PipeChat Digest #1969 - Wednesday, March 28, 2001
 
Re: Follow Up
  by <Wurlibird1@aol.com>
Re: Tempered Organs in Worship
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Bish owns a Rogers?
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Bish owns a Rogers?
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Whitelegg-Moller
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Bish owns a Rogers?
  by "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu>
Re: Tempered Organs in Worship
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Follow-up
  by <AMADPoet@aol.com>
Re: Lutheran Tenebrae (X-posted)
  by "Patricia A. Blissenbach" <pab@inreach.com>
Re: Josh and Paul, and other Subjects!
  by "Thomas H. Cotner" <cotnerpo@brightok.net>
Re: Favorite Service Repertoire -- Please help
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Follow-up
  by "Jon C. Habermaas" <opus1100@catoe.org>
Re: "Lutheran" Tenebrae
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Follow Up From: <Wurlibird1@aol.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 10:58:40 EST   Thank you, David....   The corrective post of yesterday was obviously required and no offense was =   taken in this camp. We are indeed guests in your house and you are well within your rights to establish the rules of conduct.   The knowledge base represented through subscribers to this list is astounding. Sharing that knowledge in good faith is commendable and = should be defended against self-anointed final arbitrators of fact -- or = fiction. The diversity of opinions posted here makes this forum exciting, = stimulating and informative. When intimidation and rebuke serve to throttle the = sharing of knowledge and experiences, the value of this forum diminishes.   Personally, I have little to share in terms of knowledge and experience = apart from my years of association with electronic substitutes for pipe organs. =   But I am learning a vast amount from the experiences of others who are willing to share with me through this list. Like the administrators, but = for other reasons, I become somewhat testy when that knowledge stream is threatened by untoward remarks and actions.   Dissenters are welcome to post to me privately if I have offended. But please, lets leave this list to its intended purpose. I still have a lot = to learn and am eager to get on with it through PipeChat. My fishing trip = has been destroyed by weather and I am not a happy camper, literally! :(   Positive thoughts,   Jim  
(back) Subject: Re: Tempered Organs in Worship From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 10:57:52 EST     --part1_de.123781e2.27f36400_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 3/27/01 7:45:27 PM !!!First Boot!!!, Oboe32@aol.com = writes:     > I see an equal organ leading and accompanying in a church setting much > better than an unequal instrument. I know that some temperings work well = in > worship though. The new Mander at Chesnut Hill is some form of Valotti, = and > it has a great ring in the room and is a wonderful instrument to play = and > accompany with. There is also a large Hradetzkey organ in my area by the = NJ > shore that is about 42 ranks on two manuals and is terrible at leading > hymns, but great for Bach and his contemporaries.   The comparison really doesn't explain WHY the Hradetzkey doesn't lead hymn =   singing. Is it the temperament or, more likely, the voicing. If an organ doesn't lead hymnsinging, I think the blame rather should fall upon = the player or the voicer/finisher, and not the temperament. A couple of = organs are really not sufficient base for such a blanket statement. I do understand you position, however, I was there once. But greater exposure = to more and better instruments makes quite a difference.   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_de.123781e2.27f36400_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 3/27/01 7:45:27 PM !!!First Boot!!!, Oboe32@aol.com writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">I see an equal = organ leading and accompanying in a church setting much <BR>better than an unequal instrument. I know that some temperings work = well in <BR>worship though. The new Mander at Chesnut Hill is some form of = Valotti, and <BR>it has a great ring in the room and is a wonderful instrument to play = and <BR>accompany with. There is also a large Hradetzkey organ in my area by = the NJ <BR>shore that is about 42 ranks on two manuals and is terrible at leading =   <BR>hymns, but great for Bach and his contemporaries. </FONT><FONT = COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" = LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>The comparison really doesn't explain WHY the Hradetzkey doesn't lead = hymn <BR>singing. &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Is it the temperament or, more likely, the = voicing. &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;If an <BR>organ doesn't lead hymnsinging, I think the blame rather should fall = upon the <BR>player or the voicer/finisher, and not the temperament. = &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;A couple of organs <BR>are really not sufficient base for such a blanket statement. = &nbsp;&nbsp;I do <BR>understand you position, however, I was there once. &nbsp;But greater = exposure to <BR>more and better instruments makes quite a difference. <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_de.123781e2.27f36400_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Bish owns a Rogers? From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:04:26 EST     --part1_f8.88138a1.27f3658a_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 3/27/01 8:43:25 PM !!!First Boot!!!, ResearchIV@aol.com =   writes:     > Amazing what one learns on pipechat. > Sells her name to Allen, plays a Rogers. > Guess it pays for the hair and the gowns. > I should sell my name to a digital firm. > I have three kids to put through college!!! > >   But... do you have HAIR to support??? ;-)   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_f8.88138a1.27f3658a_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 3/27/01 8:43:25 PM !!!First Boot!!!, ResearchIV@aol.com <BR>writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Amazing what one = learns on pipechat. <BR>Sells her name to Allen, plays a Rogers. <BR>Guess it pays for the hair and the gowns. <BR>I should sell my name to a digital firm. <BR>I have three kids to put through college!!! <BR> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>But... do you have HAIR to support??? &nbsp;;-) <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_f8.88138a1.27f3658a_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Bish owns a Rogers? From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:10:00 EST     --part1_88.459cab1.27f366d8_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 3/27/01 9:25:48 PM !!!First Boot!!!, organist@total.net =   writes:     > Randy...........Diane doesn't mind us discussing her choice in > organs........ > Wasn't it Bette Davis who said "there is no bad publicity." or Mae West, = "I don't care what they say, as long as they're talking about ME."   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_88.459cab1.27f366d8_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 3/27/01 9:25:48 PM !!!First Boot!!!, organist@total.net <BR>writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: = 5px">Randy...........Diane doesn't mind us discussing her choice in <BR>organs........ <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">Wasn't it Bette Davis who said "there is no bad = publicity." &nbsp;&nbsp;or Mae West, "I <BR>don't care what they say, as long as they're talking about ME." <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_88.459cab1.27f366d8_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Whitelegg-Moller From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:19:31 EST     --part1_e5.3ee9085.27f36913_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Does anyone have the specification of the Whitelegg-Moller at Holy Name?   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_e5.3ee9085.27f36913_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>Does anyone have the = specification of the Whitelegg-Moller at Holy Name? <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_e5.3ee9085.27f36913_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Bish owns a Rogers? From: "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:21:40 -0400   --=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D_-1226329591=3D=3D_ma=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"us-ascii" ; format=3D"flowed"   > > >But... do you have HAIR to support??? ;-) > >Bruce Cornely   No, just... heirs.   Randy Runyon organist, Immanuel Presbyterian Church, Cincinnati runyonr@muohio.edu --=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D_-1226329591=3D=3D_ma=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=3D"us-ascii"   <excerpt>     <fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller>But... do you have HAIR to support??? ;-)     Bruce Cornely   </smaller></fontfamily></excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><smaller>   No, just... heirs. </smaller></fontfamily>   Randy Runyon   organist, Immanuel Presbyterian Church, Cincinnati   runyonr@muohio.edu   --=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D_-1226329591=3D=3D_ma=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D--  
(back) Subject: Re: Tempered Organs in Worship From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:27:11 EST     --part1_7c.139a5878.27f36adf_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 3/28/01 12:24:28 AM !!!First Boot!!!, RMaryman@aol.com writes:     > I had the distinct dis-pleasure of hearing Franck (3rd Chorale in = A-minor) > played on a recently installed Boutique-Builder organ which is in > Wreckmeistre 3 distemper. The cromaticism of Franck's music, along with > much > other "French SYmphonic" repertoire simply does NOT work well on organs > tuned > on other than equal-temper tuning (IMNSHO). The same concert, same = organist > played a major Bach P&F (don't remember which one right at present) and = is > was like hearing a different organ, the music didn't "fight" the tuning = and > was quite pleasant to listen to. >   But here, shouldn't the blame go to the player rather than the organ. = Your statement that the Bach P&F was quite pleasant demonstrates the validity = of building such instruments and using historic temperaments. But the = really important thing to be remembers it that the instrument should be used appropriately to it's design. It would be equally exciting to hear the Franck a-minor played on an instrument specifically designed to reproduce = the colours and sounds desired by Franck. But then, the Bach P&F would = suffer. However, there would be a place for appropriate hearing of both pieces.     Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_7c.139a5878.27f36adf_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 3/28/01 12:24:28 AM !!!First Boot!!!, RMaryman@aol.com <BR>writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">I had the distinct = dis-pleasure of hearing Franck (3rd Chorale in A-minor) <BR>played on a recently installed Boutique-Builder organ which is in <BR>Wreckmeistre 3 distemper. The cromaticism of Franck's music, along = with <BR>much <BR>other "French SYmphonic" repertoire simply does NOT work well on = organs <BR>tuned <BR>on other than equal-temper tuning (IMNSHO). The same concert, same = organist <BR>played a major Bach P&amp;F (don't remember which one right at = present) and is <BR>was like hearing a different organ, the music didn't "fight" the = tuning and <BR>was quite pleasant to listen to. <BR></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR> <BR>But here, shouldn't the blame go to the player rather than the organ. = &nbsp;&nbsp;Your <BR>statement that the Bach P&amp;F was quite pleasant demonstrates the = validity of <BR>building such instruments and using historic temperaments. = &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;But the really <BR>important thing to be remembers it that the instrument should be used <BR>appropriately to it's design. &nbsp;&nbsp;It would be equally exciting = to hear the <BR>Franck a-minor played on an instrument specifically designed to = reproduce the <BR>colours and sounds desired by Franck. &nbsp;But then, the Bach P&amp;F = would suffer. &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp;However, there would be a place for appropriate hearing of both = pieces. <BR> <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_7c.139a5878.27f36adf_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Follow-up From: <AMADPoet@aol.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:46:27 EST   In a message dated 3/28/01 7:07:28 AM Central Standard Time, admin@pipechat.org writes:   << First of all I have to say I am sorry that I came across the way I did last night in case anyone took offense with my ALL READ posting. >>   Personally I'm glad you got angry, David, sometimes that's the only way people will listen. Despite the recent increase in flaming, I love this = list- there are some very knowledgable and generous people here. Several people have mentioned the fact that the younger, less experienced organists may = be put off by the behavior of certain members of the list. The fact that this =   has even come up makes up for any disillusionment I might be feeling. It's =   nice to have someone stand up for us little folks for a change!   Mandy  
(back) Subject: Re: Lutheran Tenebrae (X-posted) From: "Patricia A. Blissenbach" <pab@inreach.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 08:58:35 -0800   I would like to know more about the Tenebrae service. I am covering for = the full-time organist who is recovering from some serious surgery. This man has a doctoral degree and studied with Richard Purvis at Grace in SFO. I = am having to play catch-up since I didn't attend church for 30 years. I am practicing my you-know-what off.   A thousand thanks, Patty B-bach   ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan Freed" <afreed0904@earthlink.net> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2001 7:04 AM Subject: Re: Lutheran Tenebrae (X-posted)     > > From: quilisma@socal.rr.com > > Subject: Lutheran Tenebrae (X-posted) > > > > SOMEBODY on ONE of these lists wanted my Lutheran Tenebrae ... with = all > > the upheaval about the organ, I've forgotten who. Please contact me = ... > > I can either fax it or e-mail it ... I've got it scanned. > > > Bud, it wasn't I, but I'll take the bait. We used to do Tenebrae here, but > canned it four or five years ago; but now the new pastor is = contemplating > it, and it would be good to have. (I'm curious, too: What could be > "Lutheran" [or Anglican, for that matter] about Tenebrae?) > > Take your choice of 212 977 1838 or afreed0904@earthlink.net. > > Alan > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >    
(back) Subject: Re: Josh and Paul, and other Subjects! From: "Thomas H. Cotner" <cotnerpo@brightok.net> Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 22:06:06 -0600   Ron,   I suppose that would work, but it entails work, which I shy away from Further, the less handling of the pipe, especially with something you are = rubbing it with is, IMHO the better. That's why I simply soak them -- as long as possible, and let Mizz P & G do the work for me.   Of course, a person could spend as much time as he/she wished in fiddling = around with the things, growing a glowing gleam with all sorts of pumices and = compounds, but the secret is to do it with as little effort as possible, and with as = little harm to the pipe as possible.   Leastwise, thassa way we duz it heah.   Tom   RonSeverin@aol.com wrote:   > Hi Thomas: > > I wonder if anyone has had success with powdered pumice and water. > After cleaning with soap and water it could be applied with a cloth. > Damp cloth and dry pumice powder. The old car cleaner by Simonize > worked on a similar principal, Oh Gosh a play on words!. (similar = principal) > I don't think Simonize is used anymore because it stips off the clear > coat on modern car paints. I don't think using pumice will produce those > annoying whorrls either as it's too fine. It's worth the experiment to = try it > anyway. Tooth paste would be prohibitively expensive. Another thought > how about using baking soda and a damp cloth, it's real cheap! Then > simply wash it off. IMHO you might find some in the refrigerator used = for > odor entrapment. The old Arm and Hammer! > > Regards, > > Ron Severin > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org    
(back) Subject: Re: Favorite Service Repertoire -- Please help From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 12:06:25 EST     --part1_3e.96f51e2.27f37411_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 3/28/01 12:31:43 PM !!!First Boot!!!, = organdok@safari.net writes:     > 1-6 service pieces which you know (or at least > think) are in print. Pleast list the real title (translation would be > helpful), composer and arranger/editor, publisher and ordering = information. > >   1. Prayer (Gothic Suite) Leon Boellmann (Schirmer?) 2. Folk Tune - Charles Callahan (Morning Star?) 3. Chromatic Fugue - Pachelbel (Wedding Music, Part I - Concordia) 4. Cantilena - Josef Rheinberger (Wedding Music, Part I - Concordia) 5. Toccata (Symphony 5) C M Widor 6. Elegy - George Thalben-Ball (Oxford?)   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_3e.96f51e2.27f37411_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 3/28/01 12:31:43 PM !!!First Boot!!!, organdok@safari.net <BR>writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">1-6 service pieces = which you know (or at least <BR>think) are in print. Pleast list the real title (translation would be <BR>helpful), composer and arranger/editor, publisher and ordering = information. <BR> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>1. &nbsp;Prayer (Gothic Suite) &nbsp;&nbsp;Leon Boellmann = &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(Schirmer?) <BR>2. &nbsp;Folk Tune &nbsp;&nbsp;- &nbsp;Charles Callahan &nbsp;(Morning = Star?) <BR>3. &nbsp;Chromatic Fugue &nbsp;- &nbsp;Pachelbel &nbsp;&nbsp;(Wedding = Music, Part I &nbsp;- &nbsp;Concordia) <BR>4. &nbsp;Cantilena &nbsp;- Josef Rheinberger &nbsp;(Wedding Music, = Part I - Concordia) <BR>5. &nbsp;Toccata (Symphony 5) &nbsp;C M Widor = &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <BR>6. &nbsp;Elegy &nbsp;&nbsp;- George Thalben-Ball &nbsp;&nbsp;(Oxford?) <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_3e.96f51e2.27f37411_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Follow-up From: "Jon C. Habermaas" <opus1100@catoe.org> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:22:21 -0600   At 11:46 AM 3/28/01 -0500, you wrote: >In a message dated 3/28/01 7:07:28 AM Central Standard Time, >admin@pipechat.org writes: > ><< First of all I have to say I am sorry that I came across the way I > did last night in case anyone took offense with my ALL READ posting. = >>   To David & the list,   Like many others I am glad you came across with some strong words and helped clear the air. I've been very disturbed by the direction this list has taken in the past weeks. Frankly I don't know anything about any of you other than what you deem to share with us = on the list. I subscribed to the list and similar lists because of a life = long love of the pipe organ, in all forms including both classical and theatre instruments. I envy many of you who have the talent required to make these instruments come to life. I am currently a student who waited until much too late in life to take music lessons seriously....I will never be a virtouso, but hope to be able =   to someday make a respectable performance at any instrument that is available to me. There is little more that I can add to this discussion than has already more adequately been addressed by David and SMG. I would hope in the future that you will all accept postings at face value =   and not delight in trying to discredit others opinions. Bear in mind that when you "sling mud" some of it always manages to fly back on you. Without =   dealing in personalities one result of the last week.....there is one individual who could be the greatest organ virtuoso playing on the finest pipe organ, =   who, I would not cross the street to hear after being exposed to some of his petty vindictiveness. Perhaps I've said too much.   regards,   Jon    
(back) Subject: Re: "Lutheran" Tenebrae From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 09:37:54 -0800   "Tenebrae" has been used as a generic name upon which to hang various = evening services during Lent and Holy Week, some liturgical, some not so = liturgical (grin) ... Dale Wood's "Service of Darkness", etc.   Authentic Tenebrae as it has come down to us is this: the liturgies of = Holy Week (Maundy Thursday, Good Friday, Holy Saturday) used to be celebrated in the morning. They are long and difficult to sing. In monasteries that had the obligation of singing BOTH the liturgies AND the Divine Office, it was = VERY burdensome to sing BOTH in the morning. So the Divine Office was = transferred to the night before "by anticipation" centuries ago, and symbolism was read = into the darkness ... originally the candles were extinguished at the end of = Lauds because the sun was coming up.   Tenebrae is Mattins and Lauds of the following day, sung the night before = "by anticipation". Thus Maundy Thursday Tenebrae is sung on Wednesday night of = Holy Week, Good Friday Tenebrae is sung on Maundy Thursday night, and Holy = Saturday Tenebrae is sung on Good Friday night.   Since the LITURGIES were transferred back to their primitive times in the evening at the liturgical reforms in the 1950s, Tenebrae in Roman Catholic = and high Anglican churches pretty much died a natural death, since it was very burdensome to sing both the liturgies and Tenebrae in the EVENING. Some = places retained Wednesday night Tenebrae only, since there was no long liturgy appointed for that night. Dr. Willan's former church, St. Mary Magdalene = in Toronto, still sings all three nights, but they're the only church I'm = aware of that still does.   The form:   Mattins   MANY Psalms and Antiphons Nine Readings from Jeremiah and Nine Responsories   Lauds   MANY Psalms and Antiphons the Benedictus Canticle with Antiphon the Antiphon "Christus factus est" Psalm 51 - "Miserere"   The biggest LOSS (musically) when Tenebrae was done away with was the Responsories, and the Lamentations of Jeremiah, both of which were set by = many famous composers.   Now, to answer Alan's question as to what makes my Tenebrae "Lutheran" ... = since the LCMS doesn't have any appointed Good Friday service other than the = Liturgy of the Word, the pastor and I combined elements of the Good Friday Liturgy = with a shortened version of Tenebrae, thus:   Solemn Procession of the Cross, with "Behold the Wood of the Cross", "O = come, let us worship", the three Stations and the genuflexions; the three = sections of the Trisagion sung between Stations to the Vittoria setting as the = procession moves to the next Station.   Three Psalms / Psalm Prayers (from the ELCA book? I don't remember) / two Lamentations / two Responsories, followed by Christus factus est in its = new Missal position as the Gradual before the Passion, and the chanting of St. John's Passion with the Vittoria "turba" choruses, in this order:   Psalm Psalm Prayer Lamentation Responsory   Psalm Psalm Prayer Lamentation Responsory   Psalm Psalm Prayer Christus factus est St. John's Passion   The Benedictus with its Antiphon   The Miserere to the Allegri setting   The light is carried out, everybody makes the "loud noise" with their = books, the light is carried back in, everybody goes home in silence.   It was a STUNNING service, and I think they still use it every year for = their Good Friday liturgy.   Cheers,   Bud       "Patricia A. Blissenbach" wrote:   > I would like to know more about the Tenebrae service. I am covering for = the > full-time organist who is recovering from some serious surgery. This = man > has a doctoral degree and studied with Richard Purvis at Grace in SFO. = I am > having to play catch-up since I didn't attend church for 30 years. I am > practicing my you-know-what off. > > A thousand thanks, > Patty B-bach > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alan Freed" <afreed0904@earthlink.net> > To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2001 7:04 AM > Subject: Re: Lutheran Tenebrae (X-posted) > > > > From: quilisma@socal.rr.com > > > Subject: Lutheran Tenebrae (X-posted) > > > > > > SOMEBODY on ONE of these lists wanted my Lutheran Tenebrae ... with = all > > > the upheaval about the organ, I've forgotten who. Please contact me = ... > > > I can either fax it or e-mail it ... I've got it scanned. > > > > > Bud, it wasn't I, but I'll take the bait. We used to do Tenebrae = here, > but > > canned it four or five years ago; but now the new pastor is = contemplating > > it, and it would be good to have. (I'm curious, too: What could be > > "Lutheran" [or Anglican, for that matter] about Tenebrae?) > > > > Take your choice of 212 977 1838 or afreed0904@earthlink.net. > > > > Alan > > > > > >