PipeChat Digest #2131 - Tuesday, May 29, 2001
 
Re: piano technique
  by "Marilyn Oakes" <marilynoakes@yahoo.com>
Re: piano technique
  by <Innkawgneeto@cs.com>
Re: piano vs. organ technique
  by "Marilyn Oakes" <marilynoakes@yahoo.com>
The Copernicus Center (Gateway) Organ, Chicago x-post
  by <ScottFop@aol.com>
Re: The Copernicus Center (Gateway) Organ, Chicago x-post
  by "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com>
Divided Choirs
  by <ManderUSA@aol.com>
Re: Choir Size
  by "jdoney" <jdoney@msn.com>
Re: Divided Choirs Gabrielli's and Basilica de San Marco
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
Re: piano technique VS Tracker
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
Re: piano technique
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
Re: piano technique
  by "Stephen F. P. Karr" <karr_sf@acadmn.mercer.edu>
Re: piano vs. organ technique
  by <Innkawgneeto@cs.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: piano technique From: "Marilyn Oakes" <marilynoakes@yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 16:46:35 -0700 (PDT)   Listmates - <sound produced by wrists and hands> Anybody else on the board study Sandor technique besides me?? Please speak up!!   In the Sandor piano method, sound is produced by grasping the keys in a microscopic motion, like taking hold of an orange. It follows the natural physiology of the hand - the thumb & pinkie grasp inward and down. Pinkie is very weak on its so, so stays straight to compensate, not even uncommon to use 4 & 5 as a single unit for certain passages. Even though Sandor represented a complete technical change for me, it took only about two weeks to completely incorporate Sandor techniques because it's so physiologically natural. It cooperates with how God engineered the human body to work.   Harsh sounds are produced when pianists strike the keys straight down, and it has little to do with where the sound originates. Using the Sandor technique, the motion originates in the big muscles in the back, the arm functions as a single unit (think hollow tube) and can produce a VERY big sound on the piano without a single harsh note. In fact, my teacher, Dr. Stark, was known for his shimmering, silvery touch. (After one particularly strident pianist played, Dr. Stark walked up to the piano on stage, played a few silvery chords, and remarked to no one in particular, "Well, no permanent damage done!" and walked off. I was standing near the stage with another music student and we heard his remark. We were startled, because Dr. Stark is the quintessential gentleman.)   The concept of grasping a note instead of striking it is one that even very young students can understand. I have one 7 yo piano student who can hear how different his piano sounds depending on his technique.   How the concept of grasping and use of the whole arm translates to the organ is CONTROL, phrasing, and articulation. The hitch is that, because of the pedal board, I have to sit a little too close to the keyboards for my optimum physiologic comfort. I have little room to adjust. I adjust, anyway. Sometimes the difference is leaning back a fraction. I can't play the 2nd variation in the Durufle Veni Creator (the music box variation) if I'm sitting too close but there is no pedal line, so I can lean back as far as I need to do. If I'm having technical trouble with a passage, 99 times out of 100, it is some combination of muscle tension, hand position, or perfecting my lean.<g>   One's approach to the keyboard is very subjective. Sam Batt used to say (tongue in cheek) that a good fingering works as well as a bad fingering, if you practice long enough. The same is true of technical systems. However, it seems to me that technical systems that cooperate with science and nature are more efficient and require less time to manage than an unnatural system. At least, that has been my experience and observation.   And I have also observed that the organists who so strongly object to piano facility as a requirement for organ performance usually have little background in piano or technical facility. I'm waiting for an exception to that observation to present itself. I TEACH piano for a college conservatory division, and I'm very partial to piano.<g>   Citing JSB is a waggish answer to the challenge to name a top organist without strong piano background. I'm still waiting to hear the names of all the CURRENT organists who play the great technical master works without strong piano background. (Technical master works =3D Dupre Preludes & Fugues, Durufle Suite or Veni Creator, Reubke 94th Psalm, Vierne & Widor organ symphonies, Reger fantasies, etc.)   The ability to think logically and critically when examining subjective matters is a useful skill in any profession. Just a thought.   Marilyn T. Oakes                         =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Marilyn T. Oakes, CRC, LPC, CLCP, Certified Pain Practitioner Rehabilitation Consultants, Inc. P.O. Box 43254 Birmingham, Alabama USA 35243-0254 Web Site: www.oakes.org, email: marilyn@oakes.org -or- = marilynoakes@yahoo.com Life Care Planning, Pediatric Life Care Planning, Vocational Assessment, Chronic Pain Research & Consultation   __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/  
(back) Subject: Re: piano technique From: <Innkawgneeto@cs.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 19:57:15 EDT     --part1_83.b3c76d5.2845915b_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   I was taught to grasp when I studied back in 70s. Don't know if it was Sandor or not, but it does lend itself to better tone. I was a piano = major way back then.   Since I do not play on mech action manuals where I am, I'm wondering if = this method would be useful particularly on historic tracker instruments? I = have no way of testing it out. Would it produce differing effects?   Peace. Neil B               --part1_83.b3c76d5.2845915b_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><BODY BGCOLOR=3D"#ffffff"><FONT = SIZE=3D2>I was taught to grasp when I studied back in 70s. &nbsp;Don't = know if it was <BR>Sandor or not, but it does lend itself to better tone. &nbsp;I was a = piano major <BR>way back then. <BR> <BR>Since I &nbsp;do not play on mech action manuals where I am, I'm = wondering if this <BR>method would be useful particularly on historic tracker instruments? = &nbsp;&nbsp;I have <BR>no way of testing it out. &nbsp;Would it produce differing effects? <BR> <BR>Peace. <BR>Neil B <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR></FONT></HTML>   --part1_83.b3c76d5.2845915b_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: piano vs. organ technique From: "Marilyn Oakes" <marilynoakes@yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 16:58:50 -0700 (PDT)   > --- Innkawgneeto@cs.com wrote: > > I think piano mastery is indispensible to learning > > organ, but I also have > > found that my organ playing has helped my piano > > playing too. I am not sure I > > can explain it, but I know it has. > > > > They benefit each other.   Actually, Neil, the explanation probably has to do with training your brain tracks in certain ways. Bimanual coordination is so complicated that even neuroscientists can't completely explain it, but both piano and organ are both complex motoric activities. With piano, you're training slightly different, but closely related tracks, in that you're training hand-eye-brain, while with organ you're training hand-foot-eye-brain. Neuroscientists have demonstrated that dexterity pathways close down about ages 12 or 13, which is why adult beginner keyboard students never gain the speed and facility that people who study before ages 12 or 13. (Ditto adult beginner typists.) You can build on the existing pathways, but you can't build new ones if you didn't do it before ages 12 or 13.   I'd love to see a PET (positronic emissions) brain scan of which parts of the brain light up doing which activities (organ vs. piano), and that would make a wonderful research study. I'd volunteer my brain, and I'll bet many others who play both instruments would, as well.   Marilyn T. Oakes           =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Marilyn T. Oakes, CRC, LPC, CLCP, Certified Pain Practitioner Rehabilitation Consultants, Inc. P.O. Box 43254 Birmingham, Alabama USA 35243-0254 Web Site: www.oakes.org, email: marilyn@oakes.org -or- = marilynoakes@yahoo.com Life Care Planning, Pediatric Life Care Planning, Vocational Assessment, Chronic Pain Research & Consultation   __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/  
(back) Subject: The Copernicus Center (Gateway) Organ, Chicago x-post From: <ScottFop@aol.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 20:18:37 EDT     --part1_60.efa76dd.2845965d_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64   SEVMUCEKCkkgd3JpdGUgeW91IHRvZGF5IHJhdGhlciBvdXQgb2YgZnJ1c3RyYXRpb24gdGhh biBhbnl0aGluZyBlbHNlLiDCoEkgYW0gdG8gCnByZXNlbnQgYSBwcm9ncmFtIG5leHQgTW9u ZGF5IGV2ZW5pbmcsIEp1bmUgNCwgYXQgdGhlIENvcGVybmljdXMgQ2VudGVyICh0aGUgCk9s ZCBHYXRld2F5IFRoZWF0cmUpIGZvciB0aGUgQ2hpY2FnbyBBR08gY2hhcHRlci4gwqBUaGUg dGhlYXRyZSBvcmdhbnMgd2ViIApzaXRlIHNob3dzIGEgcmF0aGVyIGdyYWlueSBwaG90byBv ZiB0aGUgQ29wZXJuaWN1cyBDZW50ZXIgd2l0aCB0aGUgY29uc29sZSBvbiAKdGhlIHJpZ2h0 IHNpZGUgb2YgdGhlIHN0YWdlLiAgT3RoZXIgdGhhbiB0aGF0IEkgY2FuIHNlZSBub3RoaW5n LiDCoFRoZSBDQVRPRSAKc2l0ZSBzZWVtcyB0byBiZSBkb3duLiDCoAoKV2hhdCBJIGFtIGxv b2tpbmcgZm9yIGluIHBhcnRpY3VsYXIgaXMgYSByYW5rIGxpc3Qgb3IgY29tcGxldGUgc3Bl Y2lmaWNhdGlvbiAKYW5kIHBob3RvIG9mIHRoZSBjb25zb2xlLiDCoEkgYW0gYWxzbyB2ZXJ5 IGludGVyZXN0ZWQgaW4gdGhlIApwbGF5aW5nL21lY2hhbmljYWwgY29uZGl0aW9uIG9mIHRo ZSBvcmdhbiBhbmQgd2hhdCB0byBleHBlY3QuICBBcyBJIGFtIHRvIApwcmVzZW50IGEgcHJv Z3JhbSBJIGFtIGFtYXplZCBhdCB0aGUgYW1vdW50IG9mIGluZm9ybWF0aW9uIEkgaGF2ZSBi ZWVuIGFibGUgCnRvIGZpbmQgb3V0IHJlZ2FyZGluZyB0aGlzIGluc3RydW1lbnQsIG5hbWVs eS0gbm9uZS4KCkNhbiBhbnlvbmUgaGVscCBtZSBhdCBhbGw/IMKgQW55IGFuZCBhbGwgYXNz aXN0YW5jZSB3aWxsIGJlIGdyZWF0bHkgCmFwcHJlY2lhdGVkISDCoAoKVGhhbmtzIHNvIG11 Y2guCgpTQ09UVCBGLiBGT1BQSUFOTywgUHJpbmNpcGFsIE9yZ2FuaXN0IGFuZCBEaXJlY3Rv ciBvZiBNdXNpYyBhbmQgTGl0dXJneQpUSEUgTkFUSU9OQUwgU0hSSU5FIE9GIFRIRSBMSVRU TEUgRkxPV0VSLCBSb3lhbCBPYWssIE1JCihHZW8uIEtpbGdlbiAmIFNvbiwgU3QuIExvdWlz LCBNTywgT3B1cyA1MTgwLCAxOTMzKQrigJxDYW50YW50aWJ1cyBvcmdhbmlzIENhZWNpbGlh IERvbWlubyBkZWNhbnRhYmF0IGRpY2VucywKZmlhdCBjb3IgbWV1bSBpbW1hY3VsYXR1bSB1 dCBub24gY29uZnVuZGFyLuKAnQoK   --part1_60.efa76dd.2845965d_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64   PEhUTUw+PEZPTlQgRkFDRT1hcmlhbCxoZWx2ZXRpY2E+PEZPTlQgIENPTE9SPSIjMDAwMGEw IiBTSVpFPTIgRkFNSUxZPSJTQ1JJUFQiIEZBQ0U9IkNvbWljIFNhbnMgTVMiIExBTkc9IjAi PkhFTFAhCjxCUj4KPEJSPkkgd3JpdGUgeW91IHRvZGF5IHJhdGhlciBvdXQgb2YgZnJ1c3Ry YXRpb24gdGhhbiBhbnl0aGluZyBlbHNlLiDCoEkgYW0gdG8gCjxCUj5wcmVzZW50IGEgcHJv Z3JhbSBuZXh0IE1vbmRheSBldmVuaW5nLCBKdW5lIDQsIGF0IHRoZSBDb3Blcm5pY3VzIENl bnRlciAodGhlIAo8QlI+T2xkIEdhdGV3YXkgVGhlYXRyZSkgZm9yIHRoZSBDaGljYWdvIEFH TyBjaGFwdGVyLiDCoFRoZSB0aGVhdHJlIG9yZ2FucyB3ZWIgCjxCUj5zaXRlIHNob3dzIGEg cmF0aGVyIGdyYWlueSBwaG90byBvZiB0aGUgQ29wZXJuaWN1cyBDZW50ZXIgd2l0aCB0aGUg Y29uc29sZSBvbiAKPEJSPnRoZSByaWdodCBzaWRlIG9mIHRoZSBzdGFnZS4gJm5ic3A7T3Ro ZXIgdGhhbiB0aGF0IEkgY2FuIHNlZSBub3RoaW5nLiDCoFRoZSBDQVRPRSAKPEJSPnNpdGUg c2VlbXMgdG8gYmUgZG93bi4gwqAKPEJSPgo8QlI+V2hhdCBJIGFtIGxvb2tpbmcgZm9yIGlu IHBhcnRpY3VsYXIgaXMgYSByYW5rIGxpc3Qgb3IgY29tcGxldGUgc3BlY2lmaWNhdGlvbiAK PEJSPmFuZCBwaG90byBvZiB0aGUgY29uc29sZS4gwqBJIGFtIGFsc28gdmVyeSBpbnRlcmVz dGVkIGluIHRoZSAKPEJSPnBsYXlpbmcvbWVjaGFuaWNhbCBjb25kaXRpb24gb2YgdGhlIG9y Z2FuIGFuZCB3aGF0IHRvIGV4cGVjdC4gJm5ic3A7QXMgSSBhbSB0byAKPEJSPnByZXNlbnQg YSBwcm9ncmFtIEkgYW0gYW1hemVkIGF0IHRoZSBhbW91bnQgb2YgaW5mb3JtYXRpb24gSSBo YXZlIGJlZW4gYWJsZSAKPEJSPnRvIGZpbmQgb3V0IHJlZ2FyZGluZyB0aGlzIGluc3RydW1l bnQsIG5hbWVseS0gbm9uZS4KPEJSPgo8QlI+Q2FuIGFueW9uZSBoZWxwIG1lIGF0IGFsbD8g wqBBbnkgYW5kIGFsbCBhc3Npc3RhbmNlIHdpbGwgYmUgZ3JlYXRseSAKPEJSPmFwcHJlY2lh dGVkISDCoAo8QlI+CjxCUj5UaGFua3Mgc28gbXVjaC4KPEJSPgo8QlI+PEI+U0NPVFQgRi4g Rk9QUElBTk88L0I+LCBQcmluY2lwYWwgT3JnYW5pc3QgYW5kIERpcmVjdG9yIG9mIE11c2lj IGFuZCBMaXR1cmd5CjxCUj5USEUgTkFUSU9OQUwgU0hSSU5FIE9GIFRIRSBMSVRUTEUgRkxP V0VSLCBSb3lhbCBPYWssIE1JCjxCUj4oR2VvLiBLaWxnZW4gJmFtcDsgU29uLCBTdC4gTG91 aXMsIE1PLCBPcHVzIDUxODAsIDE5MzMpCjxCUj48ST7igJxDYW50YW50aWJ1cyBvcmdhbmlz IENhZWNpbGlhIERvbWlubyBkZWNhbnRhYmF0IGRpY2VucywKPEJSPmZpYXQgY29yIG1ldW0g aW1tYWN1bGF0dW0gdXQgbm9uIGNvbmZ1bmRhci7igJ08L0k+CjxCUj48L0ZPTlQ+PC9IVE1M Pgo=3D   --part1_60.efa76dd.2845965d_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: The Copernicus Center (Gateway) Organ, Chicago x-post From: "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 19:26:04 -0500   Scott   Go to: http://www.catoe.org/gateway.html - I was just there so I know the page is working. Has photos and specs on it.   David  
(back) Subject: Divided Choirs From: <ManderUSA@aol.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 21:10:08 EDT     --part1_d4.72306bd.2845a270_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 5/29/2001 9:17:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Cremona502@cs.com quotes mjolnir@ticnet.com :     > > >> Church of the Incarnation, Dallas: >> >> . . . the choir which sings at 11:15 is divided SATB / SATB, and has 6 = - >> 4 - 3 - 4 / 5 - 5 - 4 - 5 >> >   Cremona responds thus:     > Please elaborate on how you have arrived at the divided set-up and how = it > works. Thanks. >   ManderUSA pontificates: There is a long tradition of the divided choir (complete SATB choirs on both sides) in the Anglican cathedral tradition, which serves the basic parallel nature of the Psalms usually sung to = Anglican Chant. <Decani> and <Cantoris> sides alternate the verses of the Psalms, based on the parallel poetic scheme of the chosen Psalms. There is tons of =   Tudor music with <Dec and Can> indications - much Gibbons, for example. It = is really fulfilling to do this music in that manner, as intended. An early manifestation of that idea comes via San Marco in Venice, with the = opposing choir lofts, and the so-called Cori Spezzati, the spaced out choirs<G>. Monteverdi and Gabrieli knew about all this, and later Schutz in Germany, = who experienced this on site. This was later a tradition in the French Chapel Royal. There is a bunch of Lully written in this way, and there are demonstrable connections with the earlier Venetians, but I forget what = they all were. Charles the 2nd waited out the Commonwealth at the French Court, =   where he heard this divided music, and when he managed to get on the = English throne at the end of the Cromwell era, his wish was to copy the = magnificence of what he heard in France. That whole thing really fascinated me, and at = one time, I had thought of making that a dissertation topic, but someone got there first, and I am sure, did a better job than I might have done.   I taught for too many years at a Northern Ontario University which had a monthly forum led by a different faculty member each month, done at lunch hour in a private dining room. I agreed to do one of these, with slides = and musical examples and chat about the Venetian musical tradition as found at =   San Marco. I turned in my topic, and found it announced later in the week = as "Malcolm Wechsler will discuss music on the planet Venus!" When do we = leave?   Cheers,   Malcolm   --part1_d4.72306bd.2845a270_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><BODY BGCOLOR=3D"#ffffff"><FONT = SIZE=3D2>In a message dated 5/29/2001 9:17:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>Cremona502@cs.com quotes mjolnir@ticnet.com : <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Church of the = Incarnation, Dallas: <BR> <BR>. . . &nbsp;the choir which sings at 11:15 is divided SATB / SATB, and = has 6 - <BR>4 - 3 - 4 / 5 - 5 - 4 - 5 <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">Cremona responds thus: <BR> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: = #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: = 5px">Please elaborate on how you have arrived at the divided set-up and = how it <BR>works. &nbsp;Thanks. <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">ManderUSA pontificates: There is a long tradition of the divided choir <BR>(complete SATB choirs on both sides) in the Anglican cathedral = tradition, <BR>which serves the basic parallel nature of the Psalms usually sung to = Anglican <BR>Chant. &lt;Decani&gt; and &lt;Cantoris&gt; sides alternate the verses = of the Psalms, <BR>based on the parallel poetic scheme of the chosen Psalms. There is = tons of <BR>Tudor music with &lt;Dec and Can&gt; indications - much Gibbons, for = example. It is <BR>really fulfilling to do this music in that manner, as intended. An = early <BR>manifestation of that idea comes via San Marco in Venice, with the = opposing <BR>choir lofts, and the so-called Cori Spezzati, the spaced out = choirs&lt;G&gt;. <BR>Monteverdi and Gabrieli knew about all this, and later Schutz in = Germany, who <BR>experienced this on site. This was later a tradition in the French = Chapel <BR>Royal. There is a bunch of Lully written in this way, and there are <BR>demonstrable connections with the earlier Venetians, but I forget what = they <BR>all were. Charles the 2nd waited out the Commonwealth at the French = Court, <BR>where he heard this divided music, and when he managed to get on the = English <BR>throne at the end of the Cromwell era, his wish was to copy the = magnificence <BR>of what he heard in France. That whole thing really fascinated me, and = at one <BR>time, I had thought of making that a dissertation topic, but someone = got <BR>there first, and I am sure, did a better job than I might have done. <BR> <BR>I taught for too many years at a Northern Ontario University which had = a <BR>monthly forum led by a different faculty member each month, done at = lunch <BR>hour in a private dining room. I agreed to do one of these, with = slides and <BR>musical examples and chat about the Venetian musical tradition as = found at <BR>San Marco. I turned in my topic, and found it announced later in the = week as <BR>"Malcolm Wechsler will discuss music on the planet Venus!" When do we = leave? <BR> <BR>Cheers, <BR> <BR>Malcolm</FONT></HTML>   --part1_d4.72306bd.2845a270_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Choir Size From: "jdoney" <jdoney@msn.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 21:13:36 -0000   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_000A_01C0E884.3B053CE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   At Christ Presbyterian in Largo, during the height of the season - =3D January-March our choir is about 10-5-4-5. After the Easter service we = =3D go to 8-3-3-3 when the snowbirds fly back north. The church has about =3D 600 members. Fortunately I am not the choir director, having given up =3D doing choirs 4 years ago when I came to this church. Now (at my =3D advanced age) I am content to play the organ ( 4 manual Rodgers), bring = =3D out all that good stuff that I haven't played for years that needed a =3D larger instrument. We do have a good choir director who has a doctorate = =3D in music and is well liked. He and I get along well together even =3D though his taste leans more toward contemporary fundamental, but decent, = =3D music whereas my tastes are just slightly more liberal than Bud. John     ------=3D_NextPart_000_000A_01C0E884.3B053CE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META content=3D3D"text/html; charset=3D3Diso-8859-1" =3D http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 5.00.3018.900" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT size=3D3D2>At Christ Presbyterian in Largo, during the height = =3D of the=3D20 season - January-March our choir is about 10-5-4-5.&nbsp; After the =3D Easter=3D20 service we go to 8-3-3-3 when the snowbirds fly back north.&nbsp; The =3D church has=3D20 about 600 members.&nbsp; Fortunately I am not the choir director, having = =3D given=3D20 up doing choirs 4 years ago when I came to this church.&nbsp; Now (at my = =3D   advanced age) I am content to play the organ ( 4 manual Rodgers), bring = =3D out all=3D20 that good stuff that I haven't played for years that needed a larger=3D20 instrument.&nbsp; We do have a good choir director who has a doctorate =3D in music=3D20 and is well liked.&nbsp; He and I get along well together even though =3D his taste=3D20 leans more toward contemporary fundamental, but decent, music whereas my = =3D tastes=3D20 are just slightly more liberal than Bud.&nbsp;&nbsp; John</FONT></DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_000A_01C0E884.3B053CE0--    
(back) Subject: Re: Divided Choirs Gabrielli's and Basilica de San Marco From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 22:10:49 EDT   Malcolm:   Did you mean the Gabrielli's and San Marco in Venice? They made the old Basilica famous. There were four galleries for singers to do antiphonal music. The organs were small and soft intonation Violes and other instruments filled in the texture. E. Power Biggs did some of their music once upon a time and imported an extra organ by gondolla to the site for recordings. It was one of his more exciting efforts, and was well done.   Ron Severin  
(back) Subject: Re: piano technique VS Tracker From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 22:27:59 EDT   Hi Neil:   I think you will agree that the tracker reed or pipe organ can do more toward a good organ technique. The fingers are strengthened and all the necessary pathways are emphasized. I practiced on an Estey Reed Organ 2M and Ped for over 20 years. I believe that was most beneficial. The legato touch gained thereby has sustained my technique to this very day. The keys were a bit stiffer when more stops were drawn with couplers. It was a terrific practice organ.   The piano emphasises a different set of actions from organ playing. Infact the only thing both instruments have in common is the keyboard.   Ron Severin  
(back) Subject: Re: piano technique From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 22:35:14 EDT   Hi Marylyn:   I think there are two valid realities here, ment this way. In Europe the churches are mostly reverberent. A detached more pianistic approach for clraity would be essential. In dead or dry accoustical settings as are most American Churches, a more legato organistic approach for organ and piano. I think this makes sense. What do you think?   Ron Severin  
(back) Subject: Re: piano technique From: "Stephen F. P. Karr" <karr_sf@acadmn.mercer.edu> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 22:59:46 -0400   Marilyn Oakes writes of her professor Lucien Stark in glowing tones, and having heard the man perform, I heartily concur. He truly knows the piano as an old friend, and plays it marvelously (even though the day he arrived from Indiana (?) in Macon, he had to go to the hospital for a severe case of bronchitis. . .it never showed onstage). However, I still am not convinced that it is necessary to have a thorough grounding in piano technique to be proficient at even 19th and 20th century organ repertoire, written by virtuoso pianists as it may have been. To wit. . ..   > I'm still waiting to hear the names of all the CURRENT > organists who play the great technical master works > without strong piano background. (Technical master > works =3D Dupre Preludes & Fugues, Durufle Suite or Veni > Creator, Reubke 94th Psalm, Vierne & Widor organ > symphonies, Reger fantasies, etc.)   Well, does the Durufle Requiem count? Then I'm one. Add to that, I had to learn it in a month. This past March I won a competition playing Bach, Mendelssohn Sonata III (involving a good deal of scalar passages and arpeggios), and Messiaen Transports de Joie. Two of those were written by pianist/organists. I also play Franck (Fantasie in C), Mendelssohn Sonata II, most (including the parallel thirds variation, fugue and final toccata) of the Dupre Variations sur un Noel, all of Tim Tikker's Variations sur un Vieux Noel, the Passacaglia from Sowerby's Symphony in G, and am working on the Durufle Suite to end my senior recital next year.   My professor, Robert Parris plays Dupre Preludes and Fugues, among many others of the same composer; the Durufle Veni Creator; Vierne Symphonie V; Reger: Wachet Auf, Hallelujah, Gott Zu Loben, Fantasy and Fugue on BACH, among many others; Liszt Ad Nos, Prelude and Fugue on BACH; Albright Organbooks I through III; . . . need I continue? He will only play piano when it is thrust upon him, and openly disparages his own piano repertoire and technique.   The point of these lists is to show that perhaps the organ can be found on its own terms, not those of rigorous piano study, including Rachmaninoff III played with NY Philharmonic at age 7 (excuse the hyperbole, but you get the point). I reserve the right to become a virtuoso at the organ without having to learn the very different techniques of an instrument whose keyboard somewhat resembles that of my own. It has been done, and *not* just by J. S. Bach, but by many of our own time!   -Stephen Karr    
(back) Subject: Re: piano vs. organ technique From: <Innkawgneeto@cs.com> Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 23:50:59 EDT     --part1_f7.aa6e006.2845c823_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Along with that Marilyn, I have always wanted to track all the various = brain functions going on when someone is singing in a choir. Just thinking = about all the various components boggles my mind.   Neil B   --part1_f7.aa6e006.2845c823_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><BODY BGCOLOR=3D"#ffffff"><FONT = SIZE=3D2>Along with that Marilyn, &nbsp;I have always wanted to track all = the various brain <BR>functions going on when someone is singing in a choir. &nbsp;Just = thinking about <BR>all the various components boggles my mind. &nbsp; <BR> <BR>Neil B</FONT></HTML>   --part1_f7.aa6e006.2845c823_boundary--