PipeChat Digest #2691 - Wednesday, February 6, 2002
 
RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral
  by "Emmons, Paul" <pemmons@wcupa.edu>
RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral
  by "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org>
RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral
  by "Emmons, Paul" <pemmons@wcupa.edu>
RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral
  by "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org>
Re: Lingua latina
  by <LLWheels@aol.com>
RE: Lingua latina
  by "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org>
Re: overprotective
  by "Douglas A Campbell" <dougcampbell@juno.com>
Re: Lingua latina
  by "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com>
Vivaldi or Meck?
  by "Richard Dostie" <rmdostie@hotmail.com>
Re: Lingua Latin
  by <Wurlibird1@aol.com>
Re: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>
Re: Vivaldi or Meck?
  by "Robert Lind" <Robert_Lind@cch.com>
Re: Lingua Latin
  by "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com>
Re: Lingua Latin
  by <Wurlibird1@aol.com>
Re: Vivaldi or Meck?
  by "Randy Terry" <randyterryus@yahoo.com>
Re: CRITIQUING OURSELVES AS ARTISTS
  by "Jim" <bald1@prodigy.net>
Re: Lingua Latin
  by "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com>
UCLA's Thomas Harmon retires
  by "Robert P. Bass" <rpbass@earthlink.net>
 

(back) Subject: RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral From: "Emmons, Paul" <pemmons@wcupa.edu> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 13:46:28 -0500   >This is the Klais organ nobody wants to stand under.   >That's the ROOF nobody should be under.   If you ever get the opportunity to tour the space between the vaulting and the roof of a great Gothic cathedral, it's worth the climb. I recall = doing so at least in Washington and Salisbury Cathedrals. The massiveness of = the ribs, keystones, and apparently the vaulting itself, when you see them up close, is most impressive.   I hasten to say that I'm out of my area of expertise here, and any = architect or engineer is especially welcome to correct me-- but I understand that (although the primary purpose of vaulting is not structural at all, but to keep a fire in the building from reaching the roof), to the extent that vaulting does balance forces in the building, the forces it must resist = are inwards. The flying buttresses push the walls in, and the vaulting pushes them out. If for some reason the vaulting fails to do this adequately, = the ceiling will rise slightly before it collapses. Therefore, the downward weight of the superstructure helps it do its job. The heavy keystones (or "bosses"), often elaborately carved on the bottom, exist primarily for = their weight, which helps solidify the entire ceiling.   This reasoning suggests that as long as the cables or rods supporting the organ are connected to *large* metal plates on top of the stones, so this added weight is well distributed, it will actually strengthen the ceiling, not weaken it. If one should worry about anything, it would be the = outside buttresses in that area-- but I'd guess that, especially as this part of = the building is 19th-century/modern, it is very solid, and the added weight is rather trivial in the whole scheme of things.      
(back) Subject: RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral From: "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 14:03:39 -0500   Okay but gravity counts and something at 13 tons hanging down is tempation in the hands of gravity all other physics aside. I presume the buttresses and the roof have been properly adjusted to handle the extra new 13 tons? Why in hell would they suspend it anyway? Why couldn't they build up from the floor with support from below?   -----Original Message----- From: Emmons, Paul [mailto:pemmons@wcupa.edu] Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 1:46 PM To: 'PipeChat' Subject: RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral     >This is the Klais organ nobody wants to stand under.   >That's the ROOF nobody should be under.   If you ever get the opportunity to tour the space between the vaulting and the roof of a great Gothic cathedral, it's worth the climb. I recall = doing so at least in Washington and Salisbury Cathedrals. The massiveness of = the ribs, keystones, and apparently the vaulting itself, when you see them up close, is most impressive.   I hasten to say that I'm out of my area of expertise here, and any = architect or engineer is especially welcome to correct me-- but I understand that (although the primary purpose of vaulting is not structural at all, but to keep a fire in the building from reaching the roof), to the extent that vaulting does balance forces in the building, the forces it must resist = are inwards. The flying buttresses push the walls in, and the vaulting pushes them out. If for some reason the vaulting fails to do this adequately, = the ceiling will rise slightly before it collapses. Therefore, the downward weight of the superstructure helps it do its job. The heavy keystones (or "bosses"), often elaborately carved on the bottom, exist primarily for = their weight, which helps solidify the entire ceiling.   This reasoning suggests that as long as the cables or rods supporting the organ are connected to *large* metal plates on top of the stones, so this added weight is well distributed, it will actually strengthen the ceiling, not weaken it. If one should worry about anything, it would be the = outside buttresses in that area-- but I'd guess that, especially as this part of = the building is 19th-century/modern, it is very solid, and the added weight is rather trivial in the whole scheme of things.       "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org  
(back) Subject: RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral From: "Emmons, Paul" <pemmons@wcupa.edu> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 14:36:16 -0500   >Okay but gravity counts and something at 13 tons hanging down is = tempation in the hands of gravity all other physics aside.   Do you worry about such things whenever you ride an elevator? How about when you drive across a suspension bridge? That's much more than 13 tons hanging from metal.   >I presume the buttresses and the roof have been properly adjusted to = handle the extra new 13 tons?   The roof has nothing to do with it.   Question (I don't know the answer): The stone and glass (walls, = buttresses, vaulting, windows) of just one bay of a building like Cologne weighs about how many tons? A lot. The boss at the apex of the vault, just one = stone of hundreds or thousands, can be over a ton alone.   >Why in hell would they suspend it anyway? Why couldn't they build up from the floor with support from below?   Because the building is a landmark that the whole German nation cherishes and jealously guards. It was felt that even the usual west gallery = position for an organ would obscure or compromise the architecture too much. Can = you imagine how the art historians would howl over adding a platform for the organ at the front of the nave? Out of the question.    
(back) Subject: RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral From: "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 14:49:33 -0500   An elevator and suspension bridge are ancored for what they do? Was the original building built to ancor the added 13 tons of the suspended organ? That's what I'm asking; was extra support added for the extra 13 tons? The support from the base could be done with very little space being affected on sturdy and yet narrow pillars strategically placed taking up less space than the added partitions and ropes and other crap to keep = crowds this way and that take up. I'm sure not everything in the space is all = that was there 700 years ago. My guess is lots has been accumulated.   -----Original Message----- From: Emmons, Paul [mailto:pemmons@wcupa.edu] Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 2:36 PM To: 'PipeChat' Subject: RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral     >Okay but gravity counts and something at 13 tons hanging down is = tempation in the hands of gravity all other physics aside.   Do you worry about such things whenever you ride an elevator? How about when you drive across a suspension bridge? That's much more than 13 tons hanging from metal.   >I presume the buttresses and the roof have been properly adjusted to = handle the extra new 13 tons?   The roof has nothing to do with it.   Question (I don't know the answer): The stone and glass (walls, = buttresses, vaulting, windows) of just one bay of a building like Cologne weighs about how many tons? A lot. The boss at the apex of the vault, just one = stone of hundreds or thousands, can be over a ton alone.   >Why in hell would they suspend it anyway? Why couldn't they build up from the floor with support from below?   Because the building is a landmark that the whole German nation cherishes and jealously guards. It was felt that even the usual west gallery = position for an organ would obscure or compromise the architecture too much. Can = you imagine how the art historians would howl over adding a platform for the organ at the front of the nave? Out of the question.     "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org  
(back) Subject: Re: Lingua latina From: <LLWheels@aol.com> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 15:47:15 EST     --part1_9d.22ab24bb.29919ed3_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   I have written several - no, make that many - posts to this list with = hardly a comment, good bad or indifferent. I finally get a comment and what is it =   about? My sig. in Latin. Perhaps I should put my posts entirely in Latin = and then they would get some attention (fat chance) };-)   Larry L. Wheelock Madison, Wisconsin   "SI HOC LEGERE SCIS NIMIUM ERUDITONIS HABES"   --part1_9d.22ab24bb.29919ed3_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><BODY BGCOLOR=3D"#ffffff"><FONT = style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2>I have written several - no, = make that many - posts to this list with hardly a comment, good bad or = indifferent. I finally get a comment and what is it about? My sig. in = Latin. Perhaps I should put my posts entirely in Latin and then they would = get some attention (fat chance) };-)<BR> <BR> Larry L. Wheelock<BR> Madison, Wisconsin<BR> <BR> "SI HOC LEGERE SCIS NIMIUM ERUDITONIS HABES"</FONT></HTML>   --part1_9d.22ab24bb.29919ed3_boundary--  
(back) Subject: RE: Lingua latina From: "COLASACCO, ROBERT" <RCOLASACCO@popcouncil.org> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 15:52:15 -0500   Are you related to the latin textbook author and professor Wheelock or is this coincidental? Robert Colasacco     [Aside: Sorry Malcolm, this was too good to let pass. Go ahead, turn me in to my boss.] Not the Scottish play.     -----Original Message----- From: LLWheels@aol.com [mailto:LLWheels@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 3:47 PM To: pipechat@pipechat.org Subject: Re: Lingua latina     I have written several - no, make that many - posts to this list with = hardly a comment, good bad or indifferent. I finally get a comment and what is it about? My sig. in Latin. Perhaps I should put my posts entirely in Latin = and then they would get some attention (fat chance) };-)   Larry L. Wheelock Madison, Wisconsin   "SI HOC LEGERE SCIS NIMIUM ERUDITONIS HABES"  
(back) Subject: Re: overprotective From: "Douglas A Campbell" <dougcampbell@juno.com> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 10:33:07 -0500       On Mon, 4 Feb 2002 23:13:22 -0600 "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net> writes: <snip> For the life of me, I can't imagine what someone would want to > protect. If, for example, you are hiding it out of embarrassment...well, that > says to me that you know there's something "wrong" and in need of education. > If you're hiding them just because you don't want someone else to see them, > then I question the validity of that thought. That question would be, straight > up..."WHY"???? To what means does that serve? It's not like > someone with a bit of knowledge and a quick ear couldn't figure it out...<snip>   Don't you think there is a direct correlation between people that "guard" thier registrtion and the people that insist on keeping the instrument itslef out of the hands of others? (see locked console topics) ???   It seems to me that is is an indication of insecurity and has little, if anything, to do with making music.     Douglas A. Campbell Skaneateles, NY     ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.  
(back) Subject: Re: Lingua latina From: "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com> Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 16:57:12 -0600     Bud wrote:   > P.S. - Luther ENCOURAGED the study of Latin, particularly for the young, = and > produced a Latin edition of the Lutheran liturgy ...   Actually Luther produced his Latin version of the Mass before the German = ones   > Latin Masses were still sung in St. Thomas Church, Leipzig until WELL = after > Bach's death ...   It is still relatively common in the Scandinavian Lutheran Churches that = the ordinary of Choral Masses is sung in Latin, while the congregation sings = the ordinary when it is in the vernacular. I discovered this when I found a = large number of Latin settings of the ordinary in the archives of the Norwegian = and Swedish Music Information Centers.   ns    
(back) Subject: Vivaldi or Meck? From: "Richard Dostie" <rmdostie@hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 00:13:38 +0000   I own two editions of the same J. G. Walther B minor concerto = transcription. The Barenreiter edition by Wolfgang Auler attributes the original = concerto to Meck, while the Breitkopf edition by Heinz Lohmann attributes it to Vivaldi. Which is correct? Lohmann's brief introduction appears to say that the concerto formerly ascribed to Meck actually was the work of Vivaldi, but my German is nowhere near good enough to figure out if he = says anything to support this assertion.   Yours in the interest of accurate program notes.   Richard M. Dostie St. Thomas' Church Camden, ME USA       _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx    
(back) Subject: Re: Lingua Latin From: <Wurlibird1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 19:13:45 EST   Noel Soutenburg writes:     >It is still relatively common in the Scandinavian Lutheran Churches that = the >ordinary of Choral Masses is sung in Latin, while the congregation sings = the >ordinary when it is in the vernacular. I discovered this when I found a large >number of Latin settings of the ordinary in the archives of the Norwegian = and >Swedish Music Information Centers. <<   A very large representation of Norwegians are found in central Texas. = They hold an annual Norwegian Festival Days Celebration, honoring their Scandinavian heritage. Knowing several of these individuals, I shall ask of them their current Liturgy and post what is preferred among Texas Norwegians. As these folk = are strict conservatives in their native culture, I will be an interesting research.   In hoc tu ofen, Jim Pitts    
(back) Subject: Re: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 18:47:07 -0600     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Emmons, Paul" <pemmons@wcupa.edu> To: "'PipeChat'" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 12:46 PM Subject: RE: Sainte-Chapelle and Cologne Cathedral     > >This is the Klais > organ nobody wants to stand under. > > >That's the ROOF nobody should be under.   My father visited Cologne Cathedral and in 1937 and took a photograph of = the west end of the cathedral draped in swastikas with a Nazi beer garden in front. Since then, I believe, Cologne Cathedral was burnt out in World = War II, so the roof would probably be of recent construction and therefore engineered to take the weight of the organ.   John Speller    
(back) Subject: Re: Vivaldi or Meck? From: "Robert Lind" <Robert_Lind@cch.com> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 18:54:13 -0600   Rick--   I asked this question on another network (beginning with PIP) some months back and was told it was Vivaldi and that someone had written about it in a dissertation in German. I could probably dig this out tomorrow if you want.   Some years back I had heard on my car radio Rampal and an orchestra playing a Baroque flute concerto. It was in e minor, I'm cursed with = perfect pitch, and it took me a minute or two to figure out that this was the Meck concerto in b (which is probably my favorite of all the Walther transcriptions).   There is, of course, an RV catalog number to go along with the Vivaldi. What's interesting to me is that the middle movements of these = two works are entirely different. The Meck stays in b for the slow movement, = and I'm quite sure the Vivaldi flute concerto that I heard went off to a = related key. That part of the puzzle remains a mystery to me--i.e., did Vivaldi write both middle movements or will the mystery writer of the middle movement of the Walther transcription please stand up?   At home I have two CDs of Walther concerti on the Naxos label played by Craig Cramer. I haven't had time to go through them, but there is, = IIRC, a "Meck" concerto on one of those two recordings, and I think it's in yet another key! When I have time to sort things out, I mean to email Craig = and find out what he knows about all this.   All I ever knew about Josef Meck, BTW, was that he was a violinist at one time in the Mainz Court.   Bob Lind         From: Richard Dostie <rmdostie@hotmail.com> on 02/05/2002 06:13 PM Please respond to PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org>@SMTP@cchntmsd To: pipechat@pipechat.org@SMTP@cchntmsd cc:   Subject: Vivaldi or Meck?   I own two editions of the same J. G. Walther B minor concerto transcription. The Barenreiter edition by Wolfgang Auler attributes the original concerto to Meck, while the Breitkopf edition by Heinz Lohmann attributes it to Vivaldi. Which is correct? Lohmann's brief introduction appears to say that the concerto formerly ascribed to Meck actually was the work of   Vivaldi, but my German is nowhere near good enough to figure out if he says anything to support this assertion.   Yours in the interest of accurate program notes.   Richard M. Dostie St. Thomas' Church Camden, ME USA       _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx     "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org        
(back) Subject: Re: Lingua Latin From: "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com> Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 19:08:49 -0600     I wrote,   > >It is still relatively common in the Scandinavian Lutheran Churches = that the > >ordinary of Choral Masses is sung in Latin, while the congregation = sings the > >ordinary when it is in the vernacular. I discovered this when I found = a large > >number of Latin settings of the ordinary in the archives of the = Norwegian and > >Swedish Music Information Centers. <<   to which Jim responded   > A very large representation of Norwegians are found in central Texas. = They > hold an annual Norwegian Festival Days Celebration, honoring their > Scandinavian heritage. > Knowing several of these individuals, I shall ask of them their current > Liturgy and post what is preferred among Texas Norwegians. As these = folk are > strict conservatives in their native culture, I will be an interesting > research.   leading me to caution that, by and large, when Scandinavians emigrated to = the New World, all of them left some of the "high church" proclivities in the "old country", and some left a great deal more than others.   It is also interesting to note, in perusing the list of composers in LBW, = that there are as many hymn tunes by Howells and Routley (one each) as by Knut = Nystedt (for those who would otherwise have to look it up, a contemporary = Norwegian Lutheran Composers) and more than those by Egil Hovland or Roland Forsberg = (none), the former another contemporary Norwegian, the latter a contemporary = Swedish composer.   ns    
(back) Subject: Re: Lingua Latin From: <Wurlibird1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 20:45:52 EST   Noel offers:     >leading me to caution that, by and large, when Scandinavians emigrated to =   the New >World, all of them left some of the "high church" proclivities in the = "old >country", and some left a great deal more than others. <<   Thanks, Noel. As one totally ignorant of European and Scandinavian = Lutheran proclivities, I stand to learn much from both sides of the matter.   Some Norwegians apparently strayed further than others from the "High = Church" ways. A Baptist pastor in the area is named Olin Svendsen with a family = tree firmly planted in Oslo, Norway.   Again, thanks for the heads-up, Noel.   Best wishes, Jim Pitts  
(back) Subject: Re: Vivaldi or Meck? From: "Randy Terry" <randyterryus@yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 18:49:35 -0800 (PST)   Are you guys talking about the Concerto del Sigr. Meck?   I played the piece on my junior recital, but my memory is fuzzy as to its = history. I will see what I can find out too. I am thinking about beginning my Holy Week concert = with that piece.....     Randy   =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Randy Terry, Director of Music Ministry & Organist Mona Dena, Assistant & Principal Conductor The Episcopal Church of St. Peter 178 Clinton Street Redwood City, California www.stpetersrwc.org   __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com  
(back) Subject: Re: CRITIQUING OURSELVES AS ARTISTS From: "Jim" <bald1@prodigy.net> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 21:07:00 -0600     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Gettelman" <mike3247@earthlink.net> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 12:23 PM Subject: Re: CRITIQUING OURSELVES AS ARTISTS     > > > Rodney West wrote: > > (SNIP) I admit to going to concerts earlier and feeling > critical--ah, the stupidity of youth. Nowadays, I > love hearing people do things differently. I embrace > the freshness. I don't go into concerts wanting to > criticize the organ or player. I go in to be touched > and enlightened. > > Mike blathers: > Ditto, and I wish more self appointed experts would understand this.   Jim H    
(back) Subject: Re: Lingua Latin From: "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com> Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 23:23:47 -0600     Jim:   We tend to see church events primarily in terms of history of English, and = later U.S. churches, because we have the commonality of language. In fact, the movements which can be found in English Churches can be found, to a = greater or lesser extent in the history of other churches, as well, though the = parallels may not be exact, and may vary to a greater or lesser extent. To cite the = example with which I am most familiar, because of my own heritage, compare the relationships between Church of Sweden with the Church of England with = some of their ecclesiastical offspring.   If one realizes that the Baptists in the U.S. originated from the Church = of England in the colonies. While we think of the Puritans as = congregationalists, when Roger Williams left Massachusetts Bay colony, they were part of the = Church of England, and a century and a half later, the Wesley Brothers = established Methodism from the same source. Examining the Church of Sweden, one finds = that in some ways, the relationship between the Church of Sweden, and the = Swedish Evangelical Covenant Church (as they were still known in my younger days, = though these days I think they've dropped the "Swedish" from the name of the denomination; this is the organization with which North Park University in Chicago is affiliated) is very similar to the situation between the Church = of England and the Methodists, and the relationship between the Church of = Sweden and the Evangelical Free Church is has similarities to the relation ship = between the Church of England and Baptists. The simile is not perfect; the former = Augustana Lutheran Church was an offspring of the Church of Sweden, and while it = maintained a much closer relationship with the Church of Sweden that the other two = groups I've mentioned did, it as not as close as the relationship between the = ECUSA and C of E. Part of the reason for this is that part of the reason the = emigrants to the US who formed the Augustana Church were somewhat more pietistic than = those who stayed in Sweden.   By the way, the situation of the Swedes in the New World is even more = convoluted that that. The colonists of New Sweden (located in what is now = Southeastern Pennsylvania and Delaware formed churches, built buildings (some of which = still stand and are still in use); however, when the asked for Pastors, and = expressed a desire for a Bishop, (which event occurred at about the time the English = took over New Sweden), they were directed to the Episcopal Church, as they were = under the jurisdiction of the Bishop of London, with whom the Church of Sweden = was then in communion. As a result, some of the oldest Episcopal Church buildings = still in use in the U.S. have the informal appellation "Old Swede's Church".   ns        
(back) Subject: UCLA's Thomas Harmon retires From: "Robert P. Bass" <rpbass@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:10:15 -0800   This evening, Dr. Harmon is giving his farewell concert at Royce Hall. Our local TV station gave a little segment on this. The info can be found at http://sns.ktla.com/news/local/la-000009023feb05.story     Bob Bass