PipeChat Digest #2204 - Saturday, July 7, 2001
 
CARLO CURLEY TOURING ORGAN
  by "Carlo Pietroniro" <organist@total.net>
VIRGIL FOX TOURING ORGAN
  by "Carlo Pietroniro" <organist@total.net>
'BLACK BEAUTY' TOURING ORGAN
  by "Carlo Pietroniro" <organist@total.net>
Re: A "Fuller" key (perfect pitch)
  by <GHamil9709@aol.com>
Re: Carnegie Hall Rodgers Spec (long)
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Carnegie Hall Rodgers Spec (long)
  by "Carlo Pietroniro" <organist@total.net>
Re: Carnegie Hall Rodgers Spec (long)
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Carnegie Hall Rodgers
  by <Mozart609@aol.com>
Re: Rodgers Organ at Carnegie Hall
  by <Mozart609@aol.com>
Re: Rodgers Organ at Carnegie Hall
  by <Mozart609@aol.com>
Re: Virgil Fox
  by <Mozart609@aol.com>
stoplists and the literature
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
 

(back) Subject: CARLO CURLEY TOURING ORGAN From: "Carlo Pietroniro" <organist@total.net> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 00:04:16 -0400   CARLO CURLEY TOURING ORGAN Allen 1976     Inspired by the example of Virgil Fox, Carlo Curley commissioned a large touring organ from the Allen Organ Company in 1975. There were four computers, 380 speakers in 50 cabinets, and 5500 watts of audio power. The entire organ weighed over three and a half tons.   The four-manual console had 164 drawstops, but only 98 of these controlled speaking stops. There was a plethora of effects typical of 1970s Allen organs, including the 'Alterable Voices', programmable by punched cards. Several hundred voices were available, and the organ carried a = comprehensive library of cards. They included effects such as 'Linear Sawtooth' which = used the RMI synthesiser facility included in the instrument to produce a spacious, sensuous string tone quite unlike anything on conventional pipe-organs.   The speaking voices are largely those familiar from contemporary Allen instruments. The stoplist seems rather dated now, and includes a strangely slimline complement of voices particularly when compared with the rich = tonal palette of the Carnegie Hall organ, and the Allen which Virgil Fox was to commission just a year later. Despite this it made an extremely fine = sound, both in its singing, golden choruses and in a multitude of delicate, = softer effects.   The organ was best known for its role in the gala concerts at Alexandra Palace, London, in the late 1970s.       II GREAT 16 Bordun 16 Quintaden 8 Prinzipal 8 Dulciana 8 Hohlflote 8 Flute Dolce 4 Octav 4 Loudenflote 4 Spitzflote 2 2/3 Quinte 2 Super Octav 2 Waldflote IV Fourniture III Klein Cymbal 8 Regal 8 Trumpet Celeste Tuning Tremulant (adjustable) Percussion Sustain   I CHOIR/POSITIV ORGAN 8 Diapason 8 Flute 8 Viole 8 Viole Celeste 4 Prinzipal 4 Koppelflote 2 2/3 Nasat 2 Blockflote 1 3/5 Tierce 1 1/3 Larigot 1 Sifflote III Zimbel 16 Fagotto 8 Orchestral Oboe 8 Wooden Clarinet 4 Clarion Chiff Tremulant (adjustable) Percussion Sustain   GREAT/CHOIR EFFECTS Staccato Sustain Latch Fast Attack Slow Attack Sustain Control 'B' PW Modulation VCF Mains (Synthesiser) 'Take It All' (blank)   III SWELL 8 Geigen Principal 8 Salicional 8 Gedeckt 4 Spitzprinzipal 4 Rohrflote (with chiff) 2 2/3 Nasat 2 Flachflote 1 3/5 Tierce 1 Sifflote III Plein Jeu 16 Contra Trompette 8 Trompette 8 Hautbois 4 Clairon Alterable Voice 1 Alterable Voice 2 Alterable Voice 3 Alterable Voice 4 Celeste Tuning Percussion Sustain Sub Octaver Left Sub Octaver Right Tremulant (adjustable) Sustain Control 'B' Slow Attack VCF Mains (Synthesiser/RMI)   IV SOLO 8 Gamba 8 Concert Flute 4 Viole 4 Flute Triangular IV Mixture 8 Waldhorn 8 Corno di Bassetto Chrysoglott 8 Alterable Voice 5 Alterable Voice 6 Alterable Voice 7 Alterable Voice 8 Celeste Tuning Percussion Sustain Sub Octaver Left Sub Octaver Right Tremulant (adjustable)   BOMBARDE (floating) 8 Flauto Mirabilis 8 Viole d'Orchestre 4 Rohrpommer 4 Salicet 2 2/3 Twelfth 2 Feldflote 1 1/3 Larigot 1 Fife III Harmonics 16 Bombarde 8 Military Trumpet 8 Flugel Horn 8 Vox Humana 4 Clarion Alterable Voice 9 Alterable Voice 10 Alterable Voice 11 Alterable Voice 12 Celeste Tuning Percussion Sustain Sub Octaver Left Sub Octaver Right Tremulant (adjustable)   SOLO/BOMBARDE EFFECTS Staccato Sustain Latch Fast Attack Slow Attack Sustain Control 'B' PW Modulation VCF Mains (Synthesiser) Short Sustain Mains FF Vibrato Delay Vibrato (electronic theatre)   PEDAL 32 Contra Bass 32 Untersatz 16 Prinzipal 16 Subbass 16 Quintaden 16 Lieblich Gedeckt 8 Octave 8 Dulciana 8 Quintaden 8 Gedeckt 4 Choral Bass 4 Flute Ouverte 4 Spitzflote 2 Doublette 2 Feldflote IV Mixtur VI Scharf 16 Posaune 8 Trompete 8 Musette 4 Rohrschalmei Percussion Celeste Tuning   SOLO PEDAL 32 Contra Trombone 16 Trombone 16 Tibia 16 Rohr Pommer 8 Trumpet 8 Tibia 8 String 4 Clarion 4 Tibia 4 Octave Percussion Sustain Celeste Tuning Pedal 8ft. Super Coupler     The absence of celeste stops is accounted for by the 'Celeste Tuning' effects; these slightly de-tuned one half of the audio channels, allowing = a celeste on any combination of stops.   For the 1979 season the organ was revoiced to give - to my ears, at least = - a steelier, more agressive tone. Certain effects stops were removed, and = the Great lost its Regal. The following were added:     Pedal: Contra Violone 32, Violone 16. Choir: Quintaden 16, Mixtur III. Great: Contra Principal 16, Double Trumpet 16, Krummhorn 8, Schalmei 8. Swell: Violone 16. Bombarde: Tibia 8, 'Natural'.   By the early 1980s Carlo Curley had sold this organ. It is now in private ownership in the South of England. (Stoplist from a 1976 concert programme and the author's examination in 1979.)        
(back) Subject: VIRGIL FOX TOURING ORGAN From: "Carlo Pietroniro" <organist@total.net> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 00:05:51 -0400   VIRGIL FOX TOURING ORGAN Allen 1977   After Royal V had been withdrawn from use, Virgil Fox was inspired by = Carlo Curley's touring Allen to commission a four-manual instrument from the = same company. There were 144 speaking stops, 2800 watts of audio power and 600 speakers = - the largest audio system made by Allen to date.   Built only a year later than Curley's organ, there were few of the effects which proliferated on the earlier instrument. The stoplist is somewhat chaotic and repetitious, far less coherent and structured than the earlier Rodgers instruments. There is colour and effect in full measure, though; note particularly the 44-stop Swell division with its grave mutations and ten celestes (for Allen organs effectively had no octave couplers at this date).       GREAT 16 Double Open Diapason 16 Bourdon 8 Open Diapason 8 Harmonic Flute 8 Holzgedeckt 8 Quintaton 8 Erzahler 4 Octave 4 Principal 4 Flute 2 2/3 Quinte 2 Super Octave 2 Waldflute 1 3/5 Tierce 1 1/3 Larigot 1 Sifflote VII Fourniture III Scharf III Cymbal 16 Bombarde 8 Bombarde Harp 8 Tremulant Percussion A Percussion B Zymbelstern   SWELL 16 Lieblich Gedeckt 16 Dolce Flute 16 Flute Celeste 16 Gemshorn 16 Viole 16 Viole Celeste 16 Salicional 16 Voix Celeste 8 Diapason 8 Gedeckt 8 Rohrflute 8 Flute Conique 8 Conique Celeste 8 Flauto Dolce 8 Flute Celeste 8 Gamba 8 Gamba Celeste 8 Salicional I 8 Salicional II 8 Voix Celeste I 8 Voix Celeste II 5 1/3 Gross Quinte 4 Octave 4 Koppelflute 4 Triangle Flute 4 Flauto Dolce 4 Flute Celeste 4 Gamba 4 Gamba Celeste 3 1/5 Sub Terz 2 2/3 Nazard 2 Octavin 2 Blockflute 1 1/3 Larigot 1 Fife V Plein Jeu III Scharf 16 Contra Trompette 16 Bassoon 8 Trompette 8 Hautbois 8 Oboe Cor d'Amore (sic - j.r.) 8 Vox Humana (Trem) 4 Clairon Tremulant   CHOIR 16 Quintaten 16 Viola 16 Viola Celeste 8 Rohrflute 8 Viole 8 Viole Celeste 8 Erzahler 8 Erzahler Celeste 4 Principal 4 Koppelflute 2 2/3 Nazard 2 Octav (sic - j.r.) 2 Block Flute 1 3/5 Tierce 1 1/3 Larigot 1 Sifflote III Scharf III Zimbel 16 Serpent 8 Petite Trompette 8 Cromorne 8 Clarinet 4 Schalmei Harp 8 Harp 4 Harpsichord Tremulant   SOLO 16 Viole 8 Flauto Mirabilis 8 Flauto Celesta (sic - j.r.) 8 Gamba 8 Gamba Celeste 4 Flute Triangulaire 4 Flute Celeste 2 2/3 Nazard 2 Piccolo 1 1/3 Larigot 1 Fife VII Grande Jeu V Grand Fourniture 16 Contre Bombarde 16 Corno di Bassetto 8 Bombarde 8 French Horn 8 Orchestral Oboe 8 English Horn 8 Clarinet 4 Clairon Alterable Voice 1 Alterable Voice 2 Alterable Voice 3 Alterable Voice 4 Tremulant En Chamade Solo Sustain   PEDAL 64 Kontra Gravissima 32 Double Open Diapason 32 Violone 32 Bourdon 16 Open Diapason 16 Principal 16 Montre 16 Violone 16 Dolce 16 Bourdon 16 Quintaton 16 Lieblich Gedeckt 8 Octave 8 Montre 8 Spitzflote 8 Quintadena 8 Gedeckt 5 1/3 Octave Quint 4 Choralbass 4 Octavin 4 Hellflute 2 Doublette 2 Spitzflute V Mixture IV Mixture IV Scharf 32 Contra Bombarde 16 Bombarde 16 Posaune 16 Fagott 8 Posaune 8 Trompette 4 Clairon 4 Schalmei 2 Zink Tremulant     After Fox's death, this organ is believed to have been installed in a = church in Harlem, NYC.        
(back) Subject: 'BLACK BEAUTY' TOURING ORGAN From: "Carlo Pietroniro" <organist@total.net> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 00:07:35 -0400   'BLACK BEAUTY' TOURING ORGAN Rodgers c.1967     This touring organ was known as 'Black Beauty' because of the ebony finish of its console. It was most famous as the instrument used by Virgil Fox in his 'Heavy Organ' concerts at Fillmore East, NYC in 1970, and at Carnegie Hall in 1972 and 1973. There were 134 speakers in 13 cabinets, with 1000 watts of audio power. = The total weight of the instrument was two tons.   It is now in private ownership in the USA.       GREAT 16 Quintaton 8 Principal 8 Bourdon 8 Gemshorn 4 Octave 4 Flute 2 2/3 Twelfth 2 Fifteenth 1 1/3 Nineteenth 1 Principal IV Fourniture III Cymbal 8 Cor Anglais Tremulant (affecting 8ft. and 4ft. stops) Great to Great 16 8off 4 Swell to Great 16 8 4 Choir to Great 16 8 4   SWELL 16 Rohrgedeckt 8 Geigen Principal 8 Rohrfl=F6te 8 Salicional 8 Voix Celeste 8 Flauto Dolce 8 Flute Celeste 4 Prestant 4 Nachthorn 2 2/3 Rohr Nasat 2 Waldfl=F6te V Plein Jeu 16 Fagotto 8 Trompette 8 Hautbois 8 Vox Humana mf 8 Vox Humana mp 4 Clarion Tremulant Swell to Swell 16 8ff 4   CHOIR 16 Flute Conique 8 Nachthorn 8 Quintade (with chiff) 8 Viola 8 Viola Celeste 8 Erz=E4hler 8 Erz=E4hler Celeste 4 Principal 4 Lieblich Flute 4 Quintadena (with chiff) 2 2/3 Nazard 2 Blockfl=F6te 1 3/5 Tierce 1 1/3 Larigot 1 Siffl=F6te 8 Cromorne 8 Schalmei 8 Trompette Harmonique Tremulant Harp 8 Harp 4 Carillon (Flemish tuning) Choir to Choir 16 8off 4 Swell to Choir 16 8 4   PEDAL 32 Contra Principal 32 Untersatz 16 Principal 16 Bourdon 16 Lieblich Gedeckt 16 Dulciana 8 Octave 8 Bourdon 8 Still Gedeckt 8 Gemshorn 4 Choralbass 4 Nachthorn III Mixture 32 Contra Bombarde 16 Bombarde 16 Fagotto 8 Trumpet 8 Krummhorn 4 Clarion 4 Schalmei Tremulant (affecting 4ft. stops only) Great to Pedal 8 4 Swell to Pedal 8 4 Choir to Pedal 8 4   Cymbelstern        
(back) Subject: Re: A "Fuller" key (perfect pitch) From: <GHamil9709@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 00:30:22 EDT   A very good lady friend who delighted in telling everyone that she had perfect pitch --- and who, incidentally had two Steinway grand pianos in = her living room (one of which was completely rebuilt by me), complained that = the tuner who had just finished both pianos had left one with notes off key.   My wife finally prevailed in trying to get me to check them for her. = Armed with TWO tuning standards, I had the lady point out the offending notes. There were three, all in one octave. They all check "right on" on both tuning standards. The unisons were also "right on." Only when I had = lowered all three notes by 3+ cents would she agree that they were correct. I finally quit arguing with her.   Is it any wonder I have steadfastly refused to tune for this woman? She = was never satisfied with her tuner who was, incidentally, the President of our =   local Guild. Gene Hamilton  
(back) Subject: Re: Carnegie Hall Rodgers Spec (long) From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 00:46:28 EDT     --part1_8c.90d4ff9.2877ee24_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 7/6/01 11:37:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time, TubaMagna@aol.com writes:     > It is interesting that with all of its many stops and knobs and alleged > ranks, there are some serious flaws in the tonal design, omission of = stops > that one would normally find on a good concert organ of only three = manuals, > and some voices with misnomers. There are also some spurious stops = which > cannot function without certain other prerequisite stops, which are = absent > from the specification.   Would you elaborate, please. I have always been mystified by the = selection of stops the electronic folks select, even when there were knowledgeable people on their staffs.   Thanks.   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_8c.90d4ff9.2877ee24_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 7/6/01 11:37:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>TubaMagna@aol.com writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">It is interesting = that with all of its many stops and knobs and alleged <BR>ranks, there are some serious flaws in the tonal design, omission of = stops <BR>that one would normally find on a good concert organ of only three = manuals, <BR>and some voices with misnomers. &nbsp;There are also some spurious = stops which <BR>cannot function without certain other prerequisite stops, which are = absent <BR>from the specification. &nbsp;</FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 = FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>Would you elaborate, please. &nbsp;I have always been mystified by the = selection <BR>of stops the electronic folks select, even when there were = knowledgeable <BR>people on their staffs. <BR> <BR>Thanks. <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_8c.90d4ff9.2877ee24_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Carnegie Hall Rodgers Spec (long) From: "Carlo Pietroniro" <organist@total.net> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 00:53:55 -0400   anyone brave enough to say ANYTHING negative about this organ's specs, has b*lls bigger than Mount Everest, and is also saying that Virgil had no = taste in stops, because he himself composed the stoplist. let us also not forget that the concert which featured this organ was out of this world!!!   c.p.    
(back) Subject: Re: Carnegie Hall Rodgers Spec (long) From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:15:02 EDT     --part1_dc.8a6fa47.2877f4d6_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 7/7/01 12:54:36 AM Eastern Daylight Time, organist@total.net writes:     > anyone brave enough to say ANYTHING negative about this organ's specs, = has > b*lls bigger than Mount Everest, and is also saying that Virgil had no = taste > in stops, because he himself composed the stoplist   Thanks for the compliment!!   However, just because Virgil Fox did it, doesn't make "it" infallible" or perfect. Because Fox chose some stops and omitted others, resulting in tonal deficiencies according to traditional organ design practice, does = not mean that he had "no taste in stops." If we look carefully at what he created in his stoplist and how he used it, as well as what he was using = it for, we can learn much. If we blindly look and say, "OMG it's woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooonderful and perfect," we only = learn how be dedicated Fox groupies.   At the same time, if we look at the organ Fox designed and test it against =   classical standard practice, we also can learn much.   Going to waddle to bed!!! ;-)   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_dc.8a6fa47.2877f4d6_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 7/7/01 12:54:36 AM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>organist@total.net writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">anyone brave = enough to say ANYTHING negative about this organ's specs, has <BR>b*lls bigger than Mount Everest, and is also saying that Virgil had no = taste <BR>in stops, because he himself composed the stoplist</FONT><FONT = COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" = LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>Thanks for the compliment!! &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <BR> <BR>However, just because Virgil Fox did it, doesn't make "it" infallible" = or <BR>perfect. &nbsp;&nbsp;Because Fox chose some stops and omitted others, = resulting in <BR>tonal deficiencies according to traditional organ design practice, = does not <BR>mean that he had "no taste in stops." &nbsp;&nbsp;If we look carefully = at what he <BR>created in his stoplist and how he used it, as well as what he was = using it <BR>for, we can learn much. &nbsp;&nbsp;If we blindly look and say, "OMG = it's <BR>woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooonderful and perfect," = &nbsp;we only learn <BR>how be dedicated Fox groupies. &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <BR> <BR>At the same time, if we look at the organ Fox designed and test it = against <BR>classical standard practice, we also can learn much. <BR> <BR>Going to waddle to bed!!! &nbsp;;-) <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_dc.8a6fa47.2877f4d6_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Carnegie Hall Rodgers From: <Mozart609@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:27:51 EDT     --part1_28.17bfdc48.2877f7d7_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Is it true that Rodgers does not have the Tech. to build a 5 manual organ? = If this is true, They should have Walker Technical "gut" the organ with his FABULOUS Stuff.   --part1_28.17bfdc48.2877f7d7_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT COLOR=3D"#800040" SIZE=3D3 = FAMILY=3D"SERIF" FACE=3D"Times New Roman" LANG=3D"0"><B>Is it true that = Rodgers does not have the Tech. to build a 5 manual organ? If <BR>this is true, They should have Walker Technical "gut" the organ with = his <BR>FABULOUS Stuff.</B></FONT></HTML>   --part1_28.17bfdc48.2877f7d7_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Rodgers Organ at Carnegie Hall From: <Mozart609@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:31:42 EDT     --part1_12c.10f530f.2877f8be_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   It was Written:     Is it possible that *both* of you are correct?=3DA0 I've only read the new Virgil Fox biography once through (and much of that reading was while on board an OHS bus on the way to somewhere, so there *were* distractions!) but I seem to recall that Virgil played *both* his 4man "original" touring Rodgers, *and* the 5man touring organ (that came later)=3DA0 at Carnegie = on seperate occasions -- and that the Hall ended up purchasing a "twin" of = the 5man for their own as a result of the success of the concerts.     I do not recall Virgil EVER having a 4 manual touring organ. "Black = beauty"=3D20 was a 3 manual organ and then he went to Royal V.       --part1_12c.10f530f.2877f8be_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <HTML><FONT FACE=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT COLOR=3D3D"#800040" SIZE=3D3D3 = FAMILY=3D =3D3D"SERIF" FACE=3D3D"Times New Roman" LANG=3D3D"0"><B>It was Written: <BR> <BR> <BR>Is it possible that *both* of you are correct?=3DA0 I've only read the = new <BR>Virgil Fox biography once through (and much of that reading was while = on <BR>board an OHS bus on the way to somewhere, so there *were* = distractions!) <BR>but I seem to recall that Virgil played *both* his 4man "original" = touri=3D ng <BR>Rodgers, *and* the 5man touring organ (that came later)=3DA0 at = Carnegie o=3D n <BR>seperate occasions -- and that the Hall ended up purchasing a "twin" = of=3D20=3D the <BR>5man for their own as a result of the success of the concerts. <BR> <BR> <BR>I do not recall Virgil EVER having a 4 manual touring organ. "Black = beau=3D ty"=3D20 <BR>was a 3 manual organ and then he went to Royal V. <BR> <BR></B></FONT></HTML>   --part1_12c.10f530f.2877f8be_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Rodgers Organ at Carnegie Hall From: <Mozart609@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:32:33 EDT     --part1_88.8e436bc.2877f8f1_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Thank you Bill. I am glad "someone"knows what they are talking about   --part1_88.8e436bc.2877f8f1_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT COLOR=3D"#800040" SIZE=3D3 = FAMILY=3D"SERIF" FACE=3D"Times New Roman" LANG=3D"0"><B>Thank you Bill. I = am glad "someone"knows what they are talking about</B></FONT></HTML>   --part1_88.8e436bc.2877f8f1_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Virgil Fox From: <Mozart609@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:37:05 EDT     --part1_129.1122191.2877fa01_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Umm...NO......Virgil got theALLEN because RODGERS was having problems and felt that RODGERS was putting him off.   --part1_129.1122191.2877fa01_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT COLOR=3D"#800040" SIZE=3D3 = FAMILY=3D"SERIF" FACE=3D"Times New Roman" = LANG=3D"0"><B>Umm...NO......Virgil got theALLEN because RODGERS was having = problems and <BR>felt that RODGERS was putting him off.</B></FONT></HTML>   --part1_129.1122191.2877fa01_boundary--  
(back) Subject: stoplists and the literature From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 22:44:24 -0700   I feel like a broken record here, but if you ARE going to design an eclectic "American Classic" organ (pipe OR digital), then GO TO THE ORGAN LITERATURE, and see what you can REASONABLY encompass in one instrument without violating good taste or sound organ-building practice.   Bach, the starting point, requires:   Three independent principal choruses plus mixture: Great, Positive and Pedal. Preferably the Positive will be spacially differentiated, either in the main case or on the gallery railing.   Yes, Bach CAN be played on one manual, but at least some of the preludes and fugues call for two.   Fortunately, that's also the backbone of an organ to accompany the liturgy / congregational singing.   I don't personally care whether those principal choruses have an English, German, French or American accent, as long as they are well-made, clear-toned and MUSICAL ... ditto the mixtures, though the low-pitched 19th century French mixtures wouldn't be very AUTHENTIC for Bach-playing. On digital organs, you can have a gear-shift (grin).   From there you can either go to French baroque or French romantic music, depending on your tastes. Most of the solo combinations in French baroque music can also be used for Bach chorale-preludes, up to a point. Not authentic, perhaps, but MUSICAL, IF the organ is properly voiced.   The BIGGEST omission I see in most large digital AND pipe organs as far as playing French baroque music is the lack of the all-important Nasard, Tierce AND Cornet in EVERY division, and the Gros Nasard and Gros Tierce on the Great Organ.   French romantic music requires a full complement of CHORUS reeds at 16-8-4 in EVERY manual division ... something that digital builders could just as easily do as not, but they choose not to ... and the "four fonds" ... I see NO point in building a large digital organ (or pipe organ, for that matter) without at LEAST four 8' stops (principal, open/harmonic/double flute, string, stopped flute) in every division, because the LITERATURE calls for it.   Tot that all up and you STILL come in at under 60 stops, most likely, even allowing for multiple celestes and color reeds.   Anything over 100 stops is a publicity stunt, and/or just plain silly, except maybe in a room the size of Atlantic City Auditorium, St. John the Divine in NYC, or St. Peter's in Rome. You DON'T need infinite choices of flutes, or strings, or soft reeds in order to play the LITERATURE ... one or two of each in each division will do nicely.   I was looking at English cathedral organ specs recently, and I was struck by how SMALL they are, relatively speaking, but what a GRAND effect they have. They're well-placed, in good rooms, and artistically voiced.   The larger 19th century American organs could play just about anything, albeit with an American accent ... what's so hard about taking THEM for a model for the modern eclectic organ?   Cheers,   Bud