PipeChat Digest #1562 - Friday, August 18, 2000
 
Re: Acoustics and how organ Builders use them!
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
ALL READ
  by "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com>
OHS Boston
  by "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com>
RE: Red Wetherill, Paoletti and Associates, and acoustics
  by "Storandt, Peter" <pstorandt@okcu.edu>
Re: Red Wetherill, Paoletti and Associates, and acoustics
  by "Luther Melby" <lmelby@prtel.com>
Pipes Spectacular!
  by "Stewart Strategies Group" <art@stewartgrp.com>
Re: Mixtures out the ears...AAAHHH!!!
  by <Oboe32@aol.com>
Re: Mixtures out the ears...AAAHHH!!!
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: Red Wetherill, Paoletti and Associates, and acoustics
  by "TommyLee Whitlock" <tommylee@whitlock.org>
Away for a while
  by "TommyLee Whitlock" <tommylee@whitlock.org>
My ORGAN...
  by <Oboe32@aol.com>
@#$%^&+* architects, acoustics
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
Re: My ORGAN...
  by "Maynard Cuppy" <cuppy.maynard@mcleodusa.net>
Re: My ORGAN...
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: @#$%^&+* architects, acoustics
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Lively-Fulcher Encore
  by "Evelyn Rowe" <efrowe@mindspring.com>
 


(back) Subject: Re: Acoustics and how organ Builders use them! From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 07:40:59 -0500   Interesting item Ron, on rapping 'n tapping on church floors. I've walked into theatres and clapped my hands several times to hear the acoustics. In theatres, is only upholstered folding seats and plenty of plaster on the ceiling, proscineum (sp?), and what-not. I did this also at the Tampa Theatre where the 3m 12r Wurli plays. Very live room, and makes the instrument sound bigger than it is.   Our little 'Church-In-The-Cornfields' where I put in the Wicks is akin to = a big wood-frame barn with carpetted floors and upholstered pews. Surprisingly, there's not a dead-spot in the whole sanctuary- even in the farthest corners. It surprised myself and my (retired)organ-building = friend. Even with SRO, the instrument sings lively thru it all.   Rick      
(back) Subject: ALL READ From: "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 07:25:16 +0100   Folks,   There was a post yesterday that did some criticizing of something that happened recently on another of the organ lists. I would hope that this thread goes no further. Although we may not always completely agree with the rules/guidelines/administration of a list it is the prerogative of the list owner(s) to set the rules and enforce them. Each of us that are members of these lists are the "guests" of the owners and do need to follow their rules.   I also know that sometimes we get an impression of a person from their posts, an impression that might be false once we finally meet the other party in person. I know that this has happened for me with various people I have read for years on the lists. So please don't be judgmental based on what you might read.   As most of you know, I am currently in Boston and only reading mail very late at night or in the morning - I don't want to have to deal with a flame-war and will most likely have a very fast trigger finger for removing people. Please don't make me do that.   And now back to Happy PipeChatting!!   David  
(back) Subject: OHS Boston From: "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 07:36:50 +0100   Last night was the start of the annual OHS Convention here in Boston. It started with Peter Sykes' recital on the E. & G.G. Hook / Hook and Hastings Organ in the Church of the Immaculate Conception, currently known as the Jesuit Urban Center. I am sure that Malcolm will be doing a much better posting to the list about the concert but I just have to say that even if I didn't hear another organ on this trip this one made the whole 1,500 mile drive up here worth it!!   Every so often there are threads on Must Hear and Pilgrimage organs - this one for me was one of those rare instruments that fell into that category. And the nicest part is that it not only opening the convention but will also close it with Thomas Murrary performing next Wednesday night.   Listening to the concert last night all I could think of is how glad I am that this organ wasn't lost as almost happened some years back. I know that many people go off to Europe to hear some of the historic instruments over there but this one ranks right up there with any of those of the distant shores. If you have never heard this organ by all means make it a point to get yourself to Boston and hear it. American organ building does not need to take any back-seat to the old world based on what was heard last night!!   Looking forward to Malcolm's review, from Boston   David  
(back) Subject: RE: Red Wetherill, Paoletti and Associates, and acoustics From: "Storandt, Peter" <pstorandt@okcu.edu> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 07:45:04 -0500   These postings in fact appeared on piporg-l, or at least I have read them before recently. Bud's comment about the architect is right on. It's actually a form of malpractice to indulge in such gratuitous "advice." Reminds me of the more benign case of an architect we used at Trinity = Church in Concord, MA, some years back whose drawings showed the "alter." ....Calling Dr. Freud....   Cheers,   Peter   Bud wrote:   Our brain-dead architect (I don't think that's too strong ... he didn't = know what an "apse" was, or why we'd want one) wanted to damp everything down to = zero and then add the reverb back in electronically with a $20K sound system ... typical! We had to explain to him that no, we DON'T need monitor speakers on the "podium"; nor do we need 115v plugs in the chancel floor for electric gee-tars = (grin).   Oh, and he said we'd not "want" a pipe organ ... he didn't elaborate; I didn't give him time. I told the Rector later that if I want a steam calliope up there, the ARCHITECT'S job is is to see that the water lines are run for the = boiler .... whether or not we have a pipe organ is none of his business, beyond providing the 14'' floor joists to support it.    
(back) Subject: Re: Red Wetherill, Paoletti and Associates, and acoustics From: "Luther Melby" <lmelby@prtel.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 09:24:58 -0500     on August 16 you wrote;   > >Our brain-dead architect (I don't think that's too strong ... he didn't know what >an "apse" was, or why we'd want one) wanted to damp everything down to = zero and >then add the reverb back in electronically with a $20K sound system ... typical! >Cheers, > >Bud > I would design great musical acoustics into the room, as live as possible, then dampen it back down if necessary. To liven it up with electronics sounds really backwards to me. duh !! (How would he work the sound system so that the congregation could hear themselves sing ?) Luther from rural MN who used to yell in the silo, talk about reverberation!! WOW      
(back) Subject: Pipes Spectacular! From: "Stewart Strategies Group" <art@stewartgrp.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 12:36:12 -0400   Here's News on the upcoming national event Pipes Spectacular!   PIPES SPECTACULAR! -- THE WORLD'S LARGEST ORGAN CONCERT -- WILL BE UNIQUE = CELEBRATION OF THE ORGAN IN AMERICA   Audience of 100,000 Expected to Hear Over 2,000 Performers in Some 200 = Concerts Nationwide October 15th   Collaborations between Organists and Other Colleagues will feature Some of = the Country's Most Distinguished Musicians and Musical Organizations     (August 7, 2000 -- New York, NY) PIPES SPECTACULAR! -- The World's = Largest Organ Concert -- will be a unique celebration of the organ in = America that will increase appreciation for the enduring majesty of the = "King of Instruments" while re-focusing public attention on the importance = of music education, particularly for young people, and the arts in our = culture.   With over 200 concert events across the country on a single day -- Sunday = October 15, 2000 -- PIPES SPECTACULAR! is expected to attract a family = audience of 100,000 nationwide to hear over 2,000 performers in programs = featuring the organ with dance companies, brass and other instrumental = ensembles, acclaimed choral groups and vocal soloists, marching bands and = other musical organizations. Concerts will be presented in urban, = suburban and rural communities throughout the United States and in a = diverse array of settings -- from performing arts centers and concert = halls to churches, universities and outdoor pavilions. In addition to the = great variety of instruments and performers presented with the organ, = programs will feature "informances," organ "crawls," multimedia = presentations, and audiovisual enhancements.   The events comprising The World's Largest Organ Concert will feature the = organ in its historic and evolving roles as a solo, accompanying and = ensemble instrument -- showcasing the talents of the nation's leading = professional organists in collaboration with some of the country's most = distinguished musical artists. The organists are members of the American = Guild of Organists (AGO), the national professional association serving = the organ and choral music fields, which is organizing the event as a = follow-up to its 1996 "World's Largest Organ Recital". That celebration, = with hundreds of simultaneous performances nationwide that commemorated = the Centenary of the AGO's founding, became the most successful community = outreach effort in the history of the organ.   "The scale of participation by AGO members and the richness of = programmatic output is reflective of the desire to entertain and inform = the widest audience possible," notes John W. Obetz, SMD, AGO National = Councillor for Finance and Development. "We intend to engage new = audiences for the organ while giving seasoned listeners a fresh = perspective on its expansive repertoire. We also hope to communicate the = importance of music and arts education throughout our society by bringing = attention to the AGO's educational and community outreach programs on both = the local and national levels."     SIGNATURE AND PREVIEW EVENTS ANCHOR NATIONWIDE CELEBRATION The World's Largest Organ Concert is being produced within a structure of = four event categories. Signature events will anchor the national = celebration with three programs, one on each coast and one in the Midwest: = An exploration of the organ with singers, brass and synthesizer will take = place at the National Cathedral in Washington, D.C.; an appearance by = world-renowned artist and television personality Diane Bish, will = encompass a program with the Milwaukee Symphony Orchestra Chorus at the = Marcus Center for the Performing Arts in Milwaukee, WI; and three = different concert events in San Diego, CA -- at the Spreckels Organ = Pavilion, St. Paul's Cathedral and the First United Methodist Mission = Valley Church -- will feature the organ with brass, the San Diego Youth = Audience (dance and singing) and the San Diegito Orchestra.   A Flagship event will take place on Sunday, October 8, at The Riverside = Church in New York, NY, and feature an all-star cast of performers in a = tribute to one of the most famous organists of the 20th century, Virgil Fox. This concert will preview the national event of a week later = and honor Fox, a prolific concert and recording artist, at the twentieth = anniversary of his death.   Twenty-five AGO Chapters have been designated Champion Chapters for their = exceptional programmatic creativity, partnerships with other = organizations, and use of the concert format to attract and engage the = audience -- particularly youth. These Champions are part of, and will = lead, the full complement of 170-plus AGO Chapters in the production of = the national PIPES SPECTACULAR! event. The Champion Chapters are: Bethel = College (KS); Boone (NC); Boston; Brazos Valley (TX); Cache Valley (UT); = Central Florida; Chicago; Detroit; District of Columbia; Eugene (OR); = Fairfield West (CT); Greater Bridgeport (CT); Greater Kansas City; Les = Bois (ID); Lincoln (NE); Long Beach (CA); Los Angeles; Milwaukee; New York = City; San Diego; Southeast Iowa; Southern Oregon; Springfield (MA); = Springfield (MO); and Western Illinois University.   Four partner organizations are collaborating with the American Guild of = Organists to produce PIPES SPECTACULAR!: the Organ Historical Society; = the Royal Canadian College of Organists; the Royal College of Organists; = and the Virgil Fox Society. Each concert will require an admission fee, = which is determined by the local AGO Chapter. Any proceeds, after = expenses, will be shared by both the local Chapter and the national = organization to fund AGO educational and community outreach programs.   Updates on PIPES SPECTACULAR! events as well as full details on the = programs of The American Guild of Organists may be found at = http://www.agohq.org  
(back) Subject: Re: Mixtures out the ears...AAAHHH!!! From: <Oboe32@aol.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 18:27:33 EDT   Hey All, I can not help but comment concerning mixtures, as my new instrument has two mixtures on every division aside from the pedal. My mixtures are large and pitched rather high. I tend to like tubby organs, = so learning to register this instrument to the room is going to be fun! I do have 4 16' flues in the pedal, but none provide the "umph" the room really =   seems to need, so when we eventually do restoration work, the one addition =   that may happen aside from Chimes, is a 16' Open Metal to have 73 notes = and play at 16 and 8 on the Great as a 2nd Principal. None the less, out of 78 =   ranks, my instrument has 30 some odd ranks of mixtures!   -Pete Isherwood  
(back) Subject: Re: Mixtures out the ears...AAAHHH!!! From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 17:09:27   At 06:27 PM 8/17/2000 EDT, you wrote: >Hey All, > I can not help but comment concerning mixtures, as my new >instrument has two mixtures on every division aside from the pedal.<snip>   Lucky you! Must organs don't have that sort of variety.   >None the less, out of 78 >ranks, my instrument has 30 some odd ranks of mixtures!<snip>   I DO hope they're of different schools, so as to provide some variance in voicing "school". What make of organ?   DeserTBoB  
(back) Subject: Re: Red Wetherill, Paoletti and Associates, and acoustics From: "TommyLee Whitlock" <tommylee@whitlock.org> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 22:26:00 -0400   > Our brain-dead architect (I don't think that's too strong ... he > didn't know what an "apse" was, or why we'd want one)   Does this knave even know what a nave is? Besides not knowing his apse = from his a** or the proverbial hole in the ground...   wanted to > damp everything down to zero and then add the reverb back > in electronically with a $20K sound system ... typical! We had to > explain to him that no, we DON'T need monitor speakers on the > "podium"; nor do we need 115v plugs in the chancel floor for > electric gee-tars (grin).   He thinks _Anglicans_ might want plinky-plinky services?!!? The mind = reels! I agree with dBob's comment about sending him back to do his cheesy shopping =   malls. And that the building committee probably is much well acquainted = with proctology.   > Oh, and he said we'd not "want" a pipe organ ... he didn't elaborate; > I didn't give him time. I told the Rector later that if I want a > steam calliope up there, the ARCHITECT'S job is is to see that the > water lines are run for the boiler ... whether or not we have a pipe > organ is none of his business, beyond providing the 14'' floor joists > to support it.   Is it too late to replace him? If the construction hasn't started yet, = There may yet be a chance.   Cheers, tlw    
(back) Subject: Away for a while From: "TommyLee Whitlock" <tommylee@whitlock.org> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 22:33:35 -0400   But not to the OHS. As I mentioned before, I am off to Amsterdam on a business trip, but I fully intend to attend at least one organ concert = while I am there. I have a print out from the Dutch organ page for all of the concerts in North Holland. :)   I would enjoy the opportunity to meet any of our Dutch members while I am there. If you see this before I leave on Friday afternoon, drop me a line = on how I can get in touch when I am there. I'll be checking home mail till = then.   Cheers, TommyLee Whitlock    
(back) Subject: My ORGAN... From: <Oboe32@aol.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 22:44:38 EDT   Here y'all go,   As I've been posting in past, I've accepted a new post at 1st presbyterian "The Capitol Church" of Trenton, NJ. The church is a large = room built in the 1700's. The church has a diversified congregation and = supports many outreach and community groups. As of August 28th, once classes start, = I should start being there more regularly, so anyone interested in coming to =   check things out is more than welcome! We love to show off the church and = the organ!   -Pete   Robert Turner, 1974 GREAT: (4 3/4' in.) Spitzflote 16' Prinzipal 8' Bordun Flute Harmonique Spitzflote (ext.) Oktave 4' Rhor Flote Spitzfflote (ext.) Oktave 2' Spitzflote (ext.) Sesquialtera II Mixtur III-V Sharf IV Fagot 16' Trompete 8' Klarine 4' Trompete En Chamade 8'   Swell: (5 1/3' in) Rhor Bordun 16' Prinzipal 8' Gedeckt (ext.) Viole De Gambe Voix Celeste Flauto Dolce Flauto Celeste Oktave 4' Koppel Flute Gross Terz 3 1/5' Nasat 2 2/3' Oktave 2' Terz 1 3/5' (ext.) Sifflote 1 (ext.) Mixtur III-V Zimbel III Basson 16' Trompette 8' Hautbois (ext.) Voix Humaine 8' Clairon 4'   POSITIV: (enclosed, 3 3/8' in.) Prinzipal 8' Gedackt Dolce Unda Maris Oktave 4' Spillflote Nasat 2 2/3' Oktave 2' Blockflote Terz 1 3/5' Quintflote 1 1/3' Mixtur IV Sharf III Rankett 16' Trompette 8' Cromorne Clairon (ext.) 4' Oboe 4'   PEDAL: (4 to 5 in.) Prinzipal 16' Subbass Rhor Bordun (Sw.) Spitzflote (Gt.) Quintflote (Sw.) 10 2/3' Prinzipal 8' Bassflote (ext.) Spitzflote (Gt.) Rhorflote (Sw.) Oktave 4' (ext.) Flute 4' Flute 2' (ext) Mixtur V Contre Basson 32' (Sw.) Posaune 16' Basson (Sw.) Rankett (Po.) Trompete (ext.) 8' Hautbois (Sw.) Klarine 4' (ext.) Cromorne (Po.)  
(back) Subject: @#$%^&+* architects, acoustics From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 20:14:23 -0700   First, to clarify, Red Wetherill and Paoletti and Associates have NOT been involved in this madness ...   the firm we chose was chosen because they'd built a number of Episcopal = churches in SoCal (!). We HAVE changed architects within the firm, but that was = THEIR doing, not ours ... we were "handed off" to another partner because the = original architect had a "bigger" project to work on.   Believe me, if there's breath in MY body, this firm will NOT be building = the main church.   The Building Committee is a bunch of bottom-line-oriented Orange County = CEOs who SHOULD know chicanery when they see it / hear it. I have been STUNNED by = what they've allowed to slide by.   But what REALLY frosts my cookies is that they are hell-bent on = re-inventing the wheel. I TRIED to take them to see traditional churches ... mostly they = chattered and looked bored. I gave them volumes of notes about everything under the = sun ... that was two years ago; NOW they're frantically digging for them and = trying to figure out how to incorporate at least the essentials into the plans. = Hel-LO!   Fortunately the Rector's recently "gotten religion" concerning acoustics, = so, I think, given the limitations of the space, just about everything that CAN = be done WILL be done, but it certainly came right under the wire.   Cheers,   Bud        
(back) Subject: Re: My ORGAN... From: "Maynard Cuppy" <cuppy.maynard@mcleodusa.net> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 22:17:25 -0500   I'm not criticizing, because I'd love to wake up to an organ like that on = Sunday morning, but I'm a little surprised at only one 16' flue in the pedal on = an organ that size. Why didn't he borrow one or more of the manual 16' stops? The = 16' Principal seems like it would be a little stout for the softer = combinations. Or is it? Enquiring minds want to know. Maynard   Oboe32@aol.com wrote:   > Here y'all go, > > As I've been posting in past, I've accepted a new post at = 1st > presbyterian "The Capitol Church" of Trenton, NJ. The church is a large = room > built in the 1700's. The church has a diversified congregation and = supports > many outreach and community groups. As of August 28th, once classes = start, I > should start being there more regularly, so anyone interested in coming = to > check things out is more than welcome! We love to show off the church = and the > organ! > > -Pete > > Robert Turner, 1974 > GREAT: (4 3/4' in.) > Spitzflote 16' > Prinzipal 8' > Bordun > Flute Harmonique > Spitzflote (ext.) > Oktave 4' > Rhor Flote > Spitzfflote (ext.) > Oktave 2' > Spitzflote (ext.) > Sesquialtera II > Mixtur III-V > Sharf IV > Fagot 16' > Trompete 8' > Klarine 4' > Trompete En Chamade 8' > > Swell: (5 1/3' in) > Rhor Bordun 16' > Prinzipal 8' > Gedeckt (ext.) > Viole De Gambe > Voix Celeste > Flauto Dolce > Flauto Celeste > Oktave 4' > Koppel Flute > Gross Terz 3 1/5' > Nasat 2 2/3' > Oktave 2' > Terz 1 3/5' (ext.) > Sifflote 1 (ext.) > Mixtur III-V > Zimbel III > Basson 16' > Trompette 8' > Hautbois (ext.) > Voix Humaine 8' > Clairon 4' > > POSITIV: (enclosed, 3 3/8' in.) > Prinzipal 8' > Gedackt > Dolce > Unda Maris > Oktave 4' > Spillflote > Nasat 2 2/3' > Oktave 2' > Blockflote > Terz 1 3/5' > Quintflote 1 1/3' > Mixtur IV > Sharf III > Rankett 16' > Trompette 8' > Cromorne > Clairon (ext.) 4' > Oboe 4' > > PEDAL: (4 to 5 in.) > Prinzipal 16' > Subbass > Rhor Bordun (Sw.) > Spitzflote (Gt.) > Quintflote (Sw.) 10 2/3' > Prinzipal 8' > Bassflote (ext.) > Spitzflote (Gt.) > Rhorflote (Sw.) > Oktave 4' (ext.) > Flute 4' > Flute 2' (ext) > Mixtur V > Contre Basson 32' (Sw.) > Posaune 16' > Basson (Sw.) > Rankett (Po.) > Trompete (ext.) 8' > Hautbois (Sw.) > Klarine 4' (ext.) > Cromorne (Po.) > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org    
(back) Subject: Re: My ORGAN... From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 20:36:53   At 10:44 PM 8/17/2000 EDT, you wrote: >Here y'all go, > > As I've been posting in past, I've accepted a new post at 1st =   >presbyterian "The Capitol Church" of Trenton, NJ.<snip>   Yup, I've heard this one. It's a tad on the BRIIIIIIIIIIGHT side, indeed. Robert Noerhen recorded a couple of albums there. You'd think builders would have learned from overly "germanic", vertical BRIGHT organs like = this by now, but...no....   DeserTBoB  
(back) Subject: Re: @#$%^&+* architects, acoustics From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 20:39:29   At 08:14 PM 8/17/2000 -0700, you wrote: >The Building Committee is a bunch of bottom-line-oriented Orange County CEOs who >SHOULD know chicanery when they see it / hear it. I have been STUNNED by = what >they've allowed to slide by.<snip>   Ah! There's the connection! This firm is designing homes and/or home additions and/or office buildings and/or shopping centers for these guys, and the church deal is a "reward" for giving them a break on the fee. = Seen in a dozen times.   DeserTBoB  
(back) Subject: Lively-Fulcher Encore From: "Evelyn Rowe" <efrowe@mindspring.com> Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 00:15:45 -0400   Dear folks,   Earlier this week I asked you how to get in touch with the people at = Lively Fulcher. No one seemed to have old-fashioned communications channels, so = I e-mailed Paul Fulcher. My e-mail to fulcher@chesapeake.com has just been returned as undeliverable. Any suggestions?   Evie