PipeChat Digest #2385 - Tuesday, September 18, 2001
 
Re: 32 ft Resultants (correction)
  by "Bruce Miles" <bruce@gbmuk.fsnet.co.uk>
God is NOT punishing the US
  by "Cheryl Hart" <info@copemanhart.co.uk>
Re: "lifestyle"
  by "Mike Gettelman" <mike3247@earthlink.net>
Re: Pipe Chat Digest #2383 9/17/01
  by "alpat5" <alpat5@bellatlantic.net>
Re: the worst in NYC
  by "John Vanderlee" <jovanderlee@vassar.edu>
Re: PipeChat Digest #2383 - 09/17/01
  by "John Vanderlee" <jovanderlee@vassar.edu>
ALL READ
  by "Administrator" <admin@pipechat.org>
Re: "lifestyle"
  by "jch" <opus1100@catoe.org>
Crude Comments
  by <Wurlibird1@aol.com>
Many Thanks To You All!  Re: The Show Went On
  by <ScottFop@aol.com>
Re: Crude Comments
  by "Marika E. Buchberger, LRPS" <marika57@earthlink.net>
Re: the worst in NYC
  by "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au>
Re: Crude Comments
  by "Leah Smith" <gregsmithandleah@earthlink.net>
Theatre Organ Additions
  by "William T. Van Pelt" <bill@organsociety.org>
Re: the worst in NYC
  by "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au>
Re: AOL 6.0 problems
  by "Malcolm Wechsler" <manderusa@earthlink.net>
Aid to New Yorkers
  by <Wurlibird1@aol.com>
RE: Bible Reading
  by "Storandt, Peter" <pstorandt@okcu.edu>
 

(back) Subject: Re: 32 ft Resultants (correction) From: "Bruce Miles" <bruce@gbmuk.fsnet.co.uk> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:09:18 +0100   John is right --   In a real organ resultants cannot actually occur in the air space, = however large, as there are no non-linear elements (barring loose panels and such) to produce them. They can only arise by being re-constructed by the ear-brain aural sensory mechanism. In an amplifier/loudspeaker set up = system non-linearity will produce resultants but in a good system these will be = at an extremely low level and in any case will not be radiated by the = speakers or propagated through the air space.   So in every case the resultant can only be detected by inference which process must vary in effectiveness from one listener to another. No doubt other resultants including the 16 ft tone are also inferred to some extent in a full combination. The requirement seems to be that the 16 and 8 ft = etc. tones can be as rich as reedy as you like but the mutation sub-quint must = be pure and not too loud or you will hear this pitch separately and the whole effect fall to pieces.   I listen in a room 16ft x 12 ft with a pair of monitor speakers at eye = level about 5 ft away. No doubt the response has fallen away at 16ft bottom C = (32 hz) and a 16 ft Bourdon is only just audible. But a 16ft reed is loud and clear because the ear is recontructing the fundamental from the harmonics = it can hear. It is also a fact that the Bourdon seems more 'there' when accompanied by an 8ft flute (its second harmonic) and non-discordant = manual chords. Similarly I can 'hear' the 32 ft resultant though I know its not actually there. The effect, at least to me, is plain enough on the sound clip on my website misc page. This theoretical discussion is all very well but it's what you actually hear that matters which is why I posted this clip.   For a soft 32 ft, resultants seem to be less effective. The best real 32ft = I have 'heard' is the Compton accoustic cube on the BBC broadcasting House organ - you don't hear it, you just feel it through the soles of your shoes - magic.   Bruce Miles     mail to:- bruce@gbmuk.fsnet.co.uk website:- www.gbmuk.fsnet.co.uk     ----- Original Message ----- From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>   Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 2:32 AM   > "Ross Wards" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> wrote: > > > , you could never hear the effect of a 32ft resultant at home, > > as the standing-wave of a 32ft pipe is about 40ft - you need to be = that > > distance away to hear the bottom note!   > > While this is true of a real 32' stop, such as a 32' Double Open Wood, > Contra Violone, Sub Bourdon or Contra Trombone, a 32' Resultant does not > actually need to produce any 32' standing waves. The only standing = waves > are from the 16' and 10.2/3' that create it, and it works by a trick of the > ear. Of course, in a very small room you won't get the 16' and 10.2/3' > standing waves either, and in that case you won't hear the resultant either. > > John Speller      
(back) Subject: God is NOT punishing the US From: "Cheryl Hart" <info@copemanhart.co.uk> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 11:27:26 +0100   I do not know the atheists' perspective on this tragedy, but God is not responsible for it. He is not punishing anyone. It is the work of evil men - under the influence of Satan who would wish us to believe that God = is responsible.   God may allow disasters but he does not cause them. Most of Mankind has neglected or rejected God and by doing this Mankind has allowed Evil to creep in and take control. Christ promised He would return and take to heaven those who love Him/God, those who have done their best to live up = to the knowledge of God that they have. At that time, the wicked and all = evil will be destroyed, forever. I was brought up to believe that this will happen before the world can destroy itself.   Perhaps that time has come and those of us who profess to be Christians should be looking in our own hearts - not allowing ourselves to become senselessly angry, nor self-righteous, acting like hypocrites, slavering = at the mouth and pointing the finger of blame at anyone else, or any group: = I am ashamed of such so-called Christians of whichever denomination. It is =   for God to judge, not us. In the meantime, God says we should love one another as He has loved us.   God bless America - and the rest of us.   Cheryl      
(back) Subject: Re: "lifestyle" From: "Mike Gettelman" <mike3247@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 07:02:07 -0400   Hi Tim, I think I disagree with the bumper sticker. Ignorance is so very = painful to me, that I work tirelessly continuing to educate myself. If ignorance is recognized, it provides a powerful incentive to learn. I think what needs = to be painful is bigotry, hatred. Godlessness, cruelty, and narrow mindedness. = When one takes a position that involves these things without knowing the facts, = they become the lowest form of humanity, and a real danger to us all. just my $.02 Mike   Tim Bovard wrote:   > At 10:37 PM 9/17/01 -0400, you wrote: > <much snipped> > >Is ignorance a lifestyle? > > I'm reminded of a bumpersticker I saw once and have never forgotten. = How > unfortunate that its legend is not actually true -- if so, perhaps = numerous > notable events of the past few days would not have ever occurred. > > "TOO BAD THAT IGNORANCE ISN'T PAINFUL" > > TMB > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org    
(back) Subject: Re: Pipe Chat Digest #2383 9/17/01 From: "alpat5" <alpat5@bellatlantic.net> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 07:35:44 -0400   Dear John, Such language is not only unnecessary, but gravely wrong. This is by far the nadir of the entire debate. In Jonathan's post he asked those who wish to respond to his questions to do so. Those of us who disagree with him simply wrote what we believed about the matter. I believe you should apologize to the list member you called those absolutely despicable names. Just because you intensely disagree with someone does not give you the right to insult them in such a baleful manner publicly. This is not what Christ has taught us. Through your own rash actions you have in some ways compromised the arguments of others on this list who, although disagree just as much as you, never stooped to such a level. Notice carefully that the hate and bigotry you so vehemently talk about ( in many cases you are correct) is no where better exemplified on this than in your own actions. Perhaps, filled with rage, you weren't thinking correctly? I can't really be sure if you meant what you said. We ALL make statements we regret! I am willing to forgive you :-)        
(back) Subject: Re: the worst in NYC From: "John Vanderlee" <jovanderlee@vassar.edu> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:16:16 -0700   > We don't need negativity any more than anybody else on this list, >we're already getting enough of it. > > If we must, must MUST bash someone else to feel better about >ourselves as musicians, how about a rotating schedule to allow for >healing? Could we please switch to bashing zither players for a >little while?   Well... I was at a German Restaurant last week and the musician was alternating between an (eletronic) organ and a zither. Quite pleasant, actually. Food was good too.   John V       --  
(back) Subject: Re: PipeChat Digest #2383 - 09/17/01 From: "John Vanderlee" <jovanderlee@vassar.edu> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:23:13 -0700   >In a message dated 9/17/2001 11:49:18 PM Central Daylight Time, >pipechat@pipechat.org writes: > >>On the contrary, John,.... read this!!!! >> >> Anyone who has heard of the cities of "Sodom and Gommorah" knows = that >>they >> were notorious hotbeds of homosexuality. Gen 19:5-8 >> > > >Yeah, well you and FARTWELL can suck ********....... which I'm sure >is exactly what you want.... you narrow minded and sick *******.     Just think, a few weeks ago I thought this was the "kinder gentler list" .   Gentlemen (I'm using this term lightly) PLEASE TAKE THIS ELSEWHERE!!   Thank you.   John V       --  
(back) Subject: ALL READ From: "Administrator" <admin@pipechat.org> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 07:24:15 -0500   Good morning Folks   One week ago this morning the United States was under attack by terrorists and I think we have all been in a state of shock, grief and anger ever since then. We, the Administrators of this list, have tried to allow those people on this list to post their feelings and in some cases those feelings were very angry. But, in a way I hope that has allowed the people concerned to be able to work through their feelings about the situation. And I have been very PROUD of the way that all of you have handled all of this.   Yesterday there was a post that resulted in a somewhat theological discussion regarding statements made by a couple of religious leaders blaming all of the happenings of last week on various groups in this country. Basically that God was 'punishing" us. As part of that discussion late last night one person went somewhat ballistic and posting something that was revolting to all of us and not in good taste. That person has been removed from the list.   Although, we are all still being surrounded by the on going coverage of the events of last week and we are all still having all sorts of feelings, anger, sadness, grief I feel that it is time for us to move on, at least on the list. I would like to see us move back to topics that are much more closely related to the purpose of the list. I know that there are many of you that still have very strong feelings about what has happened during the past week but I would suggest at this point that you find other outlets to deal with those feelings and keep them off of this list.   I would now like to request that we all get back to HAPPY PipeChatting   David  
(back) Subject: Re: "lifestyle" From: "jch" <opus1100@catoe.org> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:50:48 -0500   At 07:02 AM 9/18/01 -0400, you wrote: > I think I disagree with the bumper sticker. Ignorance is so very > painful to >me, that I work tirelessly continuing to educate myself.   I am reminded of saying "Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise"...however if this was the case their would be many more dying of cancer and other curable maladies..so it is more likely the folly to be happy in your ignorance.   What is really hurtful is the intolerance of folks who really need not be concerned by how others live their lives.   jch    
(back) Subject: Crude Comments From: <Wurlibird1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:04:27 EDT   A post reads:     >Yeah, well you and FARTWELL can suck my fat c***........ which I'm sure = is >exactly what you want.... you narrow minded and sick F***. <<   This is inexcusable. I would expect to find such a comment on an AOL = Message Board but not here. What is more regettable is that the List = Administrator is having to monitor postings as though a teacher watching over children = at recess.   Even lighthearted responses to recent posting seem unable to divert the passions of those who now see fit to use this list to advance their = personal, social or political agendas. I think it safe to say that the = preponderance of listers have absolutely no desire to be apprised of the genital = gymnastics of others, regardless of gender preference.   Jim Pitts                
(back) Subject: Many Thanks To You All! Re: The Show Went On From: <ScottFop@aol.com> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:07:52 EDT     --part1_ad.10851908.28d8af38_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Having now returned home from Buffalo I wish to thank each and every one = of you for your support, encouragement and attendance at the theatre organ concerts which were performed over the course of this past weekend. I = know that in addition to the concert at Shea's which I played, specifically, Jelani Eddington played in Rochester Saturday evening, Tom Hazleton played = in Alabama Sunday afternoon and there were other concerts as well in Syracuse =   and other locations throughout the country. Word has gotten back that = Jelani and Tom both played fabulous concerts. Bravo guys!   Getting to Buffalo was a bit frightening and frustrating on Friday in the wake of the events which befell our country last Tuesday. Having called = US Airways 5 times Thursday and in the wee hours of Friday morning I was = assured that my flight to Buffalo was scheduled to fly and on time. Needless to = say after arriving at the airport at 6 am for a 9:45 flight, and after several =   Buffalo flights were cancelled due to crews not showing up in Charlotte, I =   finally and thankfully got to Buffalo at almost 9 pm. My personal goal = was not the trip or even the organ so much as the ability to be able to play music to listeners who needed something besides grim news casts.   I was delighted to speak with Jelani last week prior to our performances about how we as musicians could bring our audiences into both a spirit of patriotism and, hopefully, bring some musical healing to all of the hurt = and fear that we have all experienced these past days. I know that he and I = both played patriotic selections and I am sure Tom and others did as well. It = was so rewarding to see an enthusiastic audience on their feet applauding = after the Star Spangled Banner and God Bless America. This is just what we all needed!   As I sit here at my own comfortable PC in my own home, I now realize how = much I really needed that little 3 day trip myself. The past 6 weeks have been =   interesting to say the least with the Shrine occurrences, relocating unexpectedly to North Carolina (at least for the time being) and then the terrorism last week. The camaraderie of friends and colleagues and the mighty Shea's Wurlitzer (which is HOT!!!!) brought much joy, serenity, laughter and happiness back into my life.   It is indeed a marvelous thought to know that at least three of the = mightiest Wurlitzers sang forth triumphantly this past weekend to audiences that = were able to listen to the music largely of our country and its composers in = the relaxed, pleasant and beautiful surroundings of the mammoth movie palaces = in which the organs are housed.   In closing, my heartfelt thanks all of you friends and performing = colleagues for keeping music alive and continuing in our land during a time when we really need it.   God bless!   Scott F. Foppiano   --part1_ad.10851908.28d8af38_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT COLOR=3D"#0000a0" = SIZE=3D2>Having now returned home from Buffalo I wish to thank each and = every one of you for your support, encouragement and attendance at the = theatre organ concerts which were performed over the course of this past = weekend. &nbsp;I know that in addition to the concert at Shea's which I = played, specifically, Jelani Eddington played in Rochester Saturday = evening, Tom Hazleton played in Alabama Sunday afternoon and there were = other concerts as well in Syracuse and other locations throughout the = country. &nbsp;Word has gotten back that Jelani and Tom both played = fabulous concerts. &nbsp;Bravo guys! <BR> <BR>Getting to Buffalo was a bit frightening and frustrating on Friday in = the wake of the events which befell our country last Tuesday. &nbsp;Having = called US Airways 5 times Thursday and in the wee hours of Friday morning = I was assured that my flight to Buffalo was scheduled to fly and on time. = &nbsp;Needless to say after arriving at the airport at 6 am for a 9:45 = flight, and after several Buffalo flights were cancelled due to crews not = showing up in Charlotte, I finally and thankfully got to Buffalo at almost = 9 pm. &nbsp;My personal goal was not the trip or even the organ so much as = the ability to be able to play music to listeners who needed something = besides grim news casts. <BR> <BR>I was delighted to speak with Jelani last week prior to our = performances about how we as musicians could bring our audiences into both = a spirit of patriotism and, hopefully, bring some musical healing to all = of the hurt and fear that we have all experienced these past days. &nbsp;I = know that he and I both played patriotic selections and I am sure Tom and = others did as well. &nbsp;It was so rewarding to see an enthusiastic = audience on their feet applauding after the Star Spangled Banner and God = Bless America. &nbsp;This is just what we all needed! <BR> <BR>As I sit here at my own comfortable PC in my own home, I now realize = how much I really needed that little 3 day trip myself. &nbsp;The past 6 = weeks have been interesting to say the least with the Shrine occurrences, = relocating unexpectedly to North Carolina (at least for the time being) = and then the terrorism last week. &nbsp;The camaraderie of friends and = colleagues and the mighty Shea's Wurlitzer (which is HOT!!!!) brought much = joy, serenity, laughter and happiness back into my life. <BR> <BR>It is indeed a marvelous thought to know that at least three of the = mightiest Wurlitzers sang forth triumphantly this past weekend to = audiences that were able to listen to the music largely of our country and = its composers in the relaxed, pleasant and beautiful surroundings of the = mammoth movie palaces in which the organs are housed. <BR> <BR>In closing, my heartfelt thanks all of you friends and performing = colleagues for keeping music alive and continuing in our land during a = time when we really need it. <BR> <BR>God bless! <BR> <BR>Scott F. Foppiano</FONT></HTML>   --part1_ad.10851908.28d8af38_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Crude Comments From: "Marika E. Buchberger, LRPS" <marika57@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:10:50 -0400   I think at this point, at least for a "while", the list administrator(s) = will have to monitor and REMOVE all messages that have nothing to do with this = list.   Wurlibird1@aol.com wrote:   > A post reads: > > >Yeah, well you and FARTWELL can suck my fat c***........ which I'm sure = is > >exactly what you want.... you narrow minded and sick F***. << > > This is inexcusable. I would expect to find such a comment on an AOL = Message > Board but not here. What is more regettable is that the List = Administrator > is having to monitor postings as though a teacher watching over children = at > recess. > > Even lighthearted responses to recent posting seem unable to divert the > passions of those who now see fit to use this list to advance their = personal, > social or political agendas. I think it safe to say that the = preponderance > of listers have absolutely no desire to be apprised of the genital = gymnastics > of others, regardless of gender preference. > > Jim Pitts > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org   -- ***************************************************** Healthcare references for everyone. "Recipient of the year 2000 Featured Site Award at healthAtoZ.com" http://home.earthlink.net/~marika57/m_erika.html   Internet Safety Lessons. Must reading for everyone. http://home.earthlink.net/~marika57/safetylessons.html *****************************************************      
(back) Subject: Re: the worst in NYC From: "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 22:02:41 +0800   (GROAN) Oh no! Not another off-topic unwinnable argument, please. Take it somewhere else! Bob E.   David Scribner wrote: > > >Please remember that this is a list for organists, not gays.... please = take    
(back) Subject: Re: Crude Comments From: "Leah Smith" <gregsmithandleah@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 07:13:32 -0700   Hello Wurlibird...I have to agree with you. I think this type of chat is = rather childish and disgusting. I thought this was a list about pipe organs. = Boy was I ever wrong. Too bad. Good luck. Greg Smith   Wurlibird1@aol.com wrote:   > A post reads: > > >Yeah, well you and FARTWELL can suck my fat c***........ which I'm sure = is > >exactly what you want.... you narrow minded and sick F***. << > > This is inexcusable. I would expect to find such a comment on an AOL = Message > Board but not here. What is more regettable is that the List = Administrator > is having to monitor postings as though a teacher watching over children = at > recess. > > Even lighthearted responses to recent posting seem unable to divert the > passions of those who now see fit to use this list to advance their = personal, > social or political agendas. I think it safe to say that the = preponderance > of listers have absolutely no desire to be apprised of the genital = gymnastics > of others, regardless of gender preference. > > Jim Pitts > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org        
(back) Subject: Theatre Organ Additions From: "William T. Van Pelt" <bill@organsociety.org> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:17:19 -0400   New theatre organ CDs and VHS videos are now on the opening page of the = OHS Catalog http://www.ohscatalog.org Organists on the new titles include Lyn Larsen, Robert Salisbury, Dave Wickerham, Clark Wilson, Donald Mackenzie, Phil Kelsall, John Mann, and John Ogden. There is also a $4.99 CD from Gaylord Carter in the special collection of $5 CDs from Delos.   Bill    
(back) Subject: Re: the worst in NYC From: "Bob Elms" <elmsr@albanyis.com.au> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 22:09:51 +0800   Didgeridooists!!!! Fair dinkum! B.E.   Adrianne Schutt wrote: > > Or didjeriwhatsitists?    
(back) Subject: Re: AOL 6.0 problems From: "Malcolm Wechsler" <manderusa@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:23:10 -0400   Wow! How on earth did you manage to find that? After many totally frustrating phone conversations, which followed many totally frustrating e-mail exchanges with AOL "techs," in which they kept saying over and = over: "We know there is a problem and we are working on it," I finally signed on to PipOrg-L with a new address, one of those (above) that are available = with our Cable Modem. PipOrg-L was the most sensitive to all the HTML and line feed symbol problems, but I also redid Pipechat at the same time, and = there has been no trouble that I am aware of. Many AOL 6.0 users will thank you!   Cheers,   Malcolm Wechsler   ----- Original Message ----- > I also object to HTML posts. :) Plain text only please. See > this url for directions on how to do this with AOL 6.0: > > http://members.aol.com/adamkb/aol/mailfaq/#aol6html > > Have fun! > Ad ;-> >    
(back) Subject: Aid to New Yorkers From: <Wurlibird1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:31:01 EDT   Greetings,   Let me share with you a very positive story originating out of central = Texas for the relief workers in New York. Last Friday, our small radio station = in Waco began a crusade to collect work gloves for those digging in the = rubble in Lower Manhattan. It was intended to be a one day event but response was so outpouring that = the event was extended through the weekend and culminated late yesterday. = Here are the results:   15-thousand pair of work gloves Several hundred pair of steel toed work boots Steel insoles for work shoes Over 12-hundred bunker coats (firemen's gear) for workers Hundreds of hard hats Flashlights, batteries Thousands of dollars in donations for rescue gear   This project literally snowballed and our small staff was inundated within =   hours. We obtained invaluable help from Veterans Information Radio personnel, three VFW posts, and other volunteers.........and its still = going on at this hour.   A convoy of trucks left Waco last night, bound for NYC and should arrive sometime Thursday. Consolidated Freight, a nationwide trucking company, donated their vehicles and drivers to haul the cargo to the areas of need, = To be saluted as the primary contributors are the nation's truckers who traveled Interstate-35. Word spread through their network like wildfire = and many, many truckers donated their personal gloves, all of which are in serviceable condition.   This has been a most humbling and rewarding experience. There are many = who cannot assist in any other way but chose to participate in this effort. = It speaks volumes on the compassion felt nationwide for the tragedies in New York and Washington, DC.   This has nothing to do with organs, admittedly. But perhaps it does. The =   heart is an organ and never was it larger and more open to others here in Central Texas. I am honored to have had such a small part in what has = become a giant project.   Best wishes, Jim Pitts KWOW-FM Waco, Texas  
(back) Subject: RE: Bible Reading From: "Storandt, Peter" <pstorandt@okcu.edu> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 09:33:37 -0500   Check your truck for dents, David....   -----Original Message----- From: David Scribner [mailto:david@blackiris.com] Sent: Monday, September 17, 2001 10:01 PM To: PipeChat Subject: Re: Bible Reading     >Of course one should NEVER lie with a man as one lies with a woman. > >You ALWAYS tell your buddies the truth. >You think a guy is gonna tell his wife EVERYTHING? >Heck, guys HAVE to lie with women: > >"No, honey, you don't look fat in that, you look GREAT," or >"No, dear, four hundred dollars is perfectly reasonable for a pair of shoes." >When you lie with a man, it's different: >"No, man, that dent was in your pickup when I borrowed it," or >"Heck, I never TOUCHED your sister, I took her directly home to your folks."   LOLOL!!!!!!!   "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org