PipeChat Digest #754 - Saturday, March 13, 1999
 
Fw: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
Fw: Virgil, Critics, and Max Reger
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
Rodgers speakers
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
Re: Fw: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805
  by "Bud/burgie" <budchris@earthlink.net>
RE: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@truelink.net>
Looking for "Mike" from Cent. Cntr. Witchita
  by "fred lewis" <fl_43019@yahoo.com>
RE: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805
  by "William Lengyel" <theorganist@webtv.net>
Re:Tunability on analog toasters
  by <GRSCoLVR@aol.com>
Re: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805
  by "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com>
Fw: Rodgers speakers
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
Re: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805
  by "Jason McGuire" <jason@johannus-norcal.com>
 


(back) Subject: Fw: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 23:23:04 -0500   When I sold Rodgers ( church organs) in the ' 70's, the factory rep. would turn a few pots in back, and make that thing sound like a mighty you-know-what ! ! !   Rick.   -----Original Message----- From: Glenda <gksjd85@access.aic-fl.com> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Friday, March 12, 1999 10:11 PM Subject: Re: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805     >With advice like that, Bruce, I'll just cut my wrists and bleed on the >thing! But don't you think the Stars and Stripes will be a hoot on it? > >Glenda > >---------- >> From: bruce cornely <cremona84000@webtv.net> >> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> >> Subject: Re: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 >> Date: Friday, March 12, 1999 8:54 PM >> >> The easiest and most practical thing to do is just forgo trying to be >> artistic and musical, and just have a full "organ sound" which allows >> you to grab stop knobs randomly (for show, of course) without disturbing >> your playing. Do clever things like all flutes with tremolo; goey >> strings; fat, tubby theatrical sounds. If the music is fun, the >> audience will probably not care what it sounds like.... ya' know, just >> like church! > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >      
(back) Subject: Fw: Virgil, Critics, and Max Reger From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 23:25:36 -0500   Right-on, Jim....   -----Original Message----- From: Jim Hailey <Bald1@prodigy.net> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Friday, March 12, 1999 11:11 PM Subject: Re: Virgil, Critics, and Max Reger     >Hey Rick, I believe Virgil used to say, "That the purists can talk about >it, but can't do it." >Jim H. > >---------- >> From: VEAGUE <dutchorgan@svs.net> >> To: e-mail organ chat <pipechat@pipechat.org> >> Subject: Fw: Virgil, Critics, and Max Reger >> Date: Monday, March 08, 1999 9:58 PM >> >> Oh, the poor armchair critic-- knows everything, but can't play a lick. >> My heart does not bleed for them. >> >> Rick. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Larry Hoey <96606351@mail.clarityconnect.com> >> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> >> Date: Monday, March 08, 1999 10:48 PM >> Subject: Re: Virgil, Critics, and Max Reger >> >> >> >-----Original Message----- >> >From: ManderUSA@aol.com <ManderUSA@aol.com> >> >To: pipechat@pipechat.org <pipechat@pipechat.org> >> >Date: Monday, March 08, 1999 7:22 PM >> >Subject: Virgil, Critics, and Max Reger >> > >> > >> >Malcolm Wechsler writes: >> > >> >Virgil is rightly credited with many pithy comments, widely quoted by >his >> >many >> >fans. The above wonderful response to a bad review, however, came from >Max >> >Reger, as quoted in the Slonimsky "Lexicon of Musical Invective." >> > >> >Cheers, >> >Malcolm Wechsler >> > >> > >> > >> >Malcolm - "Thank you" for the correction. It's easy to imagine Reger's >> >story becoming Fox's; especially if you had ever heard Virgil tell the >> >story. My point was simply to encourage organists to do a public >concert >> >once in a while and not lose any sleep over what some isolated low life >> >"critic" might have to say about your performance. If you've prepared >> >yourself mentally and musically well enough in advance, there's really >> >nothing to sweat about doing a concert. You'll in fact be your own >worst >> >critic and who could possibly be any tougher than that? >> >Salute. >> > >> >Larry Hoey >> > >> > >> >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >> >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >> >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >> >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >> >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >> >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >> > >> >> >> >> "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >> PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >> HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >> List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >> Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >      
(back) Subject: Rodgers speakers From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 20:30:24 -0800   I used to do Rodgers installations and voicing, back when they were analog. I don't know much about the newer models, but the older ones benefitted from bouncing the sound off as many hard surfaces as possible BEFORE it reached the listener.   If we were working with chambers, we set the speakers in the middle of the chamber, aimed at the back CORNERS, and tilted so they were aimed at the TOP of the corners. The pedal cabinet (particularly if there was a 32' in the organ) we set against the front wall of the chamber aimed directly at the back wall.   If there were no chambers (as in one rear gallery installation we did), we hung the speakers across the top of the back wall of the balcony, aimed criss-cross so that the sound of the left-hand speakers hit the right side wall of the church about halfway up the aisle, and vice versa.   My friends at Allen don't like such shenanigans, but I've never met an electronic organ sound YET that didn't benefit from being bounced around before it reached the listeners.   Cheers,   Bud    
(back) Subject: Re: Fw: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 20:40:14 -0800   That was precisely why I preferred them over the early generations of Allen digital ... you could do a certain amount of voicing ... additionally, our manager brought back a detuning table from a workshop ... if you tuned certain notes a few cents sharp or flat, you didn't get that cold, locked-in, absolutely perfect electronic "blast" effect. Those of you who have tuneable analog organs, I'll be happy to try and track down a copy. It really works!   Cheers,   Bud   VEAGUE wrote:   > When I sold Rodgers ( church organs) in the ' 70's, the factory rep. would > turn a few pots in back, and make that thing sound like a mighty > you-know-what ! ! ! > > Rick. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Glenda <gksjd85@access.aic-fl.com> > To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Date: Friday, March 12, 1999 10:11 PM > Subject: Re: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 > > >With advice like that, Bruce, I'll just cut my wrists and bleed on the > >thing! But don't you think the Stars and Stripes will be a hoot on it? > > > >Glenda > > > >---------- > >> From: bruce cornely <cremona84000@webtv.net> > >> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> > >> Subject: Re: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 > >> Date: Friday, March 12, 1999 8:54 PM > >> > >> The easiest and most practical thing to do is just forgo trying to be > >> artistic and musical, and just have a full "organ sound" which allows > >> you to grab stop knobs randomly (for show, of course) without disturbing > >> your playing. Do clever things like all flutes with tremolo; goey > >> strings; fat, tubby theatrical sounds. If the music is fun, the > >> audience will probably not care what it sounds like.... ya' know, just > >> like church! > > > > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org        
(back) Subject: RE: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 From: Bob Scarborough <desertbob@truelink.net> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 21:06:05 -0800   At 08:49 PM 3/12/1999 -0700, Dennis Goward wrote: >Some of these so-called "helpful" posts are downright insulting to decent >organists.<snip>   Hear hear for Dennis! I, also, am tired of this incessant bashing from the lead addicts. I've been playing pipes and various electronics for almost 40 years now, and I can tell you with NO uncertainty...they're getting VERRRRRY close! Step back to 1947 and play an Allen C-2...or even 20 years after that on a TC-3. Play a 1966 Rodgers analog. THEN listen to the newest 'puter organs from both manufacturers. I'll take EITHER over NO organ at all, which is what's happening all across the country, thanks to "effete snobs" (the kind that inhabit pip-ARGUE-l, for example).   Beats a harmonium, now, doesn't it?   DeserTBoB    
(back) Subject: Looking for "Mike" from Cent. Cntr. Witchita From: fred lewis <fl_43019@yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 20:52:38 -0800 (PST)               Dear list, I'm looking for "Mike" who is the Pres. of the Witchita Organ group. Any help would be appre. Thanks, Fred   == Fred Lewis Organist: St. John's Lutheran - New Washington, Ohio Sacred Heart RC - Shelby, Ohio St. Joseph's RC - Crestline, Ohio ( waiting in the wings ) Renaissance Theater - Mansfield, Ohio 3/20 Kearns WurliTzer Home Address: 61 Zent Avenue Fredericktown, Ohio 43019-1031 Phone & Fax: 740-694-0046 E-mail: fred@www.ecr.net _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com    
(back) Subject: RE: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 From: theorganist@webtv.net (William Lengyel) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 23:58:03 -0500 (EST)   Hi Dennis,   You are 100% correct. I have had the opportunity to play pipe organs. but not on a regular basis. I played a Baldwin Model 11 for 17 years, an Allen 6000 ADC for 8, an Allen MDS 71 for 18 months and currently play a small self contained Allen. When we remodel (redecorate)? <G> we have budgeted $65,000 for a digital instrument. The 2 brands I am most interested in are Rodgers and Britson, althugh I recently rec'd a demo CD from Makin organs in England and it is impressive too. It certainly takes a lot more creativity to get those older analog instruments to sound good. But it can be done! I had pestered the pastor for about 6 years when I played the Baldwin to get something newer. A friend who played at the Cathedral at the time heard me play and quipped."You keep making that thing sound that good and you'll never get a new organ", he was right!   By the way, our Cathedral has a 1959 (?) 55 rank Moller in the Gallery, rebuilt and expanded to 58 gallery ranks with a separate 12 rank choir organ behind the choir which had swell shades opening into the chapel as well by Bunn-Minnick in 1986. Recently, choir went back to the gallery, YEAH, and a 4 manual custom Rodgers with 88 digital stops was added to the original 55 ranks. The Archbishop also had EVERY SINGLE PIECE of sound absorbing material removed from the sanctuary! There is also a digital antiphonal division in front, in the dome. It is glorious and 90% of the time you cannot tell which is pipe and which is digital. Future plans include another wind blown solo trumpet in front and a duplicate console which will be in front for "concitals."   BillMIA    
(back) Subject: Re:Tunability on analog toasters From: GRSCoLVR@aol.com Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 23:58:37 EST   Hi Bud,,and list! I would be most appreciative to latch onto a copy of that table you were speaking of Bud~~~~~~ I own a couple of analog Allen's that most certainly can be tuned. Verrrrrrrrr-y Interesting! Regards, ---Roc  
(back) Subject: Re: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 From: David Scribner <david@blackiris.com> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 23:22:25 -0600   I have to say that Glenda is doing a WONDERFUL job with it. And so is her "Piccoloist" on the Krutzweil. I heard them rehearsing this afternoon. The main problem that we are facing with this is the flues sound like Callopies and the reeds - well I don't even want to go there.   Unfortunately due to the lack of planning on the part of someone in the Chapter we are faced with this and we want it to sound GOOD. That is why I put out the original post. As I understand it from some of the replys we need to have the Rodgers folks come in to do something with this. I really doubt that at this late date we can get someone from the Rodgers dealership to deal with this.   And for those of you that have turned this into a pipes vs electronics I say grow up. No where did I make any comments comparing the two. All I asked for was some help with this particular instrument. This is a recital to HOPEFULLY increase the awareness and love for the Instrument and its music. What bothers some of us is that we are worried about the general public being turned off by these sounds.   And the Stars and Stripes WILL be a HOOT!!! - GO GLENDA!!!!!   David     >With advice like that, Bruce, I'll just cut my wrists and bleed on the >thing! But don't you think the Stars and Stripes will be a hoot on it? > >Glenda >    
(back) Subject: Fw: Rodgers speakers From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 00:26:37 -0500   I played an older Allen in a church in St Pete., Fla. where the speakers were in an elevated chamber installation. With the gyro's in the middle, and bass speakers in tall "oil drums", the acoustical sound in there was amazing.   Rick.   -----Original Message----- From: Bud/burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> To: pipechat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Friday, March 12, 1999 11:31 PM Subject: Rodgers speakers     >I used to do Rodgers installations and voicing, back when they were >analog. I don't know much about the newer models, but the older ones >benefitted from bouncing the sound off as many hard surfaces as possible >BEFORE it reached the listener. > >If we were working with chambers, we set the speakers in the middle of >the chamber, aimed at the back CORNERS, and tilted so they were aimed at >the TOP of the corners. The pedal cabinet (particularly if there was a >32' in the organ) we set against the front wall of the chamber aimed >directly at the back wall. > >If there were no chambers (as in one rear gallery installation we did), >we hung the speakers across the top of the back wall of the balcony, >aimed criss-cross so that the sound of the left-hand speakers hit the >right side wall of the church about halfway up the aisle, and vice >versa. > >My friends at Allen don't like such shenanigans, but I've never met an >electronic organ sound YET that didn't benefit from being bounced around >before it reached the listeners. > >Cheers, > >Bud > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >      
(back) Subject: Re: HELP!!! with Rodgers 805 From: "Jason McGuire" <jason@johannus-norcal.com> Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 22:59:19 -0800     > >Unfortunately due to the lack of planning on the part of someone in the >Chapter we are faced with this and we want it to sound GOOD. That is why I >put out the original post. As I understand it from some of the replys we >need to have the Rodgers folks come in to do something with this. I really >doubt that at this late date we can get someone from the Rodgers dealership >to deal with this.   Another thing you can do, and you have probably already figured this out, is to use fewer rather than more stops. If you use the Great principals plus the Swell principals, go real easy on the flutes and reeds, you may be able to arrive at a sound that will work better. I'm currently playing a 955 at a church and there's a point when too many stops just does not work well at all.   Jason