PipeChat Digest #4325 - Tuesday, March 2, 2004 Re: Amens, Gibson's music and Holy Week Oratorio by "MusicMan" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Re: new organ at ST. Mark's by <DarrylbytheSea@aol.com> Re: showing my ignorance by "Russ Greene" <email@example.com> Re: Amens, Gibson's music and Holy Week Oratorio by <DERREINETOR@aol.com> Re: chicago style...off topic Mo Syn's by "James Grebe" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Re: Methodists by "James Grebe" <email@example.com> Re: should the organist be a member of the denomination? by "bobelms" <firstname.lastname@example.org> NU etc. by "terry hicks" <Terrick@webtv.net> Re: Re: should the organist be a member of the denomination? by "Milo R. Shepherd" <email@example.com> Re: Anglican organs by "Scott Montgomery" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Re: Re: Allen Organ Model 314 by "Milo R. Shepherd" <email@example.com>
(back) Subject: Re: Amens, Gibson's music and Holy Week Oratorio From: "MusicMan" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:47:39 -0000 Cheerz, 'Ar-kid', Mister Keyplayr Ta. Once again, American and Great Britain; two great nations separated by a = common language, "Elton" ? Wat'dat ? "Repton" 'tis, awlrite. Obviously, a Rollsweller is a more than handy device for such = requirements- but one which is missing on 'My Beast' - an un-modernised = 1864 Walker (apart from allowing the bellows-boy to take well-earned = retirement and substituting some device powered by that new-fangled = 'electricity' - which will never catch on, y'know.) Harry [MusicMan] Grove -----Original Message----- From: keyplayr <email@example.com> To: PipeChat <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: 02 March 2004 06:39 Subject: Re: Amens, Gibson's music and Holy Week Oratorio =20 =20 on 04/03/01 4:52, MusicMan at email@example.com wrote: =20 > Paul, > <snip> > Likewise, I play 'Dear Lord and Father of mankind' as a general = diminuendo > in each verse. The final verse is the organ in quiet mode, with = the choir > going hell-for-leather in "speak through the earthquake, wind and = fire" and > suddenly going (p)iano for "still, small voice of calm". =20 >=20 Aloha, MusicMan:=20 =20 Just a gentle chide here.... You got it RIGHT the first time by n-a-m-i-n-g the TUNE -- = ROCKINGHAM, and then you fumbled and dropped the ball by making the = assumption that there is one, and only one, tune for =ABDear Lord & = Father...=BB =20 I gather (from your location) you were referring to REPTON,=20 but many Americans would identify the text with REST (Elton), a tune = which doesn't lend itself all that well to your suggestion. =20 Since John Greenleaf Whittier was (I believe) an American I won't = venture into the minefield of suggesting which tune is more suitable but = just note that we need to know which one you had in mind! BTW I have = often done what you suggest with REPTON but have to admit I have nearly = fallen off the bench of a few clumsily-functioning instruments while = attempting that subito manoeuver from fff to pp! 8-))))) =20 Cheers, Keyplayr =20 PS: For my absolute favourite example of tune-confusion and = intra-denominational politicking: =20 I was, as a student, seconded to play in rotation with other = students at a series of heavily attended Lenten Noontide Services at Old = St.Paul's (1751) in Halifax, NS. We students had the habit of auditing = each others' =ABperformances=BB and at a particularly heavily-attended = service the guest preacher had decided to schedule =ABThe Lord's My = Shepherd...=BB as the opening hymn. The student presiding at the console was handed the numbers while = she was playing her prelude and having (a) no experience with Anglican = or mainline protestant tastes in tunes, and (b) no opportunity to = consult with anyone, proceeded at the appropriate time to intro the = first of FOUR facing tunes at the number indicated (The Hymn Book - = 1938) #547. Gathering note.... NADA! Not a single voice to be heard! = Consummate musician that she was she elegantly segued into the 2nd tune = with an identical result.... then into the third, then the fourth... = STILL not a peep.... Suddenly getting my brain in gear, I precipitated = myself into the cramped console pit and, almost body-checking her to the = end of the bench launched, from memory, into CRIMOND - a tune not even = contained in the aforementioned book. Instant success! Suddenly 500+ = voices were wailing away at the =ABONLY=BB tune any of us had EVER -- = well... (with apologies to G&S) almost ever -- heard those words sung = to! =20 =20 If one examines the pages in question one finds three well-known CM = tunes which I have yet to hear ANYone sing to the text in question, and = the fourth a pretty but insipid little composition by one of the = editors, as well as a referral to a FIFTH tune also n-o-t CRIMOND!=20 =20 The book which replaced HB-1938 hardly did better when. finally = conceding that CRIMOND was the overwhelming choice for this text, = commissioned a quite ugly =ABarrangement=BB of the traditional = harmonization to (as I have been told) avoid copyright/royalty issues. =20 One further example of denominational agendas is found in The Hymnal = (BFC) wherein the glorious tune DARWALL's 148th was completely = emasculated by an editor who obviously had some serious issues with = minor chords -- replacing them with V7s -- and sounding SO bad that I = had my choir of the time REwrite the offending notes =ABcorrectly=BB so = that I could play the tune without cringing! <8-Q =20 ..... Lord save us from all manner of evils and most especially from = hymnal editors with agendas.....=20 =20 =20
(back) Subject: Re: new organ at ST. Mark's From: <DarrylbytheSea@aol.com> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:14:48 EST In a message dated 2/29/2004 5:10:56 PM Central Standard Time, firstname.lastname@example.org writes: I gather that St. Mark's is buying a new four manual tracker organ from J. W. Walker & Sons in England, due to be installed in 2005. The specification of this can be found at: Hi, y'all I don't remember anyone saying if the current musical leadership is the = same as those who purchsed the Bedient organ? And if not, how long after the Bedient was installed did that person leave? I'm just curious, of course. Yours, Darryl by the Sea
(back) Subject: Re: showing my ignorance From: "Russ Greene" <email@example.com> Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 04:25:10 -0600 Will, I'd love to see the whole routine. Hope you can find it! Russ Greene Winnipeg, Canada On Mar 2, 2004, at 2:33 AM, Will Light wrote: > I used to have a comedy quartet, which was sung by four men dressed in > choir > robes, based on the differences in pointing methods between different > branches of the Anglican church. I will try and dig it out and post it > to > the group - but I can remember the "refrain" which came between the > comedy > verses: /Please don't alter the Psalter/ a-ny . more. /O let us > appoint a. > point-ing /that's the same,/ In ev'ry church .you go. to,/ They always > have > their own particular method of .chant-ing /Psalms . their/ Way/....
(back) Subject: Re: Amens, Gibson's music and Holy Week Oratorio From: <DERREINETOR@aol.com> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:29:11 EST Dear Keyplayr, et al, John Greenleaf Whittier was indeed American--a crusty New Englander at = that. His home and his grave may be visited in Amesbury, Massachusetts. Bill H.
(back) Subject: Re: chicago style...off topic Mo Syn's From: "James Grebe" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:54:35 -0600 Hi Jeff, Wes has this young fellow form Illinois doing Saturday nights and his = name is Jim. He is pretty good and just developing skill. He looks = like and older teenager or early 20's. He is very studious. The Kilgen is in need of rebuilding or better still updating. We just = spent over $500k on the roof and tuckpointing so it will be a while = before anything can be done. Wes had this idea to get funds to get a = Cymbalsterm. I was not for it with I think funds should be started for = the organ work. We plays extremely well and seems to be able to work = around it's problems. He plays with handfuls of stops. We have at = least 1 tuba that is entirely bent over due to metal fatigue. This = particular rank also has loose wooden wedges holding the reeds in place. = That has been true since 20 to 30 years ago. Hope looks like years = away. Jim James Grebe Piano-Forte Tuning & Repair Artisan of Wood WWW.JamesGrebe.com 1526 Raspberry Lane Arnold, MO 63010 email@example.com ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jeff White=20 To: PipeChat=20 Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 8:11 PM Subject: RE: chicago style...off topic Mo Syn's=20 Jim, but you DO. I was playing there on Saturday nights for a couple = of weeks there. Wes wanted me regularly, but I couldn't commit to it. = Too much going on in my home congregation, and now Holy Trinity has a = Saturday night service, which pretty much just limits me to there. =20 How's progress on getting the Kilgen rebuilt? It NEEDS it. Jeff -----Original Message----- From: firstname.lastname@example.org [mailto:email@example.com]On Behalf = Of James Grebe Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 4:27 PM To: PipeChat Subject: Re: chicago style...off topic Mo Syn's=20 I have not found that to be the case though we do not hire outside = musicians other than volunteers James Grebe
(back) Subject: Re: Methodists From: "James Grebe" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:57:43 -0600 Are we meaning "United Methodists" when we are saying "Methodists" James Grebe Piano-Forte Tuning & Repair Artisan of Wood WWW.JamesGrebe.com 1526 Raspberry Lane Arnold, MO 63010 email@example.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "John L. Speller" <firstname.lastname@example.org> To: "PipeChat" <email@example.com> Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 9:00 PM Subject: Re: Methodists > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <firstname.lastname@example.org> > To: "PipeChat" <email@example.com> > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 3:28 PM > Subject: Methodists > > > > Um, Will, I doubt seriously that American Methodists would recognize > > their British cousins, and vice versa. American Methodism bears little > > resemblance to its British counterpart. > > All I know is that I was at school with John Wesley, great grandson of > Samuel Sebastian Wesley, and that he was, like John & Charles Wesley and all > the other Wesleys (except Samuel who was a Roman Catholic) Church of > England. > > John Speller > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > Administration: mailto:email@example.com > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > >
(back) Subject: Re: should the organist be a member of the denomination? From: "bobelms" <email@example.com> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:31:22 +0800 You are doing it again Bud. Who says there are deplorable conditions in Australia? When did you come here and experience conditions in Australia? = To what conditions are you referring? Money? Something else? What else? Let's make this clear. I have nothing against you except that you do not appear to listen to what others are saying. I have never experienced deplorable conditions here and I have played at a good many churches. Your lifestyle whatever that may be has nothing to do with me, and I made no comment about such a thing. That was your idea not mine. The fact that organists as a whole are not paid much here is partly lack = of population but mostly lack of financial resources in the churches. You = have 200 million people of which about 60% attend church so I am told. We have = 19 million of whom about 25% attend church. My denomination is the third largest in Australia with 1.2 million members spread across a continent about the same size as the USA. My own church has about 120 members and a pipe organ and a choir. We don't pay our musicians (me and a lady co-organist). Why? because there is no money for it. Do we down tools and = so "No pay, no play?" NO! because money is not that important to us. We are = not professional musicians who have done all those things you say are so important for a church organist. Yet the job we do is every bit as = important to our church as the organist in the largest cathedral who could be on a salary. We pay for the love of music and for the glory of God. The budget = at my church is $100 000 a year out of which we pay about $85 000 in = ministers' salaries. Most of the rest goes in maintenance of century old buildings, = in ministers' and leaders' travelling expenses (we service an area of about 2000 square miles so travel costs are heavy with gasoline at aboyut $4 a gallon, $A1 per litre), plus power, gas, postage and telephone plus incidentals. How can you tell me that conditions here are deplorable? ..We have not the resources, buit yet there is a dedicated band of = musicians fronting up and playing for services and choir rehearsals week after week. If we adopted your attitude about pay and conditions there would be very little music at all in our churches. Is that what you would want? I repeat we play for the love of it and for the glorification of God. Isn't that = good enough, Bud? I am sorry I have to say these things Bud but I get very angry when = someone who obviously knows nothing of our conditions tells us what it is like = over here.We live here. You don't and so you don't know! Bob Elms. ----- Original Message ----- From: <firstname.lastname@example.org> To: "PipeChat" <email@example.com> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 3:55 PM Subject: Re: should the organist be a member of the denomination?> >. I'm well aware of the DEPLORABLE salaries and working conditions in South Africa, > Australia, New Zealand and Canada, and, to a lesser degree, Great = Britain. snip > For the MOST part, American organists, with the notable exception of > Mormons and Seventh-Day Adventists, EXPECT to be paid. No pay, no play. > Simple. >
(back) Subject: NU etc. From: "terry hicks" <Terrick@webtv.net> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:42:46 -0600 (CST) I'm really amazed at the comments people make about the NU program and Doug Cleveland, with obvious lack of real knowledge of the situation. Gregory has every right to "flame" out of rage. The deterioration of the program there began before Doug Cleveland arrived. The School of Music sat on its hands and let it happen. The fact the Rubsam is now a barber in Indiana should give some clue as to problems. All his time "on the road" didn't result in students flocking to the school. Plus he was very condescending about other people's playing. There is not a top-rate recital instrument on campus. The A-S in the chapel is big and has a good stoplist but many of the sounds are mediocre, and the console is a "pig". During my time there in the '70's, most of the practice organs were not good, and you had to open windows during the winter because the heat was oppressive. Frankly, the facilities are a disgrace. Despite all the seminaries around the metro area, the church music program had no interaction with them. And if there were students who left lessons crying, it was because of people like Grigg Fountain, a gifted but disturbed person. He yelled at me when I said Mendelssohn didn't have a crescendo pedal and I didn't want to use that device as a registration crutch. He then stomped out of the chapel gallery and yelled from down front once again. He also mentally abused other students. Doug Cleveland is NOT leaving under mutual agreement. My understanding is the doctoral program at Indiana is a long and tedious process, and he was diligently working through it. Frankly, having such a degree does not guarantee good teaching nor stellar performing, just higher pay. So please, folks, don't put something on the internet that is ill-informed or just plain ignorant.
(back) Subject: Re: Re: should the organist be a member of the denomination? From: "Milo R. Shepherd" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 8:15:15 -0500 Should the organist be a member of the congregation? I don't think that = it should be a matter of concern. Sometimes a parish has to go outside to = find an organist. I remember when I was in the military in Germany. The = Catholic parish for the military didn't have a organist and I was asked if = I would play for them. I am LDS (Mormon) and play the organ for our = services. I did play gladly until they were able to find another organist = that was a member of their congregation. As for all the liturgy, well, thankfully the LDS church doesn't do that. = Its easy with a opening, sacrament, intermediate and closing hymns. = Granted with a standardized hymnbook it helps so that everyone knows the = music. This also allows for easier arrangements of the hymns too. They = rewrote the LDS hymnbook in the early 80's and released it in 1985. All = the hymns were either written or changed to singable notes by the = congregation which does away with special training. Just my plug nickels worth. Milo
(back) Subject: Re: Anglican organs From: "Scott Montgomery" <email@example.com> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:19:01 -0800 (PST) There are organs tuned in mild temperments that can play all keys. My = best memory is of the Wolfe at Bales Recital Hall. The temperment is just = enough to make your ears perk up but not enough to have any foul keys. It is possible with Kellner tuning too....I heard the Durufle Suite played = on that temperment on a Bond organ.....very convincing. firstname.lastname@example.org wrote: I have asked this question MANY times: WHAT are these organists THINKING? The French-style alternatim organ Mass didn't develop much in England .... the Reformation interrupted it. In addition, the glory of the English Church, both pre and post-reformation, has ALWAYS been the choral music. We are told that pre-reformation English organists were superb improvisers, but not a great deal of music has come down to us. The ROMAN liturgy that organ was designed to play (alternatim) no longer exists in that form; indeed, alternatim is strictly forbidden. The BULK of the Anglican CHORAL repertoire is from the 16th, 19th, and early 20th centuries; the 16th century stuff doesn't NEED organ; the 19th and 20th century stuff needs your basic "Full Swell to Reeds with the box closed" sound ... that characteristic "banked fires of hell" sound that English organs of the period share with their cross-Channel neighbors. I have seen a couple of run-back-and-forth installations ... chancel choir and original romantic organ; "boutique" organ (of whatever flavour) in the west gallery, almost invariably a tracker, so it CAN'T be played from the chancel console. Fisk experimented with electric pull-downs at Ashmont Station so the gallery organ could be played from the chancel Austin (?), but it was abandoned for complex reasons that MIGHT have been discussed here awhile back. As I recall, it had nothing to do with the success or failure of the system, but rather imperial rectors and church politics. Strikes me as silly ... EITHER you're committing yourself to having two organists on staff ... but in that case the organ scholar is needed to play accompaniments in the chancel while the Organist conducts ... OR, you are indeed committed to running back and forth, never mind the SOUND. Oberlin now has three organs tuned in (I believe) three different temperaments: Warner Hall (Flentrop), Finney Chapel (Fisk), and Fairchild Chapel (Brombaugh). That's appropriate for an academic institution; it's appropriate for a church multiple organs and with a virtually unlimited endowment, like St. Thomas or Trinity Wall Street; but MOST of the REST of us need ONE organ, and what that ONE organ has to do PRINCIPALLY is accompany the Anglican Choral Service, be it large or small. For THAT, you need noble OPEN DIAPASONS, Claribel Flutes, a REAL string and a celeste, and fine clangy-but-dark English reeds, NOT Spitzprinzipals, xylophone-chiffing Quintadenas and Schnarrenregals = (grin). Nope. Sorry. Your preludes, postludes and recitals AREN'T more important. Oh! And I almost forget ... EQUAL TEMPERAMENT (grin). Cheers, Bud Jonathan Orwig wrote: > I played the Bedient while on vacation a few years ago.... > > If you wanna play French Baroque stuff, it has no > equal this side of the pond ... the sounds are VERY authentic > > EYE happen to not really have developed > much of a taste for that stuff, although I've tried. I managed to grow = into > the sounds of a LOT of composers and eras, but.... I'm almost 40, and I = have > YET to really enjoy it, so I doubt there's much hope > > Having said that, I _can_ objectively admit it does well at what it was > desighned for. > Call me a Philistine, but I _STILL_ marvel that someone would choose to = put > such a beast in an Episcopal church.... they were forced to keep using = the > old Austin, > as the Bedient was not suited to the Anglican repertoire. > > NOW > > Before someone goes and pipes up "you can make ANYthing work if you just > try" > > Yup. You can. But WHY would you WANT to? Why install an ex$pensive copy = of > an old French organ in an Episcopal church when your service-playing > instrument > is in dire need of refurbishment or replacement? If you have a superb > existing organ > for service-playing already, sure, mebbe so, but... > > They say time usually shows us the wisdom of our decisions.... I'm both > disgruntled > and pleased that time has shown the need to remove this instrument to > another > (academic!) venue. Disgruntled that the money was wasted in the first > place, glad > that the matter has been righted and that the instrument will be in a = venue > where it > can be put to good use (and APPROPRIATE use at that) > > Best, > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:email@example.com Administration: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:email@example.com --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Search - Find what you=92re looking for faster.
(back) Subject: Re: Re: Allen Organ Model 314 From: "Milo R. Shepherd" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 8:20:29 -0500 Paul, Bud, I know that working on it might be a mission of futility, but I also look = at it as a opprotunity to learn about an older instrument. Two things I have noticed is that 1. The 2' Blockflute on the great has a = ting to it. I can tell its slightly out of whack from the rest of the = organ and gives the tone a very interesting fingernails down the = chalkboard feeling. The second is that the choir keyboard is about 1/2 the volume of the swell = keyboard. A simple setting on the pedals will overwhelm the choir. Also what I am trying to figure out totally is the switches on the boards = that pull out from under the console. They list each stop and there is 5 = small switches for that stop. I assume that each switch is for each = octave, though I could be wrong. Thanks for your input. Until the church authorizes a new organ, we are = going to be using this organ. Milo > > From: "Paul Valtos" <email@example.com> > Date: 2004/03/02 Tue AM 12:36:58 EST > To: "PipeChat" <firstname.lastname@example.org> > Subject: Re: Allen Organ Model 314 > > Dear Bud, > Well the organ I had Bud, a Custom IV had a zillion capacitors and > transistors but very few had to be replaced and that organ was built in > 1970. The Custom Carousel had fewer of them but none had to be replaced > during my ownership. Again that organ was built in 1970, I bought it in = 1983 > and according to the Allen Tech, had never been tuned either nor needed = it. > I had them do stretch tuning which did make it sound better. > Paul > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <email@example.com> > To: "PipeChat" <firstname.lastname@example.org> > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 9:42 PM > Subject: Re: Allen Organ Model 314 > > > > From some experiences here locally, it may be a lost cause ... there > > are about a zillion solder points and capacitors that can go bad., not > > just tubes and easily replaceable things. Of course it can be DONE, = and > > Allen still SUPPORTS them; the question is whether it's worth the = time, > > effort and money. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Bud > > > > Paul Valtos wrote: > > > > > Dear Milo, > > > If you tell me what it is doing (or not doing) I might be able = to > help > > > you having had two analog Allens a Custom Carousel and a Custom IV > church > > > organ. I maintained both. The Custom IV was identical to the 314 = except > you > > > have three manuals and your tone generators are within the console. > > > Paul > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Milo R.Shepherd" <email@example.com> > > > To: "PipeChat" <firstname.lastname@example.org> > > > Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 7:01 PM > > > Subject: Re: Re: Allen Organ Model 314 > > > > > > > > > > > >>well it hasn't been well taken care of over the years and having = just > > > > > > moved in, want to do what I can to keep it going and if possible = improve > the > > > sound some. I have a feeling that some of the tubes are burned out = and > need > > > to be replaced and having any info would be good. Thanks for the = info > Paul. > > > > > >>Milo > > >> > > >>>From: "Paul Valtos" <email@example.com> > > >>>Date: 2004/03/01 Mon PM 05:42:08 EST > > >>>To: "PipeChat" <firstname.lastname@example.org> > > >>>Subject: Re: Allen Organ Model 314 > > >>> > > >>>dear Milo, > > >>> I'm sure that you can buy the entire analog service manual = from > > > > > > Allen > > > > > >>>organ for around $50. bucks. It was around that price about ten = years > > > > > > ago. > > > > > >>>It covers all analog organs made by Allen including the tube type. > > > > > > What's > > > > > >>>wrong with yours. > > >>> Paul > > >>>----- Original Message ----- > > >>>From: "Milo R.Shepherd" <email@example.com> > > >>>To: <firstname.lastname@example.org> > > >>>Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 2:40 PM > > >>>Subject: Allen Organ Model 314 > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>>>I am trying to locate manuals for the Allen Organ Model 314. Is = there > > >>> > > >>>anyone out there that might have owner or technical manuals for it? > > >>> > > >>>>Thanks > > >>>> > > >>>>"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > > >>>>PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related = topics > > >>>>HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > > >>>>List: mailto:email@example.com > > >>>>Administration: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > > >>>>Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:email@example.com > > >>>> > > >>>> > > >>> > > >>>"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > > >>>PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related = topics > > >>>HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > > >>>List: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > > >>>Administration: mailto:email@example.com > > >>>Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >> > > >>"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > > >>PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related = topics > > >>HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > > >>List: mailto:email@example.com > > >>Administration: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > > >>Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:email@example.com > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > > > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related = topics > > > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > > > List: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > > > Administration: mailto:email@example.com > > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > > List: mailto:email@example.com > > Administration: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:email@example.com > > > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > Administration: mailto:email@example.com > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org > > >