PipeChat Digest #3245 - Tuesday, November 19, 2002
 
Re: Of Biggs, Bach and Blockwerk(longish)
  by "Ray Ahrens" <Ray_Ahrens@msn.com>
Re: Upcoming Handel's MESSIAH Performances (X-Posted)
  by "Roger Brown" <roger2@rogerbrown.no-ip.org>
Reveling in Ignorance?
  by "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net>
Re: Recital Programmes
  by <DudelK@aol.com>
Re: Fox & Biggs Interpretations
  by "Ray Ahrens" <Ray_Ahrens@msn.com>
Re: Fox, Biggs, and Authenticity
  by "Del Case" <dcase@puc.edu>
Re: Of Biggs, Bach and Blockwerk(longish)
  by <Gfc234@aol.com>
Re: Reveling in Ignorance?
  by "Russ Greene" <rggreene2@shaw.ca>
Re: Fox & Biggs Interpretations
  by <Gfc234@aol.com>
Re: Reveling in Ignorance?
  by <Gfc234@aol.com>
Re: Fox, Biggs, and Authenticity
  by <Gfc234@aol.com>
Re: Upcoming Handel's MESSIAH Performances (X-Posted)
  by "Ross & Lynda Wards" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Of Biggs, Bach and Blockwerk(longish) From: "Ray Ahrens" <Ray_Ahrens@msn.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 10:29:41 -0600   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_000D_01C28FB6.92A4F820 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable     If everyone were to play every thing to the best of our OWN knowldege = =3D and technique, there would be a whole lot more crappy recordings of =3D Bach.       That's all that any of us can do: play to the best of our abilities =3D and knowledge.           It's like telling a child, "Oh, you don't have to go to your history = =3D classes," or "never mind studying the constitution." It is just =3D irresponsible. Could you imagine ??? It is our job as organists to =3D prolong the sublime work of our predecessors, especially Bach. He =3D redefined the style of playing of every instrument he wrote for, in =3D particular keyboard instruments.     WHAT??? There is little known about Bach the performer: his genius =3D is in his compositions.       Just look at his contemporaries...Pachelbel, Vivaldi and many others = =3D couldn't hold a candel to Bach... The only 3 that were as revolutionary = =3D and wonderfully tasty as him were Domenico Scarlatti and Francois =3D Couperin (who were both direct contemporaries of Bach i.e. born in =3D 1685), and possibly Handel.=3D20   candel is spelled candle   You wrote:=3D20 reproducing what MAY have been in the specification?=3D20 F.Y.I.----Many organs built in Bach's time still survive in their =3D original condition. Ones that have been added on to or modified usually = =3D have a stoplist telling you what is new and what's old. For example at = =3D St. Sulpice in Paris, the organ was twice rebuilt, there are 3 stoplists = =3D hanging in the organ loft. In fact, a lot of pipework there is from =3D Cliquot (pretty old stuff!!!)=3D20   Where do you get your information, the back of a cereal box? Many =3D organs of Bach's time have been rebuilt with new actions, chests, =3D windlines, pipes, etc. Is that what you mean by original condition?     Overall, If we don't mind our manners, everone might just start to =3D play like Cameron Carpenter, and the beauty and truth of Bach and all =3D music will be distorted and diminished-He even had the nerve to add =3D notes to the Bach D major... There is no excuse for mediocrity or =3D playing something in a masturbatory style that just makes you feel good, = =3D or uses loud reeds and the 32' bombarde constantly to please highly =3D UNEDUCATED crowds. Just because a crowd likes something because they =3D know nothing about the real thing doesn't mean its good. We have =3D educate audiences about composers and proper practices and approach the = =3D music of Bach with such reverence and awe as if God has written it. He = =3D sure did inspire it.=3D20     If it weren't for the crowds, we wouldn't have any audience. You =3D should worry about your own manners.       History is important. It is our turn to prolong it.=3D20   It's better to learn from history, not repeat it.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_000D_01C28FB6.92A4F820 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type =3D content=3D3Dtext/html;charset=3D3Diso-8859-1> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY id=3D3DMailContainerBody=3D20 style=3D3D"FONT-WEIGHT: normal; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #000000; =3D BORDER-TOP-STYLE: none; FONT-STYLE: normal; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana; =3D BORDER-RIGHT-STYLE: none; BORDER-LEFT-STYLE: none; TEXT-DECORATION: =3D none; BORDER-BOTTOM-STYLE: none"=3D20 leftMargin=3D3D0 topMargin=3D3D0 acc_role=3D3D"text" = CanvasTabStop=3D3D"true"=3D20 name=3D3D"Compose message area"><?xml:namespace prefix=3D3D"v" =3D /><?xml:namespace prefix=3D3D"o" /> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3D3Dltr=3D20 style=3D3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =3D BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT = =3D size=3D3D2>If=3D20 everyone were to play every thing to the best of our OWN knowldege and =3D   technique, there would be a whole lot more crappy recordings of=3D20 Bach.</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT = =3D size=3D3D2>That's=3D20 all that any of us can do:&nbsp; play to the best of our abilities and = =3D   knowledge.</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;It's like telling a child, "Oh, you don't have to = =3D go to=3D20 your history classes," or "never mind studying the constitution." =3D &nbsp;It is=3D20 just irresponsible. Could you imagine ??? &nbsp;It is our job as =3D organists to=3D20 prolong the sublime work of our predecessors, especially Bach. =3D &nbsp;He=3D20 redefined the style of playing of every instrument he wrote for, in =3D particular=3D20 keyboard instruments.</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2>WHAT???&nbsp; There is little known about Bach the =3D performer:&nbsp; his=3D20 genius is in his compositions.</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT = face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;Just look at his contemporaries...Pachelbel, =3D Vivaldi and=3D20 many others couldn't hold a candel to Bach... The only 3 that were = as=3D20 revolutionary and wonderfully tasty as him were Domenico Scarlatti and = =3D   Francois Couperin (who were both direct contemporaries of Bach i.e. =3D born in=3D20 1685), and possibly Handel. <BR></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT = =3D size=3D3D2>candel=3D20 is spelled candle</DIV></FONT></FONT><FONT =3D face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT=3D20 size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3D3Dltr=3D20 style=3D3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =3D BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"><FONT=3D20 face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D3D2> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><BR>You wrote: <BR>reproducing what = =3D MAY have=3D20 been in the specification? <BR>F.Y.I.----Many organs built in Bach's =3D time=3D20 still survive in their original condition. &nbsp;Ones that have been =3D added on=3D20 to or modified usually have a stoplist telling you what is new and =3D what's old.=3D20 &nbsp;For example at St. Sulpice in Paris, the organ was twice =3D rebuilt, there=3D20 are 3 stoplists hanging in the organ loft. &nbsp;In fact, a lot of =3D pipework=3D20 there is from Cliquot (pretty old stuff!!!) =3D <BR></DIV></FONT></FONT><FONT=3D20 face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D3D2></FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=3D3Dltr=3D20 style=3D3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =3D BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D3D2>Where do you get = your =3D   information, the back of a cereal box?&nbsp; Many organs of Bach's =3D time have=3D20 been rebuilt with new actions, chests, windlines, pipes, etc.&nbsp; Is = =3D that=3D20 what you mean by original condition?</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D3D2>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><BR>Overall, If we don't mind our =3D manners,=3D20 everone might just start to play like Cameron Carpenter, and the =3D beauty and=3D20 truth of Bach and all music will be distorted and diminished-He even =3D had the=3D20 nerve to add notes to the Bach D major... &nbsp;There is no excuse for = =3D   mediocrity or playing something in a masturbatory style that just =3D makes you=3D20 feel good, or uses loud reeds and the 32' bombarde constantly to =3D please highly=3D20 UNEDUCATED crowds. &nbsp;Just because a crowd likes something because = =3D they=3D20 know nothing about the real thing doesn't mean its good. &nbsp;We have = =3D educate=3D20 audiences about composers and proper practices and approach the music = =3D of Bach=3D20 with such reverence and awe as if God has written it. &nbsp;He sure =3D did=3D20 inspire it. <BR></DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial">&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial">If it weren't for the crowds, we =3D wouldn't have=3D20 any audience.&nbsp; You should worry about your own manners.</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial">&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial">&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><BR>History is important. &nbsp;It is = =3D our turn=3D20 to prolong it. <BR></DIV> <DIV style=3D3D"FONT: 10pt arial">It's better to learn from history, not = =3D repeat=3D20 it.</DIV></FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_000D_01C28FB6.92A4F820--  
(back) Subject: Re: Upcoming Handel's MESSIAH Performances (X-Posted) From: "Roger Brown" <roger2@rogerbrown.no-ip.org> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 04:00:46 +1100     Richard Schneider> In that case, I certainly wish you were closer to us = then Australia!   Wash your mouth out - he's in New Zealand (with the sheep <VBG>)!   -- Regards, Roger   Roger Brown roger2@rogerbrown.no-ip.org http://rogerbrown.tripod.com http://member.melbpc.org.au/~robrown/    
(back) Subject: Reveling in Ignorance? From: "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 11:16:39 -0600   That was my post that seems to have upset you. I am NOT reveling in ignorance; I would welcome the opportunity to hear the Widor Toccata, but I don't have a recording of it, and I have not been to a concert where it was programmed. After hearing so many enthusiastic endorsements of it, I probably will purchase a recording of it.   But I fail to see that I am "reveling in ignorance" if Widor, Vierne, et. al. don't appeal to me. I listen to it, but it simply doesn't float my boat. That doesn't make me a cultural Philistine; it means I prefer the baroque and classical periods of music. And most of my limited budget for purchasing recordings is going to go primarily to what I like to hear.   I'm not a professional organist; I am an amateur in the original sense of the term--a lover of the organ--not just the sound, but the history, the construction, the design. I didn't know it was such a terrible thing not to be familiar with the entire organ repertoire and to like some pieces and styles better than others.   Dennis Steckley ________________________ From: "Steve Chandler" <stevec@open-tech.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 09:58:20 -0600 I mostly lurk this list, but two messages in two days have really annoyed me. Yesterday someone wrote that they hadn't ever heard the Widor Tocatta and that most of the music of Widor, Vierne, etc. didn't appeal to them. It struck me that the poster was revelling in their own ignorance, but I was able to choose to ignore that and let them.      
(back) Subject: Re: Recital Programmes From: <DudelK@aol.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 12:16:33 -0500   And how could I have failed to mention the Lyric Interlude by Alexander = Schreiner. (I'm one of the lucky ones who's heard it "live" at the Motab, = albeit not with Dr. Schreiner playing it.)  
(back) Subject: Re: Fox & Biggs Interpretations From: "Ray Ahrens" <Ray_Ahrens@msn.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 11:11:55 -0600   This is a multi-part message in MIME format.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0060_01C28FBC.795914E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable       >the lay public is stupid-look at the other music they like-look where =3D music has gone over the last 30 years. straight down-99% is = >mediocre!=3D20     The performing arts wouldn't exist without the "lay public."     >If Bach were alive today he would be wealthy enough to have a large =3D pipe organ in his home and would certainly have the common sense >and =3D ears of a genius to notice the differences between electronic and pipe. = =3D He would realise that the grandeur of rich pipe sonorities are =3D >impossible to reproduce with speakers. If he would play electronics, =3D Allen would probably fire Diane Bish and higher Bach as their tonal =3D >advisor. Come on now...he had many harpsichords and a few organs in =3D his possession at the time of his death. If he were around he >would be = =3D the most celebrated organist just because of his improvisational =3D skills-let alone his compositional prowess.=3D20     Organists wealthy? This guy's crap-o-meter is running on overdrive! =3D Where did you get your information on Bach's musical instrument =3D inventory? Your facts are incorrect. =3D20     >The fact is that Bach played tracker action instruments and worked with = =3D both Arp Schnitger and Gottfried Silbermann in desiging them. > Don't =3D think for a minute that the organs that Bach played didn't have any =3D balls-cause it just ain't so! Many of them have pedal divisions >with =3D 32' flues and reeds, 10-2/3 and 5-1/3 quints-these are POWERFUL! =3D20   Schnitger is a generation or two before Bach (1648-1719 v 1685-1750). =3D It's extremely unlikely that their paths ever crossed or if Bach was =3D familiar with S's work. You need to get out of the practice room more = =3D often: you're overdosing on blower exhaust fumes.   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0060_01C28FBC.795914E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3D3DContent-Type =3D content=3D3Dtext/html;charset=3D3Diso-8859-1> <META content=3D3D"MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=3D3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY id=3D3DMailContainerBody=3D20 style=3D3D"FONT-WEIGHT: normal; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #000000; =3D BORDER-TOP-STYLE: none; FONT-STYLE: normal; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana; =3D BORDER-RIGHT-STYLE: none; BORDER-LEFT-STYLE: none; TEXT-DECORATION: =3D none; BORDER-BOTTOM-STYLE: none"=3D20 leftMargin=3D3D0 topMargin=3D3D0 acc_role=3D3D"text" = CanvasTabStop=3D3D"true"=3D20 name=3D3D"Compose message area"><?xml:namespace prefix=3D3D"v" =3D /><?xml:namespace prefix=3D3D"o" /><FONT face=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT = =3D size=3D3D2> <DIV><BR><BR>&gt;the lay public is stupid-look at the other music they =3D like-look=3D20 where music has gone over the last 30 years. &nbsp;straight down-99% = is=3D20 &gt;mediocre! </DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV>The performing arts wouldn't exist without the "lay=3D20 public."<BR><BR><BR>&gt;If Bach were alive today he would be wealthy =3D enough to=3D20 have a large pipe organ in his home and would certainly have the common = =3D sense=3D20 &gt;and ears of a genius to notice the differences between electronic =3D and pipe.=3D20 &nbsp;He would realise that the grandeur of rich pipe sonorities are=3D20 &gt;impossible to reproduce with speakers. &nbsp;If he would play =3D electronics,=3D20 Allen would probably fire Diane Bish and higher Bach as their tonal =3D &gt;advisor.=3D20 &nbsp;Come on now...he had many harpsichords and a few organs in his =3D possession=3D20 at the time of his death. &nbsp;If he were around he &gt;would be the =3D most=3D20 celebrated organist just because of his improvisational skills-let alone = =3D his=3D20 compositional prowess. </DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV>Organists wealthy?&nbsp; This guy's crap-o-meter is running on=3D20 overdrive!&nbsp; Where did you get your information on Bach's musical =3D instrument=3D20 inventory?&nbsp; Your facts are incorrect.&nbsp; <BR><BR><BR>&gt;The =3D fact is=3D20 that Bach played tracker action instruments and worked with both Arp =3D Schnitger=3D20 and Gottfried Silbermann in desiging them. &gt;&nbsp;Don't think for a =3D minute=3D20 that the organs that Bach played didn't have any balls-cause it just =3D ain't so!=3D20 &nbsp;Many of them have pedal divisions &gt;with 32' flues and reeds, =3D 10-2/3 and=3D20 5-1/3 quints-these are POWERFUL! &nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT> </DIV> <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV> <DIV>Schnitger is a generation or two before Bach (1648-1719 v =3D 1685-1750).&nbsp;=3D20 It's extremely unlikely that their paths ever crossed or if Bach was =3D familiar=3D20 with S's work.&nbsp;&nbsp; You need to get out of the practice room more = =3D   often:&nbsp; you're overdosing on blower exhaust=3D20 fumes.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>   ------=3D_NextPart_000_0060_01C28FBC.795914E0--  
(back) Subject: Re: Fox, Biggs, and Authenticity From: "Del Case" <dcase@puc.edu> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 12:00:36 -0700       While this has been an interesting thread and there are many thoughts I would like to share, time does not permit, at least not today.   However, there is one short item to which I must respond. One participant expressed shock at the idea that someone would add notes to a work by J.S. Bach. I do not know what notes were added or in what style.   BUT --- improvisation is one of the most important aspects of Baroque music. The addition of improvisatory material was expected. If done stylistically, its inclusion should be welcomed and enjoyed, not treated with horror!   D. Case Pacific Union College  
(back) Subject: Re: Of Biggs, Bach and Blockwerk(longish) From: <Gfc234@aol.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 14:01:13 EST     --part1_2f.30442f6c.2b0be479_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   In a message dated 11/19/2002 11:55:11 AM Central Standard Time, Ray_Ahrens@msn.com writes:     > candel is spelled candle   thanks for the reminder!   --part1_2f.30442f6c.2b0be479_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>In a message dated = 11/19/2002 11:55:11 AM Central Standard Time, Ray_Ahrens@msn.com writes: <BR> <BR> <BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; = MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">candel is spelled = candle</FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"arial" LANG=3D"0"></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" SIZE=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" = FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> <BR>thanks for the reminder!</FONT></HTML>   --part1_2f.30442f6c.2b0be479_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Reveling in Ignorance? From: "Russ Greene" <rggreene2@shaw.ca> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 13:08:14 -0600   On 11/19/02, Steve Chandler wrote:   > Yesterday someone wrote that they hadn't ever heard the > Widor Tocatta and that most of the music of Widor, Vierne, etc. didn't > appeal to them. It struck me that the poster was revelling in their own > ignorance, but I was able to choose to ignore that and let them.   Having preferences does not imply ignorance, merely discernment. The first means not knowing, the latter knowing only too well.   Cheers, Russ Greene    
(back) Subject: Re: Fox & Biggs Interpretations From: <Gfc234@aol.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 14:11:10 EST     --part1_2b.3162e075.2b0be6ce_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   well - why don't you tell me about yourself since you're so smart? what = are=3D20 your credentials? were you even an organ major in college? who did you = stud=3D y=3D20 with? did you ever take an organ literature and history class? do you = ever=3D =3D20 listen to cd's and read liner notes? do you read books about Bach or = the=3D20 baroque? I'm sure your reply will probably have me eating my words... maybe you should get your butt into the practice room so that your = attitude=3D20 might change!   "Organists wealthy?=3DA0 This guy's crap-o-meter is running on = overdrive!=3DA0 W=3D here=3D20 did you get your information on Bach's musical instrument inventory?=3DA0 = Your=3D =3D20 facts are incorrect." I don't know about you, but I know many organists in Chicago who are = living=3D20 QUITE comfortably. Not everyone is stuck with a shitty cheap ass=3D20 congregation you know. Some churches pay big money because they want = the=3D20 best they can get! Also, lets not forget about university positions=3D20 etc...The more degrees you get, the more you're worth! greg p.s.--i am just having fun, i hope you are too! no hard feelings :)   --part1_2b.3162e075.2b0be6ce_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable   <HTML><FONT FACE=3D3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D3D2>well - why don't = you tell=3D me about yourself since you're so smart? what are your credentials? were = yo=3D u even an organ major in college? &nbsp;who did you study with? &nbsp;did = yo=3D u ever take an organ literature and history class? &nbsp;do you ever = listen=3D20=3D to cd's and read liner notes? &nbsp;do you read books about Bach or the = baro=3D que? &nbsp;I'm sure your reply will probably have me eating my words... <BR>maybe you should get your butt into the practice room so that your = attit=3D ude might change! <BR> <BR>"Organists wealthy?=3DA0 This guy's crap-o-meter is running on = overdrive!=3D =3DA0 Where did you get your information on Bach's musical instrument = inventor=3D y?=3DA0 Your facts are incorrect." <BR>I don't know about you, but I know many organists in Chicago who are = liv=3D ing QUITE comfortably. &nbsp;Not everyone is stuck with a shitty cheap ass = c=3D ongregation you know. &nbsp;Some churches pay big money because they want = th=3D e best they can get! &nbsp;Also, lets not forget about university = positions=3D20=3D etc...The more degrees you get, the more you're worth! <BR>greg <BR>p.s.--i am just having fun, i hope you are too! <BR>no hard feelings :)</FONT></HTML>   --part1_2b.3162e075.2b0be6ce_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Reveling in Ignorance? From: <Gfc234@aol.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 14:24:56 EST     --part1_94.300c4ecc.2b0bea08_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   If you are a lover of the organ, go out and buy the Vierne pieces de fantasie, and Widor's 3rd, 5th, 6th, and 7th symphonies, and the Gothique recorded on Cavaille Coll organs in France. Even if the music doesn't = thrill you, the organs certainly will. Give them a chance--you know Widor taught = at the Paris Conservatory and was a champion of Bach's works. In fact, he = made his students play Bach each week! Just give them a chance--also...read about Louis Vierne's life-it will = make you cry! he had his wedding reception in the Cavaille Coll workshop. Here is some neat trivia: The buffet was set up on an organ case that was being built! gregory   --part1_94.300c4ecc.2b0bea08_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>If you are a lover of = the organ, go out and buy the Vierne pieces de fantasie, and Widor's 3rd, = 5th, 6th, and 7th symphonies, and the Gothique recorded on Cavaille Coll = organs in France. &nbsp;Even if the music doesn't thrill you, the organs = certainly will. &nbsp;Give them a chance--you know Widor taught at the = Paris Conservatory and was a champion of Bach's works. &nbsp;In fact, he = made his students play Bach each week! <BR>Just give them a chance--also...read about Louis Vierne's life-it will = make you cry! <BR>he had his wedding reception in the Cavaille Coll workshop. &nbsp;Here = is some neat trivia: &nbsp;The buffet was set up on an organ case that was = being built! <BR>gregory</FONT></HTML>   --part1_94.300c4ecc.2b0bea08_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Fox, Biggs, and Authenticity From: <Gfc234@aol.com> Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 14:26:58 EST     --part1_8b.20e31f97.2b0bea82_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   it was not stylistic-he added fluttery sounding flourishes to the last = page of the fugue. it was purely distasteful, like the rest of the program.   --part1_8b.20e31f97.2b0bea82_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=3D2>it was not stylistic-he = added fluttery sounding flourishes to the last page of the fugue. <BR>it was purely distasteful, like the rest of the program.</FONT></HTML>   --part1_8b.20e31f97.2b0bea82_boundary--  
(back) Subject: Re: Upcoming Handel's MESSIAH Performances (X-Posted) From: "Ross & Lynda Wards" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 09:25:48 +1300   That stupid and cruel crack about NZers and sheep should be done away = with, once and for all. When a sick joke is repeated ad nauseam, it ceases to = have any humour in it. Yes, it does make me annoyed. Ross -----Original Message----- From: Roger Brown <roger2@rogerbrown.no-ip.org> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Wednesday, November 20, 2002 6:01 AM Subject: Re: Upcoming Handel's MESSIAH Performances (X-Posted)     > >Richard Schneider> In that case, I certainly wish you were closer to us then Australia! > >Wash your mouth out - he's in New Zealand (with the sheep <VBG>)! > >-- >Regards, >Roger > >Roger Brown >roger2@rogerbrown.no-ip.org >http://rogerbrown.tripod.com >http://member.melbpc.org.au/~robrown/ > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >