PipeChat Digest #2619 - Wednesday, January 2, 2002
 
Re: Shocking Facts
  by "Mike Gettelman" <mike3247@earthlink.net>
terminology
  by "DP" <dpitzer@sonic.net>
Re: Mozart organ works
  by "Karl Moyer" <kmoyer@marauder.millersville.edu>
slider chests
  by "DP" <dpitzer@sonic.net>
"overblowing" or harmonic pipes
  by <TubaMagna@aol.com>
CORRECTION: "overblowing pipes"
  by <TubaMagna@aol.com>
Re: slider chests
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
RE: slider chests
  by "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net>
Re: Shocking Facts
  by <Cremona502@cs.com>
Re: slider chests
  by "Roger Brown" <rbrown7@bigpond.net.au>
RE: slider chests
  by "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net>
RE: Shocking Facts
  by "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net>
RE: definitions
  by "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net>
Re: slider chests
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
Re: definitions
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
Songle, Doppel, Tropple
  by <TubaMagna@aol.com>
RE: definitions
  by "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Shocking Facts From: "Mike Gettelman" <mike3247@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2002 20:02:19 -0500   Hi Steve, I can't believe how much trouble I am having trying to find out about double-languid diapasons. Could you take pity on a fellow Ohioan and tell = me how such a pipe is constructed, and perhaps even guide me to a picture of one. = I would be most appreciative.   Happy New Year Mike by the Cuyahoga   youngstown fireapp wrote:   > The Wanamaker organ has a double-languid diapason in the Chorus Great > division which is circa 1927? if memeory serves correctly and is called > Chorus Diapason Magna 8 and was demonstrated for me during a performance > when only myself and the store organist were in the console = gallery....it > was quite a large and impressive voice to say the least...Steve Bournias = in > Warren Ohio > > >From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> > >Reply-To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> > >To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> > >Subject: Re: Shocking Facts > >Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2001 15:19:38 -0600 > > > >Antoni Scott wrote: > > > > > > > > How many other organs have double languid stops other than = Westminster > > > Cathedral and Atlantic City ? > > > > > > >Midmer-Losh, the builders of the Atlantic City organ, made quite = extensive > >use of them in other instruments, including some relatively small ones. = I > >recall we visited a three manual Midmer-Losh with a double-languid = diapason > >at the Roman Catholic Church of the Assumption, Ansonia, Connecticut, = at > >the OHS 1994 Convention. Ernest M. Skinner was less than enamored to > >double-languid diapasons and suggested that they were "more suited to = the > >baseball stadium" than the church. > > > >John Speller > > > > > > > > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > > > organ > > _________________________________________________________________ > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org    
(back) Subject: terminology From: "DP" <dpitzer@sonic.net> Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2002 17:38:09 -0800   Fellow-members   I occasionally read or hear the term "overblown" in reference to flue pipe =   design or voicing. What, in this context, does "overblown" mean exactly? And how would a rank of flue pipes be made to "overblow" on a windchest where the other ranks are NOT overblown? What, if any, fairly common stops =   are typically overblown. Are such stops partially (Rhoreflute) or completely (Quinadena) covered? What would be the [sound] difference between an 8' diapason overblown and a 4' diapason not overblown?   (Keep in mind that I have limited experience in voicing matters and what experience I have is with so-call "slider", "key-channel" (tracker = action) wind chests.)   Dave P. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D    
(back) Subject: Re: Mozart organ works From: "Karl Moyer" <kmoyer@marauder.millersville.edu> Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2002 20:28:59 -0500   It borders on "heresy" to suggest that Mozart's "church sonatas" are no= t "Church music," but, candidly, the aesthetic/spiritual expectations of musi= c in church where Mozart worked or worshiped were quite different from those of most persons now. In similar fashion, I would hesitate to perform Bach cantata arias for the average American congregation, given most present-day congregations' general lack of comprehension of that music and even those texts. (More about this below.)   The Mozart "church sonatas" are hardly more than sonata-form movements for strings and organ. Here again, it borders on "musical heresy" or perhaps more especially on troublesome discussion to suggest that sonata-form movements are more matters of rationality than spirituality, an= d I don't want to take the time nor the band-width in anyone's computer to defend that statement, though I do think the statement is quite defensible. So I'd not see sonata-form music generally as valid Church music, Mozart notwithstanding. =20   I suspect, furthermore, that Mozart was more interested in freemasonry than Christian theology and liturgy and that his *spiritual* relationship t= o the Church may have been somewhat minimal. (His employment relationship to the Church, of course, was often horendous!)   Thus, despite some WONDERFUL Mozart choral works, incl. esp. the late work "Ave Verum Corpus," I'd not hold up Mozart generally as a significant Church composer, as opposed to a composer who sometimes used Church-based texts as concert music. The fact that some of his choral/orchestral Masses were performed within the liturgy of his day in certain places does not change my opinion about their validity in the liturgy today for us. The "church sonatas" fall into the same consideration.   I'd far sooner play or sing Palestrina, Healey Willan, Bruckner, Bach, Harry Rowe Shelley, William Byrd, Mendelssohn, John Ireland, Heinrich Sch=FCtz--- etc., etc., -- than Mozart, save a few select Mozart works like the "Ave Verum Corpus." But Mozart "organ music" in church? Naw.   Karl E. Moyer Lancaster PA    
(back) Subject: slider chests From: "DP" <dpitzer@sonic.net> Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2002 18:55:26 -0800   Fellow Members,   First: Other than simplicity of design, what, if any, are the artistic advantages of so-called "key-channel," slider operated windchests?   Second: Does the employment of a slider windchest pre-suppose the use of tracker key-action? If so, why?   Third: In an organ employing slider stop action, tracker key action, how = is wind provided to a rank (or partial rank) of display or facade pipes whose =   feet do not set on the windchest?   Fourth: Given tracker action and that a "Manual 1" is coupled to a = "Manual 2" -- do the keys of Manual 1 necessarily physically "move" when the corresponding key on Manual 2 is depressed. In other words, is the manual coupling necessarily "visual"?   Fifth: Referring to the fourth question above -- does the same answer pertain to Pedal-to-manual coupling?   Sixth: Again assuming a purely tracker-action organ --- is the force required to depress the keys of a manual coupled to one or more other manuals significantly (or noticeably) larger than if the manual were = played "alone"? If so, is the additional force burdensome or restrictive to certain fingering -- such as staccato?   Seventh: What, if any, are the disadvantages to having a pedal division on =   electric or elecro-pneumatic action while the manuals are on pure tracker action?   Eight: Can a "resultant" 10-2/3' + 16' combination equal the "volume" and =   "gravity" of an [open] 32' stop? Same question for a closed 16' stop.   Ninth: 17th, 18th and 19th Century music aside, is the investment in a = full 32 note 32' stop (flue or reed) easily justified from a purely artistic = view?   Tenth: Assuming the inclusion of a single pure 32' stop is affordable, feasible and desirable, would it be best to specify a reed or flue stop = of 32' pitch?   Eleventh: Given a well thought-out specification in all other respects, = and cost aside (!), would the addition of a five-rank mixture to the [proposed] Choir division (to supplement a three rank mixture) take precedence over the addition of an additional 16' reed in the pedal?   Twelfth: Again cost aside, what are the advantages/disadvantages to the visible (facade pipes -- 16 and 8 feet) being made from largely pure tin versus "normal" pipe metal. Can the last octave (down) of a 16' principal stop support is own weight if mad of pure tin?   Thirteenth: What is the importance of the metal composition (e.g. 60/40 tin/lead) of non-display pipes. Cost aside, is there an optimum pipe metal =   mixture for all principal stops? What -- if any -- difference can be achieved (or heard) with display (diapson) pipes of pure polished tin?   Fourteenth: What percentage (generally) of organ literature benefits significantly from a full-length resonator horizontal reed? Is such a stop =   *generally* worth the extra expense?   I appreciate your thoughtful responses to this questions.   Daniel Pitzer, PhD., DM., D Mus. Chairman, Adjunct Organ Committee Co-Chairman, Architectural Planning Committee St. John's Cathedral, ECUS San Francisco/Novato            
(back) Subject: "overblowing" or harmonic pipes From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 22:26:12 EST   Dear PipeChatters:   David Pitzer asked about the term "overblowing," as it applies to organ pipes. When a pipe is too forcibly blown, usually due to a large toe-hole = and low cut-up, it skips the fundamental (prime) and speaks the next AVAILABLE =   overtone. In open pipes, this is the octave; in stopped pipes, this is = the twelfth (stopped pipes propagate only their odd partials, giving them = their characteristic tone). Therefore, if an open 2' C pipe is overblown, it will speak -approximately- a 2' C, and if a stoppered or capped 2' C pipe is = overblown it will speak -approximately- a 1-1/3' G. If this effect is neither = desired nor pre-engineered into the pipe, consider it poor voicing. If the intent = is to produce a specific tone color, here are some engineering and voicing particulars: For the Flute Harmonique (Harmonic Flute, Querfloete, Traversfloete, Flauto Armonico), a "node hole" is introduced at the harmonic node of the pipes, which at a certain point in the treble compass, are built to approximately double length. The node hole is actually FOUR FIFTHS = (4/5)of the way UP the pipe body from the languid, not smack in the middle. The diameter of the node hole can vary, as can its placement. I have most = often seen them placed at the front of the pipe, although I have seen two rows = of three small holes pierced at the SIDES of the pipe at the nodal point. = Most recently, I saw a set of pipes, allegedly from 1872, in which a square = flap of pipe metal was cut at the node and simply bent outward like a tiny = awning. Hook and Hastings patented a 4' Orchestral Flute, in which a small = tube, fed from the foot of the pipe, is actually formed into a set of lips, or = an embouchure, which directs a wind stream across a CIRCULAR mouth on a = harmonic open metal pipe. I have seen one complete set, still preserved in an endangered organ, and I fear for its fate. While wooden harmonic flutes are common in American pipe organs from = the 1920s and 1930s, Mr. Skinner consistently fashioned his out of common = metal or (I believe?) tickside-out shellac-coated lead in his 4' and 2' samples. Overblowing STOPPED pipes are rare, because they take up a great deal = of material for little gained effect. The Zauberfloete, as made by William Thynne, featured a stopped wooden bass with bored stoppers, in the manner = of a Rohrgedackt, and a harmonic stopped metal treble. It was a stopped metal =   treble, not capped -- stoppers with cork gaskets, rather than felted or papered canister caps. These pipes also featured nodal borings. Quintadenas, or Quintatens, are NOT harmonic. In fact, they are meant = to overblow sufficiently so as to make the twelfth as prominent as the fundamental (remember, capped pipes skip their octave). This is achieved mostly by smaller scales and lower cut-ups. Many a gritty, asthmatic = Ernest White Quintaton or Nason Flute has had its cutup raised, transforming the stop into a lovely and useful Stopped Diapason or Gedeckt. Harmonic reeds are completely different kettle of knishes, but alas, I = am tired, and this is probably more information than you wanted, so thus = endeth the rambling for the evening.   Sebastian Matthaus Gluck New York City  
(back) Subject: CORRECTION: "overblowing pipes" From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 22:36:45 EST   "Therefore, if an open 2' C pipe is overblown, it will speak = -approximately- a 2' C, and if a stoppered or capped 2' C pipe is overblown it will speak -approximately- a 1-1/3' G" SHOULD ACTUALLY READ: "Therefore, if an open 2' C pipe is overblown, it will speak = -approximately- a 1' C, and if a stoppered or capped 2' C pipe is overblown it will speak -approximately- a 2/3' G."   Mea culpa. Mea culpa maxima. Mea culpa maxima harmonique celeste. SMG, now in Proofreaders' Penitentiary  
(back) Subject: Re: slider chests From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 22:52:24 EST   Dear Daniel   Slider chests can be made either electric or tracker. In either case pipe speech is the over riding factor. Facade pipes are tubed off from a wind chest to the facade. In pipes over 4' long, Hoyt Metal or Aluminum is used and highly polished and coated with laquer, and hoisted into place using gloves to prevent finger prints. Heavy tin pipes eventually crush the pipe feet causing a general collapse of the pipe. Tracker couplers add greatly to the weight of the manual touch, so Barker or electric levers are used to lighten the key touch. In all mechaical coupling the other manuals ghost play as the coupled manual is played, even pedal couplers, and manual 16' or 4' couplers. The pedals would speak differently from the manuals if they were electric and the manuals tracker. Resultants on tracker action use real pipes. On 32' stops, a full length or stopped flue after about 45-50 ranks, 32' reed at about 60 ranks full length. En Chamade of limited use, consider it a luxury and the last stop considered. As for pure tin stops, strings may benefit from nearly pure tin. Display Diapasons and Principals would benfit from harder material such as Hoyt Metal or in use now highly polished Aluminum. Pure tin is a misnomer, you have to put something with it like lead for it to maintain it's shape. Most Principal work is 50/50 tin and lead spotted metal. Tin dents easily to the touch or in packing and moving. As for the mixture of five ranks VS an additional 16' pedal reed, if the organ were electric action a swell or choir reed could be borrowed to the pedal on a unit = chest. I don't know the politics of a second mixture of 5 ranks on a choir division, so I'll leave that alone.   Fine organ building is just that, choices have to be made, and ensambles forged for intended purposes, and choruses built. Favorite stops have to take a back seat to well thought out logic, and intended purpose. I think you can see that well enough. To build an organ with favorite stops or ones someone has down the street, may not work on a given project, thus the art of registration.   I hope my advise helps,   Ron Severin  
(back) Subject: RE: slider chests From: "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 21:55:16 -0600   > Third: In an organ employing slider stop action, tracker key > action, how is > wind provided to a rank (or partial rank) of display or facade > pipes whose > feet do not set on the windchest?   Tubing from the chest to the pipe. EP organs also have this. I play on one, myself.   > Fourth: Given tracker action and that a "Manual 1" is coupled to > a "Manual > 2" -- do the keys of Manual 1 necessarily physically "move" when the > corresponding key on Manual 2 is depressed. In other words, is the = manual > coupling necessarily "visual"?   I think this is a purely mechanical issue, whereas the key pulls the upper manual's key down to make it play as opposed to other styles. I defer to the experts on this, though.   > Fifth: Referring to the fourth question above -- does the same answer > pertain to Pedal-to-manual coupling?   See above.   > Sixth: Again assuming a purely tracker-action organ --- is the force > required to depress the keys of a manual coupled to one or more other > manuals significantly (or noticeably) larger than if the manual > were played > "alone"? If so, is the additional force burdensome or restrictive to > certain fingering -- such as staccato?   Yes, because there is more pressure put on the key via the pallets. The more stops that are open, the greater the force of the wind against the pallets.     > Seventh: What, if any, are the disadvantages to having a pedal > division on > electric or elecro-pneumatic action while the manuals are on pure = tracker > action?   Would it matter in the pedal? I wonder?   > Tenth: Assuming the inclusion of a single pure 32' stop is affordable, > feasible and desirable, would it be best to specify a reed or > flue stop of > 32' pitch?   I've heard both, and there is a significant difference in sound of a reed vs. a flue.   > Fourteenth: What percentage (generally) of organ literature benefits > significantly from a full-length resonator horizontal reed? Is > such a stop > *generally* worth the extra expense?   Go for full length...you apparently lose harmonics. I can't say I've = heard them side-by-side to make a real distinction, though, but I've always been told to go for the full, if you can.   Regards, Jeff    
(back) Subject: Re: Shocking Facts From: <Cremona502@cs.com> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 22:57:18 EST     --part1_43.457c24c.2965309e_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Mike, The double mouth Diapason has two mouths placed side by side, sort of in a =   "corner" position. I've only seen a picture (drawing). The only actual pipe I've seen constructed like this was in the case of an organ at the Boston OHS convention, and I think the pipe was a dummy. The idea is similar to a Doppelflute, but the mouths are placed adjacent rather than opposite to each other. If I find the picture I'll make you a copy.   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Duncan, Miles, Molly & Dewi http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/baskerbargains Please visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/   --part1_43.457c24c.2965309e_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>Mike, <BR>The double mouth Diapason has two mouths placed side by side, sort of = in a "corner" position. &nbsp;I've only seen a picture (drawing). = &nbsp;&nbsp;The only actual pipe I've seen constructed like this was in = the case of an organ at the Boston OHS convention, and I think the pipe = was a dummy. &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;The idea is similar to a Doppelflute, = but the mouths are placed adjacent rather than opposite to each other. = &nbsp;&nbsp;If I find the picture I'll make you a copy. <BR> <BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" <BR>Duncan, Miles, Molly &amp; Dewi = &nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/baskerbargains <BR>Please visit Howling Acres at = &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/ <BR> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></HTML>   --part1_43.457c24c.2965309e_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: slider chests From: "Roger Brown" <rbrown7@bigpond.net.au> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2002 15:09:26 +1100   DP> Seventh: What, if any, are the disadvantages to having a pedal = division on DP> electric or elecro-pneumatic action while the manuals are on pure = tracker DP> action?   That's what is done in my house organ (see web page).   Advantage - more compact. I went with the builder's recommendation on = this - he felt that the space available would cause difficulty in providing a = reliable mechanical pedal action.   Disadvantage - there can sometimes be a slight but noticeable = lack of synchronization between pedal speech and the speech of any manual = division coupled to the pedal (the coupling is mechanical). Occasionally playing a = pedal note, even in normal use, you might hear the pedal stop sound slightly = ahead of or behind the coupled manual.   I usually get the builder to slightly adjust the pedal action for this at = tuning visits, which for this instrument are annual.       Regards,     Roger   Roger Brown rbrown7@bigpond.net.au http://rogerbrown.tripod.com      
(back) Subject: RE: slider chests From: "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 22:13:29 -0600   Ron, are you sure about the aluminum? I've had it suggested to me by an individual that it would be good for replacing our bottom 6 16' principal facade pipes, but I was told by Tim and David that they're hard to voice. Our facade is made of zinc, and I've seen copper and other metals used. I won't dispute the collapsing of the tin, but I haven't heard of that happening. What is Hoyt metal? Going back to the zinc, the reason they collapsed, as you have adequately described below, is because the zinc = from Germany back in the mid-80's was too soft. Only now are we finding out = what impact that has. Interestingly, the next 6 notes, and the rest of the facade, for that matter, seem to be unaffected. We're having them = replaced by 6 new zinc pipes made by A. R. Schopp. I know he has a good reputation for pipe building.   The 100-year old facade at my previous position, Holy Cross, has a big facade, and I'm sure those are tin, with perhaps some lead mixed in, but I don't have any documentation on that. That's why it caught my eye about = the tin collapsing. That facade is still standing as straight as it did in 1902.   Just some other input on this...very interesting topic!   Respectfully, Jeff   >In pipes over 4' long, Hoyt Metal or > Aluminum is used and highly polished and coated with laquer, and > hoisted into place using gloves to prevent finger prints. Heavy tin > pipes eventually crush the pipe feet causing a general collapse of > the pipe.    
(back) Subject: RE: Shocking Facts From: "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 22:14:43 -0600   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_000E_01C193DA.E0FFD220 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   I've seen something like you're describing (Doppelflute), but they were opposite...one on each side, front and back. Or is this what you meant by "adjacent"? Just confused a little here. :-D     Jeff Mike, The double mouth Diapason has two mouths placed side by side, sort of in = a "corner" position. I've only seen a picture (drawing). The only actual pipe I've seen constructed like this was in the case of an organ at the Boston OHS convention, and I think the pipe was a dummy. The idea is similar to a Doppelflute, but the mouths are placed adjacent rather than opposite to each other. If I find the picture I'll make you a copy.   Bruce Cornely ~ Cremona502@cs.com with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, Bohawow!" Duncan, Miles, Molly & Dewi http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/baskerbargains Please visit Howling Acres at http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/     ------=3D_NextPart_000_000E_01C193DA.E0FFD220 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type content=3D3D"text/html; =3D charset=3D3Dus-ascii"> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=3D3DGENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY> <DIV><SPAN class=3D3D340451304-03012002><FONT face=3D3DArial = color=3D3D#0000ff =3D size=3D3D2>I've=3D20 seen something like you're describing (Doppelflute), but they were=3D20 opposite...one on each side, front and back.&nbsp; Or is this what you =3D meant by=3D20 "adjacent"?&nbsp; Just confused a little here. :-D</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=3D3D340451304-03012002></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=3D3D340451304-03012002><FONT face=3D3DArial = color=3D3D#0000ff =3D   size=3D3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=3D3D340451304-03012002><FONT face=3D3DArial = color=3D3D#0000ff =3D   size=3D3D2>Jeff</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE=3D20 style=3D3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px = =3D solid"> <DIV class=3D3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3D3Dltr = align=3D3Dleft><FONT=3D20 face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D3D2>Mike, <BR>The double mouth =3D Diapason has two=3D20 mouths placed side by side, sort of in a "corner" position. &nbsp;I've = =3D only=3D20 seen a picture (drawing). &nbsp;&nbsp;The only actual pipe I've = seen=3D20 constructed like this was in the case of an organ at the Boston OHS=3D20 convention, and I think the pipe was a dummy. =3D &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;The idea=3D20 is similar to a Doppelflute, but the mouths are placed adjacent rather = =3D than=3D20 opposite to each other. &nbsp;&nbsp;If I find the picture I'll make =3D you a=3D20 copy. <BR><BR>Bruce Cornely &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~ =3D &nbsp;Cremona502@cs.com=3D20 &nbsp; <BR>with the Baskerbeagles in the Beagle's Nest ~ ""Haruffaroo, = =3D   Bohawow!" <BR>Duncan, Miles, Molly &amp; Dewi=3D20 &nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/baskerbargains <BR>Please =3D visit=3D20 Howling Acres at &nbsp;&nbsp;http://members.tripod.com/Brucon502/=3D20 <BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT> </FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_000E_01C193DA.E0FFD220--    
(back) Subject: RE: definitions From: "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 22:15:53 -0600   > Dear List, > Several people have criticised my definitions of pipe tone while I've = been > on this List - just a few weeks of membership, with one person = suggesting > that maybe my postings aren't worth reading.   Ross, it's difficult to soar with eagles when you're stuck with the = turkeys, isn't it? Don't let it get you down. I enjoy your posts...and it's nice = to get something besides just the American perspective at times!   Happy New Year! :-)   Jeff    
(back) Subject: Re: slider chests From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 23:35:55 EST   Hi Jeff   They said difficult to voice, but not impossible. Buzard just completed a large Catholic organ recently with a very large Aluminum polished facade. Hoyt metal is very strong and can give a silvery look too in facade pipes. Hermann Schlicker used Hoyt Metal in All Saints Episcopal, Pasadena, CA.   Zinc has been the metal of choice for bass pipes below 4' C because of it's stiffness. If the walls are too thin, I suppose acids in the air = could eventually cause them to powder and crumble although you just described such. A good wash and relacquring will preserve them longer. If they are powdery a professional can give a very light acid wash, soap and water wash and relacquer.   Ron Severin  
(back) Subject: Re: definitions From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 23:41:31 EST   Hi Jeff   A thought about the Facade pipes in 100 yr. old Holy Cross, Could they have been silverleafed zinc pipes? I know pure tin that big would never handle the weight.   Ron  
(back) Subject: Songle, Doppel, Tropple From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2002 00:06:42 EST   Are you asking about Doppelflotes? Double-mouthed pipes with adjacent = mouths (ala Seraphonpfeiffen)? Double mouthed pipes of dual tonality (ala Ludwigtonen), or DOUBLE-LANGUID stops such as the high pressure diapasons = of the 1920s? These are very different questions, they all seem to be jumbled =   back and forth... SMG  
(back) Subject: RE: definitions From: "Jeff White" <reedstop@prodigy.net> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 23:09:36 -0600   > A thought about the Facade pipes in 100 yr. old Holy Cross, > Could they have been silverleafed zinc pipes? I know pure tin that > big would never handle the weight.   I'm not sure, to be honest. Anyone know what Kilgen normally used back in the early part of the 20th century??   Jeff