PipeChat Digest #2470 - Tuesday, October 30, 2001
 
Re: Membership in the parish
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
Re: Membership in the parish
  by "Ross Wards" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
Re: Re[4]: Membership in the parish
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Liszt
  by "Glenda" <gksjd85@access.aic-fl.com>
Re: Re[4]: Membership in the parish
  by <Bobmac36@aol.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Membership in the parish From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 16:49:57 -0800     --------------9CEA2EF175C5EFCE295B0521 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit       Innkawgneeto@cs.com wrote:   >> If the musician can do the job and doesn't get involved in any >> public activity inimical >> to the image of the church then that's it so far as I am concerned > I'm not sure I even like the sound of THAT ...   I owe the church 40 hours a week, and they owe me a wage and benefits in return. That's a lease agreement, NOT a purchase contract. They haven't BOUGHT me. They have LEASED my services.   What I do beyond those 40 hours a week is none of their concern, PERIOD.   Unfortunately, churches have managed to get themselves exempted from most anti-discrimination laws, as well as not paying into unemployment and disability funds.   It seems to me we should have at LEAST one, if not both of the above ... employment protection AND/OR unemployment and disability benefits. At present we have neither. Most churches in most states can fire us on a whim or any pretext they choose.   I find it REAL interesting that alcoholic priests with multiple DWIs never seem to lose THEIR jobs, and that's a public scandal / public SAFETY issue.   I WASN'T so hard-nosed for about 35-40 years of my 50-year career ... then I woke up one morning old and scary and decided it was time I STARTED, for my OWN well-being.   Am I bitter about my experiences? YOU BET!   But I STILL get a thrill out of starting the processional hymn on Sunday morning, or an anthem well-sung after hours and hours of hard work. It would be nice to be THANKED once in awhile, but no matter ... the choir and I know when we do well.   Church membership? Ehhh ... if I wasn't an organist I'd probably never set foot in a church again, EVER.   Cheers,   Bud   --------------9CEA2EF175C5EFCE295B0521 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html> <body bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"> &nbsp; <p>Innkawgneeto@cs.com wrote: <blockquote TYPE=3DCITE> <blockquote TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"><font = face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>If the musician can do the job and doesn't get involved in any public = activity inimical</font></font> <br><font face=3D"arial,helvetica"><font size=3D-1>to the image of the = church then that's it so far as I am concerned</font></font></blockquote> </blockquote> I'm not sure I even like the sound of THAT ... <p>I owe the church 40 hours a week, and they owe me a wage and benefits in return. That's a lease agreement, NOT a purchase contract. They haven't BOUGHT me. They have LEASED my services. <p>What I do beyond those 40 hours a week is none of their concern, = PERIOD. <p>Unfortunately, churches have managed to get themselves exempted from most anti-discrimination laws, as well as not paying into unemployment and disability funds. <p>It seems to me we should have at LEAST one, if not both of the above .... employment protection AND/OR unemployment and disability benefits. At present we have neither. Most churches in most states can fire us on a whim or any pretext they choose. <p>I find it REAL interesting that alcoholic priests with multiple DWIs never seem to lose THEIR jobs, and that's a public scandal / public SAFETY issue. <p>I WASN'T so hard-nosed for about 35-40 years of my 50-year career ... then I woke up one morning old and scary and decided it was time I = STARTED, for my OWN well-being. <p>Am I bitter about my experiences? YOU BET! <p>But I STILL get a thrill out of starting the processional hymn on = Sunday morning, or an anthem well-sung after hours and hours of hard work. It would be nice to be THANKED once in awhile, but no matter ... the choir and I know when we do well. <p>Church membership? Ehhh ... if I wasn't an organist I'd probably never set foot in a church again, EVER. <p>Cheers, <p>Bud </body> </html>   --------------9CEA2EF175C5EFCE295B0521--    
(back) Subject: Re: Membership in the parish From: "Ross Wards" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 14:41:26 +1300   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0015_01C1621A.1EA6BC80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   Bud, I may be a clergyman (just retired a month ago), but I do understand =3D sometimes how you feel. You know the old joke: Sleepy husband, "I'm not going to church today." Wife, "Why not?" Husband, "The preaching's boring, the liturgical assistants dull and =3D unconvincing, the organ music pathetic, the choir a disgrace, the =3D mannerisms of the clergy infuriating, the theological outlook dull, the = =3D hypocrisy stupefying, the clergy's children abominable....." Wife, "But you must go!" Husband, "Why? Give me one good reason." Wife, "Well, for a starter, you're the Vicar." All joking aside (I think that was a joke, but maybe not) we don't have = =3D your situation in NZ, as we have no more than about two fulltime church = =3D musicians, and they must supplement their income by teaching etc.etc. I agree, there are terrible clergy, but also terrible church members: I = =3D should know - just before I retired a month ago, a 65+ woman came to me = =3D and said, "I should tell you, you're the worst Vicar I've ever known." =3D She was one of about 3, maximum 4, folk who were pleased I was retiring, = =3D but it hurts all the same. And in the parish before this last one, a =3D rich inner-city suburb, a 22-yr-old girl came up to me one day and =3D asked, "Why don't you go back to the working class where you belong?" Oh = =3D yeah, feels good OK, especially when you're very well qualified and =3D social class has no place in my vocab. When organists/church musicians say it doesn't matter what they believe = =3D or do outside "performance" hours as long as they do their performance =3D well, then how about it not mattering what the clergy do or believe, =3D provided they can say the liturgy nicely, read prayers well, and make up = =3D a sermon that sounds "orthodox" and is not insulting or likely to press = =3D buttons? You'd hate it, and so would I, and the church would deserve to = =3D die.=3D20 I've seen good and bad in both clergy and musicians, in other words, and = =3D seen some of both sent to prison for their "peccadilloes," but it does =3D no honour to Christ and proclaim his love, and that's what a church is =3D for, not least. There have been appalling things done in churches, but =3D no more than anywhere else. Sadly, that's why churches are needed: to =3D proclaim Christ's Gospel of love and forgiveness. And no, I'm not being = =3D schmaltzy, but trying to be honest. I know what it's like to have no thanks for work well done, even if it =3D is paid work. I did the weekly newsletters every week for the eight =3D years in my last parish, from collecting the material, to the computer =3D setting-up, to the photocopying, and never once did anyone say, "Thanks, = =3D you're doing a wonderful job and that saves us the effort and from =3D paying to have paid secretarial help." Oh yes, I had complaints now and = =3D again from people who thought I'd left something out, or made a typo, or = =3D used too many fonts, or shouldn't have said a particular thing, but =3D thanks, never. Nor for my even buying the ruddy computer to begin with, = =3D and the software and clipart CDs and photocopy paper as well, never =3D being reimbursed or there even being an offer to do so. Oh yes, and when = =3D I suggested the parish might follow the diocesan rules and build a =3D garage so I could get my car out of the rain, the Vicarage having been =3D built in 1968, they just laughed, and laughed even more when I tried to = =3D get them to pay the panelbeater for lots of rust removed and told me to = =3D buy a new car, even though they were also not following diocesan rules =3D in that I had no car allowance. And all of this hurts, of course it =3D does, and you can spend years in a parish and while you find, and =3D sometimes with God's grace help create, angels and saints of the people = =3D who come, that's not always the case. Yes, I'm able to look both ways, as although I may have been a Vicar for = =3D 25 years, I've been an organist/choirmaster in a variety of positions =3D before that. Too, I'm in my 2nd term (the last was for 4 years, about 10 = =3D years ago) as President of the Organists' Association, and have been the = =3D only clergyman actively involved for my 41 years in the Association. =3D I've been a Committee member for about 17 years. Yes, I know both sides. = =3D And that's why I think it essential to have a good, if you like a =3D heart-to-heart understanding between clergy and musicians.=3D20 I've probably now said far more than my 2c worth, so if I've offended =3D anyone at all, or sound ignorant of your actual situations, the latter =3D is most likely, and the former most probable, that's probably perfectly = =3D normal. :-) Much love to all (Yaayyy!!!!) Ross (in New Zealand) -----Original Message----- From: quilisma@socal.rr.com <quilisma@socal.rr.com> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: 31 October 2001 13:53 Subject: Re: Membership in the parish     =3D20 Innkawgneeto@cs.com wrote:=3D20   If the musician can do the job and doesn't get involved in any =3D public activity inimical=3D20 to the image of the church then that's it so far as I am concerned I'm not sure I even like the sound of THAT ...=3D20 I owe the church 40 hours a week, and they owe me a wage and benefits = =3D in return. That's a lease agreement, NOT a purchase contract. They =3D haven't BOUGHT me. They have LEASED my services.=3D20   What I do beyond those 40 hours a week is none of their concern, =3D PERIOD.=3D20   Unfortunately, churches have managed to get themselves exempted from =3D most anti-discrimination laws, as well as not paying into unemployment =3D and disability funds.=3D20   It seems to me we should have at LEAST one, if not both of the above =3D .... employment protection AND/OR unemployment and disability benefits. = =3D At present we have neither. Most churches in most states can fire us on = =3D a whim or any pretext they choose.=3D20   I find it REAL interesting that alcoholic priests with multiple DWIs =3D never seem to lose THEIR jobs, and that's a public scandal / public =3D SAFETY issue.=3D20   I WASN'T so hard-nosed for about 35-40 years of my 50-year career ... = =3D then I woke up one morning old and scary and decided it was time I =3D STARTED, for my OWN well-being.=3D20   Am I bitter about my experiences? YOU BET!=3D20   But I STILL get a thrill out of starting the processional hymn on =3D Sunday morning, or an anthem well-sung after hours and hours of hard =3D work. It would be nice to be THANKED once in awhile, but no matter ... =3D the choir and I know when we do well.=3D20   Church membership? Ehhh ... if I wasn't an organist I'd probably never = =3D set foot in a church again, EVER.=3D20   Cheers,=3D20   Bud=3D20     ------=3D_NextPart_000_0015_01C1621A.1EA6BC80 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type content=3D3D"text/html; =3D charset=3D3Dwindows-1252"> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 5.50.4134.600" name=3D3DGENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV>Bud,</DIV> <DIV>I may be a clergyman (just retired a month ago), but I do =3D understand=3D20 sometimes how you feel. You know the old joke:</DIV> <DIV>Sleepy husband, "I'm not going to church today."</DIV> <DIV>Wife, "Why not?"</DIV> <DIV>Husband, "The preaching's boring, the liturgical assistants dull =3D and=3D20 unconvincing, the organ music pathetic, the choir a disgrace, the =3D mannerisms of=3D20 the clergy infuriating, the theological outlook dull, the hypocrisy =3D stupefying,=3D20 the clergy's children abominable....."</DIV> <DIV>Wife, "But you must go!"</DIV> <DIV>Husband, "Why? Give me one good reason."</DIV> <DIV>Wife, "Well, for a starter, you're the Vicar."</DIV> <DIV>All joking aside (I think that was a joke, but maybe not) we don't = =3D have=3D20 your situation in NZ, as we have no more than about two fulltime = church=3D20 musicians, and they must supplement their income by teaching =3D etc.etc.</DIV> <DIV>I agree, there are terrible clergy, but also terrible church =3D members: I=3D20 should know - just before I retired a month ago, a 65+ woman came to me = =3D and=3D20 said, "I should tell you, you're the worst Vicar I've ever known." She =3D was one=3D20 of about 3, maximum 4, folk who were pleased&nbsp;I was retiring, but it = =3D hurts=3D20 all the same. And in the parish before this last one, a rich inner-city = =3D suburb,=3D20 a 22-yr-old girl came up to me one day and asked, "Why don't you go back = =3D to the=3D20 working class where you belong?" Oh yeah, feels good OK, especially when = =3D you're=3D20 very well qualified and social class has no place in my vocab.</DIV> <DIV>When organists/church musicians&nbsp;say it doesn't matter what =3D they=3D20 believe or do outside "performance" hours as long as they = do&nbsp;their=3D20 performance&nbsp;well, then how about it not mattering what the clergy =3D do or=3D20 believe, provided they can say the liturgy nicely, read prayers well, =3D and make=3D20 up a sermon that sounds "orthodox" and is not insulting or likely to =3D press=3D20 buttons? You'd hate it, and so would I, and the church would deserve to = =3D die.=3D20 </DIV> <DIV>I've seen good and bad in both clergy and musicians, in other =3D words, and=3D20 seen some of both sent to prison for their "peccadilloes," but it does =3D no honour=3D20 to Christ and proclaim his love, and that's what a church is for, not =3D least.=3D20 There have been appalling things done in churches, but no more than =3D anywhere=3D20 else. Sadly, that's why churches are needed: to proclaim Christ's Gospel = =3D of love=3D20 and forgiveness. And no, I'm not being schmaltzy, but trying to be =3D honest.</DIV> <DIV>I know what it's like to have no thanks for work well done, even if = =3D it is=3D20 paid work. I did the weekly newsletters every week for the eight years =3D in my=3D20 last parish, from collecting the material, to the computer setting-up, =3D to the=3D20 photocopying, and never once did anyone say, "Thanks, you're doing a =3D wonderful=3D20 job and that saves us the effort and from paying to have paid =3D secretarial help."=3D20 Oh yes, I had complaints now and again from&nbsp;people who thought I'd = =3D left=3D20 something out, or made a typo, or used too many fonts, or shouldn't have = =3D said a=3D20 particular thing, but thanks, never. Nor for my even buying the ruddy =3D computer=3D20 to begin with, and the software and clipart CDs and photocopy paper as =3D well,=3D20 never being reimbursed or there even being an offer to do so. Oh yes, =3D and when I=3D20 suggested the parish might follow the diocesan rules and build a garage = =3D so I=3D20 could get my car out of the rain, the Vicarage having been built in =3D 1968, they=3D20 just laughed, and laughed even more when I tried to get them to pay = the=3D20 panelbeater for lots of rust removed and told me to buy a new car, even = =3D though=3D20 they were also not following diocesan rules in that I had no car =3D allowance. And=3D20 all of this hurts, of course it does, and you can spend years in a =3D parish and=3D20 while you find, and sometimes with God's grace help create, angels and =3D saints of=3D20 the people who come, that's not always the case.</DIV> <DIV>Yes, I'm able to look both ways, as although I may have been a =3D Vicar for 25=3D20 years, I've been an organist/choirmaster in a variety of positions =3D before that.=3D20 Too, I'm in my 2nd term (the last was for 4 years, about 10 years ago) =3D as=3D20 President of the Organists' Association, and have been the only =3D clergyman=3D20 actively involved for my 41 years in the Association. I've been a =3D Committee=3D20 member for about 17 years. Yes, I know both sides. And that's why&nbsp;I = =3D think=3D20 it essential to have a good, if you like a heart-to-heart understanding = =3D between=3D20 clergy and musicians. </DIV> <DIV>I've probably now said far more than my 2c worth, so if I've =3D offended=3D20 anyone at all, or sound ignorant of your actual situations, the latter =3D is most=3D20 likely, and the former most probable, that's probably perfectly=3D20 normal.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;:-)</DIV> <DIV>Much love to all (Yaayyy!!!!)</DIV> <DIV>Ross (in New Zealand)</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3D3Dltr=3D20 style=3D3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px = =3D solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2><B>-----Original =3D Message-----</B><BR><B>From:=3D20 </B><A href=3D3D"mailto:quilisma@socal.rr.com">quilisma@socal.rr.com</A> = =3D &lt;<A=3D20 =3D href=3D3D"mailto:quilisma@socal.rr.com">quilisma@socal.rr.com</A>&gt;<BR><B= =3D >To:=3D20 </B>PipeChat &lt;<A=3D20 =3D href=3D3D"mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org">pipechat@pipechat.org</A>&gt;<BR><B= =3D >Date:=3D20 </B>31 October 2001 13:53<BR><B>Subject: </B>Re: Membership in the=3D20 parish<BR><BR></DIV></FONT>&nbsp;=3D20 <P><A href=3D3D"mailto:Innkawgneeto@cs.com">Innkawgneeto@cs.com</A> =3D wrote:=3D20 <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3D3D"CITE"> <BLOCKQUOTE=3D20 style=3D3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff = =3D 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"=3D20 TYPE=3D3D"CITE"><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D3D-1>If = the =3D musician can=3D20 do the job and doesn't get involved in any public activity=3D20 inimical</FONT></FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT =3D size=3D3D-1>to the=3D20 image of the church then that's it so far as I am=3D20 concerned</FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>I'm not sure I even = =3D like the=3D20 sound of THAT ...=3D20 <P>I owe the church 40 hours a week, and they owe me a wage and =3D benefits in=3D20 return. That's a lease agreement, NOT a purchase contract. They =3D haven't BOUGHT=3D20 me. They have LEASED my services.=3D20 <P>What I do beyond those 40 hours a week is none of their concern, =3D PERIOD.=3D20 <P>Unfortunately, churches have managed to get themselves exempted =3D from most=3D20 anti-discrimination laws, as well as not paying into unemployment = and=3D20 disability funds.=3D20 <P>It seems to me we should have at LEAST one, if not both of the =3D above ...=3D20 employment protection AND/OR unemployment and disability benefits. At = =3D present=3D20 we have neither. Most churches in most states can fire us on a whim or = =3D any=3D20 pretext they choose.=3D20 <P>I find it REAL interesting that alcoholic priests with multiple =3D DWIs never=3D20 seem to lose THEIR jobs, and that's a public scandal / public SAFETY =3D issue.=3D20 <P>I WASN'T so hard-nosed for about 35-40 years of my 50-year career =3D .... then=3D20 I woke up one morning old and scary and decided it was time I STARTED, = =3D for my=3D20 OWN well-being.=3D20 <P>Am I bitter about my experiences? YOU BET!=3D20 <P>But I STILL get a thrill out of starting the processional hymn on =3D Sunday=3D20 morning, or an anthem well-sung after hours and hours of hard work. It = =3D would=3D20 be nice to be THANKED once in awhile, but no matter ... the choir and = =3D I know=3D20 when we do well.=3D20 <P>Church membership? Ehhh ... if I wasn't an organist I'd probably =3D never set=3D20 foot in a church again, EVER.=3D20 <P>Cheers,=3D20 <P>Bud </P></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0015_01C1621A.1EA6BC80--      
(back) Subject: Re: Re[4]: Membership in the parish From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 21:03:48 EST     --part1_ca.eb9513.2910b604_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 10/30/01 7:16:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, Innkawgneeto@cs.com writes:     > Church music is more than a job. It's more than music. It's also being =   > sensitive to God's leading in a particular worship experience. >   I'm sure that God is able to lead even the unbeliever. He seems to have = the "all-powerful" thing down pretty well. In some cases, this is how He = makes His first contact with the unbeliever.   I've known some athiests who were amazingly seemingly responsive to the inspiration of the Spirit.   Please visit the NEWLY RENOVATED Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi     --part1_ca.eb9513.2910b604_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 10/30/01 7:16:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, Innkawgneeto@cs.com writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Church music is = more than a job. &nbsp;It's more than music. &nbsp;It's also being = sensitive to God's leading in a particular worship experience. = &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>I'm sure that God is able to lead even the unbeliever. &nbsp;He seems = to have the "all-powerful" thing down pretty well. &nbsp;&nbsp;In some = cases, this is how He makes His first contact with the unbeliever. <BR> <BR>I've known some athiests who were amazingly seemingly responsive to = the inspiration of the Spirit. <BR> <BR>Please visit the NEWLY RENOVATED Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/ <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Duncan, Miles, Molly, and Dewi <BR></FONT></HTML>   --part1_ca.eb9513.2910b604_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Liszt From: "Glenda" <gksjd85@access.aic-fl.com> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 19:28:54 -0600   Can anyone enlighten me as to the following:   (1) What are the temporal relations between the 6 consolations for piano = and their equivalent for organ (or at least 4, 5, and 6, which I have found in Liszt organ volumes)? Which version came first? Did Liszt do both?   (2) Along the lines of this inquiry, were the consolations or their = organic equivalent composed later in Liszt's life, i.e., during his time as abbe? Was the B-A-C-H in younger years?   Thanks,   Glenda Sutton        
(back) Subject: Re: Re[4]: Membership in the parish From: <Bobmac36@aol.com> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 22:01:39 EST   I vote for Roger Brown. In my 40+ years as an organist-choir director, I =   have never (well, hardly ever) had time to hear much of the spoken word except to get a feeling for the direction of the service so that I can = play accordingly. For starters, I don't have hymn pistons. I set new pistons every week for almost every stanza, and then when it's time for the = opening hymn on Sunday morning, and the church is only half full, I reset as much = as possible during the Call to Worship so that the organ won't drown out the congregation. I'm watching the words in the bulletin but not hearing = because I'm too busy with the organ. The same for the Gloria Patri - changes = made during the confession. Then how shall I improvise the children to the = front of the church for their time with the preacher - shall I use a cascade of chimes, or some happy flutes as they skip down the aisle - or a funny = little reed to peak their interest. At the same time I have to think about = starting the improvisation in the key of the Gloria Patri - it changes from week to =   week (same music but different keys to tie in with key of opening hymn), = and it has to go to the key of the anthem which follows - so that it's a = seamless flow of music. The whole service is that way. And when the sermon = begins, I have to go over everything that has previously happened - every blip - = every wonderful moment - and then try to catch a few phrases of the sermon, determining at the last few seconds how much organ I should use for the introduction to the closing hymn. IMHO there is no time for prayer - not while I'm doing my job to the best of my ability. If YOU are spending a = lot of time participating in the worship, may I suggest that your music might = not be quite as good as it should/could be? We're working, guys, playing, = not praying, (well, hardly ever). Huh?