PipeChat Digest #3581 - Sunday, March 30, 2003
 
"Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"
  by <TubaMagna@aol.com>
RE: Preparing a stop
  by "Andr=E9s G=FCnther" <agun@telcel.net.ve>
RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"
  by "Andrew Mead" <mead@eagle.ca>
RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca>
Re: Boardwalk Hall
  by "Antoni Scott" <ascott@ptd.net>
Re: Boardwalk Hall
  by "danielwh" <danielwh@ns.sympatico.ca>
RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"
  by "Andrew Mead" <mead@eagle.ca>
the weather, and my service list (X-posted)
  by <quilisma@socal.rr.com>
Re: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"
  by "Rob McGregor" <e1afoxtrot@hotmail.com>
RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca>
Re: Boardwalk Hall
  by "Antoni Scott" <ascott@ptd.net>
Re: Boardwalk Hall
  by "danielwh" <danielwh@ns.sympatico.ca>
Re: Boardwalk Hall
  by "Antoni Scott" <ascott@ptd.net>
Re: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
Off-topic:  in mourning
  by "Glenda" <gksjd85@direcway.com>
Re: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"
  by "Stanley Lowkis" <nstarfil@attbi.com>
 

(back) Subject: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 10:08:15 EST   Something is not lining up here, starting with the fact that no = replies have come in acknowledging the flood of concern and need for more = information. If two Kilgen consoles were simultaneously "destroyed by a lightning strike," I wonder how... Did the 1920s Kilgen solid state systems share a lightning rod? Wouldn't a "cathedral" have a real musician at the helm? A =   real organ curator? If a city is large enough to sport a cathedral, = wouldn't there be a lot of red tape to untangle before anything could be done? Was there no outcry amongst the community of musicians in this cathedral metropolis? Why the public plea for help coupled with the cryptic secrecy? Was there any attempt made to contact the local AGO dean, the OHS, the =   local landmarks conservancy, the Archdiocese? Enquiring minds may possibly want to know.  
(back) Subject: RE: Preparing a stop From: "Andr=E9s G=FCnther" <agun@telcel.net.ve> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 11:49:46 -0400   Andres Gunther agun@telcel.net.ve     > I would like to know how YOU define a "prepared stop".   So far, "prepared stops" are setted stop combinations, ready to be drawn = at a certain moment of the performance... for the organist - <BIG grin> Okay. Now, serious:   > First, background on > the situation: 2-manual instrument, 3rd manual prepared. One = "prepared" > stop in the Pedal, another in the Choir. (There is no Swell division.) The > knobs are in place, the wiring for the combination action is there, = though > disconnected.   Sounds like an "expansion project". Perhaps the folks wanted a, say, = III/90 organ but only had the money for II/40 to begin. This way, the builder agreed to build a III/90 "plant" and console, but installed only on two sections/ped. a 40 basic stops pipework, leaving blank spaces "prepared" = for future expansion to the desired III/90 without expensive enlargening jobs- only put in the pipework, connect the stop action, and finish.   The problem with these kind of projects is that the expansion must be accomplished in a reasonable amount of time. Otherwise, the builder can disappear; other folks may want a different spec and then "pre-bored" toeboards and racks become useless; interest and documentation can got lost... you name it.   Seems to be that this happened in the present case- to make things worse = the builder perhaps "retained" the sliders in his shop to assure his = "dominion" over the project. I agree that the solution, although possible, is all but for amateurs. Unless the original builder is located it will cost a bunch = of bucks and require a careful research- re-planification. Only comfort: Console and organ case won't have to be replaced... :)   Yours Andres =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D First was the cat, then was the Orgler. The Orgler got a pet and the cat got something to wonder about    
(back) Subject: RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" From: "Andrew Mead" <mead@eagle.ca> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 10:37:41 -0500   I'm thinking "hoax" as I had from the beginning. Anyone: Please correct me if wrong. AjM      
(back) Subject: RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" From: "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 10:38:36 -0500   You know what?   I reckon that this is the work of the President Bush and Vice President Blair "spin doctors". To take the thoughts of ordinary organists and others from considering the effects of this war.   Which is much more in the fore-front of my mind, with all the "spin" that both their top brass have for us all.   Bob Conway   At 10:37 AM 3/30/03 -0500, you wrote: >I'm thinking "hoax" as I had from the beginning. Anyone: Please correct = me >if wrong. >AjM > > > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org      
(back) Subject: Re: Boardwalk Hall From: "Antoni Scott" <ascott@ptd.net> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 13:01:12 -0500   Maybe they didn't know that the World's largest pipe organ was in that building ----- Original Message ----- From: "danielwh" <danielwh@ns.sympatico.ca> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2003 11:09 PM Subject: Boardwalk Hall     > Tonight I was watching Discovery Channel . Frontiers of Construction was > on, and for about 15 minutes, Atlantic City Hall was on( now Boardwalk Hall) > They mentioned every possible thing about it, The great Acoustics, the many > millions spent on its beautiful restoration.They mentioned how they wanted > to improve the Acoustics. for concerts, THey showed someone playing a > piano.. and to test the acoustics, they used a cannon shot to check its > reverberation. > Not One mention to even let the world know that there was even a hint = of a > Pipe Organ there. However if one was looking, you could see the console > booth. > > It made me sick for them to overlook this once Grand Instrument. > Danielwh > 2000 EP Biggs Fellow > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >    
(back) Subject: Re: Boardwalk Hall From: "danielwh" <danielwh@ns.sympatico.ca> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 14:02:44 -0400   programs like this should be the ones that bring attention,but after spending 90+ million on a buildings complete restoration,I think that it would be a bit embarrasing to let the world know that it wasnst really completelty restored.This Organ was built to complete this building Danielwh    
(back) Subject: RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" From: "Andrew Mead" <mead@eagle.ca> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 15:49:28 -0500   VICE-PRESIDENT Blair!!!!!! You must be right about the "spin". Or is it = me? I thought he was the Prime Minister of Great Britain-a nation with many = fine pipe organs and notable British organ builders. :) AjM -----Original Message----- From: pipechat@pipechat.org [mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org]On Behalf Of Bob Conway Sent: Sunday, March 30, 2003 10:39 AM To: PipeChat Subject: RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ"   You know what?   I reckon that this is the work of the President Bush and Vice President Blair "spin doctors". To take the thoughts of ordinary organists and others from considering the effects of this war.   Which is much more in the fore-front of my mind, with all the "spin" that both their top brass have for us all.   Bob Conway          
(back) Subject: the weather, and my service list (X-posted) From: <quilisma@socal.rr.com> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 14:13:00 -0800   I had on a sweat shirt when I left for church at 7:30 a.m. ... when I came out of the High Mass at noon, it HAD to be at LEAST 90 degrees F (!) ... and of COURSE the kids took the air-conditioned truck today and left me with the UN-air-conditioned land yacht (A/C long dead).   The choir whooped it up in a decorous Anglican manner, this being Laetare ("Rejoice") Sunday, also called "Refreshment" Sunday, on account of reading the Gospel of feeding the five thousand (we use the old lectionary), and "Mothering" Sunday, because in England servants were given the afternoon off to visit their mothers.   Voluntary - Canon, Idyll - Flor Peeters (60 Short Pieces) Processional Hymn - Jerusalem, the Golden - Ewing Introit (11:00 only) - Laetare, Jerusalem - Willan / Clark Setting - 9:00 Merbecke; 11:00 Mass IX (Gregorian) Gradual and Tract - Laetatus sum, Laudate Dominum - Gregorian Tones VJ, VIJ, with SATB fauxbourdons at 9 Offertory - Laudate Dominum - C. Rossini / Clark - SAB at 9:00, unison at 11:00 Communion - Jerusalem, quae aedificatur - C. Rossini / Clark - SAB at 9:00, unison at 11:00 Communion Hymn - O Heavenly Jerusalem - Christ is my life (Vulpius) Kneeling Hymn - God Be In My Head - Lytlington Recessional Hymn - O Mother Dear, Jerusalem - Materna (followed by) Song - God Bless America - Berlin Voluntary - Introduction - Flor Peeters (60 Short Pieces)   In case you're wondering, we still read the Epistle of the two Jerusalems ... hence all the Jerusalem hymns.   The parish now has soldiers in combat.       Bud    
(back) Subject: Re: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" From: "Rob McGregor" <e1afoxtrot@hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 16:22:04 -0600     What is not lining up?   First of all, I'm sorry I haven't been able to reply to any of your emails =   in response to my original email until now. I have been out of town.   Now...As I stated in my first email. I am a 19 yr old organist that does = NOT yet have the position at this church. I said they were planning on hiring = me when their current organist (80 yrs old) retires, as they do not want to fire her. I am in no position of authority to command who things are = carried out. That is the duty of the priest that is at the helm of all of this. Which is another reason I am keeping the exact church a secret. I do not want them to think I am causing trouble.   I talked with the priest on Friday about all of this, and even shared some =   of the viewpoints of the people who have responded. He however, said that = he doesnt want to upset the people from the Rodgers dealership. This priest = is very passive and seems to have no business sense. HE said we could hire someone to undo what these people do wrong. What doesnt make sense is that =   they went with rodgers because they were cheaper. So...they will pay MORE money to undo Rodgers mistakes? Well I am definitely fed up with this church. NO ONE in the whole church knows anything about organ...including their organist.   Now...to address the "concerns" in the email I'm replying to. If you knew anything about the Catholic church you would know that the "size" of a = town has nothing to do with wheter or not a cathedral is there. A cathedral is just merely the head of the diocese, and is the Bishops church. Also in = the Catholic church the priests are the ones who make the final = decision...they can override an organ committee of parishoners if they chose to. HOwever = at this church I dont even think they have an organ committee. The only real decision that went into this choice was of finances, which the Finance committee controlled.   Finally, I have not contacted the AGO I also stated in my email I had only =   been in this new location for 2-3 months now. I haven't had a chance to = join yet. When I do I will still probably only join through National because I dont like how alot of the organists try to compete with another here, and dont like the politics of the local group. I have only gone through the church, and mainly this priest to try to convince him that what Rodgers is =   doing is wrong...and he agreed but he just said he doesnt want to create conflict. If the priest says no...thats about all I can do. At this point = im ready to divorce myself of the whole issue and refuse my services int he future, and find another church.   Once again THANK YOU EVERYONE! for your help I was overwhelmed by the response I received in regard to this situation.   I hope I may be of assistance in the future to the group.   Thanks again,   R.M.     PS after they finish the work on the organ I would be more than happy to disclose the location and name of the church.           >From: TubaMagna@aol.com >Reply-To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> >To: pipechat@pipechat.org >Subject: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" >Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 10:08:15 EST > > Something is not lining up here, starting with the fact that no >replies >have come in acknowledging the flood of concern and need for more >information. > If two Kilgen consoles were simultaneously "destroyed by a lightning >strike," I wonder how... Did the 1920s Kilgen solid state systems share a >lightning rod? Wouldn't a "cathedral" have a real musician at the helm? = A >real organ curator? If a city is large enough to sport a cathedral, >wouldn't >there be a lot of red tape to untangle before anything could be done? Was >there no outcry amongst the community of musicians in this cathedral >metropolis? Why the public plea for help coupled with the cryptic = secrecy? > Was there any attempt made to contact the local AGO dean, the OHS, = the >local landmarks conservancy, the Archdiocese? > Enquiring minds may possibly want to know. > >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org >     _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=3Dfeatures/junkmail    
(back) Subject: RE: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" From: "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 17:37:27 -0500   Oh Dear! - it seems that my inept attempt at sarcasm toward Mr. Blair has upset Mr. Mead!   He is right, of course, - perhaps I should have said that Mr. Blair is a "wannabe" Vice President! In fact only today, in the Toronto Star I saw a =   picture of President Bush and Vice President Cheney being given the = "works" by their advisors in the White House.   What all this has to do with organs I really don't quite know, but put it down to a Senior moment!   Bob Conway     At 03:49 PM 3/30/03 -0500, Mr. Mead wrote: >VICE-PRESIDENT Blair!!!!!! You must be right about the "spin". Or is it = me? >I thought he was the Prime Minister of Great Britain-a nation with many = fine >pipe organs and notable British organ builders. :) >AjM      
(back) Subject: Re: Boardwalk Hall From: "Antoni Scott" <ascott@ptd.net> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 17:48:56 -0500   Daniel: You bring up a good point. It is interesting to note that the organ was built to fit the scale of the building, not brought from somewhere else = and enlarged over and over again. Emerson Richards got it right the first = time. A huge organ in a huge building the scale of which will never be seen = again. The original acoustics were outstanding. Althought the additional new seating probably did not affect the acoustics, the new cieling material probably did.   Each stop was tested for scale and volume before it was installed. There = is an interesting comment in Stephen Smith's new book about the affect of the size of the building on the sound and tone colour of stops.            
(back) Subject: Re: Boardwalk Hall From: "danielwh" <danielwh@ns.sympatico.ca> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 20:54:24 -0400   One thing they did say, was that they have improved the acoustics , seems to me they said that they were proud of getting the building les = reflective of sound. and they have reduced the reverberation. to 3 seconds from the original 5 Did I misunderstand what they were saying ? Danielwh    
(back) Subject: Re: Boardwalk Hall From: "Antoni Scott" <ascott@ptd.net> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 20:15:07 -0500   Word-smithing is an art. How to say or not say something without actually saying it. Three seconds may be great for a conversation but not for the organ. I suppose three seconds isn't too bad, but five was better, much better. So three seconds is an improvement.   At least we have two good recordings of the instrument in its original environment.    
(back) Subject: Re: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 20:10:47 -0500   On 3/30/03 5:22 PM, "Rob McGregor" <e1afoxtrot@hotmail.com> wrote:   > What is not lining up?   Well, several things, as you've read. But I suspect we're ready to = suspend judgment. This is not the Star Chamber, for Pete's sake. > > First of all, I'm sorry I haven't been able to reply to any of your = emails > in response to my original email until now. I have been out of town.   OK, we missed you, big time. > > Now...As I stated in my first email. I am a 19 yr old organist that does = NOT > yet have the position at this church. I said they were planning on = hiring me > when their current organist (80 yrs old) retires, as they do not want to > fire her. I am in no position of authority to command who things are = carried > out. That is the duty of the priest that is at the helm of all of this.   No cathedral rector? No bishop? No diocesan music commission?   > Which is another reason I am keeping the exact church a secret. I do not > want them to think I am causing trouble.   That's fine. You're covering YOUR butt, and you're also showing = appropriate professional respect for the institution that may soon be your boss. = FINE. > > I talked with the priest on Friday about all of this, and even shared = some > of the viewpoints of the people who have responded.   Super. I'm the most UNinformed person on this list, but even I can tell = you that you got some VERY good advice--tentative as most of it had to be.   > He however, said that he > doesnt want to upset the people from the Rodgers dealership.   WHAT!? That's preposterous! A "dealership"?   > This priest is very passive and seems to have no business sense.   But he's the one whom described as being   > at the helm of all of this.   "Passive," but "at the helm"???? As an old Navy man, I can tell you that that is NOT a good situation!   I'm getting out of here; let someone more knowledgeable than I work on = this for a while.   Alan, already very premature with his uninformed opinions      
(back) Subject: Off-topic: in mourning From: "Glenda" <gksjd85@direcway.com> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 19:10:12 -0600   Momma-Cat, a/k/a Woodell (Rick named her thusly because she came out of the woods and it sounded like a good old Southern name), did not come home Friday night, and has not been seen since Friday morning. I fear the worst, although she was raised as a woods cat before coming to us and could handle herself against all comers. Remaining are her four offspring, all 1 year old this week:   Bubba Columbus Junior Nina Purina Maria a/k/a Mary   If you will remember, I acted as midwife for these the day after Palm Sunday last year. We were celebrating the four birthdays, plus Malachi Erastus' (Mack) and Zachariah Lucifer's (Zach) (the 5th of March) and Momma Cat's (since we don't really know her birthday) all week with tuna, hamburger and other kitty treats, but our joy has turned to sorrow in her absence.   I pray that she is only galavanting and will return safely, but in my heart I know she's gone.   Glenda Sutton gksjd85@direcway.com        
(back) Subject: Re: "Kilgan" "Rodgers" "Cathedral" "organ" From: "Stanley Lowkis" <nstarfil@attbi.com> Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 20:49:07 -0500       TubaMagna@aol.com wrote: > > Something is not lining up here, starting with the fact that no = replies > have come in acknowledging the flood of concern and need for more = information.   These are difficult Times, think "Faith Based" ..you gotta beleive.   > If two Kilgen consoles were simultaneously "destroyed by a lightning > strike," I wonder how... Did the 1920s Kilgen solid state systems share = a > lightning rod? Wouldn't a "cathedral" have a real musician at the helm? = A > real organ curator? If a city is large enough to sport a cathedral, = wouldn't > there be a lot of red tape to untangle before anything could be done? = Was > there no outcry amongst the community of musicians in this cathedral > metropolis? Why the public plea for help coupled with the cryptic = secrecy? > Was there any attempt made to contact the local AGO dean, the OHS, = the > local landmarks conservancy, the Archdiocese? > Enquiring minds may possibly want to know.       It's a Miracle! The lightning came through the water mains, up to choir loft sink; traveled to the organ totally destroying it.   I'm still considering the generous Brooklyn Bridge Offer.   Stan