PipeChat Digest #1108 - Thursday, October 7, 1999
 
Re: Pirofono
  by "Jorge J. Gomez" <uc8646@estud.unican.es>
Re: PIPORG-L Archives
  by "Ron Natalie" <ron@sensor.com>
Re: Piano Advice Requested (Request From Gray)(update from Gray)
  by "Spencer Gray King, Jr." <gking1@bellsouth.net>
Re: Piano Advice Requested (Request From Gray)(update from Gray)
  by <WAYNE_BURCHAM@rsausa.com>
Re: Piano Advice Requested (Request From Gray)(update from Gray)
  by <CHERCAPA@aol.com>
Fwd: FW: Frey in Frisco, a tome. (Mahler transcription performance)
  by "Jack Williams" <jackwilliams_1999@yahoo.com>
Re: divided chancel controversy
  by "Alan Freed" <afreed0904@earthlink.net>
Re: divided chancel controversy
  by <DudelK@aol.com>
Re: Pirofono
  by <MickBerg@aol.com>
 


(back) Subject: Re: Pirofono From: "Jorge J. Gomez" <uc8646@estud.unican.es> Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 11:30:59 +0200   Hello:   Several years ago, I have read in a magazine about a pyrophone built for a japanese gas company. I saw a photo of the console.   Jorge Gomez    
(back) Subject: Re: PIPORG-L Archives From: Ron Natalie <ron@sensor.com> Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 08:16:39 -0500     All info on PIPORG-L is available at   http://www.albany.edu/piporg-l  
(back) Subject: Re: Piano Advice Requested (Request From Gray)(update from Gray) From: "Spencer Gray King, Jr." <gking1@bellsouth.net> Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 09:36:45 -0400   I think maybe you guys misread my original message or the first reply. = The piano, I have since remembered, is a Stieff. It is a short grand, but not = a very short grand. It is about 70 years old, I think. It has new action, = pin board, keys, etc, etc.... The only thing that isn't new is the steel, = sounding board, and the cabinet. The thing I wanted to know was if 1000 sounds = about right. I understand your responses to that question. But, there aren't = that many technicians around here and I took my friend to play it from the = local Rodgers dealership. When we left, of course he said it was a piece of = trash. And, we have one at the store for 2000 - Everette at that - and in a pecan = baby poop finish. A lot of the problem in Winston-Salem is that we have the NC School of the Arts. They sell their pianos once a year....but...you think = it is a deal....no, no, no.. they really are as much as a new piano. I know = that concert grands increase in value if they are the right kind. So, I guess = the local dealer here makes so much off the sales of those pianos that they = will not drop even an old upright to less than a 1000 dollars and in fact, a = lot of them literally get the axe taken to them so they are not in the market anymore. (Including old grands) He just eats the cost and makes more = money in the long run. Anyway, the guy said it was trash, but funny how that trash attracted him to play for at least 40 minutes before we left. Ha! Bull! = The piano has a wonderful deep sounding bass that does not clunk and a = brilliancy above middle C. So, I think I will try to find a way to get it. In my original request, I never said anything about it being a spinet. Thanks for all your responses. Gray King Winston-Salem, NC       Richard Pinel wrote:   > >They were much better then the spinets of the 50"s and still > >better than the "consoles" of the 60's. TAken care of, they were a fine > >instrument. > > Just out of interest, what did the "console" model look like - you can = call > me stupid if you like (this isn't a cue for the entire list to send a > message saying "You're stupid" :-}) but does it look like a console?! > > Richard > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org        
(back) Subject: Re: Piano Advice Requested (Request From Gray)(update from Gray) From: WAYNE_BURCHAM@rsausa.com Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 09:55:01 -0400       Of course his comments were bull. That's like asking the Chevy dealer to evaluate a Ford. Not just some, although not all, but most piano and = electronic organ dealerships are out of the same school as used car salesmen. Buy = the piano if you can get it before the dealer buys it and then triples the = price. Now I don my asbestos suit. ; - )   Wayne NYC & Milford, PA           "Spencer Gray King, Jr." <gking1@bellsouth.net> on 10/06/99 09:36:45 AM   Please respond to "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org>   To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org>, organchat@onelist.com cc: (bcc: WAYNE BURCHAM/NYOM/ROYAL-SSD) Subject: Re: Piano Advice Requested (Request From Gray)(update from Gray)         I think maybe you guys misread my original message or the first reply. = The piano, I have since remembered, is a Stieff. It is a short grand, but not = a very short grand. It is about 70 years old, I think. It has new action, = pin board, keys, etc, etc.... The only thing that isn't new is the steel, = sounding board, and the cabinet. The thing I wanted to know was if 1000 sounds = about right. I understand your responses to that question. But, there aren't = that many technicians around here and I took my friend to play it from the = local Rodgers dealership. When we left, of course he said it was a piece of = trash. And, we have one at the store for 2000 - Everette at that - and in a pecan = baby poop finish. A lot of the problem in Winston-Salem is that we have the NC School of the Arts. They sell their pianos once a year....but...you think = it is a deal....no, no, no.. they really are as much as a new piano. I know = that concert grands increase in value if they are the right kind. So, I guess = the local dealer here makes so much off the sales of those pianos that they = will not drop even an old upright to less than a 1000 dollars and in fact, a = lot of them literally get the axe taken to them so they are not in the market anymore. (Including old grands) He just eats the cost and makes more = money in the long run. Anyway, the guy said it was trash, but funny how that trash attracted him to play for at least 40 minutes before we left. Ha! Bull! = The piano has a wonderful deep sounding bass that does not clunk and a = brilliancy above middle C. So, I think I will try to find a way to get it. In my original request, I never said anything about it being a spinet. Thanks for all your responses. Gray King Winston-Salem, NC       Richard Pinel wrote:   > >They were much better then the spinets of the 50"s and still > >better than the "consoles" of the 60's. TAken care of, they were a fine > >instrument. > > Just out of interest, what did the "console" model look like - you can = call > me stupid if you like (this isn't a cue for the entire list to send a > message saying "You're stupid" :-}) but does it look like a console?! > > Richard > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org         "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org                
(back) Subject: Re: Piano Advice Requested (Request From Gray)(update from Gray) From: CHERCAPA@aol.com Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 12:30:35 EDT   Dear Wayne, Unfortunately, it seems that, as with all things American, whether it be politicians, bankers, or salesmen; it is a regular sad state = of affairs. The old adage of Caveat Emptor applies even more so. If you can't =   find someone who bought from him, don't buy. Paul  
(back) Subject: Fwd: FW: Frey in Frisco, a tome. (Mahler transcription performance) From: Jack Williams <jackwilliams_1999@yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 09:50:37 -0700 (PDT)   As already mentioned, here is someone's review of Alexander Frey's performance of the organ transcription of Mahler's complete Symphony #5 at Grace Cathedral this past month. Was anyone else there? I'd appreciate your thoughts. JW --- "Storandt, Peter" <pstorandt@okcu.edu> wrote: > From: "Storandt, Peter" <pstorandt@okcu.edu> > To: "'jackwilliams_1999@yahoo.com'" > <jackwilliams_1999@yahoo.com> > Subject: FW: Fryin Frisco, a tome. > Date: Tue, 5 Oct 1999 08:41:05 -0500 > > Jack: > > Here you go. > > Peter > > -----Original Message----- > > [mailto:melhuish@uclink.berkeley.edu] > Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 1999 4:54 PM > To: Members of > Subject: Fryin Frisco, a tome. > > > Sunday evening last, 7:30PM, Grace Cathedral, San > Francisco, > Alexander Frey appeared and played the entire organ > transcription > which he had commissioned of the Mahler 5th > Symphony. > > Nave seating only, no spectators other than the > organ curators in > the chancel, at the request of the artist. I was > fortunate to have > front row seats saved for me. I was thrilled, > because I think that > the front of the nave is the optimum location to > hear the organ. I > was provided a direct line of sight to the console, > which was > brought out and turned so it was visible from the > nave. Best seat > in the house, and as it turned out with the > technique employed to > play this piece, it was spellbinding to watch. > > Approximately 150 spectators jammed the cathedral > for the > happening, (well it is an organ recital, not a rap > concert.) One poor > soul sitting two rows behind me must have passed out > under the > pew during the afternoon tourist hours, and barely > regained a bit > of consciousness when the program started. They > mumbled > through he entire program, noisily only during the > big parts, > softly during the quiet parts. Since the entire > transcription takes 80 > minutes, and was done without an intermission, > (unlike the symphony, > Grace Cathedral has no concessioners to complain > about reduced > trading time,) I was not provided with the > opportunity to offer the > noisy spectator the choices of moving, keeping > quiet, or being > muted with a hymnal. > > Anyway, I digress. Aside from the babbles of > moronia, unfortunately > I must say this performance was absolutely > masterful, approaching > near perfection in expertly matching instrument, > literature, space and > the performer so precisely to each ones strengths. > > The Grace Cathedral organ is just stellar, no matter > the problems > the current construction is causing, the organ > sounds spectacular, is > a gem in the building, and maintained by a sheer > wizards, right down > to the felt under the mirrors. Nothing more can be > said except rave > on a bit about its plethora of pure symphonic > voices, strings, flutes > and various and sundry orchestral ensembles. > > The Transcription was very well constructed, > probably to well so. > 80 minutes is absolutely far too long for anything > other than drinking > and unrestrained passion. This brought an element > of tedium into > the mix, but mechanically, the piece was terribly > accurate, and > complete. It simply should be a wee bit shorter. I > apologise, but I > don't remember the transcribers name, I never heard > of him, so the > name didn't etch into RAM very well. If anyone is > interested email > someone else who was there. They won't be rushing > this into > publication, rest assured. > > Then there is the building. Well, regardless of it's > state of deterioration, > > and construction zone status, the 7 to 10 seconds of > reverberation are a > wonder, and also are not what you would say is your > average concert > hall environment. The building contribution here is > material. The > symphonic people love the coffin like lack of any > hint of reverberation, > here that element luxuriously blended the ethereal > sounds.... > a novel concept, and one which I think is a winner. > Many folks agree > with me that the CD of Ian Tracey and the BBC > symphony doing organ > concertos in Liverpool Anglican Cathedral is one of > the best CD's ever > made for either organ or orchestra, I wonder how > much of that is due > to the draconian accounstic present...... > > Finally the performer. I am a huge proponent of > Alexander Frey's > philosophy and practice. His concepts on organ > playing and > observing the orchestral sounds with the technique > is simply translated > as playing with real musicality, and being a > conductor, who better than > he to understand and develop this concept. His > technique is prodigious, > entirely appropriate for the literature used. His > concepts of performance > were magnificent. I would say that 60% of the > program was played with > the boxes closed to mostly closed, the sounds > emanating at the level > somewhat above that of a whisper. Full organ and > huge crescendos > were sparingly used. The effect was phenomenal, as > one of the cathedral > ushers observed to me, it was the quietest he's > heard an audience in > Grace Cathedral, ever. By keeping the level down, > Frey forced > concentration on the work and the attention of the > audience, and for > those lacking the benefit of a narration in tongues, > this also helped the > near hour and a half pass very quickly. Playing this > 80 minute piece > cover to cover without getting off the bench for a > pit stop, a flask > slurp, or a cigarette was also impressive. Random > facts: about 1/3 > of the piece had a double pedal line executed > incredibly well. I need > to ask Mr. Stout if they have a pedal divide on that > new Bethstein & > Schoenhard console action, it almost appeared that > way. Also Frey > invented a few registrations that I have never heard > anything close to > emanating from that organ, quite masterful > considering the extreme > skills of the two exceptional canon resident > organists. > > So, I can only report that this was a terribly well > done program and > worthy of the effort to attend. Happily, I can muse > that this piece is > so difficult it will never even be attempted by > local hacks on Allens > in dead buildings, so the fond memory will not be > subject to tarnish > anywhere in the near future. I rarely give anything > good reviews, it's > not in my nature, but had to be done. Sorry to > dissapoint. > > >     =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D   __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com  
(back) Subject: Re: divided chancel controversy From: "Alan Freed" <afreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 17:09:57 -0400   >From: Bud/Burgie <budchris@earthlink.net> > > I get the impression from Alan that the Lutherans mostly stayed out of = it [out of the divided chancel business] ... I've > never seen an OLD Lutheran church with a divided chancel, though there = are a couple > built in the '50s in San Diego that DO have them. >   I know it was over a month ago, but just in case anyone's still thinking about it:   I probably should limit my impression-giving to GERMAN (and especially = LCMS) parishes.   Thoroughly Americanized (English-speaking) Lutheran churches on the east coast certainly had divided chancels (aping the Anglicans) in both = ordinary little churches and in bigger ones, after WWI. And they happened farther west as well, among congregations with pretensions of grandeur (including = my own home parish in Seattle).   The Church of Sweden was in full communion with Canterbury from the 1920s = to the 1940s; consequently a fair number of Augustana Synod (Swedish) = parishes n America were perfectly willing to put in divided chancels. Norwegians = and Danes did everything you can think of. But the more ethnically German a congregation was, and the more isolated from the mainstream they (LCMS) were, the less likely, by far, they were to do divided chancels.   Alan        
(back) Subject: Re: divided chancel controversy From: DudelK@aol.com Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 17:17:23 EDT   In a message dated 99-10-06 17:10:50 EDT, you write:   << But the more ethnically German a congregation was, and the more isolated from the mainstream they (LCMS) were, the less likely, by far, they were to do divided chancels. >> LCMS out of the mainstream?????? The LCMS church in which I grew up had a chancel so tiny the minister almost got bruises if he tried to turn = around. On the left side was a closet that house the pipes (and chimes) of the = mighty Hinners, the console for which was located at the side of the rear = balcony. The other side of the chancel housed a mini-office-cum-sacristy. Most of = the ones I remember from Illinois had very small chancels with organ and choir =   (when there was one) in the rear balcony or off to the side. Even Grace in =   River Forest with a very spacious chancel had the console and choir in a transept balcony (I assume still does).   "Still a recovering Lutheran"  
(back) Subject: Re: Pirofono From: MickBerg@aol.com Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 20:36:41 EDT   There was a Pyrophone in the London Science Museum when I was a lad in the =   fifties and sixties. I would often visit the museum, and would always hike = up to the top floor to see the Pyrophone. It was a fascinating contraption, = and worked by bringing two gas flames together to produce a note. Of course it =   wasn't a working exhibit. I think it had a somewhat radiating keyboard, = like a set of teeth. Pressing a key would move one of a pair of gas-jets = together so that the flames touched. All this wonderfully made mechanism was = visible, and easy to understand. A very spooky-looking device !   Sadly nearly all of these wonderful old displays are gone, to be replaced with low-resolution "interactive" video screens and mock-ups of the lunar =   surface made of baking foil. Museums are no fun any more.   However, the Science Museum may well still have the Pyrophone in storage......................   Mick Berg.