PipeChat Digest #4283 - Tuesday, February 17, 2004
 
Re: Stoplist i would plan for my church, and other things related to it
  by "Tom Hoehn" <thoehn@theatreorgans.com>
Re: Stoplist i would plan for my church, and other things related to it
  by "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com>
RE: chamadarie
  by "james nerstheimer" <enigma1685@hotmail.com>
rather punny, don't you think?
  by "james nerstheimer" <enigma1685@hotmail.com>
Tubas and Didgeridoos
  by "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk>
Re: chamadarie
  by <quilisma@cox.net>
 

(back) Subject: Re: Stoplist i would plan for my church, and other things related to it From: "Tom Hoehn" <thoehn@theatreorgans.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 00:03:45 -0500   But what is the current spec on the instrument? Would you incorporate = what you currently have into the new instrument?     Tom Hoehn, Organist http://theatreorgans.com/tomhoehn Roaring Twenties Pizza and Pipes (substitute)(4/42 Wurlitzer) First United Methodist Church, Clearwater, FL (4/98 = Ruffati/Wicks/Rodgers) Manasota/OATOS/HiloBay/CIC-ATOS/VotS-ATOS/Dairyland-ATOS ----- Original Message -----=20 From: T.Desiree' Hines=20 To: PipeChat=20 Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 11:58 PM Subject: Stoplist i would plan for my church, and other things related = to it     Ok... Now...all i want is a superhorn...a Harmonic trompeta that is simply = placed horizontally. Its what I love...and it will create a good visual = for the church. This new church job i have is turning out to be the best = thing I have ever had.=20   BTW Darryl Ray...its part time, with hopes of making me full time in 2 = years or so. The thing im faced with is, how to get them rilled up. They = are so happy im there. Comments are coming like a rain storm "she's the = best organist we've ever had!" IOne lady even said "It shows in your = playing that you have a lot of Church Music background." m thankful to = GOd for them. The big thing im faced with is, I am the first music = director they have had with formal and primary college education in = Organ performance and Sacred Music. So, of course, I have some = administration skills etc that others have never had. So, of course, I = have got to wrok on keeping them informed and getting them even more = interested in good music. They are so interested in traditional music = and the more tasteful modern music. But, the previous musicians never = listened to them or offered their comments. This weekend was probably = the first time in a very long time that they heard real organ = repertoire, or a loud piece played for the prelude.=20   I am working on informing them that a church this size needs a well = developed music program with bells, a suitable organ, adult and = childrens choirs etc. Its going to take me time, at least 3 years. the = thing that really pisses me off...the person i am replacing was a = "paycheck" church musician. You know...the ones who are just trying to = get extra money. Never intorduced the church to new things or worked = with the choir on anthems. So, im goign into deep prayer on how to get = EVERYONE interested in the musical future of the church.=20   As for the organ. I had to use the tutti button this weekend to = accompany the last verses. They sing so well, and they say they have = wanted my style of organ playing for a long time (once again, I am = blessed). The thing that hinders us is space. The ceiling is shallow. = Its a long building with a short height. BUT we need at least 3 manuals = and the sound equal to at least 45 ranks. We have avg 400 at the english = masses and almost 700 at the Polish mass. And they sing very well. I am = open to pipe/digital combinations by Cornell Zimmer or Rodgers. So, with = the size of the church in mind, Im going to dream up a 3 manual organ = with the following   Great I=20 16 Principal 8 Principal 8 Gemshorn 8 Melodia 4 Octave 4 Flute 2 2/3 Twelfth 2 Super octave IV Mixture 8 Trompet   Choir/Positif II 8 Principal 8 Clarabella 8 Erzahler 8 Erzahler Celeste 8 Flute Celeste 8 Unda Maris II 4 Octave 4 Blockflute 2 2/3 Sesquialtera 2 Octave 2 Petite Flute 1 1/3 Larigot III Sharp Mixture 8 English Trumpet (with some type of Willis or Harrison Shallots) 8 Clarinette 8 Trompeta Real   Swell III 16 Bourdon Doux 8 Octave 8 Flute Harmonique 8 Bourdon 8 Viole de Gambe 8 Viole Celeste 4 Octave 4 Koppleflute 2 2/3 Nazard 2 Octave 2 Flute Octave 1 3/5 Tierce IV Fourniture 16 Contre Trompette 8 Cornopean 8 Oboe 8 Vox humana 4 Clairon   Pedal=20 32 Soubasse 16 PrincipalBass 16 Soubasse 16 Principal (great ext) 8 Octave 8 Grave Flute 4 Choralbass 4 Cantus Flute IV Grave Mixture 32 Grave Trumpet (ext sw. 16 trompette) 16 Posaune 16 Contre Trompette (sw) 8 Trompetbass   Its just for real. We need this sound. all of it. We have the same = problem as St Chrystoms in Chicago...long length and short height. Of = course, I woudl want soemthing with a gentle voicing that envelope = rather than slaps.=20   More later. Add pointers, organ builders   Lady D       From Desiree'=20 T. Desiree' Hines Chicago, IL 60649 http://concertartist.info/bios/hines.html     -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online  
(back) Subject: Re: Stoplist i would plan for my church, and other things related to it From: "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 21:40:02 -0800 (PST)   Oh certainly. The current organ is about 20 ranks I think. But most of = them are very thin. For instance, the great 2 principal could be the choir = 2 flute on a new organ. I will look at the organ clearing house too, when that time comes.       From Desiree' T. Desiree' Hines Chicago, IL 60649 http://concertartist.info/bios/hines.html   --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online  
(back) Subject: RE: chamadarie From: "james nerstheimer" <enigma1685@hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 01:22:00 -0600   I'm with Desiree=97I likes the chamades too! I'm with the school of = thought that it's better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it. =   There is a recent instrument in Glenview=97a modest two-manual in a = building less than half the height of ours that sports a big TOOOOBA on 11" wind. Here's the kicker: it's mounted HORIZONTAL because it doesn't fit any = other way. I kept thinking to myself that a nice chamade Tumpet on 3" would be far more useful=97it would actually blend with that very mellow English = chorus sound. Remember, Spanish Trompetas were on LOW windpressure like the rest =   of the organ because Barker levers hadn't yet been invented! What you're going for in these sort of reeds is the buzz and clatter of the Battle for =   the 6th or the 1st, or whatever Tone is being fought over. You need the right tool for the job! I'm convinced a good effect could be had in ANY acoustical setting. If you need a "rounder" sound, add a Principal or Flute.   BTW, there is a Berghaus in Naperville with a chamade Regal=97something = also found on Spanish organs. Bzzzzzz, Bzzzzzzz!   Your thoughts please!   jim   st. paul's, dekalb   O):^)   _________________________________________________________________ Watch high-quality video with fast playback at MSN Video. Free! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200365ave/direct/01/    
(back) Subject: rather punny, don't you think? From: "james nerstheimer" <enigma1685@hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 02:50:14 -0600   Darryl by the Sea Nashville, TN   I think I get it now=97the Tennis Sea hee hee   jim   O):^)   _________________________________________________________________ Store more e-mails with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage =96 4 plans to choose = from! http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/    
(back) Subject: Tubas and Didgeridoos From: "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 01:29:58 -0800 (PST)   Hello,   I may be a bit of doubting Thomas, but something tells me that something is not quite right here, but also tells me that something is also quite right here.   If one takes a Trumpet (a real Trumpet, and not a Trompetta Real!) and blows it vertically, there is a very striking difference in the sound which reaches the listener.....this I concede, because I've done it in a talk to demonstrate "en chamadery."   However, I would argue that the use of an exponential resonator (flared tubing by any other name!) serves to amplify edge-tone especially, and does impart a certain "crack" to the sound.   My argument is simply that, turning a Skinner French Horn (for example) on its side, would hardly produce a Cavaille-Coll experience. For that matter, it wouldn't even come close to a Hope Jones Tuba. So perhaps we have yet to hear en chamade reeds of a more normal type.   In fact, I just had a flash of inspiration. Would a real Tuba, stretched out, really be a valved digaredoo?   Then I realised that I was being stupid, for only a few miles away from where I live are two rare and classic examples to which both John Speller and I refer.   Firstly, there is a copper en chamade Tuba by Mander at Sheffield Cathedral here in the UK; if they haven't thrown the organ in the skip yet, as they intend to do. (It's a fine organ actually, but they don't seem to appreciate it anymore.) I wouldn't say it's the best Tuba ever heard, but it IS a Tuba nonetheless, with conical resonators of quite large scale.   However, the very best example is, indeed, the one by Gray & Davison (I believe) which graces the organ of Leeds Town Hall, and which lies en chamade just behind the pipe racks of the casework. It is a really good reed, but not overwhelming by any means when added to the tutti. In fact, unless one is actually told that it is a horizontal reed, there isn't any obvious aural evidence of it......my original point exactly.   Of course, en chamade reeds are a very "male" thing aren't they? Trust the Victorians to hide them from view.   I still want to know why no-one ever seems to have made a square section metal reed....there are lots of wooden ones.   It's got to be easier than all that rolling of metal.   I think we should re-invent en chamade reeds again, but give them new names, such as the Celtic Horn I discovered, and now the 32ft Didgeridoo.   Which reminds me of that delightful, almost surreal comment from the comedian Billy Connelly, who related the story of Botany Bay and Captain Cook gazing through his telescope at Australia. The Aboriginees gathered on the shore and roared with laughter, "Look, he doesn't even know how to play it!"   Regards,   Colin Mitchell UK     --- "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> wrote:   > The trouble is, though, that very bright reeds -- > are now out of fashion ...... This > pretty much means it's > curtains for en chamades. > > The best en chamades ever made, in my humble > opinion, were those made by the > London firm of Gray & Davison in the nineteenth > century     __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html  
(back) Subject: Re: chamadarie From: <quilisma@cox.net> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 01:51:51 -0800   As with most things, I keep pleading for people to go back to the LITERATURE. Historically, the battle trumpets on old Spanish organs were only played when the Sovereign or the Bishop was present at Mass.   The PROPER big solo reed for an ANGLICAN service-playing organ is an ENCLOSED Tuba. There's nothing that says it has to be boring. But I think you'll discover in the long run that the sound "wears" better than an unenclosed chamade, no matter what the style. Time and time again I've gone into churches where the chamade was disconnected, on account of difficulty of tuning access, or (important to note) the fact that the CONGREGATION hated it.   I have to tell a cute story about that: friend Severin has told it before. Sacred Heart, Coronado Island, CA has a Ruffati Rodgers with a truly SHATTERING chamade (pipes, not digital). It has a separate blower, and it's quite audible in the nave when it starts up.   At one point they had an organist who was given to using it for the Sanctus, the Memorial Acclamation, AND the Great Amen. A lady in the pew, upon hearing the blower start, gripped the arms of her seat like a passenger on a doomed airliner and was heard to mutter,   "Sweet Mother o' Jesus! Here it COMES! BRACE yourself!!"   At the VERY least, a chamade should NEVER be built until ALL THREE manuals have a FULL complement of CHORUS reeds WITHIN the case, INCLUDING a chorus trumpet on the Great.   Again, looking to the literature and the historical models: Spanish trumpets cut through the ensemble by reason of timbre, rather than volume; the Cavaille-Coll examples in France are, as someone noted, in HUGE reverberant churches that can HANDLE that amount of sound ... though it's reported that the ENCLOSED chamade TUBA at Sacred Coeur is STILL shattering, even in that huge room; the 32' Bombarde is positively apocalyptic, if reports are to be believed. I didn't get to hear that organ when I was in Paris.   Given the cost, I'd rather have a 2nd Open Diapason on the Great and/or a second (or third) celeste (grin).   Cheers,   Bud   james nerstheimer wrote:   > I'm with Desiree=97I likes the chamades too! I'm with the school of > thought that it's better to have it and not need it than need it and not =   > have it. There is a recent instrument in Glenview=97a modest two-manual =   > in a building less than half the height of ours that sports a big > TOOOOBA on 11" wind. Here's the kicker: it's mounted HORIZONTAL > because it doesn't fit any other way. I kept thinking to myself that a > nice chamade Tumpet on 3" would be far more useful=97it would actually > blend with that very mellow English chorus sound. Remember, Spanish > Trompetas were on LOW windpressure like the rest of the organ because > Barker levers hadn't yet been invented! What you're going for in these > sort of reeds is the buzz and clatter of the Battle for the 6th or the > 1st, or whatever Tone is being fought over. You need the right tool for =   > the job! I'm convinced a good effect could be had in ANY acoustical > setting. If you need a "rounder" sound, add a Principal or Flute. > > BTW, there is a Berghaus in Naperville with a chamade Regal=97something > also found on Spanish organs. Bzzzzzz, Bzzzzzzz! > > Your thoughts please! > > jim > > st. paul's, dekalb > > O):^) > > _________________________________________________________________ > Watch high-quality video with fast playback at MSN Video. Free! > http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200365ave/direct/01/ > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > >