PipeChat Digest #4946 - Wednesday, December 1, 2004
 
Re: Re:an advert of interest
  by "F. Richard Burt" <effarbee@verizon.net>
RE: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg  [marginally on-topi
  by "Emmons, Paul" <PEMMONS@wcupa.edu>
organ sound
  by "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net>
Re: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg  [marginally on-topi
  by <DERREINETOR@aol.com>
Organ Repertoire
  by "Daniel Hancock" <dhancock@brpae.com>
Re: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg  [marginally on-topi
  by "Paul Valtos" <chercapa@enter.net>
Re: Re:an advert of interest
  by "Andy Lawrence" <andy@ablorgans.com>
Re: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg  [marginally on-topi
  by <DERREINETOR@aol.com>
an advert of interest
  by "Nathan Smith" <erzahler@sbcglobal.net>
UGH, let's try that AGAIN
  by <TubaMagna@aol.com>
Re: Organ Repertoire
  by "Robert Lind" <lindr@core.com>
Re: St. Anne
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@swbell.net>
Grains of Rice for Speakers
  by "Roy Kersey" <rkersey@tds.net>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Re:an advert of interest From: "F. Richard Burt" <effarbee@verizon.net> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 13:22:28 -0600   Hi, Andy:   Thanks for a glimpse into tuning temps in Vermont.   > Temperatures swing around quite a bit here in Vermont... but on the > colder side.   Exactly reverse in Texas. Internal temps in winter can get down to about 60 degrees during the mid-week. We warm it up to about 68 to 70 degrees F on the weekends for our main worship services.   > For us, 80 is hot.   The temperature in the meeting room can easily range up to about 85 degrees near the upper reaches of the balcony (on the same level with the upper windchests in the Swell and Choir divisions down front), . . . and that is with the air conditioner running full blast to get the temps on the main floor level down to about 78 degrees F. This is an example of real temp range control from mid-May to late September.   During hot weather, if we lose cooling, the meeting room will shoot up into the upper 90s in about 10 minutes. Then, the people fall out and go home, with the blessings of our pastoral staff.   The unusual situation that I spoke about that gets some cooling in the main meeting room is the way our air conditioning system works. In the summer, we often have to run the cooling in the main meeting room just to make the main compressor work efficiently for the rest of the building.   Nice. The organ stays fairly stable all week. <grins> BUT, when the situation changes enough that the main compressor doesn't have to be run at optimum efficiency, we save money by letting it cycle ON and OFF around 72-ish degrees F. The Finance Committee likes those days.   On the other extreme, when humidity and temperature are both high, we can lose some of the playability of the organ quickly.   Oh, yes. "Have to" tune the organ is determined by our music director to play in tune or not to play in tune. I like to hear this organ basically in tune. It can go into "Grande Celesete" mode in about 4 months during the warm seasons.   Appreciatively, F. Richard Burt     ..      
(back) Subject: RE: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg [marginally on-topic, x-posted] From: "Emmons, Paul" <PEMMONS@wcupa.edu> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 14:40:50 -0500   But do people often use the theremin as a vehicle for improvisation?   If (as I presume) not, then I joined the chorus of people hoping that he might take an interest in the organ for a reason that it does not share with the theremin. Throughout most of its history, as Roger Evans emphasized even more, it has been regarded as an improvisateur's vehicle par excellence, with great composers playing it regularly even if they left few or no written compositions for it. =20   Wouldn't learning to play some instrument or other go along with becoming a good composer? The number of great composers who have played the organ in commends it to any aspiring composer's attention. If, having acquired enough familiarity by improvising, he wishes to compose for it, so much the better. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be easy for anyone who lacks considerable experience with our instrument to compose successfully for it, even if he or she is a good composer in general.  
(back) Subject: organ sound From: "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 14:21:09 -0600   A good pipe organ is wonderful, but electronics have progressed wonderfully, and continue to do so. My home organ is a 25 year old first generation digital from Allen. Very obsolete by today's standards, but--not only reliable and repairable--it sounds WAY, WAY, better than the finest electronics of the 1950's and 1960's, no matter what they cost back then. Cost me $900. Sure, I'd rather have a pipe organ or even a brand new Allen, but economics is a factor. Yes, I can add an aftermarket MIDI and some sampled sounds. For another say, 2K$, I could have an excellent organ for under $3,000. Let's face it, pipes are going to have a tough time competing.   I'm an avid pipe organ fan, but I think we've already reached the technological point where a good, average top name electronic , properly installed, could/would fool 80% of the people (if they even cared!).   Dennis Steckley   "Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened."--Dr. Seuss        
(back) Subject: Re: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg [marginally on-topic, x... From: <DERREINETOR@aol.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 15:59:15 EST   List,   I happened to catch the segment on young Master Greenberg on "60 Minutes" this past Sunday. While I was quite impressed with his clearly enormous = talent, I was not overly impressed with the VERY little bit of his music I heard on = the broadcast.   Allow me to qualify this: for a 12-year-old, it was impressive. However, = his teacher made it clear in the interview that to be "truly great", he had to =   start questioning what he hears and "transcribes" from his own = imagination. Master Greenberg himself--in true 12-year-old style--insists that it is = "perfect" the way he hears it. If he follows his teacher's advice as he matures, he = may just be the next Mozart. If not, he'll be the next Mendelssohn.   Either way, I think that Master Greenberg is a talent to watch. Perhaps = he'll compose for the Organ?   Pax, Bill H. SJE Boston   (For those who may not have had the old-fashioned anglophile upbringing I had, "Master" is a "Mister" diminutive for gentlemen under the age of = majority and has nothing to do with the mastery of anything in particular). ;)  
(back) Subject: Organ Repertoire From: "Daniel Hancock" <dhancock@brpae.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 15:52:49 -0600   Does anyone know of a comprehensive listing of organ repertoire? I'd prefer to find something categorized by period and region...   =20   Daniel Hancock   Springfield, Missouri   =20   =20  
(back) Subject: Re: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg [marginally on-topic, x... From: "Paul Valtos" <chercapa@enter.net> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 17:08:17 -0500   Dear Bill,=20 I find your comments on the title "Master' bringing back many = memories of my birthday cards as a child when they would be addressed as = Master Paul Valtos. I thought that was appropriate for a boy. If a girl, = the title was 'Missy" from what I remember as opposed to Mistress or Ms. = It is a shame that we have lost that formality with our kids since it = put the kids in the proper pecking order.=20 Sincerely, Paul ----- Original Message -----=20 From: DERREINETOR@aol.com=20 To: pipechat@pipechat.org=20 Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 3:59 PM Subject: Re: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg = [marginally on-topic, x...     List,   I happened to catch the segment on young Master Greenberg on "60 = Minutes" this past Sunday. While I was quite impressed with his clearly = enormous talent, I was not overly impressed with the VERY little bit of = his music I heard on the broadcast.   Allow me to qualify this: for a 12-year-old, it was impressive. = However, his teacher made it clear in the interview that to be "truly = great", he had to start questioning what he hears and "transcribes" from = his own imagination. Master Greenberg himself--in true 12-year-old = style--insists that it is "perfect" the way he hears it. If he follows = his teacher's advice as he matures, he may just be the next Mozart. If = not, he'll be the next Mendelssohn.   Either way, I think that Master Greenberg is a talent to watch. = Perhaps he'll compose for the Organ?   Pax, Bill H. SJE Boston   (For those who may not have had the old-fashioned anglophile = upbringing I had, "Master" is a "Mister" diminutive for gentlemen under = the age of majority and has nothing to do with the mastery of anything = in particular). ;)=20     --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.786 / Virus Database: 532 - Release Date: 10/29/2004
(back) Subject: Re: Re:an advert of interest From: "Andy Lawrence" <andy@ablorgans.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 17:24:05 -0500   The common wisdom in Vermont seems to tune twice a year, maybe in May and late September, when its warm enough to have the heat off but not too = warm. Then maybe a reed touchup for Christmas and Easter. This is what everyone =   _says_ is best (including me). What I've observed is that everyone = settles for once a year at Christmas or Easter! So our worst tuning tends to be summer. A lot of New England churches go reedless in the summer! When a church asks me for a Christmas or Easter tuning, and I know their budget = is tight, I try to talk them into the most minor possible touchup (unless its =   really bad), and a more thorough tuning in May so the summer is not so awful. Most end up liking this system. Christmas and Easter are = important, but it seems silly for an entire summer to suffer for it.   Usually the Christmas organ that sounds "awful" turns out to have 2 bad trumpet pipes and sounds great when they're put right!   Andy   On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 13:22:28 -0600, F. Richard Burt wrote > Hi, Andy: > > Thanks for a glimpse into tuning temps in Vermont. > > > Temperatures swing around quite a bit here in Vermont... but on > the > > colder side. > > Exactly reverse in Texas. Internal temps in winter can get down > to > about 60 degrees during the mid-week. We warm it up to about > 68 to 70 degrees F on the weekends for our main worship services. > > > For us, 80 is hot. > > The temperature in the meeting room can easily range up to about > 85 degrees near the upper reaches of the balcony (on the same > level > with the upper windchests in the Swell and Choir divisions down > front), . . . and that is with the air conditioner running full > blast to get > the temps on the main floor level down to about 78 degrees F. > This > is an example of real temp range control from mid-May to late > September. > > During hot weather, if we lose cooling, the meeting room will > shoot up into the upper 90s in about 10 minutes. Then, the people > fall out and go home, with the blessings of our pastoral staff. > > The unusual situation that I spoke about that gets some cooling in > the main meeting room is the way our air conditioning system > works. > In the summer, we often have to run the cooling in the main > meeting > room just to make the main compressor work efficiently for the > rest of the building. > > Nice. The organ stays fairly stable all week. <grins> BUT, when > the situation changes enough that the main compressor doesn't have > to be run at optimum efficiency, we save money by letting it cycle > ON and OFF around 72-ish degrees F. The Finance Committee > likes those days. > > On the other extreme, when humidity and temperature are both > high, we can lose some of the playability of the organ quickly. > > Oh, yes. "Have to" tune the organ is determined by our music > director to play in tune or not to play in tune. I like to hear > this > organ basically in tune. It can go into "Grande Celesete" mode > in about 4 months during the warm seasons. > > Appreciatively, > F. Richard Burt > > . > > ****************************************************************** > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related > topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> > List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> > List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org>       A.B.Lawrence Pipe Organ Service PO Box 111 Burlington, VT 05402 (802)578-3936 Visit our website at www.ablorgans.com  
(back) Subject: Re: 11 yr old "child prodigy" composer Jay Greenberg [marginally on-topic, x... From: <DERREINETOR@aol.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 17:39:31 EST   Paul,   I believe "Mistress" was the form of address in our family, though I had = no sisters but did have female cousins, both first and second,about my age. = In those days, "Mistress" had a VERY different connotation, and it wasn't all = that very long ago.   Bill H. Boston.  
(back) Subject: an advert of interest From: "Nathan Smith" <erzahler@sbcglobal.net> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 17:40:18 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time)   Hi List,=0D =0D >>That "advert" of interest=0D >>...eight minutes of commercial "adverts,"...=0D >>Regarding the "advert" in question, we must separate the tactics of the= =20 advert"...=0D >>Are we objecting more to the content of the "advert" or to the threat o= f the device being "adverted"?=0D >>I am also friends with the gentlemen who created the "advert,"...=0D >>...although the "advert" has some wording...=0D >>The "advert" is correct about the fact that pipe organs...=0D >>The "advert" is correct...=0D >>The "advert" is correct about the bureaucratic...=0D >>The "advert" lists options...=0D >> Don't blame the "advert." =0D =0D Repeated mockery of my use of a legitimate word aside, none of this answers my question: Are we going to start dumping on each others work t= o get ahead?=0D =0D >>who has been organist at >>>Trinity Unitarian<<< ...=0D =0D Isn't that an oxymoron?=0D =0D Best,=0D =0D Nate
(back) Subject: UGH, let's try that AGAIN From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 19:23:37 EST   erzahler@sbcglobal.net ("Nate") said: "Repeated mockery of my use of a legitimate word aside, none of this answers my question: Are we going to = start dumping on each others work to get ahead?"   Okay, here we go: Yes, "advert" is a legitimate word. No, it is not a noun. It is a verb.   Now, on with the business at hand: I DID answer your question, so now you can answer some of MINE.   Where in their marketing campaign literature did Marshall & Ogletree = "knock" pipe organ builders and their work? In which sentence did they disparage craftsmanship? In what portion of the presentation did they attack pipe = organs on musical grounds? While the entire tenor of the marketing campaign may = imply that their instruments are a better choice, where did they actually SAY = it? What verbiage actually attacked pipe organs, the art of organbuilding, or any particular organbuilder? Frankly, these chatlists are FULL of attacks on = pipe organ builders, so there is no need for Torrence & Yaeger or Marshall & Ogletree = to purchase two full pages for an attack advertisement.   Yes, there are a few organists who prefer pipe organs, but most have repeatedly and proudly stated that they simply don't care, and are happy = with any substitute so long as it is large, is loud, and has many flashy controls. = THAT should concern us FAR more than a marketing program that asks legitimate questions -- WITHOUT "knocking" the pipe organ.   It would be MUCH easier to be angry if it WERE an attack, but they are spoon-feeding organists exactly what they wish to hear. Pipe organ = builders feel helpless because organists CHOOSE substitutes. Digital instrument = manufacturers are successful because of organists. Remember, they have NO control over peoples' brains, peoples' standards, or the choices they make.   Sebastian M. Gluck New York City   ..  
(back) Subject: Re: Organ Repertoire From: "Robert Lind" <lindr@core.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 18:26:56 -0600   Klaus Beckmann's Repertorium Orgelmusik 1150-2000, Volume I (=A9 2001, = published by Schott), has an alphabetical index listing all the = composers in the book that will lead you to the correct page(s) on which = a composer's oeuvre is given. The main body of the book is alphabetical = by country, and within a country composers are listed by date of birth. = This is certainly an interesting arrangement, but--   But, there is also John Henderson's A Directory of Composers for Organ, = and its 3rd edition is coming out pretty soon. This book will prove to = be indispensable.   I have both tomes (Henderson's 2nd ed. at the moment) and am glad I do.   Robert Lind =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Daniel Hancock=20 To: pipechat@pipechat.org=20 Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 3:52 PM Subject: Organ Repertoire     Does anyone know of a comprehensive listing of organ repertoire? I'd = prefer to find something categorized by period and region.       Daniel Hancock   Springfield, Missouri    
(back) Subject: Re: St. Anne From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@swbell.net> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 21:22:42 -0600   The hymn tune "St. Anne" was published by Dr. Henry Croft, organist of = Westminster Abbey, in 1708. (Croft may or may not have written it.) It = thus antedates Bach's fugue. However, as has already been pointed out = by others, the same theme is also found used by Buxtehude and even = earlier. So Bach could have copied "St. Anne", but it is unlikely he = did.   John Speller ----- Original Message -----=20 From: DudelK@aol.com=20 To: pipechat@pipechat.org=20 Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 7:51 AM Subject: Re: St. Anne     In the Hymnal 1982 it is attributed to William Croft, 1678-1727. I = don't have the date of the St. Anne fugue, but it would seem possible = since Bach died in 1750.
(back) Subject: Grains of Rice for Speakers From: "Roy Kersey" <rkersey@tds.net> Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 3:26:04 +0000   Hi Colin and all, I think a thirty year life for speakers is wildly optimistic in most = climates. The foam that supports the outside of the speaker deteriorates = before then in most cases. I would say twenty years is still a lot. Of = course, the speakers can be repaired or reconed, so they don't need to be = entirely replaced, at least the first time. I don't know whether this = means you are overestimating or underestimating the cost. Surely by = thirty years out the original speakers would be obsolete and need to be = replaced with something state of the art, so I guess that the repair on = the speaker at 15 years does increase the cost some. Assuming no falling pipes or boneheaded conservators damaging the = tracker, it should go soldiering on . . . Best Regards, Roy Kersey Organ Enthusiast and Amateur Trumpeter I hope to have a C trumpet soon, and then no organist will be safe . . .