PipeChat Digest #4090 - Sunday, November 2, 2003
 
Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group
  by "Richard Hazelip" <rhazelip@quik.com>
Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group
  by "Bartholomew Agar" <agarba@netnet.net>
Leslie Speakers
  by "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net>
Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group
  by "Administrator" <admin@pipechat.org>
Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group
  by "Octaaf" <octaaf@charter.net>
Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group
  by "Octaaf" <octaaf@charter.net>
Re: What great music for today?
  by <Cpmnhartus@aol.com>
Re: [Organ-Pipes] pipechat administartor is trying to shut down	organ pip
  by "Blair Anderson" <bda@shaw.ca>
Stephen Roberts/Danbury Symphony/WOW!
  by "Malcolm Wechsler" <manderusa@earthlink.net>
Re: [Organ-Pipes] pipechat administartor is trying to shut down organ pip
  by <BlueeyedBear@aol.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group From: "Richard Hazelip" <rhazelip@quik.com> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 19:36:24 -0600   I went to the Yahoo groups website and was told I have been banned. = What the hell is going on? Sorry to be ugly but I have had hell getting = on to lists because of the spam filter on my server. I hope this is not = the situation here.   Richard Hazelip ----- Original Message -----=20 From: bnorth=20 To: PipeChat=20 Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2003 1:21 AM Subject: Fw: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group=20     ATTN PIPECHAT ADMINISTRATOR ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Organ-Pipes moderator=20 To: bnorth@intergate.ca=20 Sent: Saturday, November 01, 2003 2:35 PM Subject: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group=20     =20 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ =20     Scb44484@cs.com has invited you to join the Organ-Pipes = group! (This invitation will expire in 7 days.) =20   A message from Scb44484@cs.com: Talk about/read about all different kinds of = organs.... worldwide....seeking to unite a divided organ world = into one harmonious whole right here in this = forum...builders....players...enthusiasts....one big happy association = of diverse organ devotees! From skilled voicer to professor to anyone = and everyone who has been smitten by the king of instruments...pipe, = digital, electronic , concert, cinema, home and all other venues...     =20 =20   Join this group! =20   =20 -OR-   REPLY to this email by clicking "Reply" and then "Send" in = your email program. =20 =20   About Yahoo! Groups: Yahoo! Groups is a free service that helps = you stay in touch with family and friends or meet new people. Yahoo! = Groups values your privacy. It is a violation of our service rules for = moderators to abuse this invitation feature. If you feel this has = happened, please notify us at abuse@yahoogroups.com. Your use of Yahoo! = Groups is subject to our Terms of Service, located at = http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/. =20      
(back) Subject: Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group From: "Bartholomew Agar" <agarba@netnet.net> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 19:56:17 -0600   I'd like to join but I am "banned"> Please explain.   Thanks,   B. Agar   On Nov 2, 2003, at 7:36 PM, Richard Hazelip wrote:   > I went to the Yahoo groups website and was told I have been banned.=A0=20=   > What the hell is going on?=A0 Sorry to be ugly but I have had hell=20 > getting on to lists because of the spam filter on my server.=A0 I hope=20=   > this is not the situation here. > =A0 > Richard Hazelip > ----- Original Message ----- > From: bnorth > To: PipeChat > Sent:Sunday, November 02, 2003 1:21 AM > Subject:Fw: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group > > ATTN PIPECHAT ADMINISTRATOR > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Organ-Pipes moderator > To: bnorth@intergate.ca > Sent:Saturday, November 01, 2003 2:35 PM > Subject:Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group > > > > > Scb44484@cs.com has invited you to join the Organ-Pipes group! > (This invitation will expire in 7 days.) > > > > A message from Scb44484@cs.com: > Talk about/read about all different kinds of organs.... > worldwide....seeking to unite a divided organ world into one=20 > harmonious whole right here in this=20 > forum...builders....players...enthusiasts....one big happy association=20=   > of diverse organ devotees! =46rom skilled voicer to professor to = anyone=20 > and everyone who has been smitten by the king of instruments...pipe,=20=   > digital, electronic , concert, cinema, home and all other venues... > > > > > > Join this group! > > > -OR- > > REPLY to this email by clicking "Reply" and then "Send" in your email=20=   > program. > > > > About Yahoo! Groups: Yahoo! Groups is a free service that helps you=20 > stay in touch with family and friends or meet new people. Yahoo!=20 > Groups values your privacy. It is a violation of our service rules for=20=   > moderators to abuse this invitation feature. If you feel this has=20 > happened, please notify us at abuse@yahoogroups.com. Your use of=20 > Yahoo! Groups is subject to our Terms of Service, located=20 > athttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/.    
(back) Subject: Leslie Speakers From: "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 20:12:07 -0600   No flames, please, but I have an opportunity to buy three Leslie Model 142 speakers for Hammond organ (and I have two Hammonds that they will fit). These speakers are mid to late 1970's; carefully and little used in a church. Any idea as to approximate value range.   Yes, dear hearts, I also have a pipe organ I love!   Dennis Steckley          
(back) Subject: Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group From: "Administrator" <admin@pipechat.org> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 20:14:50 -0600   Folks   Please don't discuss this here - we, the Administrators of PipeChat, have absolutely nothing to do with that Yahoo group. If I were you, i would contact the very elusive Moderator/owner of the group whose address, as far as I can gather, is Scb44484@cs.com   David.   >I'd like to join but I am "banned"> Please explain. > >Thanks, > >B. Agar > >On Nov 2, 2003, at 7:36 PM, Richard Hazelip wrote: > >>I went to the Yahoo groups website and was told I have been banned. >>What the hell is going on? Sorry to be ugly but I have had hell >>getting on to lists because of the spam filter on my server. I >>hope this is not the situation here. >> >>Richard Hazelip   -- **************************************** David Scribner Owner / Co-Administrator PipeChat   http://www.pipechat.org mailto:admin@pipechat.org  
(back) Subject: Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group From: "Octaaf" <octaaf@charter.net> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 20:14:15 -0600   It seems that I too have now been "banned" from the Yahoo Group = Organ-Pipes! Apparently Mr Gettleman didn't appreciate being "outed" = here as the group co-owner/moderator? Mike, if you and your buddies are = going to TROLL other lists for members, at least have the courtesy not = to ban those whom you have SPAMED to invite to join your group ....   Banned in Wisconsin,   Octaaf ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Richard Hazelip=20 To: PipeChat=20 Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2003 7:36 PM Subject: Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group=20     I went to the Yahoo groups website and was told I have been banned. = What the hell is going on? Sorry to be ugly but I have had hell getting = on to lists because of the spam filter on my server. I hope this is not = the situation here.   Richard Hazelip ----- Original Message -----=20 From: bnorth=20 To: PipeChat=20 Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2003 1:21 AM Subject: Fw: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group=20     ATTN PIPECHAT ADMINISTRATOR ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Organ-Pipes moderator=20 To: bnorth@intergate.ca=20 Sent: Saturday, November 01, 2003 2:35 PM Subject: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group=20     =20
(back) Subject: Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group From: "Octaaf" <octaaf@charter.net> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 20:16:47 -0600   My apologies.   Tim   ----- Original Message ----- From: "Administrator" <admin@pipechat.org> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2003 8:14 PM Subject: Re: Invitation to join the Organ-Pipes group     > Folks > > Please don't discuss this here - we, the Administrators of PipeChat, > have absolutely nothing to do with that Yahoo group. If I were you, > i would contact the very elusive Moderator/owner of the group whose > address, as far as I can gather, is Scb44484@cs.com > > David. > > >I'd like to join but I am "banned"> Please explain. > > > >Thanks, > > > >B. Agar > > > >On Nov 2, 2003, at 7:36 PM, Richard Hazelip wrote: > > > >>I went to the Yahoo groups website and was told I have been banned. > >>What the hell is going on? Sorry to be ugly but I have had hell > >>getting on to lists because of the spam filter on my server. I > >>hope this is not the situation here. > >> > >>Richard Hazelip > > -- > **************************************** > David Scribner > Owner / Co-Administrator > PipeChat > > http://www.pipechat.org > mailto:admin@pipechat.org > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >     --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.535 / Virus Database: 330 - Release Date: 11/1/2003  
(back) Subject: Re: What great music for today? From: <Cpmnhartus@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 22:03:42 EST   2 November 2003   At St. Peter's Episcopal Church in Lewes, Delaware the music was as = follows.   Voluntaries: "Adagio" by Samuel Barber and "Toccata" from Symphony 5 by Widor.   Anthems: "The Twenty-third Psalm" by Howard Goodall (Vicar of Dibley) "How Lovely Is Thy Dwelling Place" from "A German Requiem" by Johannes Brahms. "Lachrymosa" from "Requiem in D Minor" by W. A. Mozart Hymns: "For all the saints" "I come with joy to meet my Lord "Humbly I adore thee" "Come with us, O blessed Jesus" "Ye watchers and ye holy ones"   It was our Rector's final Sunday before leaving for a parish in Tarrytown, =   New York. He had been Rector of St. Peter's for 20 years.   George W. Bayley Director of Music    
(back) Subject: Re: [Organ-Pipes] pipechat administartor is trying to shut down organ pipes From: "Blair Anderson" <bda@shaw.ca> Date: Sun, 02 Nov 2003 20:31:53 -0600   Mike and "the Administrator":   This message is being sent to both the Organ-Pipes and PipeChat Mailing Lists...   What has not been answered and what seems to have been lost in all the hyperbole surrounding this Mailing List and its creation is the source of E-mail addresses to which invitations were sent.   If these addresses were culled from general Internet sources, then so be it - that's one of the inevitabilities of participation in this thing we call "The Internet".   However, if they were taken from existing Yahoo! Groups Mailing Lists, without that particular list Owner's or one of the Administrators' permission, then Yahoo!'s Terms of Service makes it very clear that, as a member of Yahoo! Groups, "You agree to not use the Service to: ... m. collect or store personal data about other users."   If this procedure was, in point of fact, done, then the owner/creator/administrator of the Organ-Pipes Mailing List must state it openly and publicly.   Armed with all the facts, members of the Yahoo! Groups Organ-Pipes Mailing List can then make the decision - themselves - whether or not they wish to subscribe to the service or to unsubscribe if currently a member.   When anyone provides information for a specific purpose, such as subscribin= g to a Mailing List, then that person is correct in assuming that the information provided is done so with the full knowledge that said information will be used solely and only for the purposes of that particula= r Mailing List. When such information, such as an E-mail address, is harvested, by whatever means, and used to establish another Yahoo! Groups Mailing List, this is a clear violation of the Terms of Service.   I have been an owner and administrator of many, many Yahoo! Groups Mailing Lists for many years and am completely cognizant of the rules and regulations embodied in the Terms of Service. "People" on other Mailing Lists, as represented in at least two Mailing List postings in the past 48 hours, are not, in my opinion, in the least concerned with the creation of yet another "Organ" Mailing List, but are deeply concerned, and rightly so, with the manner in which the Mailing Lists were and are being created.   The owner of the "Organ-Pipes" Mailing List should come clean and tell the subscribers to the Mailing List from where he gathered E-mail addresses to be able to send an invitation to potential subscribers.   Analogies made in an earlier posting, in an effort to ameliorate the curren= t situation are somewhat suspect, again, in my personal opinion...   > I assume spam is defined as unsolicited unwanted electronic messages.   SPAM is defined by The American Heritage=AE Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition, AD 2000 as:   "Unsolicited e-mail, often of a commercial nature, sent indiscriminately to multiple mailing lists, individuals, or newsgroups; junk e-mail."   An invitation to join a Yahoo! Groups Mailing List can, therefore, be considered as "SPAM" - IF you have not provided information specifically fo= r that express purpose. I personally don't recall giving any information specifically to be asked to join another Mailing List.   > What would you call a TV, radio, newspaper, magazine , flier or the like?   I can watch TV or listen to the radio because of advertisers paying fees to advertise and promote their products on that particular station or group of stations. It is a necessary fact of life that we all, as reasonable adults, accept. There is no such thing as totally "free" TV or radio. It just doesn't work that way.   If I want to read a newspaper, I pay, either daily, at the newsagents, for = a single copy, or a subscription to have the newspaper delivered to my front door. The advertisements are there, just as they are on TV or radio, to hel= p pay for and, therefore, facilitate the printing of that publication. We would be very naive to think otherwise. The same argument applies to magazines.   Flyers, put through the mail slot, are not solicited and, in some cases, no= t wanted. You have the right to refuse delivery of said flyers. I will not go in to the economic reasoning and underlying results of flyer distribution o= n sales and product costs. The point is that we _can_ refuse flyers if we so desire. We certainly don't _have_ to read them if they are put through the mail slot. We can choose to simply throw them in the recycling box. You all recycle, don't you?   > Are these media solicited , wanted by any stretch of the imagination?   Yes, all the above-mentioned media is solicited and wanted - by a reasonabl= e person's stretch of imagination. If I don't want to see commercials on TV, = I can mute the sound and look elsewhere, turn the TV off, or visit the little boy's room. I am not forced to view the commercials. Nor am I forced to listen to commercials on the radio. I don't have to read printed advertisements, nor do I have to read the flyers sent through my mail slot.   > How would you define telephone solicitors?   The only analogy that I can make with this statement, germane to this discussion, would be the source of the telephone numbers and information associated with that number. You can choose not to talk to the solicitation staff on the other end of the line and can, if you wish, state that you are not interested and ask that your information be removed from their calling list.   If I provide information with the express knowledge that the info. will be used to call me later and ask some questions or an attempt made to sell me = a service or product, then so be it. However, if I provide information to one service and that information is garnered or harvested to be used for anothe= r purpose, however related, then I do NOT agree and have NOT authorised that particular transaction.   > How about door to door visitors who knock unexpectedly?   I can choose to not answer the door and, if I do, I can state that I'm not interested.   > The elite in our unique profession complain when they receive an electron= ic > invitation and reply with kurt questions as how did you get my email?   This is a respectable and understandable question. I have said before, in this very E-mail, from where did the owner or this Mailing List procure my E-mail address? I have a right to know. I'm not trying to create discontent or hatred, or maligned dialog, I am asking a simple and direct question.   The person asking this question should not be put in the position of being on the defence should the owner not co-operate and provide the source. Nor should the person asking this question be made to feel uneasy or a complainer.   > Do they also call the TV, radio or newspaper or magazine and similarly > complain or do they accept these other media as a fact of life in a free > society?   As I illustrated above, this is not a good analogy to make. It certainly ha= s nothing whatsoever to do with the definition or conduct in and of a "free society".   > Freedom has a price.   I would really like this statement to be further explained and explored by the author. As it is, the statement lacks relevance to this discussion. Please explain.   > If someone wants to do you serious harm they can do so in a free society.   Sorry, no they can't! The exact opposite is, in fact, true! Obviously, the definition of a "free society" needs to be clearly stated and this is not the forum for that particular process.   > In lands where there is totalitarianism sending an unwanted email might b= e > criminal, but not in the Western World and not in most of the developing = lands > either.   Sending an unwanted E-mail, SPAM, if you will, _is_ against the law in a growing number of "Western World" jurisdictions. Once "developing lands" develop to a level where they can control or express their views and interests, SPAM is inevitable outlawed there, too.   This leads one to believe that SPAM is not a universally accepted, desirable, or preferred activity. It is, by most erudite people, considered to be unnecessary and unwanted. SPAM is largely responsible for a growing percentage of E-mail traffic today. Soon, the majority of E-mail messages will be SPAM. This means that mail servers around the world are being inundated with absolutely unnecessary traffic, slowing access to these servers by legitimate and wanted - in some cases, needed - E-mail.   > So to the elite and exclusionary I say this in the organ world: > Isnt the world already divided enough as it is along its national, ethnic > ,racial, and social borders? > Do you want our fine organ profession to thrive or whither away?   I fail to see the logic contained in the statement above. Surely, whether our profession thrives or whithers away has everything to do with the skill= , musicianship, promotion, open discussion, and public awareness of the organ and organists. It has nothing whatsoever to do with being elite or exclusionary. Since organs are, for the most part, installed in churches an= d serve the musical needs of a particular church, the future of our professio= n is undeniably linked to the future of the Church, not whether a particular Mailing List has 300, 600, or 3,000 subscribers.   Please, can we just carry on and discuss organs and organists and music, an= d put to rest the discussion of what has become political rhetoric and near-slander?   CHEERS! Blair... (and that is my _real_ name...)   _________________________________________ "The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -- George Bernard Shaw    
(back) Subject: Stephen Roberts/Danbury Symphony/WOW! From: "Malcolm Wechsler" <manderusa@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 22:34:23 -0500   Stephen Roberts/Danbury Symphony/WOW!   This Organist's post-church nap time was spent vertically today, and now, having experienced the concert I just did, sleep will not come easily, so full of the excitement of the event is my brain.   Danbury is a city in Northern Fairfield County, Connecticut, with a population of approximately 75,000, surrounded by a number of growing = small towns, including New Fairfield, where I live. In this, the city of Charles Ives, there is, appropriately a Danbury Music Center, which has been = working since 1935 to sponsor musical organizations of all kinds, including the Danbury Symphony Orchestra. Until recently, I lived in Stamford, Connecticut, a city of about 120,000. It has its Stamford Symphony Orchestra, once even conducted by Skitch Henderson, but it is a not very closely guarded secret that all the players are actually New York free-lancers. Rehearsals are in New York, and on Stamford concert nights, = a luxury bus brings the orchestra to its "home town," where it plays (very well indeed), and then hops on the bus for real home. Danbury's different. The DSO is home grown. Many of its nearly 70 players are amateurs, making their living in a wide variety of ways. There are a few professionals from the area as well. Well, I must tell you that they have nothing to be = ashamed of at all. The discerning ear knows this is not a professional ensemble - sometimes - but such is the spirit and enthusiasm of the enterprise that hearing the ensemble is, well, uplifting, if anyone uses that word = anymore. Their conductor, David Katz, made a great impression on me in a lot of = ways. He has a biography that dazzles, and includes association with some of the very great orchestras and soloists in the world. Most important, he is a strong conductor who never loses anybody. He is clear and concise, and is meticulously followed. Two things stand out, the first of which is his contagious enthusiasm as he addresses the audience. He said very little on this occasion, but he made clear his belief in what we were to hear this day. But, brothers and sisters of Pipe Organ List and Pipechat, this concert, almost entirely for Pipe Organ and Orchestra was his idea! It = took place at St. Peter R. C. Church in Danbury, where Stephen Roberts is Director of Music. It's a great space for music, and the older Peragallo = was built in the days when, for them, a stop meant exclusively a rank or more = of pipes. Bless its little unified heart, it gives a pretty good account of itself!   The soloist was Stephen Roberts, a contributing member of Pipe Organ List. In an age of shrinkage, he is building, yes, building an Organ department = at Western Connecticut State University in Danbury. He's a great teacher, and this came home to me as I talked before the concert to Fred Teardo, whom Stephen taught when he, Fred, was in high school. Fred has won some of the glittering prizes, has graduated from Eastman, and is now working on his Master's at Yale, while serving as Chapel Organist for Yale's Battell Chapel. Turning pages for Steve today was Juan Mesa, one of two students from Chile, who came to WestConn two years ago, and has gone on to win the AGO Regional Organ Playing Competition this past summer, earning a place = at Los Angeles next summer. I chatted briefly after the concert with Chris Howerter, a new Organ student, who has recently posted on our Organ lists. There is commitment in the air all around here. Who was it who said: = "Those who can play, play, and those who can't, teach." Rubbish.   Maestro Katz, in his opening remarks, before the orchestra began its = program with the Introduction to Act II of Lohengrin, said: "You will all note = that the Organ Console is vacant. This is because the Orchestra is going to = show off a bit by itself, before Stephen Roberts jumps on the bench to join us = in the Poulenc Concerto and the Saint-Saens Third Symphony." I only mention that, because had he had the expected knowledge of our instrument, he probably would have said: "You will all note that the Organ is vacant!" = Got it? The orchestra gave a strong and exciting performance of the Wagner, = and then Stephen entered to great applause. Maestro Katz made a helpful little speech about what people should expect of the one movement Concerto, the fact that it is highly sectional, with great contrasts. Things to watch = and listen for. Off they went, and what a grand performance it was! This is = big stuff for an Organist, and our man really had it all in order, so well = that, with only a small mirror to hang onto for a beat, from the conductor = behind his back, he and the orchestra were in perfect synch. Should we now expect an audience of just plain folks in 2003 to respond to the Poulenc. Played with clear commitment and excitement, yes. And so they did. There was a mighty response, well deserved, I would say.   After Intermission, Maestro again addressed us all, with helpful descriptions of the nature of the four movements we were to hear, and even better, the role of the Organ in the adagio and in the Maestoso, which he described as one of the great finales of all time. "Don't worry, you'll = hear the Organ." I just loved hearing his enthusiasm for our instrument. He = did, however, fail to mention that bits of the Saint-Saens managed to make it = to Hollywood, in the charming movie, "Babe." I do think Saint-Saens would = have loved that talking pig.   Well, this performance had everyone's full attention, watching the = intricate interplay within the orchestra, and then between orchestra and Organ, all led firmly by Maestro Katz. It was truly brilliant, and won an instant standing ovation at the end. The church was full, by the way, also very = nice to see.   Stephen Roberts graduated with high honors from the University of Oklahoma under the great Mildred Andrews. He studied with Heiller on a Fulbright, then at the Yale Institute of Sacred Music, where he studied with Robert Baker and Gerre Hancock, and also Harpsichord with Ralph Kirkpatrick. He = was for twelve years Director of Music at Berkeley Divinity School at Yale, = and is now at St. Peter Church in Danbury, while teaching at Western = Connecticut State U., also in Danbury. His students have won many prizes. He has = played in many parts of the world, and is soon to make his first tour of South America. You can hear him this July during the convention of the Organ Historical Society in Buffalo, New York. www.organsociety.org   There was a time today when Danbury was the center of the Organ World. I'm glad I was able to be there!   Malcolm Wechsler www.mander-organs.com      
(back) Subject: Re: [Organ-Pipes] pipechat administartor is trying to shut down organ pipes From: <BlueeyedBear@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 22:46:33 EST   i'm unsubscribing after this one. just too petty for words.   scot