PipeChat Digest #2117 - Thursday, May 24, 2001
 
Keeping Skinner Combination Actions as they were
  by <ManderUSA@aol.com>
Re: Digital Additions To Pipe Organs (x-posted)
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Digital Additions To Pipe Organs (x-posted)
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Felix Conquers Staten Island 5/20/01 (xPost)
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: Keeping Skinner Combination Actions as they were
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
Re: Digital Additions To Pipe Organs (x-posted)
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
Re: Keeping Skinner Combination Actions as they were
  by "douglas morgan" <dkmorgan76209@yahoo.com>
Re: Digital Additions To Pipe Organs (x-posted)
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
 

(back) Subject: Keeping Skinner Combination Actions as they were From: <ManderUSA@aol.com> Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 19:32:37 EDT     --part1_50.1642be3d.283da295_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 5/23/2001 3:32:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Devon3000@aol.com writes:     > I am also appalled that anyone would want to restore a pneumatic console =   > like E.M. Skinner made and use it for present church use. Just to hear = the > "kathunk" that the pistons make is ridiculous, considering the = advantages > of modern equipment. The expense and maintenance are just not good > stewardship. We need to make many quick changes during our worship > services. Those that just use a very small amount registrational = changes > are doing our profession and the spirit of a lively worship service no > good. And I can't think of much use for single memory combination = actions > on any large 2 manual or any three manual and up console.   This man clearly has never heard Tom Murray at the enormous Woolsey Hall organ, speaking of quick changes! To be fair, a concert at Woolsey by Tom, =   which always includes very complex symphonic music, and so, much more need =   for button pushing than in a service, does require piston resetting during = an intermission, and this can take a bit of time, but as it is intermission, = no one minds.   There are two groups with opposing points of view on this vexing question. =   Nick Thompson-Allen and Joe Dzeda, the curators of the Yale organs, and faithful restorers of a number of famous old Skinners around the = country, insist upon true restoration, involving no changes at all. St. Paul's in Winston-Salem, which OHS will see at the convention in June, Trinity = Church on the Green in New Haven, which I know well, a 1937 Harrison/Skinner, restored to almost just as Skinner left it, including the combination = action, First Presbyterian in Wilmington, NC, to name a few. The music program at Trinity on the Green is quite intense, with a fine boychoir, a recital series, and the works. They felt keenly the importance of keeping an organ =   they see as a treasure (I agree) intact, so that the experience one has playing it is authentic to its period. You may be "appalled" at this, but there are lots of fine organists who play them that believe maintaining = these instruments as they were built is aesthetically and historically = important. There are some less-than-wonderful Skinners around, and one might make a = case that, if they have been messed around with to the point of no return, one might as well have all the mod cons possible. You say: "The expense and maintenance are just not good stewardship." One wonders if you have = figures to support that statement. Most of those instruments were tremendously reliable, with the tuner able to make any minor adjustments on a regular tuning visit.   No one doubts the incredible convenience of having tons of memories. We certainly provide them - 256 memories at St. Ignatius, for example - and = they are much appreciated and well used by the three organists working there. = But there is a place for a little sense of history, and for preserving in important places an example of the way it was. Decades of stunning church services were played and tons of great recitals were played on organs with =   only one memory. I don't think I ever did anything stunning in either of those categories, but I never felt badly put upon for lack of memories. That's what one did, and it was what we did in university. There was no alternative, and we did not miss what we did not have. I play a straight = Hook & Hastings mechanical organ with only one registrational aid - a Great to Pedal reversible paddle. You'd just be amazed at what I can do with that = <G>.   Cheers,   Malcolm Wechsler www.mander-organs.com   --part1_50.1642be3d.283da295_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><BODY BGCOLOR=3D"#ffffff"><FONT = SIZE=3D2>In a message dated 5/23/2001 3:32:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>Devon3000@aol.com writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">I am also appalled = that anyone would want to restore a pneumatic console <BR>like E.M. Skinner made and use it for present church use. &nbsp;Just = to hear the <BR>"kathunk" that the pistons make is ridiculous, considering the = advantages <BR>of modern equipment. &nbsp;The expense and maintenance are just not = good <BR>stewardship. &nbsp;We need to make many quick changes during our = worship <BR>services. &nbsp;Those that just use a very small amount registrational = changes <BR>are doing our profession and the spirit of a lively worship service no =   <BR>good. &nbsp;And I can't think of much use for single memory = combination actions <BR>on any large 2 manual or any three manual and up console. = &nbsp;</FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>This man clearly has never heard Tom Murray at the enormous Woolsey = Hall <BR>organ, speaking of quick changes! To be fair, a concert at Woolsey by = Tom, <BR>which always includes very complex symphonic music, and so, much more = need <BR>for button pushing than in a service, does require piston resetting = during an <BR>intermission, and this can take a bit of time, but as it is = intermission, no <BR>one minds. <BR> <BR>There are two groups with opposing points of view on this vexing = question. <BR>Nick Thompson-Allen and Joe Dzeda, the curators of the Yale organs, = and <BR>faithful restorers &nbsp;&nbsp;of a number of famous old Skinners = around the country, <BR>insist upon true restoration, involving no changes at all. St. Paul's = in <BR>Winston-Salem, which OHS will see at the convention in June, Trinity = Church <BR>on the Green in New Haven, which I know well, a 1937 Harrison/Skinner, =   <BR>restored to almost just as Skinner left it, including the combination = action, <BR>First Presbyterian in Wilmington, NC, to name a few. The music program = at <BR>Trinity on the Green is quite intense, with a fine boychoir, a recital =   <BR>series, and the works. They felt keenly the importance of keeping an = organ <BR>they see as a treasure (I agree) intact, so that the experience one = has <BR>playing it is authentic to its period. You may be "appalled" at this, = but <BR>there are lots of fine organists who play them that believe = maintaining these <BR>instruments as they were built is aesthetically and historically = important. <BR>There are some less-than-wonderful Skinners around, and one might make = a case <BR>that, if they have been messed around with to the point of no return, = one <BR>might as well have all the mod cons possible. You say: "The expense = and <BR>maintenance are just not good stewardship." One wonders if you have = figures <BR>to support that statement. Most of those instruments were tremendously =   <BR>reliable, with the tuner able to make any minor adjustments on a = regular <BR>tuning visit. <BR> <BR>No one doubts the incredible convenience of having tons of memories. = We <BR>certainly provide them - 256 memories at St. Ignatius, for example - = and they <BR>are much appreciated and well used by the three organists working = there. But <BR>there is a place for a little sense of history, and for preserving in <BR>important places an example of the way it was. Decades of stunning = church <BR>services were played and tons of great recitals were played on organs = with <BR>only one memory. I don't think I ever did anything stunning in either = of <BR>those categories, but I never felt badly put upon for lack of = memories. <BR>That's what one did, and it was what we did in university. There was = no <BR>alternative, and we did not miss what we did not have. I play a = straight Hook <BR>&amp; Hastings mechanical organ with only one registrational aid - a = Great to <BR>Pedal reversible paddle. You'd just be amazed at what I can do with = that &lt;G&gt;. <BR> <BR>Cheers, <BR> <BR>Malcolm Wechsler <BR>www.mander-organs.com</FONT></HTML>   --part1_50.1642be3d.283da295_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Digital Additions To Pipe Organs (x-posted) From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 19:57:06 EDT     --part1_ca.157b64ed.283da852_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 5/23/01 3:31:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Devon3000@aol.com writes:     > but I will wager that not one organist will avoid use of the digital = stops, > even if he/she can ever figure out which are which. > > This obvious joy in deceit is one of the things that really bothers me. = If your digital stuff is so dang good, why are you afraid to mark the stop digital? My objection to mixing pipes and digital is on principle. If = I'm going to play a pipe organ, I want it to have all pipes. If I'm going to =   play a digital thing, then I want to know it. It's just plain old = courteous honesty.   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_ca.157b64ed.283da852_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 5/23/01 3:31:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>Devon3000@aol.com writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">but I will wager = that not one organist will avoid use of the digital stops, <BR>even if he/she can ever figure out which are which. &nbsp; <BR> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">This obvious joy in deceit is one of the things = that really bothers me. &nbsp;&nbsp;If <BR>your digital stuff is so dang good, why are you afraid to mark the = stop <BR>digital? &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;My objection to mixing pipes and digital is = on principle. &nbsp;If I'm <BR>going to play a pipe organ, I want it to have all pipes. = &nbsp;&nbsp;If I'm going to <BR>play a digital thing, then I want to know it. &nbsp;It's just plain = old courteous <BR>honesty. <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_ca.157b64ed.283da852_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Digital Additions To Pipe Organs (x-posted) From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 20:19:53 EDT     --part1_37.1586fc13.283dada9_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 5/23/01 5:33:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time, steve@ststephenscanterbury.freeserve.co.uk writes:   > Firstly, we don't really have the space for any more pipes... we have 15 =   > ranks of > pipes and the case is full. I often find myself wishing for a solo = reed... > a 16' Open Diapason on the Pedal (don't have the height for that one > either)... a mixture on the Swell... one on the Great too would be = nice... > a Celeste on the Swell... the list could go on! >   And therein lies the problem... the list can go on and on and on. I = think it is more artistic and musical to work within the limitations of the the instrument. If there are deficiencies that can be appropriately (adding pipes to pipes!) remedied, then do it. But just adding more stuff because you can or because you want it seldom results in a better instrument, and after you tire of the new stuff more = is wanted. It never ends until the funds dry up, and then you're faced with having to maintain this monstrosity (not to mention listen to it!). If = you have money to burn, then set up and endowment for the time when the money might not be so readily available. Or (gasp), share it with a small = parish that cannot afford a pipe organ.     > positioning of the choir far away from the pipes > and not being able to hear them, without me playing louder, and > consequently drowning them out for the congregation - snip - I have > thought of a seperate 'choir' organ (although, not in the traditional = choir > organ sense, more of a sepearte instrument) to accompany the anthems, = the > psalms and to add to the full organ .... > Actually, the choir organ concept of which you speak is "traditional". = My preference for a similar situation would be to have a completely separate instrument for use with the choir. It could be voiced in a wonderfully delicate manner which would be exquisite for choral accompanying. I = would, however, not design it with the idea of "interesting antiphonal effects" because this would necessitate compromising the voicing to make it "work" with the main organ. It will work perhaps for duets without compromising voicing, but not if it is designed as "part" of the main organ. You have = a potentially very interesting situation. With some restraint and = creativity it has the potential of being quite unique.     Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_37.1586fc13.283dada9_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 5/23/01 5:33:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>steve@ststephenscanterbury.freeserve.co.uk writes: <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Firstly, we don't = really have the space for any more pipes... we have 15 <BR>ranks of <BR>pipes and the case is full. &nbsp;I often find myself wishing for a = solo reed... <BR>a 16' Open Diapason on the Pedal (don't have the height for that one <BR>either)... a mixture on the Swell... one on the Great too would be = nice... <BR>a Celeste on the Swell... the list could go on! &nbsp; <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR> <BR>And therein lies the problem... the list can go on and on and on. = &nbsp;&nbsp;I think <BR>it is more artistic and musical to work within the limitations of the = the <BR>instrument. &nbsp;If there are deficiencies that can be appropriately = (adding <BR>pipes to pipes!) remedied, then do it. <BR>But just adding more stuff because you can or because you want it = seldom <BR>results in a better instrument, and after you tire of the new stuff more is <BR>wanted. &nbsp;It never ends until the funds dry up, and then you're = faced with <BR>having to maintain this monstrosity (not to mention listen to it!). = &nbsp;&nbsp;If you <BR>have money to burn, then set up and endowment for the time when the = money <BR>might not be so readily available. &nbsp;Or (gasp), share it with a = small parish <BR>that cannot afford a pipe organ. <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR> <BR>The second problem is the <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE = style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: = 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">positioning of the choir far away from the pipes <BR>and not being able to hear them, without me playing louder, and <BR>consequently drowning them out for the congregation &nbsp;- snip - = &nbsp;I have <BR>thought of a seperate 'choir' organ (although, not in the traditional = choir <BR>organ &nbsp;sense, more of a sepearte instrument) to accompany the = anthems, the <BR>psalms and to add to the full organ .... <BR></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR>Actually, the choir organ concept of which you speak is "traditional". = &nbsp;&nbsp;My <BR>preference for a similar situation would be to have a completely = separate <BR>instrument for use with the choir. &nbsp;It could be voiced in a = wonderfully <BR>delicate manner which would be exquisite for choral accompanying. = &nbsp;I would, <BR>however, not design it with the idea of "interesting antiphonal = effects" <BR>because this would necessitate compromising the voicing to make it = "work" <BR>with the main organ. &nbsp;It will work perhaps for duets without = compromising <BR>voicing, but not if it is designed as "part" of the main organ. = &nbsp;&nbsp;You have a <BR>potentially very interesting situation. &nbsp;With some restraint and = creativity <BR>it has the potential of being quite unique. &nbsp; <BR> <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_37.1586fc13.283dada9_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Felix Conquers Staten Island 5/20/01 (xPost) From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 20:21:14 EDT     --part1_d8.6bc1e22.283dadfa_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 5/23/01 6:24:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, edbroorg@webtv.net writes:     > Cannot read your blue ink answers, Bruce > Huh? I didn't know I sent any "blue ink" answers. I would offer to resend, but I just flushed my casche!!! ;-) sorry....     Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi Visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_d8.6bc1e22.283dadfa_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 5/23/01 6:24:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>edbroorg@webtv.net writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Cannot &nbsp;read = &nbsp;your blue ink answers, Bruce <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">Huh? &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;I didn't know I sent any = "blue ink" answers. &nbsp;&nbsp;I would offer to <BR>resend, but I just flushed my casche!!! &nbsp;;-) &nbsp;sorry.... <BR> <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi <BR>Visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/</FONT></HTML>   --part1_d8.6bc1e22.283dadfa_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Keeping Skinner Combination Actions as they were From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 18:31:13 -0700     --------------D744D9F489BD2B18E38E9572 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Horsefeathers! 99% of the great organ AND choral literature was written BEFORE the invention of pistons, and the organists of the day managed quite spectacularly, from all reports.   Skinner combination machines are FAMOUS for their reliability and durability. True, they require releathering every 50-75 years ... so what? We have yet to see if electronic components will last that long.   There is nothing more satisfying than to sit down and play a well-maintained, unaltered Skinner organ.   We have INVENTED the need for multiple memories and dozens of pistons .... the MUSIC certainly doesn't require it.   Cheers,   Bud-By-The-Beach, who wishes he had room for that 4m 37 rank one in Chicago that's up for grabs       > In a message dated 5/23/2001 3:32:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > Devon3000@aol.com writes: > > > >> I am also appalled that anyone would want to restore a pneumatic >> console >> like E.M. Skinner made and use it for present church use. Just to >> hear the >> "kathunk" that the pistons make is ridiculous, considering the >> advantages >> of modern equipment. The expense and maintenance are just not good >> stewardship. We need to make many quick changes during our worship >> services. Those that just use a very small amount registrational >> changes >> are doing our profession and the spirit of a lively worship service >> no >> good. And I can't think of much use for single memory combination >> actions >> on any large 2 manual or any three manual and up console. > > >   --------------D744D9F489BD2B18E38E9572 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html> <body bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"> Horsefeathers! 99% of the great organ AND choral literature was written BEFORE the invention of pistons, and the organists of the day managed = quite spectacularly, from all reports. <p>Skinner combination machines are FAMOUS for their reliability and = durability. True, they require releathering every 50-75 years ... so what? We have yet to see if electronic components will last that long. <p>There is nothing more satisfying than to sit down and play a = well-maintained, unaltered Skinner organ. <p>We have INVENTED the need for multiple memories and dozens of pistons .... the MUSIC certainly doesn't require it. <p>Cheers, <p>Bud-By-The-Beach, who wishes he had room for that 4m 37 rank one in Chicago that's up for grabs <br>&nbsp; <br>&nbsp; <blockquote TYPE=3DCITE><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>In = a message dated 5/23/2001 3:32:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time,</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>Devon3000@aol.com = writes:</font></font> <br>&nbsp; <br>&nbsp; <blockquote TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"><font = face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>I am also appalled that anyone would want to restore a pneumatic = console</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>like E.M. Skinner made = and use it for present church use.&nbsp; Just to hear the</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>"kathunk" that the = pistons make is ridiculous, considering the advantages</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>of modern = equipment.&nbsp; The expense and maintenance are just not good</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>stewardship.&nbsp; We = need to make many quick changes during our worship</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>services.&nbsp; Those = that just use a very small amount registrational changes</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>are doing our = profession and the spirit of a lively worship service no</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>good.&nbsp; And I can't think of much use for single memory combination actions</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>on any large 2 manual = or any three manual and up console.</font></font></blockquote>   <br>&nbsp;</blockquote>   </body> </html>   --------------D744D9F489BD2B18E38E9572--    
(back) Subject: Re: Digital Additions To Pipe Organs (x-posted) From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 18:49:20 -0700   Stephen - if you're thinking about it, talk to Ernest and Cheryl Hart at = Copeman Hart.   Cheers,   Bud   Stephen Barker wrote:   > Dear list, > > I was interested to read the post about adding digital parts to pipe = organs. > Have any of you done this already? what was the response? It is = something > that I have been considering myself recently for several reasons. = Firstly, > we don't really have the space for any more pipes... we have 15 ranks of > pipes and the case is full. I often find myself wishing for a solo = reed... > a 16' Open Diapason on the Pedal (don't have the height for that one > either)... a mixture on the Swell... one on the Great too would be = nice... a > Celeste on the Swell... the list could go on! The second problem is the > positioning of the choir far away from the pipes and not being able to = hear > them, without me playing louder, and consequently drowning them out for = the > congregation (although the sound is great in the Chancel :-)... I have > thought of a seperate 'choir' organ (although, not in the traditional = choir > organ sense, more of a sepearte instrument) to accompany the anthems, = the > psalms and to add to the full organ - it could even be used to give some > interesting antiphonal effects - but that is just more for fun really! > > So what are your thoughts on this? should I investigate this further? = or is > it just a wild fantasy that I should try and forget about? Let me know! > > Thanks, > > Steve Barker > St Stephen's Canterbury UK    
(back) Subject: Re: Keeping Skinner Combination Actions as they were From: "douglas morgan" <dkmorgan76209@yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 18:51:26 -0700 (PDT)   Dear quilisma@socal.rr.com:   As a former voicer and tonal finisher for Aeolian-Skinner, I certainly agree with you.   Years ago when I was in high school in the 1950s, people couldn't find enough cuss words in seven languages for Austin. Because of the way Austin's combination action was designed, they could include an enormous quantity of pistons. I have played some 15- rank organs with 20 general pistons.   Where does this madness stop? Soon, we will have no unaltered Skinners left when they have been "rebuilt" out of existance.   Sincerely yours,   D. Keith Morgan   Now, they have to have multiple memories with several hundred pistons. --- quilisma@socal.rr.com wrote: > Horsefeathers! 99% of the great organ AND choral > literature was written > BEFORE the invention of pistons, and the organists > of the day managed > quite spectacularly, from all reports. > > Skinner combination machines are FAMOUS for their > reliability and > durability. True, they require releathering every > 50-75 years ... so > what? We have yet to see if electronic components > will last that long. > > There is nothing more satisfying than to sit down > and play a > well-maintained, unaltered Skinner organ. > > We have INVENTED the need for multiple memories and > dozens of pistons > ... the MUSIC certainly doesn't require it. > > Cheers, > > Bud-By-The-Beach, who wishes he had room for that 4m > 37 rank one in > Chicago that's up for grabs > > > > > In a message dated 5/23/2001 3:32:26 PM Eastern > Daylight Time, > > Devon3000@aol.com writes: > > > > > > > >> I am also appalled that anyone would want to > restore a pneumatic > >> console > >> like E.M. Skinner made and use it for present > church use. Just to > >> hear the > >> "kathunk" that the pistons make is ridiculous, > considering the > >> advantages > >> of modern equipment. The expense and maintenance > are just not good > >> stewardship. We need to make many quick changes > during our worship > >> services. Those that just use a very small > amount registrational > >> changes > >> are doing our profession and the spirit of a > lively worship service > >> no > >> good. And I can't think of much use for single > memory combination > >> actions > >> on any large 2 manual or any three manual and up > console. > > > > > > >     __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/  
(back) Subject: Re: Digital Additions To Pipe Organs (x-posted) From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Thu, 24 May 2001 00:38:35 EDT   Hi Steven Barker:   It is entirely possible to do what you envisioned. My church did it with=20 a totally unenclosed six rank unit organ with great success. Yes, it can be done. We used Ahlborn sample boxes 201 and Classic, and added reverb for a totally dead room. All 54 ranks are under expression. We also have the added capability to use about eight different Classical temperments at A=3D440 and 415. Two blank temperments can be programmed by the user. The speakers can be located inside the swell enclosures for expression. We didn't have that obvious option, so the modules express electronically instead. Every stop is separately voiceable. You could do the whole job for 15,000=A3. Digital pipe tracking keeps the pipes and digital voices tuned tightly together all the time. I know it works, I play this organ every Sunday. There are 6 pipe ranks, and 54 equivalent additional digital ranks. 60 Ranks in all.   Regards,   Ron Severin