PipeChat Digest #1320 - Thursday, March 23, 2000
 
Re: expletive deleted and the modern church
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
organ fun
  by "John Vanderlee" <jovanderlee@vassar.edu>
Re: Recital notice
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: expletive deleted and the modern church
  by "Ron Natalie" <ron@sensor.com>
Re: Brides:  not from my planet
  by "Adrianne Schutt" <maybe@pipcom.com>
Re: expletive deleted and the modern church
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: Recital notice
  by "Rebekah Ingram" <rringram@syr.edu>
OHS Convention Hotel Info (x poxt)
  by <ScottFop@aol.com>
Schweinorgel
  by "Maynard Cuppy" <cuppy.maynard@mcleodusa.net>
Re: expletive deleted and the modern church
  by <Innkawgneeto@webtv.net>
Re: Pipes and Bytes
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
The "Popular" pipe organ
  by "Tim Bovard" <tmbovard@arkansas.net>
Re: The "Popular" pipe organ
  by "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net>
Re: The "Popular" pipe organ
  by "Adrianne Schutt" <maybe@pipcom.com>
Re: The "Popular" pipe organ
  by "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net>
Re: The "Popular" pipe organ
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@post.queensu.ca>
Re: Recital notice
  by "Mark Harris" <M.Harris@Admin.lon.ac.uk>
 



(back) Subject: Re: expletive deleted and the modern church From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:01:06   At 07:57 AM 3/22/2000 -0800, you wrote: >Despite Pius X's pronouncements on Modernism, the Church at the >beginning of the 21st century reflects popular culture. Having attempted >to "baptise" it in the 1960s, it was instead overwhelmed by it. The >camel's nose in the tent was followed by the rest of the camel in short >order.<snip>   Tut Tut, Bud! Let us not forget that before Vatican II, there was NO hymn singing of any regularity in most RC churches. It was only AFTER that certain Lutheran, Anglican and other melodies were heard on RC turf for the first time. However, right on the heels of this came the "gee-tar Masses", "Mariachi Masses" and other aberrations. The effect was pronounced and immediate. A lot of "ol' white folk" quit going to Mass. Fortunately, some fine, non-diocesan churches, such as the National Cathedral of the Immaculate Heart in DC and The National Shine of the Little Flower in MI developed and maintain their own high quality music programs, and stand as testimony to the failure of diocesan politics regarding musical liturgy. > >Nor is this phenomenon limited to the RC church ... pick up a copy of >the current Book of Common Prayer, or the current hymnal of any mainline >denomination, if indeed there IS a hymnal (as opposed to a disposable >paperback, or, worse, a projection screen).<snip>   An invention of the "tilt-ups". I remember in the late '80s a co-worker, who was way into a tilt-up, slaved to adapt a PC to drive an old projection TV to do the lyrics to their myriad of CCM "hits". I remember provoking an arguement (Moi???? Ne pas vrai, certainment!!) when I said, "Ya know, you really don't need this. After all, there's only seven words repeated eleven times...that's why we call it "7-11" music!" Threats from him of fire and brimstone ensued, saying that they were the "new, true church", so I never again spoke much to him about much of anything.   >Meanwhile, instead of attempting to DO something about it, the churches >have divided themselves into mean-spirited, circle-the-wagons right-wing >groups and anything-goes-as-long-as-it-has-shock-value left-wing= groups<snip>   I'd hate to put a left wing label on anything in this arena, that's for sure! It's the left that abandoned the whole church mileau entirely! I prefer to think of it as "old style righties" and "new style= righties"...ROFL!   >These latter have to constantly re-invent themselves because of the high >turnover in their congregations, due to the lack of anything to hold >people beyond the first flush of excitement.<snip>   One wonders when the "Pass The Loot Club" will merge with Time-Warner....   >Comments of boomers and Gen-Xers notwithstanding, the organ is a >symptom, not a cause.<snip>   As one tilt-up devotee said to me, "The organ represents all that was wrong with religion and represents the evil Catholic church." Whatta crock, since the organ was never an integral part of RC worship! It did, however, confirm my suspicions that the tilt-up craze is a Southern Baptist plot from start to finish.   >However, due blame must be laid at the "purists' " door ... the >neo-classic tracker revival signaled the beginning of the organ's >dethronement as King of Instruments. Boring organ recitals consisting >entirely of literature from BEFORE Bach (I once heard a recital by a >"major" player where the PEDALS weren't used for the first half of the >recital) didn't help, either. One has to wonder what the old civic >organists were doing RIGHT that we're doing WRONG.<snip>   Hehehehhahahaha! How true, true, TRUE! Although I'm inviting broadside volley blasts from the tracker-backer crowd, these small, limited and obsolete instruments have no place in the large expanses of the concert hall or auditorium. I recall the installation of a smallish Flentrop (I think) of two manuals in the University of California Riverside theater, c. 1968. After some EPB-ish Bach and Buxehude recitals by various university cognoscenti, it sat and sat and sat. No way could the "lil box of whistles" do Saint-Sa=EBns #3, or the Jongen (my personal fave), or anything other than providing a continuum to what could already be heard on E. Power Biggs' "Music for Jubilee" album of the '60s. AFAIK, it still just sits and sits, in use by university students and faculty for baroque literature practice only.   Today's concert hall organ requires tonal diversity and flexibility found in the ideals of G. Donald Harrison and other "organ reform" boosters of the early part of the century, and requires a considerably well-sized and appointed instrument. EP and/or DE action is a must, as is a solid state combon action; movable, possibly multiple consoles and acoustically proper chambers and attractive fa=E7ades.   >I was interviewed by the local newspaper in San Diego some years ago >when I started a Schola Cantorum for the preservation of Gregorian Chant >in the service of the Church. The interviewer asked me if I foresaw a >renaissance of Gregorian Chant. My reply is still valid: "No. That's why >I'm doing this."<snip>   Love of chant's fine, but with it goes the reality that it's an archiac musical form, never again to attain "popularity"...whatever THAT is. I got a belly full of it growing up in the catholic church, and don't really care to ever have to deal with it again, personally. Also love of tracker organs is fine, as long one takes the reality that it, too, is an archiac, historical artifact, and, although it can be charming in a small church while noodled along for accompaniment, it's no match for a modern organ of concert hall proportions in public venues.   Such organs are proven public draws; witness the years of successful recital series of San Diego's Spreckles Austin Opus 453, in an outdoor amphitheater, yet! The "Kotszchmar" Austin, Opus 323, of Portland, ME, is another splendid example of a popular public organ. A finger of shame should be wagged at San Francisco, however, for keeping the magnificent and thoroughly rebuilt Opus 500 boxed up in storage. Double the shame for proposing to dump it into a small "organ plaza" on the Embarcadero. The organ could be attracting thousands of new fans to the King of Instruments if in a proper, attractive environment.   DeserTBoB    
(back) Subject: organ fun From: "John Vanderlee" <jovanderlee@vassar.edu> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:31:22 -0500   Dear list,   This weekend we are about to embark on one of the most fun events of the = year.   Saturday and Sunday downtown Poughkeepsie, NY will be blocked of for pedestrian traffic only as we hold the annual Kid's Expo.   All the merchants, and offices wil have displays and activities geared toward kids. Both the civic center and the armory will have dispaly booths with information and games all for kids. Food vendors will roam the streets, a special trolley transports people around. There will be street musicians, etc. etc.   In the midst of all this our venerable Bardavon 1869 Opera house will have non-stop stage shows from 10 to 4. And to glue all these stage shows together will be music on our Wurlitzer Organ in between acts.   Based on the past, we expect some 15,000 kids to traipse through the theater in those two days, many of them will stop by the console and ask = no end of questions. Yes, we get schlocky and have multicolored lights in the chambers, which always prompt people to ask questions as they watch the shutters move. But it is so much fun to stand there and explain that the organ is a relic from 1928, and that ALL those sounds are real: "No there are no speakers", and "the console is only a small piece of the organ.."   Yes it's all dressed in glitz and lights, but we feel we're doing our bit for awareness of the fun of a pipe organ.   Stop by if you're in the neighborhood!      
(back) Subject: Re: Recital notice From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:08:24   At 01:39 PM 3/22/2000 -0500, Rebekah wrote:   >Reception to follow > >Let me know if you want to bake for it. ;)   What??!? No champagne?!??   hehehehe!   DeserTBoB  
(back) Subject: Re: expletive deleted and the modern church From: "Ron Natalie" <ron@sensor.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 16:26:26 -0500       Bob Scarborough wrote: > Fortunately, > some fine, non-diocesan churches, such as the National Cathedral of the > Immaculate Heart in DC   I'm not sure how you can have a non-dioscesan Cathedral. That's sort of a contradiction. You mean the "Shrine of the Immaculate Conception" by any chance?  
(back) Subject: Re: Brides: not from my planet From: "Adrianne Schutt" <maybe@pipcom.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:03:52 -0800   At 06:31 AM 3/22/2000 -0400, Charles E. Peery wrote: >Two different bride phone calls this week: #1, whose soloist is doing = the >"wedding version of the Lord's Prayer" (what the heck is that?) I could be way off, but my best guess is bride #1 means Cliff Richards' "Millennium Prayer". Boils down to the Lord's Prayer set to = Auld Lang Syne. Caused quite the stir late last year.....some people thought it was the most moving thing since running water, others thought it was = blasphemy.   Have fun! Ad ;->      
(back) Subject: Re: expletive deleted and the modern church From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 14:36:21   At 04:26 PM 3/22/2000 -0500, you wrote: >You mean the "Shrine of the Immaculate Conception" by any >chance?<snip>   But, of course! Thanks for correcting the error.   dB  
(back) Subject: Re: Recital notice From: "Rebekah Ingram" <rringram@syr.edu> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 18:14:56 -0500     ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob Scarborough <desertbob@rglobal.net> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2000 1:08 PM Subject: Re: Recital notice     > At 01:39 PM 3/22/2000 -0500, Rebekah wrote: > > >Reception to follow > > > >Let me know if you want to bake for it. ;) > > What??!? No champagne?!?? > > hehehehe!   That's at the wedding!!!   -Me    
(back) Subject: OHS Convention Hotel Info (x poxt) From: <ScottFop@aol.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:00:02 EST   Am I to understand that the renovated Suffolk University Residence Hall is =   the OHS "convention hotel" for this year's convention?????  
(back) Subject: Schweinorgel From: "Maynard Cuppy" <cuppy.maynard@mcleodusa.net> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 20:10:40 -0600   In light of a recent thread on this list, I can't resist sharing something I just found on the Organ Web Ring:   The word SCHWEINEORGEL is a German term and means translated "PORK ORGAN" or "PIGGY ORGAN".   The term SCHWEINEORGEL was normally used for the accordeon, which anyway got very bizarre names. Later it was spitefully used for all cheap organs, that were sounding mostly awful (filthy/ piggy). I used it for all nasty sounding synthesizers and organs, later for ALL electronic musical instruments, which is not a satisfying description. Therefore we should watch the term from different positions:   You can go to the site to find the rest: http://www.schweineorgel.de/   I'll let you guys make what you will of what I've offered above. Now I'm going back to learn more about das Schweinorgel. Maynard    
(back) Subject: Re: expletive deleted and the modern church From: <Innkawgneeto@webtv.net> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 21:20:27 -0500 (EST)   Bud, you have raised some very valid points. Neil    
(back) Subject: Re: Pipes and Bytes From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 22:23:50 EST   In a message dated 3/22/00 1:32:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, desertbob@rglobal.net writes:   > >I would truly love to develop a real time performance digital keyboard instrument   > > Perhaps you'd like my 3 manual Hammond HBCERT-3100! Teehehehehe! > Hmmm. Wouldn't that be UNREAL time! woohooo woohoooo woohooo   Bruce .. . . .in the Beagles' Nest with the Baskerbeagles Molly, Duncan, and Miles Cremona502@cs.com http://community.webtv.net/cremona84000/ALLHAILTHEPOWERand http://community.webtv.net/hydrant/TheBeaglesNest http://community.webtv.net/bruco/STORIESINGLASS  
(back) Subject: The "Popular" pipe organ From: "Tim Bovard" <tmbovard@arkansas.net> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 22:48:02 -0600   Erik Johnson wrote, in response to a question and several good points raised by Bob Scarborough:   >I hesitate to say that un-enthusiastic playing of historical or = specialist >music on a 10 - 20 rank organ may be quaint and delightful for OHS / AGO = and >other organ minded people - however the general public is frankly BO[RE]D = TO >DEATH with this.   I wouldn't be so quick to hesitate, Erik -- I think you've hit upon a very important aspect of the reasons why the organ, as an instrument, is not nearly as popular as it once was in this world. I think that if we, as organists and organ-people, were a bit more willing to "let our hair down" and try to have *FUN* with the instruments at our disposal, that this = would be a very good first step. I can't tell you all how many organ concerts I've attended that, though well performed, and even occasionally well attended, were nonetheless DULL AS DISHWATER!!   In many of these cases, a few very simple things could have been done by the performers to change this perception. Off the top of my head:   1) TALK TO THE AUDIENCE!! Give them a few tidbits about the music or the instrument, relate a funny story about something happening 'on the way to the recital', or even (HORRORS!) crack a *joke*!! Avoid the academic = lingo (esp the word "contrapuntal" <g>). In short, display a personality to go with your phyical presence there. 2) Let the audience see what you're doing. If the console cannot be = moved into view, there have been many well-reported successes using CCTV and big-screen monitors. Perhaps the occasional "dramatic flourish" might = even be in order, when reaching for that last high note or big chord. Try to show them that it is *FUN* to play the organ!! (it *is*, isn't it??) 3) Program music that is accessible (read: interesting) to folks that = have not studied the instrument or its literature for years and years. We all know of the sorts of music we call "bonbons"...but are we forgetting why = we call them so?? It's because *people LIKE them*!! (and, you can also always sneak in something "studious", if you must <g>) 4) Vary your programs to include as many different sound combinations as possible -- everything from bubbly flutes, to slushy strings/celestes, to crashing full-organ chords. Is there a harp?? USE it!! Same goes for the chimes. People *do* enjoy that stuff!!   These are only a few simple things that could be done to help "liven up" = an organ concert -- who has further suggestions?? I think we all need to = hear them, if we're ever to get our beloved instrument back into the public = eye. And, I think we all need to *DO* them -- at least a bit more often than (currently) average.   Bob's suggestions about municipal (non-church) organs are indeed very good ones -- these instruments should be promoted and exploited to their = fullest advantage. It's truly a shame that so many have "gone by the wayside", = and it's heartening that some of those remaining are experiencing renewed interest. But, however, it would seem that at this point in history, the majority of pipe organs and organ concerts/recitals are located in churches. Shouldn't we be able to include the church organs in our attempts to broaden the interest in the instrument? Shouldn't we at least try??     Cheers --   Tim                        
(back) Subject: Re: The "Popular" pipe organ From: "VEAGUE" <dutchorgan@svs.net> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 00:20:24 -0500   In reply to Tims suggestions to enhance organ concerts- all good tips indeed- why not a pitcher of beer and some pizza to go with that? --and = all the bells and whistles!   Rick        
(back) Subject: Re: The "Popular" pipe organ From: "Adrianne Schutt" <maybe@pipcom.com> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 00:29:04 -0800   At 10:48 PM 3/22/2000 -0600, Tim Bovard wrote: >These are only a few simple things that could be done to help "liven up" = an >organ concert -- who has further suggestions?? Not organ-ic, but a good illustration, IMHO....2 years or so ago = I found myself stage managing a concert by a Canadian folk group. The evening was going well, the group was good, the audience was reasonably happy, but you could tell it was lacking that certain magic something. Sound familiar so far?   For their final number, the group decided to pull a little joke = on the audience. In the middle of a perfectly normal, bouncy folk tune, the double bass player picked up his bow and launched heavily into that familiar "da..da..daaaa....da..da..da-daaaaa" riff from "Smoke on the = Water".   That did it.   I about swallowed the mic on my headset. Were it not for arms on =   the seats, the audience would've ROFLed into the aisles. It was a wonderful thing to watch, and I certainly learned from it.   Have fun! Ad ;->    
(back) Subject: Re: The "Popular" pipe organ From: "Bob Scarborough" <desertbob@rglobal.net> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 21:25:33   At 10:48 PM 3/22/2000 -0600, Tim Bovard wrote: >In many of these cases, a few very simple things could have been done by >the performers to change this perception. Off the top of my head: <snipping some REALLY good stuff>   Yes, yes, YES! If you look at all the truly successful organists in the last century, they did all of these things, and more! One thing I learned the hard way in recitals...NEVER play to organists or academics. They'll denigrate anything you do anyway, so nuts to 'em! I'd never even let the local AGO poobahs know I was "reciting". Play to the PUBLIC! You don't have to be as chatty as most TO players, but showmanship sells the instrument, as well as the performer! I remember the snobs panned everything Virgil Fox did (so did I; he wasn't my style, for sure), but he DID reach his target audience, and by coupling his incredible technical skills with the persona directed at them, was wildly successful. Another secret of the music bizz that's no secret: Promote, promote, PROMOTE! Flyers, pasteboards, radio spots in community bully-tin = boards...anything's fair game.   DeserTBoB    
(back) Subject: Re: The "Popular" pipe organ From: "Bob Conway" <conwayb@post.queensu.ca> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 04:25:44 -0500   At 10:48 PM 2000-03-22 -0600, Tim and Erik wrote: >Erik Johnson wrote, in response to a question and several good points >raised by Bob Scarborough: > > >I hesitate to say that un-enthusiastic playing of historical or = specialist > >music on a 10 - 20 rank organ may be quaint and delightful for OHS / = AGO > and > >other organ minded people - however the general public is frankly > BO[RE]D TO > >DEATH with this. > >I wouldn't be so quick to hesitate, Erik -- I think you've hit upon a = very >important aspect of the reasons why the organ, as an instrument, is not >nearly as popular as it once was in this world. I think that if we, as >organists and organ-people, were a bit more willing to "let our hair = down" >and try to have *FUN* with the instruments at our disposal, that this = would >be a very good first step. I can't tell you all how many organ concerts >I've attended that, though well performed, and even occasionally well >attended, were nonetheless DULL AS DISHWATER!!   Wasn't this just what Virgil Fox did? Is it not what Carlo Curley still = does?   >1) TALK TO THE AUDIENCE!! Give them a few tidbits about the music or = the >instrument, relate a funny story about something happening 'on the way = to >the recital', or even (HORRORS!) crack a *joke*!! Avoid the academic = lingo >(esp the word "contrapuntal" <g>). In short, display a personality to go >with your phyical presence there.   Diane Bish seems to do that on her TV programmes, at least!   >2) Let the audience see what you're doing. If the console cannot be = moved >into view, there have been many well-reported successes using CCTV and >big-screen monitors. Perhaps the occasional "dramatic flourish" might = even >be in order, when reaching for that last high note or big chord. Try to >show them that it is *FUN* to play the organ!! (it *is*, isn't it??)   The Theatre Organ performers all seem to manage all this and more = extremely well.   >3) Program music that is accessible (read: interesting) to folks that = have >not studied the instrument or its literature for years and years. We all >know of the sorts of music we call "bonbons"...but are we forgetting why = we >call them so?? It's because *people LIKE them*!! (and, you can also >always sneak in something "studious", if you must <g>)   Going back a long, long time, Edwin Lemare did just that, His "Andantino" =   is a case in point, and it is still a popular piece.   >4) Vary your programs to include as many different sound combinations as >possible -- everything from bubbly flutes, to slushy strings/celestes, to >crashing full-organ chords. Is there a harp?? USE it!! Same goes for = the >chimes. People *do* enjoy that stuff!!   Don't forget the Zimbelstern!   It not only has been done, but continues to be done to this day. I hope that some of our younger organists will take up the challenge, and even if =   they have never had the chance to actually see Virgil in the flesh, listen =   to the re-issues of his "Heavy Organ" concerts. He knew how to pack them = in!   I have sat through many a "dry as dust" organ recital, only to watch the =   audience diminish after the intermission! - If my radio programmes had been like them, I would not have been able to keep my audience. Listen to =   Michael Barone, or Bonnie Beth Derby for how to do it over the air, and continue to develop that technique at the console.   Bob Conway, Retired organic disc jockey for CFRC-FM     "I am easily satisfied with the very best." Sir Winston Churchill.    
(back) Subject: Re: Recital notice From: "Mark Harris" <M.Harris@Admin.lon.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:57:45 GMT     Glenda wrote,   >should we mail brownies?   Didn't know the Postal Service (or the ATF Bureau) would let you do that!   Mark Harris =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D