PipeChat Digest #5017 - Sunday, December 19, 2004
 
Re: The Catholic  "Grosser Gott"
  by "Thomas Mohr" <thomasmohr@aon.at>
RE: 128' stops - and the Fundaton!
  by "Paul White" <paulwh@optusnet.com.au>
Re: The Catholic  "Grosser Gott"
  by "Stephen Best" <stevebest@usadatanet.net>
Re: I wonder what Funeral Homes have pipe organs?
  by "Jerry Richer" <jerry@ChirpingBat.Com>
Re: Weird Pedal Stops
  by "Jerry Richer" <jerry@ChirpingBat.Com>
Re: Weird Pedal Stops
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
Re: The Catholic  "Grosser Gott"
  by "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com>
32' stops reproduced on subwoofers...
  by <Wuxuzusu@aol.com>
RE: Weird Pedal Stops
  by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
RE: Weird Pedal Stops
  by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
Lowest human voice; was: Weird Pedal Stops
  by <Wuxuzusu@aol.com>
Re: The Catholic "Grosser Gott"
  by <RVScara@aol.com>
Re: The Catholic "Grosser Gott"
  by "Liquescent" <quilisma@cox.net>
Re: 128' stops
  by "Jerry Richer" <jerry@ChirpingBat.Com>
Re: Weird Pedal Stops
  by "Jerry Richer" <jerry@ChirpingBat.Com>
The old organ of Stavanger Cathedral (x-post)
  by "Jarle Fagerheim" <jarle_fagerheim@yahoo.co.uk>
Fwd: Computer geeks discover the Disney organ
  by "Administrator" <admin@pipechat.org>
RE: Weird Pedal Stops
  by "Tim Bovard" <tmbovard@earthlink.net>
RE: Weird Pedal Stops
  by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
RE: Weird Pedal Stops
  by "Tim Bovard" <tmbovard@earthlink.net>
Re: Weird Pedal Stops
  by "Jim McFarland" <mcfarland6@juno.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: The Catholic "Grosser Gott" From: "Thomas Mohr" <thomasmohr@aon.at> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 11:38:22 +0100     > Subject: The Catholic "Grosser Gott" > From: "Alicia Zeilenga" <azeilenga@theatreorgans.com> > Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 22:42:01 -0600 > > Hi, > > I was practicing for church tomorrow and I decided to play a few others > too just for fun. One of the ones I was playing around with was Grosser > Gott (Holy God We Praise Thy Name). My hymnal (Catholic) gives 8 bar > repeat that Catholics traditionally sing, but it doesn't give the few > ornaments that we traditionally add. (And it's the only Catholic hymnal > that I've seen that even has the repeat.) Does anyone know why > Catholics traditionally repeat those eight measures? Where did the > extra notes come from and why don't we write it the way we sing it? > > Alicia   Dear Alicia,   I am Catholic and from Vienna, Austria from where this song originated. I regularly play "Grosser Gott" in our church. I have never heard of = repeating the last 8 measures, except in the last verse where they are sometimes repeated pleno organo, but this is at the organists discretion. The hymnal = we use (used in Austria, Germany and Switzerland) does not have any = ornaments. If you look at Max Reger (who was a Catholic) op 135a, 30 Little Preludes = for Organ, which contains a prelude for "Grosser Gott", you don't find the ornamentation in the c.f. either.   I guess this must be some sort of a US resp. protestant specific = alteration.   regads, Thomas -- DI Thomas Mohr Institute for Cancer Research Medical University of Vienna Borschkegasse 8a A-1090 Vienna   ++43 1 4277 65160  
(back) Subject: RE: 128' stops - and the Fundaton! From: "Paul White" <paulwh@optusnet.com.au> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 22:41:44 +1100   While wiping the tears away from my eyes after reading this, I remembered that the theatre organist Len Rawle told the story about the care he took over the installation of the Wurlitzer at his home. Being concerned about disturbing the neighbours, Len went to some effort in ensuring that the sounds of his late night practice would remain within his own four corners. But he was surprised one day to meet the man who lived next door, and be complimented on his playing the previous evening. When Len replied that he had not thought that the music could be heard outside the house, the neighbour agreed, but said that he did heard Len playing when he went to the toilet! It turned out that the two properties shared a common sewer, and obviously the musical vibrations found their way across the boundary. Not quite the Fundaton, but there must be a connection(!) somewhere. Paul White Melbourne (Incidentally, Len was in Melbourne recently, and gave a wonderful informal concert for a TOSA club night on the Blackett & Howden theatre organ at Coburg Town Hall.) -----Original Message----- From: pipechat@pipechat.org [mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org] On Behalf Of Will Light Sent: Sunday, 19 December 2004 5:17 AM To: 'PipeChat' Subject: RE: 128' stops - and the Fundaton! Jarle is MUCH too young to remember the Fundaton, so here is a repeat of the whole sorry story!  
(back) Subject: Re: The Catholic "Grosser Gott" From: "Stephen Best" <stevebest@usadatanet.net> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 08:41:17 -0500   This is definitely not a "US resp. protestant specific alteration." I have taught a great many Catholic organists for the diocese in my area, and in virtually all of their congregations the last 8 measures are repeated and the "ornaments" added. In others, the measures are repeated without the ornaments. When I encounter this in Protestant hymnals, there are no repeats or ornaments (not that I've inspected every Protestant hymnal). When teaching this hymn, I always have to make sure that the version I teach is the one the student's congregation sings. So -- Alice and I are still waiting for someone to tell us how the repeats/ornaments happened to come about.   Steve Best in Utica, NY   Thomas Mohr wrote:   >>Subject: The Catholic "Grosser Gott" >> >> >> >Dear Alicia, > >I am Catholic and from Vienna, Austria from where this song originated. I =   >regularly play "Grosser Gott" in our church. I have never heard of = repeating >the last 8 measures, except in the last verse where they are sometimes >repeated pleno organo, > >I guess this must be some sort of a US resp. protestant specific = alteration. > >regads, >Thomas > >      
(back) Subject: Re: I wonder what Funeral Homes have pipe organs? From: "Jerry Richer" <jerry@ChirpingBat.Com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 07:13:43 -0500   Andrew! I grew up in a Funeral Home but never got involved with the Family Business as people affectionately refer to it as. My Father tried = to get us boys interested but there were no takers until he got to the = youngest who still runs the business today. I wouldn't even play the organ at the Funeral Home, only in the church at the Funeral. Like my Father my = brother is regularly approached by places like SCI and Family Funeral but still manages to keep them away. I don't know Champion Funeral Supply but he does, I just asked him. Merry Christmas / Happy Holidays.   Jerry   Chirp|Chirp|Chirp: It's the Bat, Bat Arhonious Software, = www.chirpingbat.com    
(back) Subject: Re: Weird Pedal Stops From: "Jerry Richer" <jerry@ChirpingBat.Com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 12:42:17 -0500   So Ross you actually have a 64' open stop in Australia. How many of those exist in the world and where would you find them? I'll have to = check with organ supply to see how much they want for a rank, nothing fancy, = just whatever they happen to have on the shelf. Merry Christmas / Happy Holidays.   Chirp|Chirp|Chirp: It's the Bat, Bat Arhonious Software, = www.chirpingbat.com    
(back) Subject: Re: Weird Pedal Stops From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 13:29:38 EST   Jerry:   The 64' Ross is talking about is a quarter length reed IIRC. I stand on firm ground when I say, stops like these are of limited use, a luxury, and quite often disappointing ego builders. From my experience with 64' stops having sat the Crystal Cathedral console and tried them, produce little more than an unfocused noise. Part of the problem there is the glass walls which are not conductive to producing solid waves in that range and pitch.   Ron Severin    
(back) Subject: Re: The Catholic "Grosser Gott" From: "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 13:12:32 -0600   Adding to what Stephen Best wrote:   > When I encounter this in Protestant hymnals, there are no repeats or > ornaments (not that I've inspected every Protestant hymnal).   I own about 40 Protestant hymnals in speaking. Examining more than half, including specimens from all tradtions (Lutheran, Anglican, Methodist, Presbyterian), snf countries in my collection, the only hymnal I see with the repeat is a recent Roman Cathoic one.Moreover, the older hymnal I own intended for Roman Catholic use, the St. Gregory of Fr. Montani, does not contain the repeat, eithe.   My best guess is that the practice of repeating the last line is an instance of something done for expedience in one place which got picked up as a more general tradition. It is not difficult at all for me to imagine that this was music to accompany some activity, perhaps a procession which was just a bit too short, but was just right if the last line of each verse was repeated. Others heard this, liked it, and replicated it. How is the tune in the St. Basil?   ns  
(back) Subject: 32' stops reproduced on subwoofers... From: <Wuxuzusu@aol.com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 14:47:05 EST   I have a 10 year old set of subwoofers manufactured by HSU Research. Each = has a 10" speaker and the set is rated down to 18Hz, a solid 32' C#, I do believe. It handles the low notes of all my organ recordings.   Stan Krider   In a message dated 12/18/2004 11:43:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, Garrison Johnson writes:   Let's take another look: middle C (2')=3D256 Hz two octaves down, 8' C then =3D 64 Hz 16' C =3D 32 Hz 32" C =3D 16 Hz 64' C =3D 8 Hz, still (barely) audible As far as producing these low notes electronically, no problem with generating them (oscillators), but try to find a speaker which will reproduce them. A 32' stop requires a big box and a couple of at least 18" speakers!  
(back) Subject: RE: Weird Pedal Stops From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 08:49:38 +1300     > So Ross you actually have a 64' open stop in Australia. How many of those exist in the world and where would you find them?   Hey, even as a joke you don't say NZers live in Oz!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We are 1300 miles away at the closest point. I think it's closer from London to Moscow than it is from Wellington to Sydney.   Politics and Geography aside now, in deference to the Christmas spirit of peace and goodwill....... :-)   The Sydney Town Hall's 1891 Hill organ, five manuals and its original pneumatic action still, has 127 straight stops, with no extension or duplication anywhere and was the biggest organ in the world when built. It has a 64ft Trombone, full-length, the only such stop ever to have been built, and it beats at approx.8 cps at CCCCC. It is not an extension of a 32ft reed, but an entirely independent rank.   The only other 64ft stop ever to have been built is the Diaphone at the Atlantic City Stadium the USA, but I'm not sure if it still functions as = (I believe) most of the organ is out-of-commission these days. The Sydney organ, though, is in perfect order.   Whatever people might say, these are the only 64ft stops ever to have been built. A few organs may have one or two notes into the 64ft octave, but no other is complete. The 64ft "Gravissima" stops are usually as real as a = 32ft Resultant Bass or Acoustic Bass. No one has ever made a 32ft flue stop.   Ross    
(back) Subject: RE: Weird Pedal Stops From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 08:53:17 +1300   >he 64' Ross is talking about is a quarter length reed IIRC. I stand on firm ground when I say, stops like these are of limited use, a luxury, and quite often disappointing ego builders.   I've missed a bit here. I've never spoken of any fractional-length 64ft = reed as I don't believe anyone has ever made such a stop. The Sydney Town = Hall's 64ft Trombone is in fact almost 68ft long at CCCCC I think, but someone = else may have the exact length. Without actually hearing the stop in the Town Hall, I'm not willing to be judge of the stop, as I don't believe any recording or hi-fi home system could ever even begin to reproduce it.   Ross        
(back) Subject: Lowest human voice; was: Weird Pedal Stops From: <Wuxuzusu@aol.com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 14:57:37 EST   This comment brings to mind the legendary J. D. Sumner, who sang bass for=20 Elvis Presley. How would he compare? ...and what about the famed Cossack=20 Singers, a Russian male mens' chorus? I'm sure their bass section might deba= te this=20 claim, although they lived decades before the Guinness World Records origina= ted.   Stan Krider   Now back to the lowest pipe organ sounds...   :-)   In a message dated 12/19/2004 5:01:35 AM Eastern Standard Time, Jan Nijhuis=20 writes:   Tim Storms, a member of the Christian a capella group "Rescue"=20 (www.rescueministries.com) currently holds the record for that note by a hum= an ... From=20 their press packet pdf file:   "Their sound is comprised of four young men: Jason Overstreet, Jay McKenney,= =20 Mitch Fewell, and their bass, Tim Storms, who holds the Guinness World Recor= d=20 for the lowest note produced by a human! (The note is two octaves below the=20 lowest B on the piano =E2=80=93 8 Hz.)"  
(back) Subject: Re: The Catholic "Grosser Gott" From: <RVScara@aol.com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 15:26:37 EST   As I recall, the ornamentals were in the oldest editions of the St Basil Hymnal but in a later revision, "to clean it up and make it more = liturgically correct," a number of changes were made to several hymns including Holy = God and Mother Dear O Pray for Me (which had similar ornamentals. That hymnal was =   "banned" in a number of areas, a lot of the complaints coming from the Pittsburgh Diocese. I think Bud could comment on that. = I still have 2 old editions and occasionally play some of the "oldies" for = the senior members of the parish. Bob Scara St Paul RC Burlington, NJ  
(back) Subject: Re: The Catholic "Grosser Gott" From: "Liquescent" <quilisma@cox.net> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 13:06:14 -0800   Ah yes, the battle between the St. Basil Hymnal and the St. Gregory Hymnal (grin).   Nicolai (sp?) Montani and Fr. Carlo Rossini were cut from the same cloth (grin) ... they both came to power about the same time as Mussolini, and employed approximately the same techniques (chuckle) ... Montani in Philadelphia, Rossini in Pittsburgh.   BOTH despised the St. Basil Hymnal (Healy Willan was the music editor of the St. Basil ... a little-known fact); but I don't think they liked each OTHER very much EITHER (grin).   Those were the days of TOWERING egos in RC church music.   In some ways, it was the Irish vs. the Italians ... the Irish parishes used the St. Basil; the Italians used the St. Gregory.   Fr. Rossini published his own "Parochial Hymnal", but I don't think it was much used outside the diocese of Pittsburgh, where he was diocesan music dictator and organist/choirmaster of St. Paul's Cathedral.   The attempt to ban "Mother Dear, O Pray For Me" and things of similar ilk was made in the infamous "White List" of the Society of St. Gregory (published by the Montani camp) ... it read like the "List of Banned Italians and Germans" ... though Montani was Italian, evidently he HATED Rossini, Perosi, Carnevali, et al ... it might have also had to do with them all being in J. Fischer's stable ... I don't recall Montani publishing that much, other than the St. Gregory Hymnal. At any rate, their Masses were ALL on his Black List (contained in the "White List" book), along with Schubert, Mozart, Haydn, etc. ... and of COURSE my FAVORITE perversion of ALL that is holy (chuckle), the Repertorium Chorale of Msgr. Peter Griesbacher of Regensburg Cathedral (think R. Wagner on BAD acid).   In fairness, some of the Masses of Mozart, Haydn, Schubert, etc. DID violate the rules set down by Pius X in his Motu Proprio on Church Music about pronouncing the text clearly ...   Mozart and Haydn both wrote Glorias and Credos where each voice part started on the first, second, third, and fourth lines of the text respectively; then they came together at the "Qui tollis" section of the Gloria, and again at the Amen of the Gloria; and at the Incarnatus of the Credo, and again at the Amen of the Credo, resulting (in some case) in Glorias and Credos that took all of a minute or two to sing (grin).   Schubert OMITTED phrases of the Credo that he disagreed with (!), notably "et unam sanctam catholican et apostolicam Ecclesiam (!!), though later editions usually had the "restored" text printed as an ossia.   As for the rest, they were no better or worse than what was being sung in Anglican church at the time, if you look at service-lists of city Anglican churches, or the Chant and Service Book of 1898. Indeed many anglo-catholic churches sang the SAME music, either in the original Latin, or in the bowdlerized Novello English adaptations ... things like Henry Farmer's "Grand (Celebrated?) Mass In B Flat", a favorite of the black-listers.   Knowing that I'd made an edition of John Bacchus Dykes' "Dies irae", somebody sent me the service-list from a turn-of-the-century priest's funeral at the Church of St. Mary the Virgin (Episcopal) in NYC at which it was sung. For those of you who don't know it, it's the "Wolf's Glen Scene" of Victorian church music (chuckle).   I find it somewhat amusing that a church like The Ascension in Chicago has revived some of the Masses of Perosi, though my chant teacher told me that Perosi's best works were written for the papal choir while Perosi was director, and were never published. My teacher, Father John de Deo, OFM sang in the papal choir in the 1930s; he said the rehearsal room was LOCKED during rehearsal, and only UNLOCKED after each numbered copy of music had been carefully collected and counted.   Cheers,   Bud, who still plays "Grosser Gott" with the repeat and the "flips" in the melody   RVScara@aol.com wrote:   > As I recall, the ornamentals were in the oldest editions of the St Basil = > Hymnal but in a later revision, "to clean it up and make it more = liturgically > correct," a number of changes were made to several hymns including Holy = God and > Mother Dear O Pray for Me (which had similar ornamentals. That hymnal = was > "banned" in a number of areas, a lot of the complaints > coming from the Pittsburgh Diocese. I think Bud could comment on that. = I > still have 2 old editions and occasionally play some of the "oldies" = for the > senior members of the parish. > > Bob Scara > St Paul RC > Burlington, NJ >    
(back) Subject: Re: 128' stops From: "Jerry Richer" <jerry@ChirpingBat.Com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 14:31:23 -0500   If the helicopter rotor rotates at 330 revolutions per minute and if there are two blades then I guess there would be a fundamental generated = at 2 * 330 cycles per minute or 11 hertz. There are so many other higher harmonics though I don't know that 11 hertz would be obvious. Helicopters pass over my house frequently and the low frequencies are really very ominous. I guess I feel them more than hear them. Merry Christmas / Happy Holidays. Jerry   Chirp|Chirp|Chirp: It's the Bat, Bat Arhonious Software, = www.chirpingbat.com    
(back) Subject: Re: Weird Pedal Stops From: "Jerry Richer" <jerry@ChirpingBat.Com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 14:37:14 -0500   I wonder how they measured 8 Hurtz? It's not like you could compare = it to a piano or does someone have perfect pitch? Maybe you could just put your hand on his chest and count the vibrations, one, two, three .... Merry Christmas / Happy Holidays. Jerry   Chirp|Chirp|Chirp: It's the Bat, Bat Arhonious Software, = www.chirpingbat.com    
(back) Subject: The old organ of Stavanger Cathedral (x-post) From: "Jarle Fagerheim" <jarle_fagerheim@yahoo.co.uk> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 23:03:52 +0100   Dear Chatters and Listers,   I live quite close to the capital of South-Western Norway, Stavanger, home to a wonderful old Norman/Gothic Cathedral with a not-so-wonderful organ. The current organ is by Gebr. Reil of Holland, dating from 1991, which replaced a 1941/1948 Frobenius. My mother had first hand experience with it for several years, being a student of the cathedral organist Lars M=E6land. It was a very fine instrument, but unfortunately the pipes were crammed in beneath the roof -- the gallery was to small for such a large instrument. When the EP action eventually broke down, it was decided to replace the whole thing, as restoring supposedly wouldn't be cheaper than building a new instrument. Even though the space problem was solved by lowering the gallery, the Reil has been deservedly critisized ever since its completion. I won't go in detail about that one now, though.   I find the disposition (http://home.no.net/jafagerh/stavanger_frobenius.txt) of the Frobenius organ rather interesting. It's definitely not what one would expect from a Danish builder of the era. In many ways, it resembles the great organ of Aarhus Cathedral, Denmark, also by Frobenius (http://musikhistoriskmuseum.kroyer.kulturhotel.dk/reg/aarhus_dom_hovedo_te= kniske_data.htm).   Both have EP action, slider chests, and were heavily influenced by the Elsassian organ movement. Albert Schweitzer himself were consulted in both cases. On his recommendation Emilius Bangert, organist of Roskilde Cathedral, was hired as consultant for the Stavanger organ.   As far as I know the organ is still in storage. Stavanger will be a European Culture City in 2008. A new concert hall is being planned, and there was a commitee discussing whether the old organ could be re-used. I'm not sure why their answer turned out negative, but I do believe the organ should be put back together. It represents a different organ movement, one that strove to unite the German baroque and French symphonic schools -- and whose principles are remarkably similar to those of the modern "eclectic" styles.   Jarle http://jarle.moo.no  
(back) Subject: Fwd: Computer geeks discover the Disney organ From: "Administrator" <admin@pipechat.org> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 16:15:07 -0600   The following was sent to me to forward since the PipeChat server seems to think that URL's sent by TommyLee's email program are attachments.     >This URL was forwarded to me by a friend. The article is at a website = that >seems to be geared towards computer/internet geeks. It's about the = Disney >organ. Now if we can garner more interest from this group, then the = survival >of the organ looks much less bleak. > >http://www.boingboing.net/2004/12/17/geeking_out_over_geh.html > >Unfortunately, the reviewer only saw the organ and didn't hear it, but = the >article is nontheless encouraging, and he does have link to upcoming = concerts >on the organ. Enjoy! > >Happy Holidays to all! > >Cheers, >TommyLee Whitlock     -- **************************************** David Scribner Owner / Co-Administrator PipeChat   http://www.pipechat.org mailto:admin@pipechat.org  
(back) Subject: RE: Weird Pedal Stops From: "Tim Bovard" <tmbovard@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 16:47:16 -0600   No, Ross -- you haven't missed a thing.   Ron is entirely incorrect, again. The Sydney (Australia) Town Hall organ contains a full length 64' Trombone (as you correctly state) and the Atlantic City (New Jersey) Boardwalk Convention Hall contains a full = length 64' Diaphone/Dulzian. These are the ONLY two such fully complete 64' = stops ever built in the world.   The Crystal Cathedral organ has a single 64' stop (called "Le Force, I think) which is a derived stop with NO pipes of its own, of whatever = length.   --Tim   At 01:53 PM 12/19/2004, Ross wrote: > >he 64' Ross is talking about is a quarter length reed IIRC. >I stand on firm ground when I say, stops like these are of >limited use, a luxury, and quite often disappointing ego >builders. > >I've missed a bit here. I've never spoken of any fractional-length 64ft = reed >as I don't believe anyone has ever made such a stop. The Sydney Town = Hall's >64ft Trombone is in fact almost 68ft long at CCCCC I think    
(back) Subject: RE: Weird Pedal Stops From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 12:01:28 +1300   >Ron is entirely incorrect, again. The Sydney (Australia) Town Hall organ =   contains a full length 64' Trombone (as you correctly state) and the Atlantic City (New Jersey) Boardwalk Convention Hall contains a full = length 64' Diaphone/Dulzian. These are the ONLY two such fully complete 64' = stops ever built in the world.   Do note, though, that the Atlantic City 64ft is a full-length wooden diaphone. In no way whatever can this be compared with a Dulzian, which is = a fractional-length reed stop of metal somewhere, roughly, in tone half way between a Vox Humana and a Krummhorn. Even the Midmer-Losh firm wouldn't have attempted such a ghastly idea as one at 64ft, nor would Richards have even conceived it. (But I do like the Dulzian at 8ft or 16ft if you can = find one with stable speech and tuning).   Ross    
(back) Subject: RE: Weird Pedal Stops From: "Tim Bovard" <tmbovard@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 17:49:50 -0600   Correct. (well, mostly :-) ) The Atlantic City stop is of Diaphone construction in its bottom octaves, and changes to Dulzian construction as =   it ascends the scale -- somewhere around 16' CCC, I believe. The difference is all in the "boots" (if you will) between the Diaphone valvular beaters vs. standard brass reed tongues/shallots -- the = resonators themselves appearing as any typical (albeit enormous) wooden contra bombarde/trombone stop. The stoptab on the console reads simply 64' Diaphone, regardless.   --Tim   At 05:01 PM 12/19/2004, you wrote: >Do note, though, that the Atlantic City 64ft is a full-length wooden >diaphone. In no way whatever can this be compared with a Dulzian, which = is a >fractional-length reed stop of metal somewhere, roughly, in tone half way >between a Vox Humana and a Krummhorn. Even the Midmer-Losh firm wouldn't >have attempted such a ghastly idea as one at 64ft, nor would Richards = have >even conceived it. (But I do like the Dulzian at 8ft or 16ft if you can = find >one with stable speech and tuning).    
(back) Subject: Re: Weird Pedal Stops From: "Jim McFarland" <mcfarland6@juno.com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 18:56:34 -0500     On Mon, 20 Dec 2004 12:01:28 +1300 "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> writes:   > > Do note, though, that the Atlantic City 64ft is a full-length > wooden diaphone. In no way whatever can this be compared with a Dulzian, > which is a fractional-length reed stop of metal somewhere, roughly, in tone > half way between a Vox Humana and a Krummhorn. Even the Midmer-Losh firm > wouldn't have attempted such a ghastly idea as one at 64ft, nor would > Richards have even conceived it. (But I do like the Dulzian at 8ft or 16ft if you > can find one with stable speech and tuning).     Ross:     Call it what you will or won't, the stop IS a full length metal Dulzian by name. The bottom 22 pipes are of Diaphone construction, the remainder full length reeds of normal construction.   As far as your definition, I know of full length metal Dulzians, full length metal Dulzians with half length basses, and more importantly, hundreds of examples constructed of wood of various lengths.     Remember: There are no absolutes in pipe construction or nomenclature.       Jim               "Weaseling out of things is an important skill to learn. Its what separates us from the animals. Except the weasel" --Homer Simpson