PipeChat Digest #4282 - Monday, February 16, 2004
 
Re: hyfrydol and other language intricacies
  by <DERREINETOR@aol.com>
Re: Baptist Churches that aren't "Baptist"
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
Re: hyfrydol and other language intricacies
  by "Shirley" <pnst.shirley@verizon.net>
RE: hyfrydol
  by "John Foss" <harfo32@yahoo.co.uk>
Re: OMG that
  by "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net>
Re: Left, Right, etc.
  by "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net>
Re: Lou Dobbs last night
  by "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net>
Re: 32' short resonator reeds
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>
Re: Lou Dobbs last night
  by "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net>
Re: there's organs, then there's ORGANS
  by "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net>
Re: hyfrydol and other language intricacies
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>
A question about worship styles (X-posted)
  by "TommyLee Whitlock" <tommylee@whitlock.org>
Re: A question about worship styles (X-posted)
  by <Innkawgneeto@cs.com>
First Baptist Church, Jackson, Mississippi
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>
Re: First Baptist Church, Jackson, Mississippi
  by "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com>
Stoplist i would plan for my church, and other things related to it
  by "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com>
Interesting Item
  by "mack02445" <mack02445@comcast.net>
 

(back) Subject: Re: hyfrydol and other language intricacies From: <DERREINETOR@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:25:35 EST   Richard,   You're very right about what Texans do to Mexican Spanish--though I'm a = New Englander, I lived in Texas for many years and took my HS education there. = I used to work at the intersection of Sage Rd and San FILL-li-pee, (San = Filipe Rd.) which I pronounced "incorrectly" for years as "San fe(e)-LEE-pay".   I'm not surprised that the "Texians" anglicized Spanish during and after = the "Texas War of Independence" and today's anglophone Texans continue the = trend. There's nothing funnier than "upper crust" Anglo Texans speaking Spanish. = If you haven't heard it, wait a few months--you'll hear it in the news. Some = of the Texans you'll hear speaking Spanish were actually born in Connecticut, = but "talk" like "Texans". Especially when they "talk" Spanish.   I will point out, however--as a matter of historical fact- that the "Texas =   War for Independence" was waged by land-grant immigrants and = proto-corporate opportunists (Like Stephen Austin and Sam Houston) from the United States = against Mexico for the very reason that the Mexican Government had recently = outlawed slavery (at that time, in Mexico, widely practiced only in the Tejas = province) and curbed immigration from the United States into the Tejas Province of Mexico out of a fear that their culture and tongue would be diluted by = foreign influence. What an ironic (cynical?) beginning for the current home of wage-slavery ideologues and persistent fear of illegal immigration and = "cultural pollution".   Not that Massachusetts is any better, but let's tell the truth about why anglophone Texans behave--culturally--the way they do.   With understanding that this is pretty off-topic, Bill H.    
(back) Subject: Re: Baptist Churches that aren't "Baptist" From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 12:53:51 -0500   On 2/16/04 11:34 AM, "DERREINETOR@aol.com" <DERREINETOR@aol.com> wrote:   > the South has other churches not afraid to take the best from ALL traditi= ons! > There's something very special about churches like that. >=20 Bill: Agreed=8Bwith one very minor quibble. I think it=B9s important that any church has full ownership of the entire heritage of (at least Western) Christianity. So if a Baptist congregation uses a crucifer, they are not taking it =B3FROM=B2 any tradition, but using THE tradition to which they have every right.   But I=B9m still agreeing with your basic thoughts.   Alan    
(back) Subject: Re: hyfrydol and other language intricacies From: "Shirley" <pnst.shirley@verizon.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 15:19:32 -0500       On 16 Feb 2004 at 12:25, DERREINETOR@aol.com wrote:   > You're very right about what Texans do to Mexican Spanish--though I'm > a New Englander, I lived in Texas for many years and took my HS > education there. I used to work at the intersection of Sage Rd and San > FILL-li-pee, (San Filipe Rd.) which I pronounced "incorrectly" for > years as "San fe(e)-LEE-pay".     So do Californians. San Pedro is San PEE-dro for instance.   -Shirley      
(back) Subject: RE: hyfrydol From: "John Foss" <harfo32@yahoo.co.uk> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:51:07 +0000 (GMT)   Interesting, Will - Welsh sounds as if it sounds like Greek! B =3D V Y =3D Uh P =3D R G =3D Yuh H =3D EE D =3D TH and so on! Very confusing at first. John Foss     =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D www.johnfoss.gr http://groups.yahoo.com/group/orgofftop/ Topics of the week : God's gonna GIT you! The religious Right A failure of trust - can we trust governments any longer?     ___________________________________________________________ BT Yahoo! Broadband - Free modem offer, sign up online today and save = =A380 http://btyahoo.yahoo.co.uk  
(back) Subject: Re: OMG that From: "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:38:49 -0600   Is it just my computer, or is someone else not receiving any of Desiree's messages.   Jim H     ----- Original Message ----- From: "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Cc: <rmb10@aol.com> Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2004 10:16 PM Subject: OMG that        
(back) Subject: Re: Left, Right, etc. From: "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:37:04 -0600   Left, Right, etc.And also with you.   Jim H ----- Original Message -----=20 From: F. Richard Burt=20 To: PipeChat=20 Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 3:35 PM Subject: Re: Left, Right, etc.     Hello, Alan, et al: =20 =20 At the risk of sounding religious, Peace be with you. =20 F. Richard Burt =20 =20 .  
(back) Subject: Re: Lou Dobbs last night From: "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:11:00 -0600   A C2A, stripped down with the cheapest bench and music rack will run about 10-11K according to my last price sheet. Delivery not included. You are not getting much with this, but would suffice for a self-contained = practice organ.   Jim H     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Octaaf" <octaaf@charter.net> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 12:14 PM Subject: Re: Lou Dobbs last night     > Randy wrote: "They did say prices started at $10,000. What model might that > be?" > > Good question Randy. 10K for a new Allen? ...not likely. A 3 manual of > solid disposition STARTS around $75-100K. Hard to find a "newer" pre-owned > Allen under $20K, even on the Theatre Organ Classifieds! > > Perhaps there is an Allen dealer on this list that can clarify??? It = was > much less expensive importing my new digital organ from Europe .. = though, I > admit much more inconvenient. Being a custom instrument, there was a = wait > of several months. > > Cheers, > > Tim > > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.587 / Virus Database: 371 - Release Date: 2/12/2004 > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >      
(back) Subject: Re: 32' short resonator reeds From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:59:05 -0600     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 8:13 AM Subject: Re: 32' short resonator reeds     > Hello, > > Does it matter if a reed is horizontal or not, I > wonder? > > Surely, if a reed is mitred and the thing turned > towards the front, isn't the effect much the same?   Yes, it does matter, because most of the harmonics come out of the end of the pipe. Mitering and turning toward the front is known as "hooding", = and it is certainly true that hooded reeds are brighter than completely = vertical ones, but not anything like en chamade ones.   The trouble is, though, that very bright reeds -- the height of fashion in the 1960's -- are now out of fashion and smooth reeds with plenty of fundamental have now become the fashion. This pretty much means it's curtains for en chamades.   The best en chamades ever made, in my humble opinion, were those made by = the London firm of Gray & Davison in the nineteenth century, of which examples survive at Ludlow and Usk. These are of large scale with plenty of fundamental, and when placed en chamade became rich and wonderful. They would have been very dark and uninspiring as vertical reeds.   John Speller    
(back) Subject: Re: Lou Dobbs last night From: "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:16:55 -0600   All of the Protege series organs use Renaissance Technology. They differ from the Renaissance model organs in that the sounds can only be modified, not changed, as in the Renaissance models.   Jim H ----- Original Message ----- From: "F. Richard Burt" <effarbee@verizon.net> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 7:30 PM Subject: Re: Lou Dobbs last night     > Hi, Randy: > > Check it out on the Allen internet site. > > www.allenorgan.com/www/products/c-2a/c-2a.asp > > They show that it uses Rennaissance Technology. > > The one disadvantage as I see it is the use of only one > expression shoe. It's a single organ on two manuals > and pedals. > > Appreciatively, > F. Richard Burt > > > . > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Randolph Runyon" <runyonr@muohio.edu> > To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 4:48 PM > Subject: Re: Lou Dobbs last night > > > > on 2/15/04 4:50 PM, F. Richard Burt at effarbee@verizon.net > wrote: > > > > > > > Supposedly, ...it was rumored among dealers of competitive > brands > > > that > > > Allen introduced a two-manual, two-channel, self-contained > organ > > > with > > > external options (at extra cost) that had a dealer-cost of > less > > > than $5,000. > > > This is unsubstantiated, so don't proclaim this as newly > > > discovered truth. > > > <grins> > > > > > > If a dealer was in competition with another brand for an organ > > > that might > > > be considered to be deeply discounted, this small Protoge > Allen > > > was > > > supposedly going to be their counter-move. > > > > > > Does the Protege lack the Renaissance sound? Does it merely > sound like > > pre-Renaissance Allens? Or somewhere in between? > > > > > > Randy Runyon > > Music Director > > Zion Lutheran Church > > Hamilton, Ohio > > runyonr@muohio.edu > > > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related > topics > > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > > > > > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >      
(back) Subject: Re: there's organs, then there's ORGANS From: "Jim Hailey" <jhaileya10@charter.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:37:00 -0600   I know that I am somewhat challenged when it comes to digital-pipe combinations, but I just received an invitation to attend the inaugural concert of the Ruffati-Johannes in Arnold, MO. Are they switch hitting o= r what?   Jim H   ----- Original Message -----=20 From: <quilisma@cox.net> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 7:07 PM Subject: there's organs, then there's ORGANS     > > Cheers, > > Bud > > > > james nerstheimer wrote: > > > Allow me to join the chorus of welcomes at 16' 8' 4' 2' 2 2/3' and IV > > and with a Trompeta Real spitting out the tune! I'm with ya on the > > Coral Ridge School thing. Haven't quite heard anything like The Soun= d. > > Although I've found the Moller's I've heard to be the most pleasant > > musical mush ever, a Berghaus most boisterous, and Austins absolutely > > amazing, the Ruffatti sound just has this inexplicable enchantment ov= er > > me! I'll admit, I get my fix by clicking their website to hear the > > Balbastre Noel variations. I just love the "birdie and the bullfrog" > > one! (2' Flute duo-ing with a 16' reed) Anybody know which of the > > listed recordings that sample is taken from? I think it's St. Mary's= , S.F. > > > > BTW, if anyone has any info whatsoever on Moller Opus 8903=97Greensbo= ro, > > N.C., I am interested. You see, the console used where I play used t= o > > belong to that instrument. It has just come back this week from the > > Peterson shop in Alsip and looks absolutely stunning. Our project at > > St. Paul's thus far is on schedule and the organ should be playing ag= ain > > by 15th March. All are welcome to drop by for a test-drive! I have > > been documenting the work with pics. Email me if you'd like to have = a > > look-see. > > > > cheers n' beers > > > > jim > > > > O):^) > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get some great ideas here for your sweetheart on Valentine's Day - an= d > > beyond. http://special.msn.com/network/celebrateromance.armx > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topic= s > > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > > > > > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >      
(back) Subject: Re: hyfrydol and other language intricacies From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:26:58 -0600     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shirley" <pnst.shirley@verizon.net> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 2:19 PM Subject: Re: hyfrydol and other language intricacies     > San Pedro is San PEE-dro for instance.   The P, of course, is silent. As in "swimming."   John Speller    
(back) Subject: A question about worship styles (X-posted) From: "TommyLee Whitlock" <tommylee@whitlock.org> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 22:10:01 -0500   Hello,   I have seen much discussion about various worship traditions on these = lists, particularly about CCM vs traditional or litugical worship.   Regarding this (and a situation arrising at my church), my question is = this. Can anyone give me examples of of churches which have switched from CCM = back to traditional, liturgical worship? I have read some reports on the lists =   that there is evidence that this a trend which is gaining momentum as congregations grow tired of CCM. How successful has it been? Can anyone = give me examples where churches are thriving with traditional music? I gather = that Monty's church is one. <G> Others?   I don't know how much interest there is on the list for this topic, so = unless there is expressed interest from other list members, maybe it would be = best to reply to me off-list.   Cheers, Tommy Lee Whitlock Reston, VA    
(back) Subject: Re: A question about worship styles (X-posted) From: <Innkawgneeto@cs.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 22:29:56 EST   What my spin on the topic is...   I'm not so sure the pendulum is swinging BACK, but rather we're making = room for all the styles to co-exist, when appropriate.   For example, when a new baby comes into the household, all attention is = on that new baby. But as he/she grows, he/she just sorta fits into the = family. When my 2nd son was born, I wondered if I would have enough love for him, = in addition to my wife and 1st son. Of course I did, just made room.   So, the attention has been on CCM the last several years. Maybe now, over =   the course of time, CCM will fit into the family of worship music and be a = PART, not the WHOLE.   Maybe I'm idealistic? I think not. I think CCM has a place in worship, = but other styles do also.   Many, many churches have successfully utilized a variety of styles in = their services. It's nothing new!   Neil by the Bay      
(back) Subject: First Baptist Church, Jackson, Mississippi From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 21:31:23 -0600   Over the last few months several members of this list have asked me for = the stoplist of the 5/155 organ which Quimby Pipe Organs are building for = First Baptist Church, Jackson, Mississippi. I have been reluctant to give this = as some changes have been made during the course of construction, and it was very much a "work in progress" until now. However, the instrument is now = in the last stages of installation and the specification has been finalised. Those interested may find it on our website at: http://www.quimbypipeorgans.com/1bptsjackson.htm Since it is on the = website I will not waste bandwidth on reproducing it here.   A few comments. It will be noted that the instrument is very much in the Symphonic style and makes extensive use of fairly high pressures. Both = 32' reeds are full length. They are 12" scale and 9" scale. All ranks are entirely composed of pipes and there is not a digital voice or electronic bass in the organ. The lowest octave of the Pedal 16' Tuba Mirabilis is composed of Diaphone pipes.   John Speller      
(back) Subject: Re: First Baptist Church, Jackson, Mississippi From: "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:13:31 -0800 (PST)   YAY! An organ from home that I am familiar with. The previous Cassavant/Skinner/Geissler was a real problem shooter. I can = share with you some horror stories if you'ld like. I have some friends = that have played for First Jackson. Its a very big room and there is a lot = of hymn singing. A lot of praise chorsues too. The organ really is not = used as much as it should be...its a Baptist church. Glen Crosthwaite was organist there from 1990-1999 and a VERY good one at = that. Glen has that old fashioned Baptist organist "flava" Like Don = Hustad and Al Travis. Plays and writes some of the most beautiful hymn = arrangements. Hes now Minister of Music at a church in GA.       From Desiree' T. Desiree' Hines Chicago, IL 60649 http://concertartist.info/bios/hines.html   --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online  
(back) Subject: Stoplist i would plan for my church, and other things related to it From: "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:58:05 -0800 (PST)   Ok... Now...all i want is a superhorn...a Harmonic trompeta that is simply = placed horizontally. Its what I love...and it will create a good visual = for the church. This new church job i have is turning out to be the best = thing I have ever had. BTW Darryl Ray...its part time, with hopes of making me full time in 2 = years or so. The thing im faced with is, how to get them rilled up. They = are so happy im there. Comments are coming like a rain storm "she's the = best organist we've ever had!" IOne lady even said "It shows in your = playing that you have a lot of Church Music background." m thankful to GOd = for them. The big thing im faced with is, I am the first music director = they have had with formal and primary college education in Organ = performance and Sacred Music. So, of course, I have some administration = skills etc that others have never had. So, of course, I have got to wrok = on keeping them informed and getting them even more interested in good = music. They are so interested in traditional music and the more tasteful = modern music. But, the previous musicians never listened to them or = offered their comments. This weekend was probably the first time in a very = long time that they heard real organ repertoire, or a loud piece played for the prelude. I am working on informing them that a church this size needs a well = developed music program with bells, a suitable organ, adult and childrens = choirs etc. Its going to take me time, at least 3 years. the thing that = really pisses me off...the person i am replacing was a "paycheck" church = musician. You know...the ones who are just trying to get extra money. = Never intorduced the church to new things or worked with the choir on = anthems. So, im goign into deep prayer on how to get EVERYONE interested = in the musical future of the church. As for the organ. I had to use the tutti button this weekend to accompany = the last verses. They sing so well, and they say they have wanted my style = of organ playing for a long time (once again, I am blessed). The thing = that hinders us is space. The ceiling is shallow. Its a long building with = a short height. BUT we need at least 3 manuals and the sound equal to at = least 45 ranks. We have avg 400 at the english masses and almost 700 at = the Polish mass. And they sing very well. I am open to pipe/digital = combinations by Cornell Zimmer or Rodgers. So, with the size of the church = in mind, Im going to dream up a 3 manual organ with the following Great I 16 Principal 8 Principal 8 Gemshorn 8 Melodia 4 Octave 4 Flute 2 2/3 Twelfth 2 Super octave IV Mixture 8 Trompet Choir/Positif II 8 Principal 8 Clarabella 8 Erzahler 8 Erzahler Celeste 8 Flute Celeste 8 Unda Maris II 4 Octave 4 Blockflute 2 2/3 Sesquialtera 2 Octave 2 Petite Flute 1 1/3 Larigot III Sharp Mixture 8 English Trumpet (with some type of Willis or Harrison Shallots) 8 Clarinette 8 Trompeta Real Swell III 16 Bourdon Doux 8 Octave 8 Flute Harmonique 8 Bourdon 8 Viole de Gambe 8 Viole Celeste 4 Octave 4 Koppleflute 2 2/3 Nazard 2 Octave 2 Flute Octave 1 3/5 Tierce IV Fourniture 16 Contre Trompette 8 Cornopean 8 Oboe 8 Vox humana 4 Clairon Pedal 32 Soubasse 16 PrincipalBass 16 Soubasse 16 Principal (great ext) 8 Octave 8 Grave Flute 4 Choralbass 4 Cantus Flute IV Grave Mixture 32 Grave Trumpet (ext sw. 16 trompette) 16 Posaune 16 Contre Trompette (sw) 8 Trompetbass Its just for real. We need this sound. all of it. We have the same problem = as St Chrystoms in Chicago...long length and short height. Of course, I = woudl want soemthing with a gentle voicing that envelope rather than = slaps. More later. Add pointers, organ builders Lady D       From Desiree' T. Desiree' Hines Chicago, IL 60649 http://concertartist.info/bios/hines.html   --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online  
(back) Subject: Interesting Item From: "mack02445" <mack02445@comcast.net> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 00:01:15 -0500   A friend in the Houston area sent me this today knowing I follow "organic happenings."   Mack   The Houston Chronicle (newspaper) of 13 Feb. has a "Bankruptcy Auction" notice for 19 Feb. (Thur.) @ 10:00: Visser & Assoc., 22814 Commercial Ln., Tomball, TX.   A Web-Site is printed on same notice: <http://www.webstersauction.com>www.webstersauction.com