PipeChat Digest #2013 - Wednesday, April 11, 2001
 
Re: first lady-person of the organ
  by "Kaiser, M - Lancee, T." <lankai@netrover.com>
Re: first lady-person of the organ
  by "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com>
Re: Interesting new Disney Hall organ X-Posted
  by <SProt82850@cs.com>
(no subject)
  by <ahremsen40@aol.com>
Re: Interesting new Disney Hall organ X-Posted
  by "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu>
Re: first lady-person of the organ
  by "Mike Gettelman" <mike3247@earthlink.net>
Re: full swell
  by "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au>
Carpet and Legionaires Disease
  by "noel jones" <gedeckt@usit.net>
Roman Candle
  by "Louis Katz" <Louis.Katz@mail.tamucc.edu>
Re: Roman Candle
  by "noel jones" <gedeckt@usit.net>
disney facade
  by "Randy Terry" <randyterryus@yahoo.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: first lady-person of the organ From: "Kaiser, M - Lancee, T." <lankai@netrover.com> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 20:28:43 -0400   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0056_01C0C1FC.D61E4040 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable     ----- Original Message -----=3D20 From: Weber, Richard=3D20 To: pipechat@pipechat.org=3D20 Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 6:00 PM Subject: first lady-person of the organ     Her shoes harmonize completely with her hair and playing: cheap and =3D vulgar. =3D20 Richard   I normally lurk and enjoy the information which is disseminated on =3D this list. However, I feel it necessary to address the above. In 1996, = =3D the Toronto Branch (Ontario, Canada) of the Royal School of Church =3D Music contracted with Miss Bish to play the closing recital of our =3D Summer Course. The location was one of the largest churches in Canada. = =3D The Treasurer and I (Chair of the Branch) met Miss Bish at the airport. = =3D During the drive to the downtown hotel, during her practice for the =3D recital, during the recital and afterward, she was a consummate =3D professional in her dealings with the Branch, the church and the =3D audience. Her genuine warmth and her ability to relate to the audience = =3D was amazing. I am appalled at unprofessional comments, rudeness =3D directed toward her or her appearance and, lest this should go =3D unmentioned, the uncharitable and unChristian comments. I would suggest = =3D that such "cheap and vulgar" comments be taken for what they are worth: = =3D not worth the space taken. =3D20   With regards from the musical vineyards,   Michael   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0056_01C0C1FC.D61E4040 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META content=3D3D"text/html; charset=3D3Diso-8859-1" =3D http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 5.00.2722.2800" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE=3D20 style=3D3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: = =3D 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV=3D20 style=3D3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =3D black"><B>From:</B>=3D20 <A href=3D3D"mailto:rweber@aero.net" title=3D3Drweber@aero.net>Weber, = =3D Richard</A>=3D20 </DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=3D20 href=3D3D"mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org"=3D20 title=3D3Dpipechat@pipechat.org>pipechat@pipechat.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, April 09, 2001 = =3D 6:00=3D20 PM</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> first lady-person of = =3D the=3D20 organ</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3D3D2>Her shoes harmonize completely with her hair and = =3D playing:=3D20 cheap and vulgar.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3D3D2>Richard</FONT></DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3D3D2>I normally lurk and enjoy the information which is = =3D   disseminated on this list.&nbsp; However, I feel it necessary to =3D address the=3D20 above.&nbsp; In 1996, the Toronto Branch (Ontario,&nbsp;Canada) of the = =3D Royal=3D20 School of&nbsp; Church Music contracted with Miss Bish to play the =3D closing=3D20 recital of our Summer Course.&nbsp; The location was one of the =3D largest=3D20 churches in Canada.&nbsp; The Treasurer and I (Chair of the Branch) =3D met Miss=3D20 Bish at the airport.&nbsp; During the drive to the downtown hotel, =3D during her=3D20 practice for the recital, during the recital and afterward, she was = a=3D20 consummate professional in her dealings with the Branch,&nbsp;the =3D church and=3D20 the audience.&nbsp; Her genuine warmth and her ability to relate to =3D the=3D20 audience was&nbsp;amazing.&nbsp; I am appalled = at&nbsp;unprofessional=3D20 comments,&nbsp;rudeness directed toward her or her appearance and, =3D lest this=3D20 should go unmentioned, the uncharitable and unChristian =3D comments.&nbsp; I=3D20 would suggest that such "cheap and vulgar" comments be taken for what =3D they are=3D20 worth:&nbsp; not worth the space taken.&nbsp; </FONT></DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3D3D2>With regards from the musical =3D vineyards,</FONT></DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT size=3D3D2>Michael</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0056_01C0C1FC.D61E4040--    
(back) Subject: Re: first lady-person of the organ From: "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 20:10:56 -0500   At 2:29 PM -0400 4/10/01, Jeffrey Trimble wrote: >Back in my graduate days a group of organ majors were at our >teacher's house for a cookout. Someone made a comment regarding >Diane and we were royally chastised by our teacher. To quote him (and >I still remember his quote) " No, No, don't say those things, she can >certainly play. But more important, she has reached out to the common > man--where none of you organ majors have done so--you sit on your >ivory towers." > >That certainly put all of us in our places. IT also made me think about >artist who "show off the organ". I have seen her in concert and she >has been stunning to the audience. (And to me too.) She is >gracious when a guest and you >couldn't ask for anyone to be so nice and reach out to the audience. > >When she plays a concert anywhere, there is SRO. (Standing Room Only).   It seems that history is repeating itself! Back when i was in college the organist that many tired to put down as being crash was Virgil Fox. There were all sorts of noses up in the air about him and his playing. I can remember when one of the professors at college asked our Organ Pedagogy class how many were attending Virgil's concert that evening/weekend/whatever. When almost all of us put up our hands to show that we were going he started in on how we were "prostituting" our art by attending his concert! Of course, I had to get the last word in on the subject by replying " Mr. ---------, I am attending with YOUR teacher who is looking very forward to the concert!" That shut him up on the subject since my organ teacher had been his organ teacher many years previously.   Virgil with all his touring, including his touring with "Black Beauty" or whatever electronic organ he was using at various times, did more for our art than any other organist of his time except for E. Power Biggs. I can remember seeing and hearing Virgil in a high school auditorium/gym on a Community Concert series and he had that room PACKED and it was a large room. He made the concert FUN for the people attending, he spoke WITH them not talked down to them and playing MUSIC that they could enjoy! And from his looks and the way he talked he ENJOYED being there and playing for them! Sure, some of it was "schmaltzy" but they enjoyed it and were after more! Yet, I also know that Virgil could play Bach and other composers in a complete "academic" fashion if he wanted to. But he also knew that the "unwashed masses" wouldn't and didn't relate to that type of performance.   I don't think that Diane is broadcast here or at least, if she is, I haven't been able to find the program, so I haven't seen her on TV in a very long time. But I know that she is doing more for our instrument than any other of us. And she is seen by more people in one program than any of the rest of us will ever be in our whole lifetimes.   We need more artists like Diane and Virgil to bring the organ to the general public. Luckily, it seems that some of the younger generation of artists is following their lead with programs of transcriptions and fun music. And NOT being so academic in their playing. And some of these younger artists do make the audience aware that they are enjoying being up there presenting this program. These are going to be the salvation of our chosen instrument - not all the "academic types" who play ever note perfectly but totally without feeling!   I know that some of this is not going to be popular with some members of this list but those are my feelings and I am STICKING to them!! <G>   David  
(back) Subject: Re: Interesting new Disney Hall organ X-Posted From: <SProt82850@cs.com> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 21:36:10 EDT   << Russ Greene wrote: =20 > On the contrary, the public and trained visual artists such as architects= =20 do > seem to be quite impressed with the design. So I don't feel it's a VERY > large assumption. All of the criticism I have seen focuses on the visual > design of the fa=E7ade and comes from organists, who are not trained visu= al > artists, and are therefore no more qualified to comment on the visual=20 design > of the instrument than any member of the general public. >>   Excuse me, but as an organist AND architect AND pipe organ architect AND=20 liturgical designer/fine arts consultant, which should make me a trained=20 visual artist, I am quite qualified to comment on the visual design and I AM= =20 NOT impressed. On the contrary, I am horrified by what I see and my initial= =20 reaction was to call for immediate execution of the architect. Further, the= =20 fellow architects, organ designers and artists whose opinions I have sought=20 thus far virtually all share my disdain. The general consensus is that it i= s=20 NOT good design but merely homage to that most fickle of mistresses, FASHION= ,=20 and an egotistical attempt to be different and shocking, which it at least=20 succeeds in doing.   Granted, the design could be seen as whimsical and playful and in keeping=20 with the character of the building. It may also capture some of the=20 public's imagination, but will that do the organ any genuine good? Or will=20 it continue the downward trend of the pipe organ's importance musically by=20 sending a message that the organ cannot be taken seriously? After all, this= =20 design "would you like fries with your concert hall?" strips the organ of an= y=20 visual dignity and reduces the King of Instruments to the Clown of=20 Instruments. "That's a pipe organ? We certainly don't want something like=20 that in OUR church."   At least people are talking about it and the organ, for better or worse, is=20 getting some badly needed publicity. It will be interesting to see, if like= =20 the Stravinsky or the Seattle Flentrop, it survives the trials of time and i= s=20 recognized as a true timeless work of art, or whether it will be seen as a=20 fleeting and embarassing moment of fashion and like today's spring styles or= =20 hit rock band, vanishes quickly.   Steven  
(back) Subject: (no subject) From: <ahremsen40@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 22:01:30 EDT   Hooray for you David!   I was at dinner with three organists (many years ago) in New York. All = they did all night was bash Virgil for his lack of taste, his clothes, blah, = blah, blah. Finally I wouldn't listen to anymore. I told them that Virgil had = made me laugh, had made me cry, had made me angry, and moved me beyond = endurance, but that he had NEVER bored me stiff which was all their playing did for = me. End of dinner, last time any of them ever spoke to me. No loss!   Best Folks, Allan  
(back) Subject: Re: Interesting new Disney Hall organ X-Posted From: "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 22:02:25 -0400   > > >Excuse me, but as an organist AND architect AND pipe organ architect AND >liturgical designer/fine arts consultant, which should make me a trained >visual artist, I am quite qualified to comment on the visual design and I = AM >NOT impressed. ..."That's a pipe organ? We certainly don't want >something like >that in OUR church." > > >Steven >   Sure, but this is a civic organ, not a church installation. Wasn't there a time (and wouldn't it be great if that time would come again) when people went to hear concerts on civic organs? They didn't think they were in church just because they were listening to an organ. They were hearing nonliturgical music like transcriptions of orchestral works, and bonbons by Edwin Lemare and Alfred Hollins. It wasn't a churchy experience, thank God. If the organ's only future is its liturgical link to mainstream churches, then it might not have much of a future.   Randy Runyon organist, Immanuel Presbyterian Church, Cincinnati runyonr@muohio.edu  
(back) Subject: Re: first lady-person of the organ From: "Mike Gettelman" <mike3247@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 22:06:46 -0400     --------------DC044A7DDD9BE939C34BC741 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   David Scribner wrote:     <snip> artists do make the audience aware that they are enjoying being up there presenting this program. These are going to be the salvation of our chosen instrument - not all the "academic types" who play ever note perfectly but totally without feeling! <snip>     Mike Gettelman wrote:   I took some "unorganic" friends with me to hear Jillian Weir play the big Skinner at Severance Hall in February. After the concert I heard one friend remark, "the music was beautiful, but the organist had the sense of humor of a root canal"   Those of us who know Dame Weir recognize her talent as an impeccable performance technician, but she did not speak to the audience, nor did she stray at all from her serious classical program. Had she encored with Stars and Stripes Forever, she would have brought the house down.   I stress that this post in no way intends to impugn Jillian Weir's artistry, but merely provides an example of why it is necessary to entertain a little at each concert.   My 2 or 3 cents worth Mike     --------------DC044A7DDD9BE939C34BC741 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html> David Scribner wrote: <br>&nbsp; <blockquote>&lt;snip>&nbsp;&nbsp; artists do make the audience <br>aware that they are enjoying being up there presenting this program. <br>These are going to be the salvation of our chosen instrument - not <br>all the "academic types" who play ever note perfectly but totally <br>without feeling!&nbsp; &lt;snip> <br>&nbsp;</blockquote> Mike Gettelman wrote: <blockquote>I took some "unorganic" friends with me to hear Jillian Weir play the big Skinner at Severance Hall in February.&nbsp; After the = concert I heard one friend remark, "the music was beautiful, but the organist had the sense of humor of a root canal" <p>Those of us who know Dame Weir recognize her talent as an impeccable performance technician, but she did not speak to the audience, nor did she stray at all from her serious classical program. Had she encored with Stars and Stripes Forever, she would have brought the house down. <p>I stress that this post in no way intends to impugn Jillian Weir's = artistry, but merely provides an example of why it is necessary to entertain a = little at each concert. <p>My 2 or 3 cents worth <br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Mike <br>&nbsp;</blockquote> </html>   --------------DC044A7DDD9BE939C34BC741--    
(back) Subject: Re: full swell From: "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au> Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2001 10:04:58 +0800   Full swell in English Romantic organ music would certainly have as its first requisite swell chorus reeds plus mixture. Oboe need not be included. Bob E.   Randolph Runyon wrote: > > What exactly is meant to be included in the registration indication > "Full Swell"--for example, in Edwin Lemare? Would it include a > mixture if one is on the swell? Would it exclude reeds other than > oboe?    
(back) Subject: Carpet and Legionaires Disease From: "noel jones" <gedeckt@usit.net> Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2001 00:09:43 -0400   There are many reasons why a church should return to traditional building materials....but unfortunately for the kinesthetic and visual people saying that it will make the music sound better means nothing to = them....   There are the wonderful fear tactics...at http://www.envirohome.com/mold.asp you can read about Legionnaires and some of the places that microbes can hide. I was at a church the other day, a relatively new church built on a concrete slab with carpet laid over it. I was reading an instruction manual stored on a shelf next to the organ bench and found that it smelled of mold rather than incense. The entire choir area was damp....   There is no repository of information that we can find that can help us build a strong foundation of reference materials. For that reason we have founded the Traditional Church Acoustics Study Group at:     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/churchacoustics     A website is being designed, which will have links to articles of interest and we will publish papers in support of the returning to buildings that work. Architects and designers who wish to be recognized for their work are encouraged to post messages and submit articles.   Thank you! -- noel jones, aago  
(back) Subject: Roman Candle From: "Louis Katz" <Louis.Katz@mail.tamucc.edu> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 23:32:30 +0000   I don't really know how y'all will react to this but I thought I would throw it out your way anyway. In a week i am doing a performance on my "new" organ. Thanks again to everyone who has helped via advice in my speedy removal and my repair questions. The lamb tallow has really helped. Anyhow five ranks of the 42 I saved from sawsalls and dumpsters are working well and connected to a single manual. The rest are still stored.   An additonal "rank" has been installed. It is in the form of a long skinny kiln with 60 chimneys (wouldn't you figure I would forget high C). Anyhow each of the chimneys has a gas jet installed. The gas jets are connected to 12V gas solenoid valves. The chimneys are laid out in a pattern like the black and white keys on a keyboard. Just to calm you, the pipes, keyboard and relay are a good safe distance from the kiln. I played it tonight complete with the flames and the potential is glorious, but I have to get the flames to light off more reliably. Today only about 2/3's worked. Its windy out here. I am playing a program of music selected to look not necessarily good.I have one manual, no pedals. Bach prelude I in C has some great simple patterning. There is also a Scarlatti Sonanata in C with a right hand that jumps from above to below the left that seems to look good. Maple leaf rag is something I play well, so its in the mix, as is a slower cakewalk. Unfortunately, the piece that has great patterns that seem like they will be discernable to the audience is in D minor. I am going to butcher it. Oy. It does look good. I am not however giving a concert. This is a short performance, more like a play, I will be dressed as a repairman, and am at least considering doing some tuning, and stopping of the performance to fix sticking notes.   The working title is "A Rehearsal of Five Octaves". I also have a performance schedule this June at a ceramic art center in Montana. Louis Katz          
(back) Subject: Re: Roman Candle From: "noel jones" <gedeckt@usit.net> Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2001 01:09:17 -0400   Will you be selling video tapes? [serious question!]   Louis Katz wrote: > > I don't really know how y'all will react to this but I thought I would > throw it out your way anyway.   noel jones, aago ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ moderator, rodgers organ users group www.frogmusic.com/rodgers.html  
(back) Subject: disney facade From: "Randy Terry" <randyterryus@yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 22:16:34 -0700 (PDT)   Funny - I sought out the facade draft when all the comments started coming = in. I find it interesting. I wonder if it would get old after a while, but I would be = willing to give it a try. It would certainly be totally impossible to call this a "church" organ! = Hopefully it will get played after its first year!   =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Randy Terry Minister of Music, Organist & Choirmaster The Episcopal Church of St. Peter Redwood City, California www.stpetersrwc.org   __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/