PipeChat Digest #3020 - Wednesday, August 7, 2002
 
Re: Gravissima
  by <DarrylbytheSea@aol.com>
qualifying buyers AND sellers
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
RE: Gravissima
  by "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org>
RE: qualifying buyers AND sellers
  by "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org>
spacing of keys on a manual, more information, more questions
  by "Ray Kimber" <ray@kimber.com>
RE: spacing of keys on a manual, more information, more questions
  by "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org>
Kilgen Organs
  by "Lisette Ehrat" <lisette@papadocs.com>
Resultants: doing them "right"
  by <TubaMagna@aol.com>
Re: qualifying buyers AND sellers
  by <TubaMagna@aol.com>
RE: qualifying buyers AND sellers
  by "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org>
Re: PipeChat Digest #3017 - 08/07/02
  by <Chicaleee@aol.com>
Re: bringing a Wurlitzer reed organ to A=3D440
  by <Chicaleee@aol.com>
Re: qualifying buyers AND sellers
  by "Paul Valtos" <chercapa@enter.net>
Re: Kilgen Organs
  by "Lisette Ehrat" <lisette@papadocs.com>
Moller Artistes
  by "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net>
Re: Kilgen Organs
  by "jon bertschinger" <jonberts@magiccablepc.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Gravissima From: <DarrylbytheSea@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 12:22:14 EDT     --part1_ea.2bcc8331.2a82a336_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Hey, David.   When I played at St. Patrick's in NYC a few weeks ago, I noticed there was = a gravissima '64 on the pedal. It didn't shake, rattle or roll all that = much, but I did use it when the final note was in the middle of the pedal board. = I never have liked resultants and try to avoid them in the lower notes since =   it's just not a clean sound to my ear.   I have no idea how it was derived or anything about it, but it was my = first experience with that stop and that pitch. File this note in the "for = whatever it's worth category!"   Yours,   Darryl by the Sea   --part1_ea.2bcc8331.2a82a336_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>Hey, David. <BR> <BR>When I played at St. Patrick's in NYC a few weeks ago, I noticed there = was a gravissima '64 on the pedal. It didn't shake, rattle or roll all = that much, but I did use it when the final note was in the middle of the = pedal board. I never have liked resultants and try to avoid them in the = lower notes since it's just not a clean sound to my ear. <BR> <BR>I have no idea how it was derived or anything about it, but it was my = first experience with that stop and that pitch. File this note in the "for = whatever it's worth category!" <BR> <BR>Yours, <BR> <BR>Darryl by the Sea</FONT></HTML>   --part1_ea.2bcc8331.2a82a336_boundary--  
(back) Subject: qualifying buyers AND sellers From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Wed, 07 Aug 2002 09:26:51 -0700   Arp, I hear what you're saying, of course ... and we've had this conversation before (grin).   But That's The Way Things Are. And perhaps that IS a "Catch-22" situation for small shops who can't AFFORD to make detailed proposals for every church who rings you up with an initial inquiry.   If ANYBODY has any concrete suggestions as to HOW one would move an organ committee and an organ-builder around this seeming impasse, I'd be happy to hear them, even though my own project HAS moved beyond it. It seems to me it's a SIGNIFICANT problem in the whole process.   I do have to say that we DID get three detailed, concrete bids from the three builders we selected in the last round. Two of them were from large enough shops that it probably WASN'T a great outlay of time, as standard templates and scales could probably be used, for the most part; I imagine that the third one DID require a significant amount of time, as I don't think he had access to computer-driven design equipment.   I don't expect the builder to hold the price TO THE PENNY, and neither does my committee, if an act of God intervenes, or civil war in Peru sends the price of tin through the roof, or a major supplier of computer chips goes bankrupt, etc. ... I think a certain margin is built into the contract for that, as it was for the construction of the church building.   But please let's DO pursue this discussion, as it DOES have SIGNIFICANT impact on the sale of pipe organs.   Cheers,   Bud    
(back) Subject: RE: Gravissima From: "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 12:33:28 -0400   This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.   ------_=3D_NextPart_001_01C23E30.291F3AA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1"   I didn't intend to make the "rumble" sound like it was a complaint, in = fact, it was quite exciting and somewhat scarry to have a structure that size = (the entire cathedral, that is) just gently rumble. It's a similar feeling, if you live in NYC you'll understand what I am about to refer to, it's = similar to when a heavy tracktor trailer goes by your apartment building or when = the subway passes under the structure you are sitting it. Anyway I guess it's personal and whatever it's worth. -----Original Message----- From: DarrylbytheSea@aol.com [mailto:DarrylbytheSea@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 12:22 PM To: pipechat@pipechat.org Subject: Re: Gravissima     Hey, David.   When I played at St. Patrick's in NYC a few weeks ago, I noticed there was = a gravissima '64 on the pedal. It didn't shake, rattle or roll all that = much, but I did use it when the final note was in the middle of the pedal board. = I never have liked resultants and try to avoid them in the lower notes since it's just not a clean sound to my ear.   I have no idea how it was derived or anything about it, but it was my = first experience with that stop and that pitch. File this note in the "for whatever it's worth category!"   Yours,   Darryl by the Sea   ------_=3D_NextPart_001_01C23E30.291F3AA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1"   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; = charset=3Diso-8859-1">     <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4916.2300" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY> <DIV><SPAN class=3D883282916-07082002><FONT face=3D"Footlight MT Light" color=3D#800000>I didn't intend to make the "rumble" sound like it was a complaint, in fact, it was quite exciting and somewhat scarry&nbsp;to have = a structure that size (the entire cathedral, that is) just gently rumble. = It's a similar feeling, if you live in NYC you'll understand what I am about to = refer to, it's similar to when a heavy tracktor trailer goes by your apartment building or when the subway passes under the structure you are sitting it. =   Anyway I guess it's personal and whatever it's worth.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=3D883282916-07082002><FONT face=3D"Footlight MT Light" color=3D#800000></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=3D883282916-07082002></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT = face=3DTahoma size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> DarrylbytheSea@aol.com =   [mailto:DarrylbytheSea@aol.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, August 07, 2002 = 12:22 PM<BR><B>To:</B> pipechat@pipechat.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Gravissima<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT = size=3D2>Hey, David. <BR><BR>When I played at St. Patrick's in NYC a few weeks ago, I = noticed there was a gravissima '64 on the pedal. It didn't shake, rattle or roll = all that much, but I did use it when the final note was in the middle of the = pedal board. I never have liked resultants and try to avoid them in the lower = notes since it's just not a clean sound to my ear. <BR><BR>I have no idea how it = was derived or anything about it, but it was my first experience with that = stop and that pitch. File this note in the "for whatever it's worth category!" <BR><BR>Yours, <BR><BR>Darryl by the Sea</FONT> </FONT></BODY></HTML>   ------_=3D_NextPart_001_01C23E30.291F3AA0--  
(back) Subject: RE: qualifying buyers AND sellers From: "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 12:38:37 -0400   Let me make an offer. To all and any organ builder who would like to build an organ in my apartment for demonstrations you are welcome to come do so. Don't be so quick to reply. Think about it. You will realize that having your prospective clients come over and try out the instrument would be to your advantage. RBC  
(back) Subject: spacing of keys on a manual, more information, more questions From: "Ray Kimber" <ray@kimber.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 10:44:32 -0600   Dear List,   Thank you to the folks who have previously responded about the width of = the sharp keys.   I haven't been able to locate any definitive spec from the ISO or the ISO (Although <laughing> I was inititially thinking that ISO stood for International Standards Ogranization, I now also know about the International Society of Organbuilders)   Here is one interesting link that I discovered   http://www.bikexprt.com/music/introduc.htm   I am still wondering if there is "standard" set of specs that define the keyboard.   Kind regards,   Ray Kimber   ray@kimber.com      
(back) Subject: RE: spacing of keys on a manual, more information, more questions From: "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 12:47:23 -0400   I remember somewhere, and not over the rainbow, seeing specs that AGO put out. Did you know AGO puts out, ba-boom tssss! Seriously though, I can't seem to find them. Don't these include manual spec? I can't believe that they DON'T exist? RBC =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D   I am still wondering if there is "standard" set of specs that define the keyboard.   Kind regards,   Ray Kimber    
(back) Subject: Kilgen Organs From: "Lisette Ehrat" <lisette@papadocs.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 12:31:13 -0500   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0015_01C23E0E.5151BA10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   What can anyone tell me about the Kilgen organs. Our church has one built in 1918. Has about 10 stops or so (haven't =3D played it in a couple of years - disrepair) plus couplers. How can I tell how many ranks it really has?   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0015_01C23E0E.5151BA10 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META content=3D3D"text/html; charset=3D3Diso-8859-1" =3D http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>What can anyone tell me about the =3D Kilgen=3D20 organs.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>Our church has one built in 1918. Has = =3D about&nbsp;10=3D20 stops or so&nbsp;(haven't played it in a couple of years - disrepair) =3D plus=3D20 couplers.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>How can I tell how many ranks it = really =3D   has?</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0015_01C23E0E.5151BA10--    
(back) Subject: Resultants: doing them "right" From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 13:42:31 EDT   Just a couple of tricks:   Don't take the two pitches off of the same rank - try using a slightly lighter tone for the contraquint. Some have had success with an open wood =   for the 16' and a stopped flute for the 10-2/3', which is the way it is = often done with independent 10-2/3' stops. This was common practice in many, = many fine 19th Century American instruments (not all of them have been = scrapped, either). In the right room, a resultant off the 16' Open Wood for both pitches, = if placed in a corner against masonry, can work well. Remember that if you = have all stopped ranks in a composite tone, you have to factor in the quint of = the prime as well as the quint of the quint in the harmonic soup, and if they = are not fully tempered, you get a bit of an asthmatic sound. If the stops are divided into C and C-sharp sides, your "resultant" most =   likely will not give you any "results," as exhibited by a last-minute addition of such a resultant in a big organ here in NYC. The addition was insisted upon back in the 1960s by the dedicatory recitalist, who also insisted on the last minute addition of a Swell Vox Humana. The resultant doesn't work because the pipes in question are much too widely separated. In the 1920s and early 1930s, one could occasionally find instruments in =   which the 32' Double Open Diapason was actually 12 stopped wood 10-2/3' = pipes playing with the bottom octave of the 16' Open Wood, with seismic and convincing effect. The audience was none the wiser. The one installation = I heard in which that effect worked magnificently was methodically destroyed = by several waves of amateurs, and eventually scrapped in favor of a = substitute. 10-2/3' independently scaled and built voices have the advantage of = the ability to select the strength of the allied 16' tones. The other advantage is that the independent rank is REALLY, truly in tune, and the resultant effect purer and more on pitch. Likewise, the relative power of the quint can be adjusted to the tonal director's = liking, as opposed to settling for what is available through switching.   Sebastian Matthaus Gluck New York City  
(back) Subject: Re: qualifying buyers AND sellers From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 14:01:03 EDT   Many smaller firms give very detailed bids, right down to blueprints and scalings. We bid on a two manual instrument, submitting case drawings and engineering drawings in great detail, and a final, set price, good for = ninety days so that the church would have time to decide. The "consultant," who = was also bidding on the new organ, told the committee that our design would = not fit in their gallery, despite the detailed blueprints, and the = organist/choir director husband/wife team told me that they took his word for it, despite =   the drawings, and gave him the job. The legal issues did not seem to = bother the client or the winning businessman. On another occasion, we were sent back to the drawing board many, many =   times to refine our ideas, only to find out that our drawings and specifications were given to a rural factory builder for production. They proudly displayed our design at the Centennial Guild Convention. What is the good side to this story? More often than not, smaller firms are used as "third bids," to = satisfy the rules of a vestry or board that requires three bids. This occurs when =   the organist has a pet builder, and MUST have that organbuilder's = instrument, or nothing at all. What this usually generates is a series of really fine =   designs from smaller builders who really DO want the job, and it is at = THAT time that they are at their most creative. If smaller builders who are burned by being used as "third bids" can = see these experiences as intellectual exercises, they won't feel so bad about being used and having their time wasted. Admittedly, it requires an iron stomach and a great deal of forgiveness to look past such breaches of = ethics and decency, but if one has learned something about organbuilding and problem-solving in the process, one can try to reap some benefits.   SMG  
(back) Subject: RE: qualifying buyers AND sellers From: "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 14:11:51 -0400   It sounds pretty sleazy to me. To use someone else's designs? Iron = stomach, nothing a law suit is certainly in the calling here. I'm not a believer in suing everyone for everything. Quite the contrary but this kind of = nonsense is outright stealing. RBC   =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Many smaller firms give very detailed bids, right down to blueprints and scalings. We bid on a two manual instrument, submitting case drawings and engineering drawings in great detail, and a final, set price, good for ninety days so that the church would have time to decide. The "consultant," who was also bidding on the new organ, told the committee that our design would = not fit in their gallery, despite the detailed blueprints, and the organist/choir director husband/wife team told me that they took his word for it, despite =   the drawings, and gave him the job. The legal issues did not seem to = bother the client or the winning businessman. On another occasion, we were sent back to the drawing board many, many =   times to refine our ideas, only to find out that our drawings and specifications were given to a rural factory builder for production. They proudly displayed our design at the Centennial Guild Convention. What is the good side to this story?  
(back) Subject: Re: PipeChat Digest #3017 - 08/07/02 From: <Chicaleee@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 14:17:45 EDT     --part1_fe.1bec12b4.2a82be49_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   The Artiste would probably have been easier to get through the door than = this old WurliTzer. However, how long do you think I could practice on a pipe organ before some of the neighbors, on all 4 sides, would begin to = complain. They complain about my dog barking when she isn't here, and she never = barks inside. Someone even complained about my computer saying "You've got = mail." However, they will all go to the country jam sessions every week. Maybe = this is an opportunity for me to educate some of my neighbors about music and practice the piano more. I have the speakers on the organ turned off and = it only plays through the reeds for practicing. The only way I'll get a pipe =   organ in a home is to marry a rich man with a large house in the country. =   Phat chance. Lee   --part1_fe.1bec12b4.2a82be49_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>The Artiste would = probably have been easier to get through the door than this old WurliTzer. = &nbsp;However, how long do you think I could practice on a pipe organ = before some of the neighbors, on all 4 sides, would begin to complain. = &nbsp;They complain about my dog barking when she isn't here, and she = never barks inside. &nbsp;Someone even complained about my computer saying = "You've got mail." &nbsp;However, they will all go to the country jam = sessions every week. &nbsp;Maybe this is an opportunity for me to educate = some of my neighbors about music and practice the piano more. &nbsp;I have = the speakers on the organ turned off and it only plays through the reeds = for practicing. &nbsp;The only way I'll get a pipe organ in a home is to = marry a rich man with a large house in the country. &nbsp;Phat chance. = &nbsp;Lee</FONT></HTML>   --part1_fe.1bec12b4.2a82be49_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: bringing a Wurlitzer reed organ to A=3D440 From: <Chicaleee@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 14:26:50 EDT     --part1_8a.1c80eb46.2a82c06a_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   I have become adjusted to the fact that the organ is always going to be = flat. I have asked as many technicians as I know, and none of them want to = touch it. My son keeps a supply of old tubes in case one goes out. But, other than that, I am thankful I have it. It is not even in the same room with = the piano at this writing (I live in a 600 sq. ft. apartment, and once it is placed, it probably will stay). When we want to use a "piano" sound with = the organ, I use the keyboard. Thanks for your post and interest. Lee   --part1_8a.1c80eb46.2a82c06a_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>I have become adjusted = to the fact that the organ is always going to be flat. &nbsp;I have asked = as many technicians as I know, and none of them want to touch it. &nbsp;My = son keeps a supply of old tubes in case one goes out. &nbsp;But, other = than that, I am thankful I have it. &nbsp;It is not even in the same room = with the piano at this writing (I live in a 600 sq. ft. apartment, and = once it is placed, it probably will stay). &nbsp;When we want to use a = "piano" sound with the organ, I use the keyboard. &nbsp;Thanks for your = post and interest. &nbsp;Lee</FONT></HTML>   --part1_8a.1c80eb46.2a82c06a_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: qualifying buyers AND sellers From: "Paul Valtos" <chercapa@enter.net> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 14:23:36 -0400   Dear Sebastian, I think that the organ business has to straddle two worlds, that of = the preached goodness of organized religion and the old adage of"All is fair = and love and war and business." After spending much of my adult years as a = sales engineer, I found that I had to accept that I had to compromise between my ideals and the rough road of business. It was that same philosophy which caused my to choose a profession that pays and that of church organist = which gets 50% of its remuneration in God Bless you's. Paul ----- Original Message ----- From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> To: <quilisma@socal.rr.com>; <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 2:01 PM Subject: Re: qualifying buyers AND sellers     > Many smaller firms give very detailed bids, right down to blueprints and > scalings. > We bid on a two manual instrument, submitting case drawings and > engineering drawings in great detail, and a final, set price, good for ninety > days so that the church would have time to decide. The "consultant," = who was > also bidding on the new organ, told the committee that our design would not > fit in their gallery, despite the detailed blueprints, and the organist/choir > director husband/wife team told me that they took his word for it, = despite > the drawings, and gave him the job. The legal issues did not seem to bother > the client or the winning businessman. > On another occasion, we were sent back to the drawing board many, = many > times to refine our ideas, only to find out that our drawings and > specifications were given to a rural factory builder for production. = They > proudly displayed our design at the Centennial Guild Convention. > What is the good side to this story? > More often than not, smaller firms are used as "third bids," to satisfy > the rules of a vestry or board that requires three bids. This occurs = when > the organist has a pet builder, and MUST have that organbuilder's instrument, > or nothing at all. What this usually generates is a series of really = fine > designs from smaller builders who really DO want the job, and it is at THAT > time that they are at their most creative. > If smaller builders who are burned by being used as "third bids" can see > these experiences as intellectual exercises, they won't feel so bad = about > being used and having their time wasted. Admittedly, it requires an = iron > stomach and a great deal of forgiveness to look past such breaches of ethics > and decency, but if one has learned something about organbuilding and > problem-solving in the process, one can try to reap some benefits. > > SMG > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >    
(back) Subject: Re: Kilgen Organs From: "Lisette Ehrat" <lisette@papadocs.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 13:38:42 -0500   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_001C_01C23E17.BEE5DB20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   This Kilgen is located in South-Central Illinois, about 80 miles from =3D St. Louis. The reason I'm asking for general info on Kilgens because I = =3D would like to prepare a "paper" for the church who owns the organ. I =3D would like to develop a curiosity on their part about what it is and who = =3D made it, give them some contacts and information and hope that someday =3D someone will take a real interest in it and perhaps restore it if its =3D worthy...but that's a long, long way away for a musically uneducated, =3D congregation (they have a good reason for their lack of music, though). = =3D So, I'm trying to start small by developing an interest within. It's not = =3D really my place to tell them what to do with it at this point, I'm just = =3D trying to raise awareness. ----- Original Message -----=3D20 From: Lisette Ehrat=3D20 To: pipechat@pipechat.org=3D20 Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 12:31 PM Subject: Kilgen Organs     What can anyone tell me about the Kilgen organs. Our church has one built in 1918. Has about 10 stops or so (haven't =3D played it in a couple of years - disrepair) plus couplers. How can I tell how many ranks it really has?   ------=3D_NextPart_000_001C_01C23E17.BEE5DB20 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META content=3D3D"text/html; charset=3D3Diso-8859-1" =3D http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>This Kilgen is located in = South-Central =3D Illinois,=3D20 about 80 miles from St. Louis.&nbsp; The reason I'm asking for general =3D info on=3D20 Kilgens because I would like to prepare a "paper" for the church who =3D owns the=3D20 organ.&nbsp; I would like to develop a curiosity on their part about =3D what it is=3D20 and who made it, give them some contacts and information and hope that =3D someday=3D20 someone will take a real interest in it and perhaps restore it if its=3D20 worthy...but that's a long, long way away for a musically uneducated,=3D20 congregation (they have a good reason for their lack of music, =3D though).&nbsp;=3D20 So, I'm trying to start small by developing an interest within. It's not = =3D really=3D20 my place to tell them what to do with it at this point,&nbsp; I'm just =3D trying to=3D20 raise awareness.</FONT></DIV> <DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE=3D20 style=3D3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: = =3D 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV=3D20 style=3D3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =3D black"><B>From:</B>=3D20 <A href=3D3D"mailto:lisette@papadocs.com" =3D title=3D3Dlisette@papadocs.com>Lisette=3D20 Ehrat</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=3D20 href=3D3D"mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org"=3D20 title=3D3Dpipechat@pipechat.org>pipechat@pipechat.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, August 07, =3D 2002 12:31=3D20 PM</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Kilgen Organs</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>What can anyone tell me about the = =3D Kilgen=3D20 organs.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>Our church has one built in 1918. = Has =3D   about&nbsp;10 stops or so&nbsp;(haven't played it in a couple of years = =3D -=3D20 disrepair) plus couplers.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>How can I tell how many ranks it = =3D really=3D20 has?</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_001C_01C23E17.BEE5DB20--    
(back) Subject: Moller Artistes From: "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 13:29:57 -0500   I think they're great little organs......despite the fact that people love to make fun of 'em. Artistes were small and relatively inexpensive..........but you got a lot of bang for the buck and good reliable performance, too.   (Forgive the off topic, but McKeesport isn't that far from Morgantown, WV where I lived for 7 years.)   Dennis Steckley ______________________________________ From: <Icedad@aol.com> Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2002 11:00:56 EDT   Dear Dennis,   I played 2 Moller Artiste organs from the time I was 10 years old until I left for college. One was at St. Perpetua Church, McKeesport ,Pa and the other at St, Stephen Church, McKeesport. Pa. Daniel      
(back) Subject: Re: Kilgen Organs From: "jon bertschinger" <jonberts@magiccablepc.com> Date: Wed, 07 Aug 2002 13:49:13 -0500   Do you have the stoplist? possibly from the stop list could tell you how many ranks. thinking about repairs etc?   Jon Bertschinger