PipeChat Digest #1486 - Sunday, July 2, 2000
 
Re: need wiring diagram for a 2-6
  by "paul" <paulkruger@flashcom.net>
Re: secular organs
  by "Donald Hinckley" <rosedon@iopener.net>
Re: secular organs
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: secular organs
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@stlnet.com>
Re: Re:Ocean Grove Recitals
  by <Innkawgneeto@webtv.net>
Adding electric to pipe organ
  by "Mark" <obc@knickelbein.com>
Re: Adding electric to pipe organ
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
Re: Re:Ocean Grove Recitals
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: Baaahstun Symphony Hall =C6-S / Cincinnati's 	vanished Hook/Austin
  by "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au>
Re: Adding electric and Her Bishness moves slots
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: Baaahstun Symphony Hall =C6-S /   Cincinnati's vanished Hook/Austin
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: Baaahstun Symphony Hall =C6-S /  Cincinnati's 	vanished Hook/Austin
  by "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au>
Re: Baaahstun Symphony Hall =C6-S /    Cincinnati's vanished Hook/Austin
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
 


(back) Subject: Re: need wiring diagram for a 2-6 From: "paul" <paulkruger@flashcom.net> Date: Sat, 1 Jul 2000 20:53:44 -0700   lamar thanks for the info i have wurlitzer opus 1658 from the william fox home and am doing a complete rebuld to it paul ----- Original Message ----- From: "LAMAR BOULET" <lmar@hotmail.com> To: <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2000 5:26 PM Subject: Re: need wiring diagram for a 2-6     > Where are you? You will not find a diagram for wiring. You will have = to > just sit there and figure it out one wire etc at a time. If you are in the > Louisiana area, I could help you. I have had to repair cables cut by = rats > etc. Also note, if extensive wiring is required, the codes these days > require replacing old cotton wraped wire with the up to date plastic coated > wire.. lamar > > > ----Original Message Follows---- > From: "paul" <paulkruger@flashcom.net> > Reply-To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> > To: <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Subject: need wiring diagram for a 2-6 > Date: Sat, 1 Jul 2000 12:13:19 -0700 > > wurlitzer opus 1658 style d list 500 have relays and all cable cut can > some one help > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >    
(back) Subject: Re: secular organs From: "Donald Hinckley" <rosedon@iopener.net> Date: Sat, 1 Jul 2000 20:39:10 -0400   Secular organs? Has everyone forgotten the monster at City Hall in = Portland Maine? And speakin about the weakness of some of the organs, = Vergil Fox on one memorable night a few Octobers ago agreed to play the = Symphonie Concertante with the Portland orchestra on stage. The orchestra = was great. But when Verg turned up the volume, all one could sense was the = orchestra going through the motions-there was no sound except for the = orchestra!! How many completely frustrated organists would have shouted = their lungs out at the concert. I was sad because I would to hear that = piece where there was a better balance. Lately the late Elizabeth Noyes had left a few million to redecorate the = hall-which is now called appropriated _Elizaveth Noyes Hall- and she = didn't forget the organ. They organ was vaccuumed out and the old = wheezebox still wheezes but it's the most fun we have just listening to = it. One Municipal Organ that still exists, and has regular concerts all = summer for those of us who still enjoy hearing the power and the glory. Don Hinckley ----- Original Message -----   From: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> To: 'PipeChat' <pipechat@pipechat.org> Subject: secular organs Date: Sat, 1 Jul 2000 17:10:15 -0500   Check the Seattle Symphony web site and see around a dozen programs with organ in the coming season. Time will tell if this becomes standard, but for now there's a big buzz around town about the Fisk that's being opened officially this weekend. Peter -----Original Message----- From: quilisma@socal.rr.com [mailto:quilisma@socal.rr.com] Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2000 5:17 PM To: PipeChat Subject: secular organs It's kind of a vicious circle ... not that many concert halls have functioning organs, so modern composers in the mainstream seldom include the organ in their orchestration. Symphony management looks at the cost of maintaining an = organ vs. how often it is used, and throws up their hands. And it's also simply too costly to open a two or three thousand seat auditorium for organ recitals that only draw in the hundreds. San Diego Symphony moved into the renovated Fox Theatre, which includes a four-manual Robert Morton (?) theatre organ. They've made good use of it, with a silent film series with organ and orchestra. I don't know, though, if = they use it with the orchestra during the regular season. And Balboa Park, of course, is one of the biggest modern success stories of the organ recital = in a secular setting. Part of it has to do with the relaxed outdoor setting, of =   course. San Bernardino Symphony has a two-manual Wurlitzer in their hall, but it's =   in pretty sad shape. I was supposed to play the Saint-Saens there for Maestro =   Robertson, but then I got sick and the organ died (grin). It made enough NOISE for the Saint-Saens ... Maestro Robertson opined that with all the = couplers and playing up an octave, it "snarled" sufficiently (grin). They ended up = doing it a couple of seasons later with an electronic. It will be interesting to see (controversies aside) if the Disney Hall = organ is used regularly, or sinks into obscurity. Cheers, Bud "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org      
(back) Subject: Re: secular organs From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 17:54:30   At 03:16 PM 7/1/2000 -0700, you wrote: >San Bernardino Symphony has a two-manual Wurlitzer in their hall, but it's= in >pretty sad shape. I was supposed to play the Saint-Saens there for Maestro >Robertson, but then I got sick and the organ died (grin). It made enough NOISE >for the Saint-Saens ... Maestro Robertson opined that with all the couplers and >playing up an octave, it "snarled" sufficiently (grin). They ended up doing it >a couple of seasons later with an electronic.<snip>   I believe the San Berardino Wurlie (California Theater on Mill St.) is a Style D, 2m/7r, and never was much of anything, as is the theater, and most DEFINATELY the town! San Berdoo has a rare distinction of being one of the very few cities in California that has actually shrunk in population over the years. Those of us who know it well know why! =20 > >It will be interesting to see (controversies aside) if the Disney Hall organ is >used regularly, or sinks into obscurity.<snip>   I certainly hope it comes out OK, and is a versatile and usable instrument. The legacy of Glatter-G=F6tz and Rosales, however, lead many to believe it might wind up being a large Baroquish hard-voiced thing with an assortment of party horns, all controlled by a non-mobile console straight out of a medieval dungeon. Should this be the case, one can be quite sure that the dust that will gather in Lehry's "McDonald's Super Scoop" fa=E7ade, one of the most laughable architectural boners yet devised, certainly won't be disturbed by sonic intrusion from the pipes themselves! Regarding Lehry, the Seattle Museum of Rock 'n Roll, now open, shows his cartoonish whims of formless shape and blatant color to a tee. His Guggenheim project also elicits hmmms and haws.   Although "Wizzley" promises to be somewhat more sane, it won't be by much, for certain. Gehry's love affair with stainless steel is rivalled in history only by General Motors' styling chief of the '30s Harley Earl, whose use of stainless accents on Cadillacs became a trademark of the marque, culminating with the full stainless roofs of the '57 and '58 Eldorado Broughams. Unfortunately for Gehry, Earl's products were a bit more sane in nature! While the nearby LA County Music Center wears its 1960's design with grace and dignity 36 years later, as does New York's Lincoln Center, I feel Gehry's fits and spurts of non-parallel lunacy will be as relavent to the public in 35 years as a 1950's coffee shop is to them today.   DeserTBoB  
(back) Subject: Re: secular organs From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@stlnet.com> Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 20:23:50 -0500   Storandt, Peter wrote: > It's kind of a vicious circle ... not that many concert halls have > functioning > organs,   But on the other hand don't forget there have been quite a number of big new organs in symphony halls in recent years. There is, for example, the Fisk at the Myerson Hall in Dallas, and we at Quimby's are currently installing a relocated Casavant organ in the new Jacoby Symphony Hall in Jacksonville, Florida, which will be completed in time for a concert series heavily involving the organ commencing in the fall. Also, I believe Mander's are building a new instrument for the symphony hall in Miami. I would say Boston and Cincinnati might be a bit behind the times ...   John Speller  
(back) Subject: Re: Re:Ocean Grove Recitals From: <Innkawgneeto@webtv.net> Date: Sat, 1 Jul 2000 22:52:44 -0400 (EDT)   Visiting Ocean Grove is an "experience". One does not get the Ocean Grove Experience completely until one has felt and heard that great organ.   Next Sunday, July 9th, is the annual choir festival which will draw nearly 1500 singers and more than 5000 listeners. It is quite an evening.   Neil    
(back) Subject: Adding electric to pipe organ From: "Mark" <obc@knickelbein.com> Date: Sat, 1 Jul 2000 22:34:12 -0500   Where do I go about researching adding electronics to a pipe organ (for = more stops)? I'm curious about how far this can go, price, etc.    
(back) Subject: Re: Adding electric to pipe organ From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Jul 2000 00:10:35 EDT   Dear Mark:   I've told others about this. If you get a chance to hear an Ahlborn module = or two, it will be all over, (The looking and researching etc.). My church bought = two a Classic and a 201, with Four large speaker Cabs., two five channel 450 = watt amps. a Cathedral reverb. system, 54 ranks installed for $14,000.00. Every stop = is separately voiceable, pipe speech, wind, treble Vs Bass, chiff, reed = speech, and the samples are to die for as they match the existing pipes to a tee. = There is nothing electronic sounding or phony about the sound what so ever. These = will save a lot of small organs, and you'll look like a genius for saving a lot = of money.   Do I sell them, no! I wish I did, I'd be rich by now! I sell trackers if = you could believe such a thing. General Music has a web site on Piporg-L under the Ahlborn = name. Check them out, look at the specs of all four modules. They are coming out =   with a Cavaille Coll and a Silbermann sample module soon.   I've had big name organists down to my church to play them. They couldn't believe what they heard, and they weren't just being polite, they liked them. When = I saw your request, I couldn't resist telling you about them. We actually built = the modules into the console, they work with my existing Peterson Combination action, and now SSL has come out with a module that makes a single memory combination action like mine perform as if it had 256 memories, all saved = on a single floppy. Things are happening fast in the electronic field and = mostly all good.   Let me know how you come out on your project.   Ron Severin  
(back) Subject: Re: Re:Ocean Grove Recitals From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 21:14:40   At 10:52 PM 7/1/2000 -0400, you wrote: >Visiting Ocean Grove is an "experience". One does not get the Ocean >Grove Experience completely until one has felt and heard that great >organ.<snip>   "Great", most probably, in spite of Hope-Jones, rather than because of = him! Not having heard this organ either live or via recording, I've found it = to be an interesting subject. Does anyone have a concise history of the organ's many additions and rearrangements? It's been said that the original Hope-Jones installation was, as were many of his, very poor in terms of power, and was unified to the hilt. Hope-Jones did, probably in desparation, use interesting sonic reflectors in the chambers at Ocean Grove, an innovation that could probably help many an organ entombed in ridiculously deep, concrete bunkers.   One must give the devil his due, however, as Hope-Jones was indeed responsible for many modernizations of the organ, including sprung regulators which gave well-regulated wind at last, the ergonomically thoughtful "horseshoe" console (better than drawknobs or "stops on the wall" anyday, in my book), and other appliances and accoutrements. Even his tonal blunders found usefulness in the theater organ, where his Tibia Clausa replaced the diapason as a building block of tone. In retrospect, one could say that Hope-Jones' tonal ideas, although having no place in a serious instrument, indeed made for a very flexible and expressive "unit orchestra". Personally, I feel there is indeed a usage today for his diaphones, especially at 32' pitch in a large hall's concert organ...nothing else can give that powerful roll of heavy fundamental at these pitches, all the while providing relatively quick speech. Big = "party horn" reeds at these pitches just can't compare, and certainly cost as = much or more.   Although Hope-Jones is many times credited with bringing out the first reliable electro-pneumatic action, such is not the case, as others were working in the field as contemporaries of his. Indeed, some of his early installations were short-lived disasters. The later versions of his unit chest action, as utilized and modified by Rudolph Wurlitzers to great success, are the fastest EM actions ever built, and are among the most reliable and long lived.   DeserTBoB    
(back) Subject: Re: Baaahstun Symphony Hall =C6-S / Cincinnati's vanished Hook/Austin From: "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au> Date: Sun, 02 Jul 2000 12:47:49 +0800   Hey! Wait a minute! Is this really true? I don't think so! Perhaps you should look beyond the ocean. I have been buying books of new organ music for years, some of it very good and by English composers, but = a lot of it by American composers. And it's not all church music.   In addition there doesn't seem to be any end to the building of new = organs, many going into public buildings other than churches.   Bob Elms.     Russ Greene wrote:   > OI agree that few modern composers are attracted to the organ anymore - = but > frankly, I don't think that is the fault of religion. Without the > church(es), would the pipe organ exist at all? Or in fact, even have = been > developed past its early and quite humble beginnings? > > Russ >    
(back) Subject: Re: Adding electric and Her Bishness moves slots From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 22:37:52   At 12:10 AM 7/2/2000 EDT, you wrote: >There is >nothing electronic sounding or phony about the sound what so ever. These = will >save a lot of small organs, and you'll look like a genius for saving a = lot of >money.<snip>   Organ people have an unbelievably tough time digesting the fact that a LOT of digital stuff out there is PRETTY durned close to the real deal. I'd challenge a lot of the "golden ears" out there to an "is is live or Memorex" shoot-out in some hybrid installations. Sure, you can take to = the ivory tower and scream that "It's a fake!", and all that, but...in a lot = of situations, these additions make sense. What's needed, however, is a simple thermistor circuit to make sure their tuning tracks the flues as they meander here and there throughout the season! As always, the poor reeds will continue to take the bashing of the tuning hammer, while the flues are at fault!   Speaking of "bashing", I notice that Her Bishness' show has moved to Mondays on TBN, my comedy network of choice (Pat Robertson is in a tie = with Jon Stewart's "Daily Show" over on Comedy Central for yuks in my household). I also notice no new material on "Le Joie du Moozique". One can surmise that productions at Corraled Gerbils are all over and done = with?   DeserTBoB  
(back) Subject: Re: Baaahstun Symphony Hall =C6-S / Cincinnati's vanished Hook/Austin From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 22:40:02   At 12:47 PM 7/2/2000 +0800, you wrote: >I have been buying books of new >organ music for years, some of it very good and by English composers, but = a >lot of it by American composers. And it's not all church music.<snip>   And a lot of it is, as they say in Baaaahstun...."gah-BAGHE".   DeserTBoB  
(back) Subject: Re: Baaahstun Symphony Hall =C6-S / Cincinnati's vanished Hook/Austin From: "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au> Date: Sun, 02 Jul 2000 13:47:13 +0800   How can you say that? You haven't seen what I have? Have you got a closed = mind? Bob E.   Bob Scarborough wrote:   > At 12:47 PM 7/2/2000 +0800, you wrote: > >I have been buying books of new > >organ music for years, some of it very good and by English composers, = but a > >lot of it by American composers. And it's not all church music.<snip> > > And a lot of it is, as they say in Baaaahstun...."gah-BAGHE". > > DeserTBoB > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org   -- ----------------------------------------------------- Click here for Free Video!! http://www.gohip.com/freevideo/      
(back) Subject: Re: Baaahstun Symphony Hall =C6-S / Cincinnati's vanished Hook/Austin From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 23:53:45   At 01:47 PM 7/2/2000 +0800, you wrote: >How can you say that? You haven't seen what I have? Have you got a closed mind?<snip>   Moi? NEVER! Jes' needlin', as I'm famous for in all hemispheres. =20 Seriously, however, there's precious little out there that would be considered a huge public "draw". New ground needs to be plowed (ploughed?) for certain; the old warhorses (Widor's 5th, Bach's 565 "The Ubiquitous", and even a lot of Dupr=E9) has had their odometers turn over more than once, and no longer make for very interesting recitals for what public does show up. Fox in the '70s roasted Bach to a crisp, as Biggs valiantly fought back with never-ending "period-correct" recitals and recordings. Bach's sorta "done" for now in the public ear, much to the certain chagrin of the tracker-backers.   So, what DOES the organist have to offer the public? Piles and piles of tepid church junk? Interestingly, the nation's most popular and well-attended recitals these days (Spreckles, Wanamaker, the Maine Austin) consist of that old 19th century staple, transcriptions! The unit orchestra is holding its own, albeit with a seemingly endless stream of the dreaded, stereotypical "show tune". But now, the orgo-cognescendi is going off into the tracker-backer/Kellno-Vilottiland abyss, what with hard voiced teutonic tonality and torture-chamber, "stops-on-the-wall" consoles making such orchestrally-based presentations impossible, if not downright silly.   It IS a puzzlement, indeed. As I listen to that old recording of the 1949 Boston organ, I find it exciting and diverse...some Cavaille-C=F6ll here, some Willis there, Skinner poking around in the background, and it all sounds in BALANCE. The same could be said for Riverside, to a degree, as well as the St. Paul's Chapel/Columbia University organ. I think we've headed off at passenger train speed onto a dead-end siding since then, somehow, and the lack of illustreous, captivating contemporary repertoire doesn't help, either.   DeserTBoB