PipeChat Digest #2724 - Monday, February 25, 2002
 
back to the Tenn organ]
  by "Wayne Grauel" <wayne@eminent-usa.com>
Re: Age to start piano lessons
  by "Panning" <jpanning@cal-net.net>
AGO Convention
  by "David Baker" <bestlaw@ix.netcom.com>
Digital Instruments and such
  by "Travis L. Evans" <tevansmo@prodigy.net>
Re: back to the Tenn organ]
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Organ with Brass ( X posted)
  by "Hugh Drogemuller" <hdrogemuller@sympatico.ca>
Organ Recital X-Post
  by "Travis L. Evans" <tevansmo@prodigy.net>
Re: Organ Recital X-Post
  by "Stephen Ohmer" <knopfregal@yahoo.com>
A question for you Anglophiles out there . . .
  by "Glenda" <gksjd85@access.aic-fl.com>
Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . .
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . .
  by "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu>
Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . .
  by "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu>
Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . .
  by "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu>
Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . .
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca>
Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . .
  by "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com>
 

(back) Subject: back to the Tenn organ] From: "Wayne Grauel" <wayne@eminent-usa.com> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 08:26:09 -0500       it was written..   "" Now I will challenge this as I saw and played some brand new, very large Schantz organs and a Schoenstein in Houston last summer at the AGO regional convention. "" Scott... I'll be the first to admit that one of my favorite instruments is a Moller at Immanual Lutheran Church in Baltimore, so the point is not to "stereotype" but to rather point out the unique and interesting.   I think many churches and musicians have gone beyond the thinking of one organ does it all perfectly....   On the contrary, I don't think you'd take you're BMW 500 series and head out over the fields and across streams, better leave that to the full size 4WD SUV.   You bring up an interesting point here... ***************************************************** "With the exception of a traditional Lutheran church, such as First in Boston, I really have a problem with organists and professors who hoist instruments onto congregations that will probably be there for the next 100+ years that are A) purely academic in nature thereby satisfying the consultant's overweening and academic ego and B) cannot effectively and completely lead worship in an appropriate manner. This includes repertoire for the organ voluntaries, choral accompaniment, hymn playing (with some variance in the verses)and improvisation. Can we REALLY do all of this solidly on a tracker in some funky, antique temperament with no expression, no pistons and flexible wind that makes the organ sound like it blew a gusset???" ********************************************************* You've serious? I thought the organ's first job was to lead the congregation in hymn singing.... and accompany the choir? Does this require fist fulls of stops?   The Richards Fowkes has the following... Hmmmmmm   A full principal chorus with reeds on the great and a flute chorus   A principal chorus on the swell, strings/celeste, flute chorus, reeds 16,8   Well, I guess I'll have to admit that this isn't the best choice to accompany the praise band.   I'm sorry, But I think for the church that puts high sound quality at the top of the list and the principal function of the organ, simplicity of operation and long term stability as far as maintenance goes, this is one of the best choices out there. To mention Funky temperaments is slightly closed minded unless you can tell me the temperament that the organ is in.... so is it mean tone, what?   If you aren't up on temperaments and those commonly accepted and used in organ building than it would be advisable to play some of these instruments, or go get you hands on a digital organ and hear for your self, back and forth... all of the sudden equal won't sound so good anymore.... (unless you play most of your literature in more than 4 #'s or b's. Do the math, in equal, none of it is in tune... but that's been covered before.   More and more builders are actually building mechanical action instruments with conventional capture stop action, the best of both worlds...   Don't like mechanical action, I guess that means it's better to play an electric keyboard than an acoustic grand... that's mechanical action!   *************************************************************   You wrote... Lastly- don't knock Allen either- they have been and are doing some rather spectacular things these days.   ************************************************************   Lighten up...   I didn't knock Allen... not at all, I represent digital organ builders from the Netherlands. I'm not here to tell you that a digital organ is going to sound better than a Paul Fritts, Fisk, Richards - Fowlks, Flentrop, Noack, or name a host of other builders out there no matter how small.   What I will tell you is that for the purpose they are intended... the lack of a half a million dollars, poor acoustics, no space... they will sound extremely convincing, and the more you spend the more accurate it can get. In many cases, these organs have the capability to sound better than just about any "run of the mill" pipe organ... no joke! And the worse the room acoustics gets, the more these organs will be an effective solution.   But that's another topic.   I will be the first to admit the Allen builds a good product, Good console quality, quality electronics, well thought out, but it's just another run of the mill organ in digital form. It sure as heck isn't anything I'd want to waste my time playing if I was on an organ crawl to play "unique" organs... let's be real! Here again, a stock organ from an assembly line with a stock stock list.... you can sell a stock organ at Wal Mart if there's a market.   There is certainly nothing wrong with stock, off the shelf products if this is what people want. Especially if I want my church to have the exact same organ as the church down the street! But to go to another city to play one would be like flying across the country just to test drive a Honda Civic.     I personally prefer organs that are built to order and made one at a time. This goes for digital as well as pipe. This allows the organ reflect the musical tastes and ideals of both the builder and the person or group who specified it.   But, this is music, and music is art. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.   Hey, if people want to go look at organs with opus numbers in 4 or 5 digits and they think that is the best sound since the hydraulis, they they certainly are entitled to their opinions. it's all a matter of color and personal preference.   I'm not here to offend anyone's personal taste, especially when it's set in stone. But I think there are numerous people out there who might find some diversity and a change from the American Classic diet quite interesting, it not at least for those "special occasions, when musically, nothing else will just quite do!     Take care! Wayne    
(back) Subject: Re: Age to start piano lessons From: "Panning" <jpanning@cal-net.net> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 10:22:24 -0500   My wife is both a piano teacher and an early childhood music specialist. She recommends to all parents that children have many musical experiences before they begin piano lessons. She offers classes for children as young as age one (with a parent). During these 45 minute classes, parent and child explore movement, steady beat, and the singing voice (pitch matching, etc.). As soon as they are able to grasp pitch and rhythm, they are taught to read music. This is usually around age five or six. By the time their hands have developed to the point that they're physically able to navigate a piano keyboard, they already have had a substantial amount of musical experiences that really make piano lessons more productive.   At age two, every child is curious about the piano: it's another thing to explore, just like opening cupboard doors or petting the cat. A child's interest in playing notes on the piano does not necessarily mean that they're exhibiting a special interest in music. That being said, early childhood music classes provide the background for every later musical endeavor (let's face it, the piano is not going to be the musical gateway for every child), and some extra-musical benefits as well (improved attention, better coordination, confidence, early socialization, etc.). Such classes are available all over the country; Musikgarten, Kindermusik and Music Together are the best known curricula, but there are also many private programs.   John  
(back) Subject: AGO Convention From: "David Baker" <bestlaw@ix.netcom.com> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 14:29:16 -0500   Dear list:   I am presenting a workshop at the National Convention in Philadelphia = titled "A Lawyer's Guide to Church Music". In order that it can be relevant, interesting and useful to participants, I am soliciting topics or = questions that listers would like to hear addressed. NO SPECIFIC PROBLEMS, PLEASE! = I will not be giving legal advice! Thanks for your input.   -- David G. Baker - dbaker@lawyers.com Dean, Merrimack Valley Chapter http://www.geocities.com/merrimackago    
(back) Subject: Digital Instruments and such From: "Travis L. Evans" <tevansmo@prodigy.net> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 14:43:11 -0800     In starting our search for a new piano I was shown Yamahas digital line. The do have a digital instrument with the same action as their accoustic grands, that strike some sort of mechanism in order to acheive the tone production even in playback mode the keys move like their disklavier.   We however are probably going with the Yamaha C1 Conservatory Grand.   Travis     > Well, for a start, there is no such thing as a "digital piano." A piano = is > an instrument in which strings are struck by hammers. No hammers or strings, > no piano, no piano touch, no piano tone. > Ross      
(back) Subject: Re: back to the Tenn organ] From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 19:09:23 EST     --part1_135.9f1c15d.29aadab3_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 2/24/02 1:26:02 PM !!!First Boot!!!, = wayne@eminent-usa.com writes:     > I'm not here to offend anyone's personal taste, especially when it's set > in stone.   My opinion is set in stone! ..... and I agree with you, except for my wholesale (or retail even) rejection of electronics, even in bad = acoustics. I think one Diapason rank in a dead room would sound better than a digitothingy in a dead room.... but that's more stone!!   Thanks for your fine and comprehensive post.   Bruce Cornely < Cremona502@cs.com > with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Visit Howling Acres and meet the Baskerbeagles: Duncan, Miles, Molly & = Dewi < http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502 + http://prepaidlegal.com/go/brucecornely >   --part1_135.9f1c15d.29aadab3_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 2/24/02 1:26:02 PM !!!First Boot!!!, wayne@eminent-usa.com writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">I'm not here to = offend anyone's personal taste, especially when it's set <BR>in stone.</FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>My opinion is set in stone! &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;..... and I agree with = you, except for my wholesale (or retail even) rejection of electronics, = even in bad acoustics. &nbsp;I think one Diapason rank in a dead room = would sound better than a digitothingy in a dead room.... &nbsp;&nbsp;but = that's more stone!! <BR> <BR>Thanks for your fine and comprehensive post. <BR> <BR> Bruce Cornely &lt; Cremona502@cs.com &gt;<I> </I> <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR>Visit Howling Acres <I>&nbsp;</I>and meet the Baskerbeagles: = &nbsp;Duncan, Miles, Molly &amp; Dewi <BR>&lt; http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502 + = http://prepaidlegal.com/go/brucecornely &nbsp;&gt;</FONT></HTML>   --part1_135.9f1c15d.29aadab3_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Organ with Brass ( X posted) From: "Hugh Drogemuller" <hdrogemuller@sympatico.ca> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 20:26:55 -0500   Last evening at St. Peters Basilica in London Ontario concert-goers were treated to a fine program of music for organ with brass. The program was = : Marche triomphale ............................................................S. =   Karg-Elert Three trumpets and organ Hodie Christus natus est................................................ Giovanni Gabrieli Brass quintet and organ Prelude and Fugue (1973)......................................................Robert King Trumpet, French horn, trombone and organ Sacrae Symphoniae (1597): Canzon duodecima toni.........Giovanni Gabrieli Brass quintet and organ Grand Choeur Dialogue............................................... .....Eugene = Gigout Brass quintet and organ   Intermission Okna (Windows).................................................................P= etr Eben III . Red IV. Gold Trumpet and Organ Lass dich nur nichts nich dauren..........................................J. Brahms Brass quartet and organ Pieces de Fantaisie Op. 55: Naides.......................................L.Vierne Organ solo Battle Suite......................................................................= ...S. Scheidt Galliard Battaglia Courant Dolorosa Canzon Bergamasque Brass Quintet Marche Triomphale du centenaire de Napoleon 1 .....................L. Vierne Three trumpets,french horn,trombone,tuba and tympani with organ   The program was a fund raiser for the Cathedrals organ restoration fund . The organ is a circa 1925 Casavant , 3m. about 48 stops. It is kept in good playing condition by the regional Casavant representatives, Dodington =   and Dodington Pipe Organ Services but there will need to be work done on various parts of the pneumatic system before long. Dr. Ron Fox is the organist for the Cathedral and he was organ soloist. The brass players are members of various regional brass groups ; = trumpeters were Paul Stevenson, Julia Meyers and Craig Robertson. Nigel Evans played =   the French horn, Karen Bulmer the Tuba and Wayne Nickoli the trombone. Rob =   Inch was the tympanist. Except for the last two pieces, all the music was played from the rear gallery which houses the organ and choir. For the balance of the program the brass moved into the nave just ahead of the altar which stands at the entrance to the chancel. Much of the music was familiar. The Eben was new to me although the = theme for the second part seemed familiar but I was unable to identify it. The final work by Vierne was the one that "grabbed" me. In part, because I had =   never heard it before , but mainly because of the majesty of the work and the variety of parts and instrumentation. Simply put, it was wonderful. I must try and fine a good recording of it. The acoustics of the Cathedral are excellent and added a bloom to the = music that only fine room ambience can.   HD    
(back) Subject: Organ Recital X-Post From: "Travis L. Evans" <tevansmo@prodigy.net> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 20:10:42 -0800   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0032_01C1BD6F.55CB7060 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   Reminder to anyone close by:   I'll be giving an Organ Recital Sunday March 3, 2002 at 3 pm. Holy =3D Cross Lutheran Church, O'Fallon, MO. Refreshments following.   Travis Evans Director of Music Holy Cross Lutheran O'Fallon, MO   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0032_01C1BD6F.55CB7060 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type content=3D3D"text/html; =3D charset=3D3Diso-8859-1"> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 5.50.4522.1800" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial>Reminder to anyone close by:</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial>I'll be giving an Organ Recital Sunday March 3, = =3D 2002 at 3=3D20 pm.&nbsp; Holy Cross Lutheran Church, O'Fallon, MO.&nbsp; = Refreshments=3D20 following.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial>Travis Evans</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial>Director of Music</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial>Holy Cross Lutheran</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial>O'Fallon, MO</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0032_01C1BD6F.55CB7060--    
(back) Subject: Re: Organ Recital X-Post From: "Stephen Ohmer" <knopfregal@yahoo.com> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 18:12:45 -0800 (PST)   ooo ooo - what kind of refreshments?                       okay, just kidding. But what music are you playing and on what kind of organ? SteveOhmer --- "Travis L. Evans" <tevansmo@prodigy.net> wrote: > Reminder to anyone close by: > > I'll be giving an Organ Recital Sunday March 3, > 2002 at 3 pm. Holy Cross Lutheran Church, > O'Fallon, MO. Refreshments following. > > Travis Evans > Director of Music > Holy Cross Lutheran > O'Fallon, MO >     =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D     __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games http://sports.yahoo.com  
(back) Subject: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . . From: "Glenda" <gksjd85@access.aic-fl.com> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 20:40:00 -0600   I have just finished reading "John Adams" by David McCullough, and just had to laugh. John Quincy Adams was married in London at, and I quote, "the ancient Anglican church known as All Hallows Barking by the Tower of London".   Does this edifice still exist, and does it boast an organ?   Glenda Sutton        
(back) Subject: Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . . From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 18:47:52 -0800   http://www.hiddenlondon.com/all_hallows.htm   Glenda wrote:   > I have just finished reading "John Adams" by David McCullough, and just > had to laugh. John Quincy Adams was married in London at, and I quote, > "the ancient Anglican church known as All Hallows Barking by the Tower > of London". > > Does this edifice still exist, and does it boast an organ? > > Glenda Sutton > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org    
(back) Subject: Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . . From: "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 21:51:05 -0400   on 2/24/02 10:40 PM, Glenda at gksjd85@access.aic-fl.com wrote:   > I have just finished reading "John Adams" by David McCullough, and just > had to laugh. John Quincy Adams was married in London at, and I quote, > "the ancient Anglican church known as All Hallows Barking by the Tower > of London". > > Does this edifice still exist, and does it boast an organ? > > Glenda Sutton > It does still exist. Don't know about the organ but check out the "Hidden London" website on it at http://www.hiddenlondon.com/all_hallows.htm   Absolutely fascinating historical connections, from William Penn to Samuel Pepys to the original Hanging Judge.     Randy Runyon Music Director Zion Lutheran Church Hamilton, Ohio runyonr@muohio.edu      
(back) Subject: Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . . From: "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 21:56:08 -0400   Check out http://web.ukonline.co.uk/dickon.love/london/allhallows_barking.htm for a picture of the result of the bombing raid it suffered in 1940. Probably destroyed any organ that might have been there. Its bells have been replaced, though.   Randy Runyon Music Director Zion Lutheran Church Hamilton, Ohio runyonr@muohio.edu      
(back) Subject: Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . . From: "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 22:06:39 -0400   I can't help it, must offer one more site. This one the church's own. Includes their newsletter, a guide to what to see in the church (no = mention of an organ), etc.: http://www.allhallowsbythetower.org.uk/     Randy Runyon Music Director Zion Lutheran Church Hamilton, Ohio runyonr@muohio.edu      
(back) Subject: Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . . From: "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 22:32:01 -0500   The mention of All Hallows, Barking, by the Tower, brings to mind that = when I was a choirboy at St. Matthews Church, ( also bombed in the London blitz), I was taken by Dr. Boulter, our Choirmaster, to a recital given by =   Dr. Albert Schweitzer, - I have the recording of Dr. Schweitzer playing that organ. At the time it was the most exciting recital that I had ever heard, - but now I am afraid that Dr. Schweitzer's performing technique would not receive many plaudits from the Bach lovers of today!   The organ was destroyed in the bombing, and was not replaced until 1957, when Harrisons Built a new instrument with a remarkably similar case to = the instrument that was destroyed. As far as I recall, it is a three manual and pedal organ, although I do not recall how many stops it has.   There is also a small two manual Bishop and Son organ that was provided whilst the church was being rebuilt and is now in the South Aisle of the church.   Yes, Glenda, the church is still there, and it has two organs!   Bob Conway    
(back) Subject: Re: A question for you Anglophiles out there . . . From: "David Scribner" <david@blackiris.com> Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 21:49:39 -0600   Glenda   As you see from some of the other postings the building does exist although rebuilt after being bombed during WWII.   If i have gotten the right listing in the National Pipe Organ Registry the current organ was built in 1957 by Harrison and Harrison with updating by bishop in 1991. You can find the stop list by going to: http://lehuray2.csi.cam.ac.uk/npor.html and searching for the Index number N17680   David