PipeChat Digest #3849 - Monday, August 4, 2003
Re: Where did the organ go?
  by <Pologaptommy@aol.com>
Re: Youth and leading the services (was Where Did the Organ Go?)
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
traditional hymns
  by "terry hicks" <Terrick@webtv.net>

(back) Subject: Re: Where did the organ go? From: <Pologaptommy@aol.com> Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 01:00:19 EDT   In a message dated 8/3/03 7:00:35 PM Pacific Daylight Time, vdbarton@erols.com writes:   > So, then, Josh, are you saying that in the UMC it is the young people of =   > the laity, themselves, who are pressing for these liturgical reforms? = If so, > that's quite different from what I perceive to be happening within ECUSA = (my > church). There, it seems to be the clergy who are the driving force. = It is > the clergy who are working so hard to toss a millennium of liturgical = and > musical tradition out and replace it with -- what? third-rate cabaret = music? > They (the clergy) are ramming it down the throats of the laity, most of = whom > don't want any part of it. They keep pushing the "new," decrying the > traditional as "old hat." All this is done in the name of "rejuvenating = and renewing" > the church. Funny thing, though; our church's membership has fallen by = half > during my adult lifetime (about 40 years). The maths simply don't work. > Actually, Dave, it IS the opposite in our particular church it = seems...from 1921 thru 2000 the pipe organ was the primary instrument in our church. = In the year 2000 the organist who had been there 40 years retired, and the church =   could not find anyone to replace her. So they hired a pianist as an = interim until a suitable organist could be found. Well, two YEARS later, they = hired me, and since the interim pianist had been there for two years, they kept her = on staff as the choir accompanist. So basically we split duties. We rarely = use the piano and organ together. If she were ever to leave, the organ would = again reign as the primary instrument of worship in this church. However, she = is a good friend of mine, and I would hate to see that happen, as I enjoy = working with her!   But, basically, the church over the 30 years has grown like crazy, and we have seen many, many new members in the last 2 years. Many of them = joining BECAUSE of our style of worship. I think the current program staff likes = the current style of worship, and there is no reason to change anything. What = my post was about, was when the NEXT generation ARE the program staff!   > Rather than voting with their feet, it would be much better if people > stayed on board and, instead, voted with their checkbooks -- *by keeping = them > firmly closed!* If contributions fell of to the point that the rector's = salary > could no longer be met, he (or she) might get the idea that the people = were > pissed off! Nothing else seems to be getting through. >   Also, in our church, one of the most influential families installed the original organ in the old sanctuary in 1921, had it enlarged and moved to = the new sanctuary in the 1970s, and from the 1970s-2000 had a number of = improvements done, including revoicing, stop additions, new windchests, ect....They = have also set up a large trust fund for the organ, that will support the organ for many, many years to come. So that in itself is a good indication that = there is no chance that the instrument will be excluded from worship anytime soon!   I guess what I am thinking is that IF we want this tradition to continue, = the importance of this style of music, and this particular instrument, should = be instilled in the minds of our Youth.   Thanks josh    
(back) Subject: Re: Youth and leading the services (was Where Did the Organ Go?) From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 01:19:28 EDT   Hi Scott:   I haven't been saving the results, but I will foreward a prediction. Churches going from a traditional service to a contemporary one to gain members, or satisfy the youth, will be sadly mistaken. Out of the mouths of babes, after doing one of these, said it didn't feel right. Now there is God talking through our youth. They are not skulls full of mush, but some of our older more influential, members and clergy are. They are the ones looking for novelty. If they seek novelty, they are not mature Christians, but seed scattered on rocky ground or on the path to be trampled under foot. These haven't one wit of an idea of why they attend church services except to be entertained. This shallowness gives it all away as to motive. There's no great furvor there, but lukewarm. No real life to it at all. No conviction what so ever. Jesus predicted this, and said "Let the Dead bury Their Dead." "if they are only lukewarm I will spew them out of my mouth" refering to warm water instead of cool refreshing water. He further said I'd prefer they be hot or cold, not lukewarm. Powerful words not to be forgotten or missed.   Ron Severin    
(back) Subject: traditional hymns From: "terry hicks" <Terrick@webtv.net> Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2003 01:01:02 -0500 (CDT)   Amy, You're observations about Contemporary Christian Music is true regarding it's indulgence in emotion at the expense of theology. On the other hand, so many traditional hymns/songs use language that is no longer part of our vernacular. Just as Martin Luther took the Latin hymns of the Roman church and put them into his vernacular, it's probably time to redo the English in many of our traditional hymns. This can be done without destroying the intent of the original text. There are also many wonderful old tunes that people will accept if they have "new" texts.   For instance, when I introduced the tune Picardy (it's true...they didn't know it!), I paired it with a contemporary text and either played it on the piano using a picking pattern like a guitar, or used a good guitarist while I sustained chords on the organ - the people loved it. Now, I'll use any instrumentation/text and don't get hassled about it being old or boring.