PipeChat Digest #3594 - Monday, April 7, 2003
 
Passion Sunday (X-posted)
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
Trinity's Organ Dedication NYC
  by "Mattcinnj" <mattcinnj@yahoo.com>
Re: The Mormons, Organ-Building, and Music
  by "Eric McKirdy" <eric@jazzyeric.com>
Re: Trinity's Organ Dedication NYC
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
EUROPE and USA : Organ Builders of quality
  by "John Foss" <harfo32@hotmail.com>
Re: Tried-and-True Karl Moyer, aka Marauder
  by "MARAUDER" <kmoyer@marauder.millersville.edu>
Re: EUROPE and USA : Organ Builders of quality
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
What Are Those Guys Playing ????
  by "Mattcinnj" <mattcinnj@yahoo.com>
how often the organs get PLAYED
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
Ireland Question--choir expedition--
  by "Philip Thibault" <pthibaul@maine.rr.com>
Re: how often the organs get PLAYED
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
Re: Tried-and-True Karl Moyer, aka Marauder
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>
Re: how often the organs get PLAYED
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>
Re: Ireland Question--choir expedition--
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
 

(back) Subject: Passion Sunday (X-posted) From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 06:59:47 -0700   St. Matthew's Anglican Catholic Church 2300 Ford Road Newport Beach CA USA   Sung Mass at 9; High Mass at 11   No voluntary Processional Hymn - The Royal Banners Foward Go - Spires Introit (11:00 only) - Judica me - Healy Willan - unison Setting - Merbecke (9:00), Mass IX Gregorian (11:00) Gradual - Eripe me - Tone iij (SATB fauxbourdons at 9:00) Tract - Saepe expugnaverunt - Tone VIIJ (SATB fauxbourdons at 9:00) Offertory - Confitebor tibi - C. Rossini / Clark - SAB at 9; unison at 11 Communion - Qui vult venire - St. John 12 - Gregorian (new Graduale Romanum)   If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.   Communion Anthem - O Salutaris - C. Rossini / Clark (9:00 only) Communion Hymn - Thirty Years Among Us Dwelling - Pange lingua Orison - God Be In My Head - Lytlington Recessional Hymn - O Sacred Head, Sore Wounded - Passion Chorale No voluntary   We move "Hoc corpus" (the Communion appointed in the old Graduale) to Maundy Thursday, rather than repeating "Dominus Jesus" from the Maundy antiphons (per the new Graduale). We MOSTLY follow the old Graduale, but occasionally the new one makes more sense.   Cheers,   Bud    
(back) Subject: Trinity's Organ Dedication NYC From: "Mattcinnj" <mattcinnj@yahoo.com> Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 11:46:28 -0700 (PDT)   --0-1490500624-1049654788=3D:32428 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii     Hi All,   I just remembered that the dedication of Trinity's temporary, prototype = electronic organ was scheduled to have taken place last month.   Anybody have any feedback on this ???? Did it take place ????   Matt       --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more --0-1490500624-1049654788=3D:32428 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii   <P>Hi All,</P> <P>I just remembered that the dedication of Trinity's temporary, prototype = electronic organ was scheduled to have taken place last month.</P> <P>Anybody have any feedback on this ???? Did it take place ???? </P> <P>Matt</P><p><br><hr size=3D1>Do you Yahoo!?<br> <a = href=3D"http://us.rd.yahoo.com/finance/mailsig/*http://tax.yahoo.com">Yahoo= ! Tax Center</a> - File online, calculators, forms, and more --0-1490500624-1049654788=3D:32428--  
(back) Subject: Re: The Mormons, Organ-Building, and Music From: "Eric McKirdy" <eric@jazzyeric.com> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 12:39:20 -0700   On 4/5/03 3:31 PM, rtadams said something about:   > Even brass instruments are not allowed in the Sunday Service, only > woodwinds and strings.   Not quite correct, according to the church music handbook, from which I'll quote:   "Organs and pianos are the the standard instruments in church meetings... Instruments with a prominent or less worshipful sound, such as MOST brass = or percussion, are not appropriate..." (emphasis mine)   But now I've regressed to hair-splitting. I do so, however, in the = interest of disseminating correct information -- especially because I've used a trumpet in worship services on several occasions, and it has always been deemed tasteful and appropriate.   There is a "spirit of the law" which suggests that all of these restrictions, regulations and stipulations are laid down for those who couldn't otherwise govern themselves or the music for which they are responsible. There are exceptional cases, though, where there is both = talent and appreciation for that talent within a congregation, and exceptions can always occur.   I suspect that principle holds true within every denomination.   Eric -- by the way, did any of you hear the Conference Center organ this morning? Is it my imagination, or are we having a little 8' reed problem?    
(back) Subject: Re: Trinity's Organ Dedication NYC From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 15:44:45 -0400   > This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not = understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.   --B_3132488685_9132665 Content-type: text/plain; charset=3D"ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable   On 4/6/03 2:46 PM, "Mattcinnj" <mattcinnj@yahoo.com> wrote:   > I just remembered that the dedication of Trinity's temporary, prototype > electronic organ was scheduled to have taken place last month. >=3D20 > Anybody have any feedback on this ???? Did it take place ???? >=3D20   I vaguely recall reading (here, I think) that it was delayed indefinitely. They couldn=3DB9t make it work right, or something.   Alan   --B_3132488685_9132665 Content-type: text/html; charset=3D"ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable   <HTML> <HEAD> <TITLE>Re: Trinity's Organ Dedication NYC</TITLE> </HEAD> <BODY> <FONT FACE=3D3D"Times New Roman">On 4/6/03 2:46 PM, &quot;Mattcinnj&quot; = &lt;m=3D attcinnj@yahoo.com&gt; wrote:<BR> <BR> </FONT><BLOCKQUOTE><FONT FACE=3D3D"Times New Roman">I just remembered that = the =3D dedication of Trinity's temporary, prototype electronic organ was = scheduled =3D to have taken place last month.<BR> <BR> Anybody have any feedback on this ???? Did it take place ???? <BR> <BR> </FONT></BLOCKQUOTE><FONT FACE=3D3D"Times New Roman"><BR> I vaguely recall reading (here, I think) that it was delayed indefinitely. = =3D &nbsp;They couldn&#8217;t make it work right, or something.<BR> <BR> Alan</FONT> </BODY> </HTML>     --B_3132488685_9132665--    
(back) Subject: EUROPE and USA : Organ Builders of quality From: "John Foss" <harfo32@hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 20:35:27 +0000   Dear list members,   In a recent discussion on Pipe Chat the proposition was put forward that = at present there were more first rate organ builders in The USA than in Europe. To compare like with like I would suggest that you should take = those those European countries whose population, when added together, is similar =   to that of the USA. e.g. USA - 280 million, UK, France, Denmark, Italy, Holland, Germany, Switzerland, Austria 297 million. Consensus on which = organ builders are the "great" builders of today, as Cavaille-Coll, Willis and Harrison were in the past, will be reached with the passage of time, and I =   would not know where to begin with organ builders in the USA, but I would suggest as a starting point the following European builders: UK Harrison & Harrison J W Walker & Sons N P Mander Goetze and Gwynn Kenneth Tickell GERMANY Von beckerath Glatter Gotz Klais Oberlingen FRANCE Alfred Kern HOLLAND Flentrop DENMARK Frobenius Marcussen ITALY Mascioni Ruffati AUSTRIA Rieger I am sure list members can think of other names I should have included = -but this makes 16 European organ builders producing world class instruments in =   terms of quality. Some specialise in smaller instruments, but they are no less notable for this. There are a vast number of organ builders out there = - look in Google under Facteur d'orgues in France, for example! I have only included those I know of personally, or from reputation and web sites. John Foss         www.johnfoss.gr         _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=3Dfeatures/junkmail    
(back) Subject: Re: Tried-and-True Karl Moyer, aka Marauder From: "MARAUDER" <kmoyer@marauder.millersville.edu> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 16:50:07 -0400   Yes, I deserve this!!! :-( Mea culpa!!   Old Moyer Guy   > From: "Malcolm Wechsler" <manderusa@earthlink.net> > Reply-To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2003 21:35:19 -0500 > To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org>, "Pipe Organ > List"<PIPORG-L@listserv.albany.edu> > Subject: Tried-and-True Karl Moyer, aka Marauder > > I have always considered Karl to be youthful looking for his age and = long > experience, but this is remarkable! Having recently read a few Anne Rice > Vampire novels, I will be watching this man with great care. Will he = attend > only evening recitals? > > Looking forward to this summer's OHS Convention in Central Transylvania, > > Malcolm Wechsler > www.mander-organs.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MARAUDER" <kmoyer@marauder.millersville.edu> > To: "pipechat" <pipechat@pipechat.org>; "piporg-l" > <piporg-l@listserv.albany.edu>; "organchat" <organchat@egroups.com> > Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2003 2:49 PM > Subject: Tried-and-True OHS players in OHS 2003 > > > Dear Friends, > > " I still recall the 1876 OHS convention with Gerhard > (?) Klais exuding over this instrument." > >> Cordially, >> Karl E. Moyer >> Lasncaster PA >> > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >    
(back) Subject: Re: EUROPE and USA : Organ Builders of quality From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 17:31:04 -0400   On 4/6/03 4:35 PM, "John Foss" <harfo32@hotmail.com> wrote:   > the proposition was put forward that at > present there were more first rate organ builders in The USA than in > Europe.   John: Your cautionary about our statistics is surely appropriate. If I = may speak for those of us over 50, I'd guess it's kind of a normal human response to waking up one day in the past decade or two and suddenly REALIZING (with pride and delight) how many very good organ builders we have. We're not USED to thinking of ourselves that way (well, maybe the younger folks are), especially in comparison to Europe. Please excuse our silliness, but I hope it's somewhat normal.   Scratching desperately for SOME statistical "advantage" in the field, = maybe I could venture the theory that there are more "person-hours" of HEARING these (American and European) instruments in the USA in a given span of = time (a year, say) than there are on a similar sampling of fine instruments in Europe. Whatever THAT might mean, if anything. (If it's true.)   Alan    
(back) Subject: What Are Those Guys Playing ???? From: "Mattcinnj" <mattcinnj@yahoo.com> Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 14:55:27 -0700 (PDT)   --0-961439184-1049666127=3D:70012 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii     Hi All.   Sometimes I run across an Hour Of Power program while the organist = (current and ex) is softly playing some very beautiful piece or = improvisation as background music to accompany the Schullers during = prayers etc. I can only hear a little, in bits and pieces since the spoken = word is covering it up but am always moved by it.   I was wondering if anyone knows what is being performed ??? Regardless of = the organist, there seems to be a great similarity in what I hear. I'm = hoping some one comes forward and announces it is something akin to the = 200 Last Verses type collections that are available because there is no = way in Heaven or Hell that I'm ever going to be able to improvise anything = that remotely resembles what I am hearing.   Thanks       --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more --0-961439184-1049666127=3D:70012 Content-Type: text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii   <P>Hi All.</P> <P>Sometimes I run across an Hour Of Power&nbsp;program while the organist = (current and ex) is softly playing some very&nbsp;beautiful piece or = improvisation as background music to accompany the Schullers during = prayers etc. I can only hear a little, in bits and pieces&nbsp;since the = spoken word is covering it up but am always moved by it.</P> <P>I was wondering if anyone knows what is being performed = ???&nbsp;Regardless of the organist, there seems to be a great similarity = in what I hear. &nbsp;I'm hoping some one comes forward and announces it = is something akin to the 200&nbsp; Last Verses type collections that are = available because there is no way in Heaven or Hell that I'm ever going to = be able to improvise&nbsp;anything that remotely resembles what I am = hearing.</P> <P>Thanks</P><p><br><hr size=3D1>Do you Yahoo!?<br> <a = href=3D"http://us.rd.yahoo.com/finance/mailsig/*http://tax.yahoo.com">Yahoo= ! Tax Center</a> - File online, calculators, forms, and more --0-961439184-1049666127=3D:70012--  
(back) Subject: how often the organs get PLAYED From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 14:58:58 -0700       Alan Freed wrote: > > > Scratching desperately for SOME statistical "advantage" in the field, = maybe > I could venture the theory that there are more "person-hours" of HEARING > these (American and European) instruments in the USA in a given span of = time > (a year, say) than there are on a similar sampling of fine instruments = in > Europe. Whatever THAT might mean, if anything. (If it's true.) > > Alan >   Alan's right, particularly if you're talking about France ... those huge churches with their beloved Cavaille-Coll organs mostly have ONE Mass on Sunday; St. Ouen (one of the most famous C-Cs) is closed altogether, and is only used for the occasional concert.   OTOH, when I went to Mass at St. Stephen's in Vienna (middle of the summer, nothing special going on, unvested mixed choir off to the side in the front, mostly Gregorian chant), the church was quite full. I don't remember how MANY Masses they had, though.   In Germany, they very sensibly rotate the Sunday Mass among all the historic downtown churches, rather than closing them, though it CAN be a LITTLE confusing figuring out where the one and only Mass IS that particular Sunday.   In England, most of the C of E churches are EMPTY most of the TIME, at least the parish churches, except for Harvest Festival, Remembrance Sunday (closest to Armistice Day, Nov. 11), and Christmas Lessons and Carols. Even the mighty King's College choir REGULARLY sings their EXQUISITE Evensongs to a TOTALLY empty church, even during term. I think there were about 20 people in the congregation when I went to Evensong at St. Paul's in London on a Friday afternoon in August, and half of those were tourists who got "trapped" (chuckle).   All Saints' Margaret Street (on the anglo-catholic "must attend" list) was crowded when I was there, but there was some kind of meeting going on, possibly a Lambeth Conference, and they had bishops all OVER the place (grin).   On the RC side, Brompton Oratory (the parish church of the late "Fat Lady" ... can't remember her name ... of "Two Fat Ladies" cooking show fame ... she left the choir school a HEFTY endowment) gets a good crowd for their Latin (sorta old rite, sorta new rite) Solemn Mass, as do the other City churches that have the Tridentine Rite in Latin.   NOBODY goes to Mass in Italy (chuckle), except on the village patron saint's Name Day, and POSSIBLY the Assumption on Aug. 15th ... and, oh yes, the Feast of St. Januarius' Blood in Naples, and St. Francis' Day in Assisi. The cathedral in Venice was FILTHY, and looked all but ABANDONED inside. There are the ruins of two small organs in the two front side galleries, and a large electric-action Tamburini (?) in the back that had pigeon nests in among the pipework. I'm not sure it was playable.   EVERYBODY goes to Mass in Poland and Ireland, of course, and there are some significant organs in both countries that we know little about. The Jesuits in Poland were evidently wealthy at one time, and built many significant baroque organs ... the Diapason covered them years ago. One distinguishing feature I recall was the use of wrought-iron dresser-drawer pulls for stop-knobs (grin).   Ireland evidently has some fine modern organs by Kenneth (?) Jones, the builder of the organ in The Madeleine in Salt Lake City, as well as some historic organs by Hill, Willis, Harrison, etc.   By European standards, America is a VERY religious country; OTOH, they get crowds at ORGAN RECITALS in Europe that WE can only DREAM about.   Cheers,   Bud    
(back) Subject: Ireland Question--choir expedition-- From: "Philip Thibault" <pthibaul@maine.rr.com> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 18:42:00 -0400   THIS IS FOR ANYONE WHO CAN ANSWER QUESTIONS ABOUT VISITING GALWAY OR = DUBLIN OR ANYWHERE IN BETWEEN: HELP!   Our choir director booked a trip to Ireland in June--the company with = which she worked rather implied that they had all sorts of "connections" with Irish choirs and we could meet up with one or two--now the case seems to = be that "all choirs" are on vacation when we will be there on June 25-July 2....Oops and sorry.   On the possibility that one of you has an "in" with Irish organs, = organists, and choir directors, I am shooting out these questions:   We will be in Galway on June 25--any possibility of something interesting muscial to do or see there? XXXXX Tour company (which specializes in church choir tours) doesn't seem to know much other than 'pub tours'. Suggestions for the children's choir during the pub tours are "go see a movie at the local multiplex". Yeah and right. Travel to Ireland to go = see a movie 'cuz their ain't nuthin' for to see.   We will sing in Loughrea at St Brendan's on Sunday June 29 but the tour company says that their organist is "too busy" and I am not being given an email address. I'd like to find out who is there so that I might do more than play on the "electronic keyboard at the front of the church" while = the service is played on the pipe organ at the rear. ARGH! and OH = WELL....(and words which rhyme) Corresponding beforehand with the organist of a church one is to visit seems to be the most basic of good manners.   Monday the 30th we will be in Dublin and will leave on July 2....   Our choir will have lots of fun singing impromptu (tour company is working on a list of nursing homes and hospitals where we will be booked--but so = far hasn't listed any real firm bookings in this area yet) but this tour = company obviously sold itself at the ACDA convention in NYC as "Having musical connections" which it obviously doesn't have. I am the organist half of = the equation, NOT the choral half so I didn't have an opportunity to sniff out the rat....but this is a plausible warning about tour companies which sell themselves on the basis that they are all doing this for "GOD" and not for profit. I am stopping short of naming this company but surfice it to say that I've exchanged my share of snotty emails with the "alleged" tour director. In my other life as a French/Latin teacher, I KNOW how to run a tour and I can recognize when obligations are being ignored.   Our choir is a good balanced amateur choir of about 35 SATB ---and our = teen girl's choir of 15 which is really excellent. We plan mostly an a capella program because we were told there aren't any instruments in Ireland = (other than electronic keyboards) we would be allowed to play. I hope this isn't the case!   If I can unscrew this schedule before we leave because of the kindness of one of you wonderful people, I'd be quite happy! You all know the old maxim, if you want something done right.... etc.   Phil Thibault yarmouth ME USA  
(back) Subject: Re: how often the organs get PLAYED From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 19:23:09 -0400   On 4/6/03 5:58 PM, "quilisma@socal.rr.com" <quilisma@socal.rr.com> wrote:   > Alan's right, particularly if you're talking about France ... those huge > churches with their beloved Cavaille-Coll organs mostly have ONE Mass on > Sunday; St. Ouen (one of the most famous C-Cs) is closed altogether, and > is only used for the occasional concert. > > OTOH, when I went to Mass at St. Stephen's in Vienna (middle of the > summer, nothing special going on, unvested mixed choir off to the side > in the front, mostly Gregorian chant), the church was quite full. I > don't remember how MANY Masses they had, though.   Alan inserts: Same experience in the same church. Monday noon mass, on Pfingstmontag (which admittedly is a real "day" there). Good crowd, probably mostly tourists. A friend (who's organist in another Vienna parish) said it's the result of the Archbishop (this was 1993, I think), = who decreed: "We're here to do serious business. Part of that business is in that cathedral. It's not a tourist site." Tourists were allowed beyond = the narthex only on pledge to remain for the entire mass. We did. In this case, no choir, but a FINE mass, with excellent organplaying. (In case it's not clear, I'm applauding the cardinal.)   > By European standards, America is a VERY religious country; OTOH, they > get crowds at ORGAN RECITALS in Europe that WE can only DREAM about. > With a few exceptions (these in NYC). St. Ignatius Loyola isn't hurting (thanks to the wonderful Malcolm/Mander/Tritle team). And St. Vincent Ferrer has filled the house on occasion. I THINK St. Bart's gets a crowd, still. Basically Bach weekend at St. Peter's is not in pain. Rick = Erickson brings them out for Bach Vespers (etc.) at Holy Trinity, Central Park West--and it's worth it. We can hope that both St. John the Divine (fire) and Trinity Wall Street (don't ask) will come back in a year or three.   There's the very ambitious program at Fourth Presby. in Chicago. I don't KNOW, but I hope it's drawing.   But, in general, yes. I've been to Smoky Mary recitals with 6 or 7 people in attendance. We can do THAT well at Saint LUKE's, for Pete's sake = (though not much better). (But, then, we do much better than that on Sunday MORNING, which is the REAL reason we bought the machine.)   Alan www.stlukesnyc.org    
(back) Subject: Re: Tried-and-True Karl Moyer, aka Marauder From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 18:29:48 -0500   The Convention I was really sorry to have missed was 1776, when David Tannenberg played his newly completed instrument at Trinity Lutheran Church in Lancaster.   John Speller   MARAUDER wrote:   >Yes, I deserve this!!! :-( Mea culpa!! > > Old Moyer Guy > > > >>From: "Malcolm Wechsler" <manderusa@earthlink.net> >>Reply-To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> >>Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2003 21:35:19 -0500 >>To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org>, "Pipe Organ >>List"<PIPORG-L@listserv.albany.edu> >>Subject: Tried-and-True Karl Moyer, aka Marauder >> >>I have always considered Karl to be youthful looking for his age and = long >>experience, but this is remarkable! Having recently read a few Anne Rice >>Vampire novels, I will be watching this man with great care. Will he = attend >>only evening recitals? >> >>Looking forward to this summer's OHS Convention in Central Transylvania, >> >>Malcolm Wechsler >>www.mander-organs.com >> >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "MARAUDER" <kmoyer@marauder.millersville.edu> >>To: "pipechat" <pipechat@pipechat.org>; "piporg-l" >><piporg-l@listserv.albany.edu>; "organchat" <organchat@egroups.com> >>Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2003 2:49 PM >>Subject: Tried-and-True OHS players in OHS 2003 >> >> >>Dear Friends, >> >>" I still recall the 1876 OHS convention with Gerhard >>(?) Klais exuding over this instrument." >> >>      
(back) Subject: Re: how often the organs get PLAYED From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 18:38:01 -0500   Of course, if you wished to go to the American Cathedral in Paris (Episcopal) they have an 1887 Cavaille-Coll organ, and their Sunday services are listed as:   9:00 Holy Eucharist Rite I 11:00 Holy Eucharist (with music & sermon) 15:00 Holy Eucharist in Chinese 17:00 Solemn Evensong (3rd Sunday of the month)   See their website at http://www.episcopalchurch.org/europe/paris.html   John Speller   >On 4/6/03 5:58 PM, "quilisma@socal.rr.com" <quilisma@socal.rr.com> wrote: > > > >>Alan's right, particularly if you're talking about France ... those huge >>churches with their beloved Cavaille-Coll organs mostly have ONE Mass on >>Sunday; St. Ouen (one of the most famous C-Cs) is closed altogether, and >>is only used for the occasional concert. >> >> >>      
(back) Subject: Re: Ireland Question--choir expedition-- From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 19:48:09 -0400   On 4/6/03 6:42 PM, "Philip Thibault" <pthibaul@maine.rr.com> wrote:   > this tour company obviously sold itself at the ACDA convention > in NYC as "Having musical connections" which it obviously doesn't have. > I am the organist half of the equation, NOT the choral half so I didn't > have an opportunity to sniff out the rat....   Phil, this is disgusting beyond description.   Pull out, and sue for your losses.   Next year, don't plan for summertime. Europe is closed.   I've been on both ends of this, many times. YEARS ago I was in a variety = of touring choirs; no sweat. You have a "business manager" (not a musician) who set things up.   In more recent years I've represented the "host" organization (church). = We get calls all the time from European and Midwest American groups (usually through a tour agency in Florida or something) wanting to perform. We fiddle with the details ("no electronics," for starters), and we have TREMENDOUSLY successful appearances. European groups (instrumental or choral) generally ask what we will charge for the opportunity to perform. We say, "Nothing." And then they force us to accept $1000 to $5000 as a gratuity for the privilege of using our space. (A few exceptions: = EASTERN European groups want us to pay VERY big bucks for them to come, for their food and lodging for several days, etc. We tell them it doesn't work that way.)   Yours is a sickening story. I wish I were a highpowered lawyer with the leisure to take your case. There's a branch of Law called "Entertainment Law." Go for the best you can get. It'll cost. But why go to Ireland to see a movie? This was simply a big mistake. Get out of it.   Alan