PipeChat Digest #2919 - Wednesday, June 19, 2002
 
Re: Correction to My Narrative! Okra revisited!
  by <Chicaleee@aol.com>
Re: Digital creativity
  by <Chicaleee@aol.com>
Re: Shining on
  by <MyrtleBeachMusic@aol.com>
Re: Shining on
  by "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net>
Shining with organ and worship
  by <MyrtleBeachMusic@aol.com>
Re: Correction to My Narrative! Okra revisited!
  by "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net>
Re: Digital creativity
  by <PHarri5833@aol.com>
Re: Shining with organ and worship
  by <Pologaptommy@aol.com>
Re: Congregations run amok
  by <Wurlibird1@aol.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Correction to My Narrative! Okra revisited! From: <Chicaleee@aol.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 00:34:57 EDT     --part1_10c.1396de5c.2a4163f1_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   I'm not supposed to eat fried "things," either, but I don't consider okra = a "thing." It is a delicacy.   A little about church music: When I started playing for the church where = I am now, 15 years ago, the services were traditional, using hymns from the hymnal and a few choruses. Sunday night we had the praise and worship = band, the "polka" band, and 2 of the youth singing their original song. For all = I was needed was the Postlude. This is only once a month. The rest of the time we use mostly choruses and a few hymns from the hymnal, but I do traditional organ repertoire most of the time. Once in a while I throw in = a "rip roaring" gospel/jazz rendition of an old hymn, usually my own arrangement, making the old Allen sound like a "B3." If I were younger = and starting out, rather in my last years, I would go east where the services = are still traditional and organists are still respected members of the staff. =   But, where do we go from here? Lee   --part1_10c.1396de5c.2a4163f1_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>I'm not supposed to eat = fried "things," either, but I don't consider okra a "thing." &nbsp;It is a = delicacy. &nbsp; <BR> <BR>A little about church music: &nbsp;When I started playing for the = church where I am now, 15 years ago, the services were traditional, using = hymns from the hymnal and a few choruses. &nbsp;Sunday night we had the = praise and worship band, the "polka" band, and 2 of the youth singing = their original song. &nbsp;For all I was needed was the Postlude. = &nbsp;This is only once a month. &nbsp;The rest of the time we use mostly = choruses and a few hymns from the hymnal, but I do traditional organ = repertoire most of the time. &nbsp;Once in a while I throw in a "rip = roaring" gospel/jazz rendition of an old hymn, usually my own arrangement, = making the old Allen sound like a "B3." &nbsp;If I were younger and = starting out, rather in my last years, I would go east where the services = are still traditional and organists are still respected members of the = staff. &nbsp;But, where do we go from here? &nbsp;Lee</FONT></HTML>   --part1_10c.1396de5c.2a4163f1_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Digital creativity From: <Chicaleee@aol.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 01:02:55 EDT     --part1_150.f93150d.2a416a7f_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   Bruce, I agree thoroughly with you regarding those hymns that we sing less =   seldom than in the past. With some of the choruses we hear it is a matter = of being selective rather than adding them to your list. Lee   --part1_150.f93150d.2a416a7f_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>Bruce, I agree = thoroughly with you regarding those hymns that we sing less seldom than in = the past. &nbsp;With some of the choruses we hear it is a matter of being = selective rather than adding them to your list. &nbsp;Lee</FONT></HTML>   --part1_150.f93150d.2a416a7f_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Shining on From: <MyrtleBeachMusic@aol.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 01:07:48 EDT     --part1_160.f66935e.2a416ba4_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 6/18/2002 9:59:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jhaileya10@charter.net writes:     > This may even have to be done at the expense of using the sanctuary > where an organ may be available, heaven forbid. Songs such as this make = a > person feel good. Great. Nothing wrong with that, except that this is a > human feeling that is short lived and does nothing to help the soul. > Although, I see absolutely nothing wrong with feeling good about Jesus > Christ. And since this is a program, as opposed to a service, it would = not > hurt to maybe throw a little catechism in with a little of the "whys" on > certain traditions. > > Now then, when the weekend comes and it is time for "regular" worship, = the > singing is strictly hymns from the appropriate sources. We now make our > soul > feel good instead of our body. We know and understand that this service = is > Soli Deo Gloria. Therefore, we conduct ourselves in this manner and all > material used is to proclaim the Gospel. But, at the same time, we have > whetted our body's appetite to feel good, and we know that there will be = a > more appropriate time to sing those songs that we enjoy, but are not > appropriate for the service.   I would love to know where this notion of "if it feels good to the = worshiper then it must not be glorifying God" comes from. I've 'heard' several = people comment to the same during this thread and it's quite disturbing. I would =   dare say that the traditional hymns 'feel good' to you and that's okay, = but Shine, Jesus, Shine doesn't so it's bad and not appropriate for worship.   Keep in mind I love the traditional stuff and would defend it vigorously = if anyone tried to completely banish it from my church's worship, however I = can recognize that some of this contemporary music has a great message, IS = valid in worship, and deserves just as much of an open mind from us and we = expect (usually in vain) from a congregation when introducing a new traditional-sounding hymn.   I would also contend that songs such as these actually CAN and DO = encourage people to dig deeper and go the next step in the christian journey. One = only has to read the book about the song by the same name, "Shout to the Lord" = to realize this.   Criticize as you will, but consider that your judgements of = appropriateness might really just be a musical, bias-influenced judgement.   Jeremy   --part1_160.f66935e.2a416ba4_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">In a message dated 6/18/2002 9:59:39 PM Eastern = Daylight Time, jhaileya10@charter.net writes:<BR> <BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">This may even have = to be done at the expense of using the sanctuary<BR> where an organ may be available, heaven forbid.&nbsp; Songs such as this = make a<BR> person feel good.&nbsp; Great. Nothing wrong with that, except that this = is a<BR> human feeling that is short lived and does nothing to help the soul.<BR> Although, I see absolutely nothing wrong with feeling good about Jesus<BR> Christ.&nbsp; And since this is a program, as opposed to a service, it = would not<BR> hurt to maybe throw a little catechism in with a little of the "whys" = on<BR> certain traditions.<BR> <BR> Now then, when the weekend comes and it is time for "regular" worship, = the<BR> singing is strictly hymns from the appropriate sources. We now make our = soul<BR> feel good instead of our body.&nbsp; We know and understand that this = service is<BR> Soli Deo Gloria.&nbsp; Therefore, we conduct ourselves in this manner and = all<BR> material used is to proclaim the Gospel.&nbsp; But, at the same time, we = have<BR> whetted our body's appetite to feel good, and we know that there will be = a<BR> more appropriate time to sing those songs that we enjoy, but are not<BR> appropriate for the service.</BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BR> I would love to know where this notion of "if it feels good to the = worshiper then it must not be glorifying God" comes from.&nbsp; I've = 'heard' several people comment to the same during this thread and it's = quite disturbing.&nbsp; I would dare say that the traditional hymns 'feel = good' to you and that's okay, but Shine, Jesus, Shine doesn't so it's bad = and not appropriate for worship.<BR> <BR> Keep in mind I love the traditional stuff and would defend it vigorously = if anyone tried to completely banish it from my church's worship, however = I can recognize that some of this contemporary music has a great message, = IS valid in worship, and deserves just as much of an open mind from us and = we expect (usually in vain) from a congregation when introducing a new = traditional-sounding hymn.<BR> <BR> I would also contend that songs such as these actually CAN and DO = encourage people to dig deeper and go the next step in the christian = journey.&nbsp; One only has to read the book about the song by the same = name, "Shout to the Lord" to realize this.<BR> <BR> Criticize as you will, but consider that your judgements of = appropriateness might really just be a musical, bias-influenced = judgement.<BR> <BR> Jeremy</FONT></HTML>   --part1_160.f66935e.2a416ba4_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Shining on From: "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 01:17:45 -0500   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0005_01C2172F.1E45FC40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   No Jeremy, in this instance, music has nothing to do with it. And it is = =3D not necessarily one song in particular that is necessarily the problem. = =3D However, one leads to another, and if it is not checked, pretty soon =3D there is no longer any worship service, but rather a service in which =3D the focus becomes feel good, as opposed to worship.=3D20   That is why the good Lord decided that denominations best serve his =3D will. Because people worship in different ways.   Jim H   ----- Original Message -----=3D20 From: MyrtleBeachMusic@aol.com=3D20 To: pipechat@pipechat.org=3D20 Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2002 12:07 AM Subject: Re: Shining on     In a message dated 6/18/2002 9:59:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, =3D jhaileya10@charter.net writes:     Criticize as you will, but consider that your judgements of =3D appropriateness might really just be a musical, bias-influenced =3D judgement.   Jeremy=3D20   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0005_01C2172F.1E45FC40 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type content=3D3D"text/html; =3D charset=3D3Diso-8859-1"> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>No Jeremy, in this instance, music = has =3D nothing to=3D20 do with it.&nbsp; And it is not necessarily one song in particular that = =3D is=3D20 necessarily the problem.&nbsp; However, one leads to another, and if it = =3D is not=3D20 checked, pretty soon there is no longer any worship service, but rather = =3D a=3D20 service in which the focus becomes feel good, as opposed to=3D20 worship.&nbsp;</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>That is why the good Lord decided = that=3D20 denominations best serve his will.&nbsp; Because people worship in =3D different=3D20 ways.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>Jim H</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE=3D20 style=3D3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =3D BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV=3D20 style=3D3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =3D black"><B>From:</B>=3D20 <A title=3D3DMyrtleBeachMusic@aol.com=3D20 href=3D3D"mailto:MyrtleBeachMusic@aol.com">MyrtleBeachMusic@aol.com</A> = =3D </DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =3D title=3D3Dpipechat@pipechat.org=3D20 href=3D3D"mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org">pipechat@pipechat.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, June 19, 2002 = =3D 12:07=3D20 AM</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Shining on</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT lang=3D3D0 =3D face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2=3D20 FAMILY=3D3D"SANSSERIF">In a message dated 6/18/2002 9:59:39 PM Eastern = =3D Daylight=3D20 Time, <A =3D href=3D3D"mailto:jhaileya10@charter.net">jhaileya10@charter.net</A>=3D20 writes:<BR><BR><BR>Criticize as you will, but consider that your =3D judgements of=3D20 appropriateness might really just be a musical, bias-influenced=3D20 judgement.<BR><BR>Jeremy</FONT> </FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0005_01C2172F.1E45FC40--    
(back) Subject: Shining with organ and worship From: <MyrtleBeachMusic@aol.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 01:57:40 EDT     --part1_f7.1cee7033.2a417754_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 6/18/2002 9:59:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jhaileya10@charter.net writes:     > This may even have to be done at the expense of using the sanctuary > where an organ may be available, heaven forbid. Songs such as this make = a > person feel good. Great. Nothing wrong with that, except that this is a > human feeling that is short lived and does nothing to help the soul. > Although, I see absolutely nothing wrong with feeling good about Jesus > Christ. And since this is a program, as opposed to a service, it would = not > hurt to maybe throw a little catechism in with a little of the "whys" on > certain traditions. > > Now then, when the weekend comes and it is time for "regular" worship, = the > singing is strictly hymns from the appropriate sources. We now make our > soul > feel good instead of our body. We know and understand that this service = is > Soli Deo Gloria. Therefore, we conduct ourselves in this manner and all > material used is to proclaim the Gospel. But, at the same time, we have > whetted our body's appetite to feel good, and we know that there will be = a > more appropriate time to sing those songs that we enjoy, but are not > appropriate for the service.   I would love to know where this notion of "if it feels good to the = worshiper then it must not be glorifying God" comes from. I've 'heard' several = people comment to the same during this thread and it's quite disturbing. I would =   dare say that the traditional hymns 'feel good' to you and that's okay, = but Shine, Jesus, Shine doesn't so it's bad and not appropriate for worship.   Keep in mind I love the traditional stuff and would defend it vigorously = if anyone tried to completely banish it from my church's worship, however I = can recognize that some of this contemporary music has a great message, IS = valid in worship, and deserves just as much of an open mind from us and we = expect (usually in vain) from a congregation when introducing a new traditional-sounding hymn.   I would also contend that songs such as these actually CAN and DO = encourage people to dig deeper and go the next step in the christian journey. One = only has to read the book about the song by the same name, "Shout to the Lord" = to realize this.   Criticize as you will, but consider that your judgements of = appropriateness might really just be a musical, bias-influenced judgement.   Jeremy   --part1_f7.1cee7033.2a417754_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">In a message dated 6/18/2002 9:59:39 PM Eastern = Daylight Time, jhaileya10@charter.net writes:<BR> <BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">This may even have = to be done at the expense of using the sanctuary<BR> where an organ may be available, heaven forbid.&nbsp; Songs such as this = make a<BR> person feel good.&nbsp; Great. Nothing wrong with that, except that this = is a<BR> human feeling that is short lived and does nothing to help the soul.<BR> Although, I see absolutely nothing wrong with feeling good about Jesus<BR> Christ.&nbsp; And since this is a program, as opposed to a service, it = would not<BR> hurt to maybe throw a little catechism in with a little of the "whys" = on<BR> certain traditions.<BR> <BR> Now then, when the weekend comes and it is time for "regular" worship, = the<BR> singing is strictly hymns from the appropriate sources. We now make our = soul<BR> feel good instead of our body.&nbsp; We know and understand that this = service is<BR> Soli Deo Gloria.&nbsp; Therefore, we conduct ourselves in this manner and = all<BR> material used is to proclaim the Gospel.&nbsp; But, at the same time, we = have<BR> whetted our body's appetite to feel good, and we know that there will be = a<BR> more appropriate time to sing those songs that we enjoy, but are not<BR> appropriate for the service.</BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BR> I would love to know where this notion of "if it feels good to the = worshiper then it must not be glorifying God" comes from.&nbsp; I've = 'heard' several people comment to the same during this thread and it's = quite disturbing.&nbsp; I would dare say that the traditional hymns 'feel = good' to you and that's okay, but Shine, Jesus, Shine doesn't so it's bad = and not appropriate for worship.<BR> <BR> Keep in mind I love the traditional stuff and would defend it vigorously = if anyone tried to completely banish it from my church's worship, however = I can recognize that some of this contemporary music has a great message, = IS valid in worship, and deserves just as much of an open mind from us and = we expect (usually in vain) from a congregation when introducing a new = traditional-sounding hymn.<BR> <BR> I would also contend that songs such as these actually CAN and DO = encourage people to dig deeper and go the next step in the christian = journey.&nbsp; One only has to read the book about the song by the same = name, "Shout to the Lord" to realize this.<BR> <BR> Criticize as you will, but consider that your judgements of = appropriateness might really just be a musical, bias-influenced = judgement.<BR> <BR> Jeremy </FONT></HTML> --part1_f7.1cee7033.2a417754_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Correction to My Narrative! Okra revisited! From: "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 01:38:46 -0500   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0025_01C21732.0DC7D980 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   I wish I had an answer Lee, because I agree with you. =3D20   Jim H ----- Original Message -----=3D20 From: Chicaleee@aol.com=3D20 To: pipechat@pipechat.org=3D20 Sent: Tuesday, June 18, 2002 11:34 PM Subject: Re: Correction to My Narrative! Okra revisited!     I would go east where the services are still traditional and organists = =3D are still respected members of the staff. But, where do we go from =3D here? Lee=3D20   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0025_01C21732.0DC7D980 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type content=3D3D"text/html; =3D charset=3D3Diso-8859-1"> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>I wish I had an answer Lee, because I = =3D agree with=3D20 you.&nbsp; </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3DArial size=3D3D2>Jim H</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE=3D20 style=3D3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =3D BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV=3D20 style=3D3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =3D black"><B>From:</B>=3D20 <A title=3D3DChicaleee@aol.com=3D20 href=3D3D"mailto:Chicaleee@aol.com">Chicaleee@aol.com</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =3D title=3D3Dpipechat@pipechat.org=3D20 href=3D3D"mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org">pipechat@pipechat.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, June 18, 2002 = =3D 11:34=3D20 PM</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Correction to My = =3D Narrative!=3D20 Okra revisited!</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D3D2>I would = go =3D east where=3D20 the services are still traditional and organists are still respected =3D members=3D20 of the staff. &nbsp;But, where do we go from here? &nbsp;Lee</FONT>=3D20 </FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0025_01C21732.0DC7D980--    
(back) Subject: Re: Digital creativity From: <PHarri5833@aol.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 02:20:24 EDT     --part1_10c.1392c26c.2a417ca8_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 19/06/02 01:37:40 GMT Daylight Time, "Richard Jordan" < mail@gesangbuch.org> writes:     > I believe I have guitar chords for anything you could throw at me = certainly > for anything that a Lutheran would likely sing...   Transcribing all the Bach cantatas must have been quite a task. I think = I'd prefer traditional instrumentation though!   :-))   Peter M Harrison Organist and Director of Music, Emmanuel Church, Holcombe, Ramsbottom, GB & P H Music : 48 Moorfield : Edgworth Bolton : Lancs : BL7 0DH : GB fax: +44 (0)1204 853445 : tel: +44 (0)1204 853310 <A HREF=3D"http://www.phmusic.co.uk/">web: www.phmusic.co.uk</A> <A HREF=3D"mailto: peter@phmusic.co.uk">reply email: = peter@phmusic.co.uk</A>   --part1_10c.1392c26c.2a417ca8_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">In a message dated 19/06/02 01:37:40 GMT = Daylight Time, "Richard Jordan" &lt;mail@gesangbuch.org&gt; writes:<BR> <BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">I believe I have = guitar chords for anything you could throw at me certainly for anything = that a Lutheran would likely sing...</BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BR> Transcribing all the Bach cantatas must have been quite a task. I think = I'd prefer traditional instrumentation though!<BR> <BR> :-))<BR> <BR> Peter M Harrison<BR> Organist and Director of Music, Emmanuel Church, Holcombe, Ramsbottom, = GB<BR> &amp;<BR> P H Music : 48 Moorfield : Edgworth<BR> Bolton : Lancs : BL7 0DH : GB<BR> fax: +44 (0)1204 853445 : tel: +44 (0)1204 853310<BR> <A HREF=3D"http://www.phmusic.co.uk/">web: www.phmusic.co.uk</A><BR> <A HREF=3D"mailto: peter@phmusic.co.uk">reply email: = peter@phmusic.co.uk</A><BR> </FONT></HTML> --part1_10c.1392c26c.2a417ca8_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Shining with organ and worship From: <Pologaptommy@aol.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 02:23:08 EDT   I will make one final comment: As I said before, since we have had the interim Director of Music, we have =   done several different contemporary hymns, which are a far cry from what = most people call "Praize Choruses." These hymns are a joy for us to sing, and = the interim has added them right in with both morning services. They have = been accepted very will in our particular congregation, even though I feel that =   they will pass with time, we enjoy singing them. Many of the contemporary =   hymns that Brandon picks out have beautiful melodies, and the words are = taken directly from the Bible. And yes, we DO accompany many of these hymns = using the pipe organ. It gives me a chance to use the many ranks of strings and =   flutes that the pipe organ at my church has, even though the organ is not many ranks total. We often add the use of the piano, handbells, and Brass =   section to complete the overall affect of these hymns. What we have is simply beautiful, in every way. I just do not see how anything that is sung from our hearts to God, can be =   such a disagreeable subject. If you make your congregation happy to be at =   church, and look forward to the next service, then you have done your job. = I know of a few families that go to both morning services, along with the evening services at my church, just so they can enjoy the worship service again. If your congregation feels like it is a chore to come to church, = and church becomes something they think they HAVE to do-then we need to second-guess whether or not our current style of worship is a reflection = of our own personal tastes, or the congregations likes and dislikes. We will =   find that the congregations opinion on the matter is much, much more important than our own! :)   Thanks, Josh White FUMC, Graham TX www.fumcgraham.org; FUMC organ pics: www.geocities.com/polo_gap_tommie  
(back) Subject: Re: Congregations run amok From: <Wurlibird1@aol.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 02:33:10 EDT   Jeremy writes:   >Not directed at you Jim, but in general: <<   Your comments are not without merit, Jeremy, whether directed at me solely = or to the general audience. [I did not take offense to your post, not in the least.] For the record, I retired from the bench April 2001 after = forty-five years. My "reincarnation" is hopefully temporary and if not, it will = become so after the summer months. During these years I have fought the usual battles, winning some, losing some, and some were declared a draw. At present, there just aren't any battles that I want to fight with many of = the so-called "issues" so petty as not to justify a contradiction. But you do =   make a point worthy of consideration.   I sometimes wonder what would happen if, during one of our well planned, strict and structured services, the Holy Spirit would descend on us in = such compelling force as to free us from our self-regulated legalism. There = could be some present who would remind the Holy Spirit that "you are welcome to join us, but you will have to behave." As you aptly noted, Jeremy, this is not directed toward anyone specific, = but in general. Could we handle it?   Best wishes, Jim Pitts