matter of fact, last year at the Parish Meeting = when the pledges didn't come up to the projected budget, fifteen members of the = parish stood up and pledged the entire amount of my full-time (albeit modest) = salary on the spot. Within reason, I've gotten everything I've needed for the music program ... additional Leslies for the Hammond, paid section leaders for = Holy Week, a decent budget to buy music (this is a new parish in rented space = ... hence the Hammond and the lack of a choir library), a practice piano, = additional vestments, etc. etc. etc.   > Of course a Church Choir cannot be a democracy; > for the simple reason that it would take too long > to make the necessary decisions. > > HOWEVER the wise Choirmaster, whilst he may > ignore the whims of various INDIVIDUALS, does > not go against a CONSENSUS in an Adult, > AMATEUR organisation.   Nor do I ... when I wanted to re-introduce ruffs and Canterbury caps, I = got voted down, at least until my 75-year-old mezzo soloist (who's the DEAREST person in the world and a CRACKERJACK musician) retires. OK, fine; not = necessary to salvation.   > I am quite certain that my "back row" (2A, 3T, 5B) > would ALL have their feathers ruffled if required > to sing more than just the last verse in unison.   Mine could care less. Different strokes. End of story.   > So, being a SENSIBLE Choirmaster, with ENOUGH > Men in the Choir (but none too many) I don't rattle their > cages on the Altar of my own ego.   EVERY music program is a reflection of the tastes and personality of the organist/choirmaster to some extent ... ego, if you will. As to sensible, = I LISTENED to my choir and held back the Mozart until NEXT Pentecost. The = Rector wanted us to sing all summer; they said "no", and I backed them up.   > After all, as you rightly say, it's THEIR Church; all but > two of them pre-date me, and they have far more > right, when in CONSENSUS, to dictate policy than I .   They ALL predate me, some going back to the founding of the Parish = eighteen years ago. The choir has grown (and, I'd like to think, improved) under my direction; both they and I take lawful pride in their progress. But = POLICY, by the Canon Law of the Anglican Catholic Church (not to be confused with the American Episcopal Church or the Church of England and her various = daughter churches), belongs to the RECTOR, who may CHOOSE (and he does) to delegate = most day-to-day decisions to me. BOTH of us are bound by the rubrics of the old Prayer Book, which is our official Prayer Book.   But I cannot for the life of me see why unison singing is such a big issue = ... whenever we introduce a new hymn (which only happens about twice a year = ... they pretty much have the standard repertoire "down"), we ALWAYS sing it in = unison. If a hymn has a difficult tune, we sing in unison until the congregation = "gets going". That's just common sense.   As I indicated below, they sing a good deal of serious, complicated = polyphonic music and Gregorian Chant (which, horror of horrors, is not only in unison = but sung ANTIPHONALLY between the women and the men, so they don't get to = sing every verse of everything ... a complaint that I DID hear in a couple of = my former parishes), so it's not that we'd have to spend additional time = learning the parts in the hymns ... when parts are called for, they read them right = off.   There IS a danger in any dissident group such as ours of what we call the = "take my marbles and go home" syndrome. This parish has withstood a couple of = major upheavals caused by that kind of (dare I say) unchristian behaviour; as a = result they have a rather low opinion of ANYBODY who "has to have it their own = way".   My choir rehearses two and a half hours on Wednesday; during Advent and = Lent they rehearse an additional TWO hours after High Mass. The ONLY time = ANYONE misses rehearsal or service is if they're ill or out of town on business = ... and if they know they're going to be gone, they sign out on a sheet posted on the back of the organ console, so I'll know ahead of time if I'll be short of singers for a particular Sunday or Holy Day. I didn't have to lay down the = law to get that kind of cooperation ... I simply say (or THEY say), "we really = need some extra time to learn this or that", and they all show up. Every week. = Every Sunday. Every Holy Day. I must be doing SOMETHING right.   Cheers,   Bud   > > > Mark Checkley. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> > To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Date: Saturday, June 19, 1999 03:18 > Subject: Re: treatment of choirs > > >The choir's FIRST duty is to LEAD the congregation in the hymns and the > >Ordinary of the Mass. THAT they do by singing the tune (except in the > Gloria, > >which the CONGREGATION sings in parts). And they don't sing ALL the = hymns > in > >unison ... just the pro and the rec. The sermon hymn (when there is = one) > and > >the communion hymn they sing in parts. They also sing the Introit, = Gradual, > >Alleluia, Anthem, Communion, Psalm and Motet in parts, which is PLENTY = for > >them. > > > >Cheers, > > > >Bud > > > >P.S. - I'm old enough and big enough and ugly enough that choirs have > finally > >quit trying to blackmail me by "not standing" for this, that or the = other > >thing. Either they're there to sing for the glory of God (AND for me!), = or > >there's the door. My choir loves me, and I love them, but my choir loft = is > a > >benevolent dictatorship. In point of fact, THEY have asked a couple of > people > >to leave who thought to come in and "take over the music". On the other > hand, > >when they say "no" and I know that they really MEAN "no", I listen. I = asked > >them if we could pull off the Mozart "Veni Sancte Spiritus" for = Pentecost > >with extra rehearsals. They said, "no, we're tired; it's the end of the > >season; wait till the new open scores come in the Fall ... this old > >closed-score Kalmus edition is too hard to read." We have THAT kind of = give > >and take, but as to WHAT the music is (for the most part) and HOW it's = done > >... I'm not ABOUT to take a vote on how to arrange the antiphonal = singing > in > >the psalms -- I tell them what it's to be, and they do it. Ditto the = hymns. > >And I've NEVER been in a church (as a chorister OR an organist) where = it > was > >otherwise. And, incidentally, that is my MANDATE from the Rector. > > > >We have lots of fun; there's been exactly ONE dust-up in the choir in = the > two > >years I've been there, and it turned out it had to do with one of the > bass's > >meds being out of whack and had NOTHING to do with the music. They HAD = a > >musical troika (tenor soloist, choir director, organist) before I came; > >they're having NONE of music-by-committee (grin). If they don't like > >something, they SAY so, but it's THEIR church; they DON'T walk. And = usually > >if I explain "why", they go along. > > > >Cheers, > > > >Bud > > > >Mark Checkley wrote: > > > >> Don't think my Choir Men would be too happy about all that > >> unison hymnsinging. > >> > >> I certainly wouldn't stand for it, if I was in your Alto department = !! > >> > >> I would be inclined to wonder why I was there. > >> > >> MOC > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> > >> To: organchat <organchat@onelist.com>; pipechat = <pipechat@pipechat.org> > >> Date: Saturday, June 19, 1999 01:28 > >> Subject: treatment of hymns > >> > >> >Free hymn accompaniments, improvisations, modulations, etc. must be = in > >> >Anglicans' genes ... the first Sunday I played at St. Matthew's, I = did > >> >all of the above as a matter of course, and nobody batted an eye, = except > >> >to say, "Gee! That was exciting! The people really SANG!" Which, we > >> >should never forget, is the PURPOSE of flossying up the hymns in the > >> >first place. > >> > > >> >In fairness, most of my people are refugees from St. Luke's = Episcopal in > >> >Long Beach, which had a long and distinguished history of traditional > >> >Anglican service-playing and choir singing in the high Victorian = English > >> >style; and from Blessed Sacrament Episcopal in Placentia, which at = one > >> >time was an old-line Anglo-Catholic parish. So while they'd never = heard > >> >it AT ST. MATTHEW'S, they'd certainly HEARD it. > >> > > >> >We always sing the processional and recessional hymns in unison from > >> >start to finish ... I dislike hearing the parts go by if I'm sitting = in > >> >the congregation ... not unlike listening to the doppler effect of a > >> >train going by (grin) ... so I don't have to tell them ahead of time > >> >what I'm going to do in those. Occasionally I DO tell them if I'm = going > >> >to improvise a partita between verses of the communion hymn ... = their > >> >term for that (which I discovered written in their hymnals) is "Bud > >> >gonna go nuts" (grin). > >> > > >> >There's a fairly major (if short) improvisation after the Gospel = every > >> >Sunday (usually on the Alleluia melody) to get the Gospel procession > >> >back to the Sanctuary. I practically ALWAYS improvise the closing > >> >voluntary at Evensong, usually on the Office Hymn. > >> > > >> >I've gathered quite an audience for the closing voluntaries, both at > >> >Mass and at Evensong ... they come and sit in the choir stalls (if > >> >there's any room ... most of the choir stays as well) and in the = back > >> >pews, or just stand around the console. And this has occurred in a > >> >relatively short period of time since Easter last. I'm not PLAYING > >> >anything different ... I guess they just NOTICED (grin). > >> > > >> >I can't think of anything more BORING that playing ALL the verses of = ALL > >> >the hymns with the same harmonization, Hyfrydol included (grin). > >> > > >> >Cheers, > >> > > >> >Bud > >> > > >> > > >> >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > >> >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related = topics > >> >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > >> >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > >> >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > >> >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >> > > >> > >> "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > >> PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related = topics > >> HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > >> List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > >> Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > > > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org    
(back) Subject: Re: [organchat] choir versus organ (NOT!) From: "Mark Checkley" <xcs53@dial.pipex.com> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 12:39:12 +0100   Absolutely.   Herein, of course, the eternal "Pandora's box".   If you are the CHOIRMASTER, then THAT must be the priority, because you are leading a team of PEOPLE, which is a very complex exercise.   Historically the Church has often appointed excellent Organists with fine repertoire, and then just "assumed" that they will take charge of the Choir. That is silly, because they may not have any of the personal qualities necessary. This often leads to political disasters. It means that excellent organists who are poor Choirmasters find themselves having to do something at which they do not excel, to the detriment of their own satisfaction and that of the team. It also = means that people with a good knowledge of singing and Choir Training don't get asked to lead Church Choirs if they don;t also happen to be Organists. Waste of talent the Church can ill afford.   More enlightened Churches are, I find, beginning to view the Organist and Choirmaster functions as SEPARATE FUNCTIONS WHICH MAY OR MAY NOT BE DISCHARGED BY THE SAME PERSON, DEPENDING UPON WHO HAPPENS TO BE AVAILABLE.   I see increasing numbers of Advertisements in the appropriate publications for "a Director of Music with Choir Training experience, who may or may not also be an Organist", or "applications are invited from Organists and non-Organists alike".   That seems eminently sensible to me.   On another note, Bud, I notice that you comment that imperfect health has reduced your REPERTOIRE. What a sensible person you are, to reduce your repertoire rather than the standard of your playing.   The point I have been trying to make all along this debate is not that shoddy playing in Church is just fine and dandy, because I don't think it is. Rather that WE DON'T NEED MUCH, IF ANY, COMPLEX REPERTOIRE IN AN ORDINARY CHURCH, and, therefore, we don't usually need to "hire" people who can play the complete works of JSB without the score (and pay accordingly).   I don't think I very often play badly, but that is simply because I never attempt anything beyond my skill-base. There is PLENTY of meritorious but uncomplicated Organ Music, particularly in the Chorale Prelude department, which does the job very nicely without being technically demanding at all.   Kind regards, Mark Checkley.     -----Original Message----- From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> To: organchat <organchat@onelist.com>; pipechat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Saturday, June 19, 1999 11:57 Subject: [organchat] choir versus organ (NOT!)     >From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> > >I think I'm a moderately competent organist, albeit somewhat reduced in >repertoire due to age and infirmity. > >St. Matthew's has a perfectly DREADFUL digital Hammond/Suzuki at the >moment ... all the Leslies in the western WORLD aren't gonna redeem THAT >beast to any perceptible extent. The church is struggling to put the >financing package together for the new building; absent an "angel", it >looks like I'll be playing the Hammond for awhile, unless I bestir >myself to lead an organ "transplant". > >I have a REALLY fun choir, congenially crazy after the manner of >Anglican choir singers, who (as they say) don't have the good sense NOT >to tackle just about ANYTHING I put in front of them... I'm chewing on a >performance of Stainer's "The Crucifixion" for next Lent, or maybe >Maunder's "Penitence, Pardon and Peace" (!) ... anybody ever done THAT >one??!! > >As a result, I spend a LOT more time writing, arranging and researching >music for the choir, and relatively little time on the organ music. To >be sure, there's a respectable opening and closing voluntary every >Sunday, titles printed in the service list (and most of the time I >actually PLAY what I PRINT), but our people don't get there until five >minutes before service time, and it takes all of two minutes to empty >the church at the end, so organ literature isn't real high on my list of >priorities at the moment. > >Historically most Anglican organists have been good players, but the >"meat and potatos" of what I do is the choral SERVICE in all its >sometimes maddening complexity (and beauty). I see no reason to fault >other listmembers who can field the kinds of service lists I've seen >posted for Evensong (for instance), just because they're choirmasters >first and organists second. To my way of thinking, that SHOULD be the >order of importance, at least for an Anglican organist. > >Cheers, > >Bud > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >ONElist: the best source for group communications. >http://www.onelist.com >Join a new list today! >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >OrganChat, the Friendly List --- >http://organchat.virtualave.net >For moderator service, mailto:organchat@desertsounds.com    
(back) Subject: Re: choir versus organ (NOT!) From: "Mark Checkley" <xcs53@dial.pipex.com> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 12:41:34 +0100   A transplant is precisely what you require, thus saving some worthy instrument from disuse or worse, whilst equipping yourself appropriately at the same time.   Go for it.   MOC.   -----Original Message----- From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> To: organchat <organchat@onelist.com>; pipechat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Saturday, June 19, 1999 12:02 Subject: choir versus organ (NOT!)     >I think I'm a moderately competent organist, albeit somewhat reduced in >repertoire due to age and infirmity. > >St. Matthew's has a perfectly DREADFUL digital Hammond/Suzuki at the >moment ... all the Leslies in the western WORLD aren't gonna redeem THAT >beast to any perceptible extent. The church is struggling to put the >financing package together for the new building; absent an "angel", it >looks like I'll be playing the Hammond for awhile, unless I bestir >myself to lead an organ "transplant". > >I have a REALLY fun choir, congenially crazy after the manner of >Anglican choir singers, who (as they say) don't have the good sense NOT >to tackle just about ANYTHING I put in front of them... I'm chewing on a >performance of Stainer's "The Crucifixion" for next Lent, or maybe >Maunder's "Penitence, Pardon and Peace" (!) ... anybody ever done THAT >one??!! > >As a result, I spend a LOT more time writing, arranging and researching >music for the choir, and relatively little time on the organ music. To >be sure, there's a respectable opening and closing voluntary every >Sunday, titles printed in the service list (and most of the time I >actually PLAY what I PRINT), but our people don't get there until five >minutes before service time, and it takes all of two minutes to empty >the church at the end, so organ literature isn't real high on my list of >priorities at the moment. > >Historically most Anglican organists have been good players, but the >"meat and potatos" of what I do is the choral SERVICE in all its >sometimes maddening complexity (and beauty). I see no reason to fault >other listmembers who can field the kinds of service lists I've seen >posted for Evensong (for instance), just because they're choirmasters >first and organists second. To my way of thinking, that SHOULD be the >order of importance, at least for an Anglican organist. > >Cheers, > >Bud > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >    
(back) Subject: Re: St. Sulpice From: antoni scott <ascott@epix.net> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 07:52:43 -0400   Only in France:   My visit to St. Sulpice in 1982 was equally as inspiring. The day before my scheduled visit, I went to St. Sulpice to look around. There was a wedding going on and a curator closed the doors after the last person entered and then he tapped his cane on the ground as a signal to Grunenwald to start playing upstairs. I asked the curator if I could go upstairs and he replied that "no-one" is allowed up there. The following day I met both organ curators and got the grand tour of the organ and a chance to play it for at least an hour. Another organist from Belgium was there so we shared the time. We were able to climb to the very top of the organ where the Trompette Chamade is located nia a ladder that can be seen on the far left of any photograph of the organ casework. The organ is an absolute mechanical marvel with its Barker lever action and long trackers. Everything was working perfectly. A small room on the console level had some old black and white photo's on the wall of Widor himself, plus his desk where he used to sit and work. Very nostalgic.     Antoni   Jason McGuire wrote: > > Yes, only in France ... I know certain Cathedral near where I live where = the > organist would probably not even speak to you ... and allow you near the > console AFTER the service? maybe after he's left the chancel ... get a > chance to play it or talk to him about it, NOT likely. It's treated like > personal property. > > > Only in France. Speaking of civility, when I was in Paris in 1976 and = visited > > St. Sulpice one Sunday morning, Messieur Grunewald (Dupre successor) = greeted > > those of us waiting at the door to the steps to the loft and invited = us to > join > > him in the loft whilst he played Mass. I noticed in the stairway, = just before > > entering the loft, that there was a urinel (how thoughtful). He was = very > > charming and between playing inquired about where everyone was from = and what > was > > their background. Each time, just before he played, he would = announce, "And > > now I will be playing ......." Don't remember anymore what he played = except > for > > the Postlude - Bach G Major Prelude & Fugue. Alas, no champagne. > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org  
(back) Subject: Re: Hyfrydol From: "Richard Scott-Copeland" <organist@x-stream.co.uk> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 11:56:15 +0100   Not least being a damn good pedal excercise!   RSC        
(back) Subject: Re: Royal Wedding Music From: "Richard Scott-Copeland" <organist@x-stream.co.uk> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 12:13:04 +0100   John wrote:       >Regarding this wedding of HRH Prince Edward... I can't imagine why the = HM >the Queen would want this broadcast the world over in light of the last three >Royal weddings.... Especially since HRH Prince Edward is not "quite" the >marrying type!     I really DON'T think you meant to say that, did you?   Richard and Emma Scott-Copeland Southampton England    
(back) Subject: Re: virtuosic hymn-playing, etc. From: "Mark Checkley" <xcs53@dial.pipex.com> Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 12:49:25 +0100   Clearly your Church has both the need for a full time musician and the resources to pay for the same.   That is entirely appropriate in a small minority of Parishes.   I suggest, however, it is not in the least appropriate to a small village Church in the rural English Midlands, where the entire population of the village (about 400) could just about fill the building.   Such Churches have always relied on the goodwill of the amateur.   I would further suggest that your church is the exception rather than the rule. By far the majority of ORDINARY Churches not only couldn't afford a professional musician, but wouldn't have anything for him to do for half his working week.   Is it not a question of "horses for courses" combined with "cutting the suit according to the cloth" ?   MOC.   -----Original Message----- From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Saturday, June 19, 1999 12:46 Subject: Re: virtuosic hymn-playing, etc.     > > >Mark Checkley wrote: > >> Why do I need to HIRE one (you are OBSESSED with getting >> PAID) when I have three very competent Organists (all better >> than me) in the Parish, who are very happy to do it for nothing ? >> > >I don't know about other listmembers, but I'm not independently wealthy, and >being an organist/choirmaster is how I make my LIVING ... I'm full-time = at St. >Matthew's, and they pay me a full-time (albeit modest) salary. As a = result, >I'm available to the Rector whenever he needs to consult with me; I'm >available to the Parish whenever music is required. I have adequate time = to >practice, compose and do research. > >Churches who don't pay their musicians are lulled into a false sense of >security/economy. Someday, Mark, there WON'T be three organists who are happy >to do it for nothing; and THEN there will be wailing and gnashing of = teeth in >the Parish Council when they discover how much a competent organist COSTS in >the real world. It's a fact of life that folks tend not to value things that >cost them nothing. > >Cheers, > >Bud > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >    
(back) Subject: volunteer vs paid organists From: KriderSM@aol.com Date: Sat, 19 Jun 1999 08:13:25 EDT   budchris@earthlink.net wrote:   <snip> I'm not independently wealthy, and being an organist/choirmaster is =   how I make my >LIVING.   I am retired. I CAN do the playing for nothing - given the choice of a = free organist or nor organist, the church gets the free organist.   >Churches who don't pay their musicians are lulled into a false sense of >security/economy.   OTOH, the church is so very appreciative of the fact that the organist's salary was used to pay the utility bills for so many years.     >Someday, there WON'T be three organists who are happy >to do it for nothing; and THEN there will be wailing and gnashing of = teeth in >the Parish Council when they discover how much a competent organist COSTS = in >the real world.   OTOH The wailing and knashing of teeth will come as the Parish Council anguishes over how to inform the congregation that the church must now = close its doors forever.   IMHO In certain corners of Bud's "real world" there are congregations who = are going bankrupt, yet want to serve their flock to the very end. They cannot =   afford the electricity for turning the organ blower on, let alone paying a =   decent wage.   Folks, please stop attacking those who would question your points of view. =   State your opinions rationally, then listen to other perspectives.   Stan Krider