PipeChat Digest #4374 - Monday, March 15, 2004
 
Re: The whole "marching" thing
  by <quilisma@cox.net>
RE: Re: Wedding Processionals
  by "Milo R. Shepherd" <mrstwin2@cox.net>
RE: Re: Wedding Processionals
  by "Milo R. Shepherd" <mrstwin2@cox.net>
RE: Re: Wedding Processionals
  by "Milo R. Shepherd" <mrstwin2@cox.net>
Re: Organ use during Easter Triduum
  by "bgsx" <bgsx52@sympatico.ca>
Weddings.  Reality vs. "mainstream"
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
Re: Organ use during Easter Triduum
  by "bgsx" <bgsx52@sympatico.ca>
new organ publications
  by "Robert Lind" <lindr@core.com>
Anglican Church and music rubrics
  by <quilisma@cox.net>
Re: "Sound of Music" Processional
  by <ProOrgo53@aol.com>
Re: The whole "marching" thing
  by "F. Richard Burt" <effarbee@verizon.net>
Re: The whole "marching" thing
  by "Ray Ahrens" <Ray_Ahrens@msn.com>
Re: Josh Grobin: "You Raise Me Up"
  by "Erik Johnson" <the_maitre@hotmail.com>
Re: Chicago Cathedral
  by "F. Richard Burt" <effarbee@verizon.net>
Re: The whole "marching" thing
  by <quilisma@cox.net>
Re: How much for a wedding?
  by <OMusic@aol.com>
RE: Chicago Cathedral
  by "Emmons, Paul" <PEMMONS@wcupa.edu>
Re: The whole "marching" thing
  by <OMusic@aol.com>
Re: Wedding Processionals
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>
Re:  Wanted: Used small, Kimber-Allen DE Magnets
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com>
Re: The whole "marching" thing
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
 

(back) Subject: Re: The whole "marching" thing From: <quilisma@cox.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:46:40 -0800   Oddly enough, one of the weddings that came the CLOSEST to what I described was in First Assembly of God Church, San Diego.   I was engaged to play the organ for the entrance and exit processions (the two Trumpet pieces); the excellent (volunteer) church orchestra played everything else.   Yes, there WERE processions, but the parents of the bride escorted the bride, and the parents of the groom escorted the groom. As I recall, there were only two other attendants.   There were hymns, prayers, Scripture readings, and a sermon; then the marriage ceremony; and finally Holy Communion.   I tossed off a comment about priorities and the American divorce rate in passing, but I think that needs revisiting and expanding.   The Roman Catholic marriage service has, in the Exhortation, words to the effect of "this is a SACRAMENT which is MOST serious and MOST sacred."   The first Book of Common Prayer spells it out in more detail and somewhat more elegantly:   THE FORME OF   SOLEMNIZACION OF MATRIMONIE.     =B6 First the bannes must be asked three several Soondayes or holye dayes. =   in the service tyme, the people beeyng presente, after the accustomed = maner.   And if the persones that woulde bee maried dwel in divers parishes, the bannes muste bee asked in bothe parishes, and the Curate of thone [the one] parish shall not solemnize matrimonie betwixt them, withoute a certificate of the bannes beeyng thrise asked from the Curate of thother parishe.   At the daye appointed for Solemnizacion of Matrimonie, the persones to be maried shal come into the bodie of ye churche, with theyr frendes and neighbours. And there the priest shal thus saye.   DEERELY beloved frendes, we are gathered together here in the syght of God, and in the face of his congregacion, to joyne together this man and this woman in holy matrimonie, which is an honorable estate instituted of God in paradise, in the time of mannes innocencie, signifying unto us the misticall union that is betwixte Christe and his Churche: whiche holy estate, Christe adorned and beutified with his presence, and first miracle that he wrought in Cana of Galile, and is commended of Sainct Paule to be honourable emong all men; and therefore is not to bee enterprised, nor taken in hande unadvisedlye, lightelye, or wantonly, to satisfie mens carnal lustes and appetites, like brute beastes that have no understanding: but reverentely, discretely, advisedly, soberly, and in the feare of God. Duely consideryng the causes for the whiche matrimonie was ordeined. One cause was the procreacion of children, to be brought up in the feare and nurture of the Lord, and prayse of God. Secondly it was ordeined for a remedie agaynst sinne, and to avoide fornicacion, that suche persones as bee maried, might live chastlie in matrimonie, and kepe themselves undefiled membres of Christes bodye. Thirdelye for the mutuall societie, helpe, and coumfort, that the one oughte to have of thother, both in prosperitie and adversitie. Into the whiche holy estate these two persones present: come nowe to be joyned. Therefore if any man can shewe any juste cause why they maie not lawfully be joyned so together: Leat him now speake, or els hereafter for ever hold his peace.   And also speakyng to the persones that shalbe maried, he shall saie.   I REQUIRE and charge you (as you will aunswere at the dreade full daye of judgemente, when the secretes of all hartes shalbee disclosed) that if either of you doe knowe any impedimente, why ye maie not bee lawfully joyned together in matrimonie, that ye confesse it. For be ye wel assured, that so manye as bee coupled together otherwaies then Goddes woord doeth allowe: are not joyned of God, neither is their matrimonie lawful.   --------------------------------   No mention of attendants, flowers (or music, for that matter).   LOTS of "uncomfortable" talk about GOD and fidelity and vows that CANNOT be broken.   MOST young couples today are WOEFULLY unprepared for what comes AFTER the wedding, in just about EVERY department. And I lay the fault for THAT squarely where Paul Emmons does: at the feet of the Teaching Elders of the CHURCH.   Granted, as "mere" musicians we can't do a WHOLE lot about THAT, but we CAN keep wildly inappropriate music out of God's house, AND teach our children (if we have any) about the true nature of marriage.   Cheers,   Bud                
(back) Subject: RE: Re: Wedding Processionals From: "Milo R. Shepherd" <mrstwin2@cox.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:41:17 -0500   Jeff, the music actually has built into it a natural stop before you get = to the part of the nuns singing and so I used that as the ending point. = It does require you to play through it twice because the actual march is = short. > > From: <reedstop@charter.net> > Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 09:54:48 EST > To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Subject: RE: Re: Wedding Processionals > > > > yes I did stop before the nuns came out singing...actually I locked = them in the abbey so they wouldn't come out singing. > > Milo...that's great!! LOL Thanks for the chuckle! :) > > I just always wondered about using that piece...how do you end it before = that part of the music (the nuns) with dignity? Inquiring minds... > > Jeff > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > >    
(back) Subject: RE: Re: Wedding Processionals From: "Milo R. Shepherd" <mrstwin2@cox.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:41:17 -0500   Jeff, the music actually has built into it a natural stop before you get = to the part of the nuns singing and so I used that as the ending point. = It does require you to play through it twice because the actual march is = short. > > From: <reedstop@charter.net> > Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 09:54:48 EST > To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Subject: RE: Re: Wedding Processionals > > > > yes I did stop before the nuns came out singing...actually I locked = them in the abbey so they wouldn't come out singing. > > Milo...that's great!! LOL Thanks for the chuckle! :) > > I just always wondered about using that piece...how do you end it before = that part of the music (the nuns) with dignity? Inquiring minds... > > Jeff > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > >    
(back) Subject: RE: Re: Wedding Processionals From: "Milo R. Shepherd" <mrstwin2@cox.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:43:00 -0500   Jeff,   The music has a natural stop in it before the nuns start singing. You = just have to it into a nice chorded ending. Unfortunately the march is a = short piece so you have to play through it twice.   Milo > > From: <reedstop@charter.net> > Date: 2004/03/15 Mon AM 09:54:48 EST > To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> > Subject: RE: Re: Wedding Processionals > > > > yes I did stop before the nuns came out singing...actually I locked = them in the abbey so they wouldn't come out singing. > > Milo...that's great!! LOL Thanks for the chuckle! :) > > I just always wondered about using that piece...how do you end it before = that part of the music (the nuns) with dignity? Inquiring minds... > > Jeff > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > >    
(back) Subject: Re: Organ use during Easter Triduum From: "bgsx" <bgsx52@sympatico.ca> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:49:24 -0500     The C of E point of view, according to "Ritual Notes" ...   http://www.trinitytulsa.org/life0304.html   Published in 1926, Ritual Notes is a complete guide to the Rites and Ceremonies of the English Church. In it we read: "During Lent, which includes Passiontide, flowers should not adorn the altars; the organ should not be played (except on the fourth Sunday) unless it be necessary to sustain a weak choir, voluntaries and interludes should be carefully avoided; the colour is purple but on the fourth Sunday rose colour may be used; folded chasubles and the "broad stole" are worn in cathedrals and principal churches (in default, deacon and subdeacon minister in albs - on no account in dalmatic and tunicle), but on the fourth Sunday, dalmatic and tunicle (purple, if not rose) are worn, and on this day flowers may be used."      
(back) Subject: Weddings. Reality vs. "mainstream" From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:54:29 -0500   On 3/15/04 5:14 PM, "Emmons, Paul" <PEMMONS@wcupa.edu> wrote:   > Let people know, in general, that it is still very much a live option in = the > parish, so that when he reminds the couple of it at their own = counseling, it > won't come as a complete surprise.   Whee! and Wonderful! To your whole post! Including our corporate gratitude to Bud for so MUCH he teaches us. (If ONLY because he was = paying attention when the Church's wisdom [not his, as he'd be the first to say] was being passed out.)   Let me add one more line: When you've got kids in catechism class, or preparation for confirmation, or whatever you call it, the boys won't pay attention at all, but the GIRLS will take COPIOUS notes on anything to do with romance, marriage, etc. Teach them THEN about their wedding, coming = up maybe ten years in the future.   (Sorry; that's what Lutheran clergy call "one more line.")   Alan    
(back) Subject: Re: Organ use during Easter Triduum From: "bgsx" <bgsx52@sympatico.ca> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 18:02:56 -0500     > The C of E point of view, according to "Ritual Notes" ...   I meant "Anglican" ... not C of E ...      
(back) Subject: new organ publications From: "Robert Lind" <lindr@core.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:08:01 -0600   A new collection of 12 of my recent organ compositions has finally found = its way to the Augsburg Fortress website:   http://www.augsburgfortress.org/store/item.asp?isbn=3D0800676823&clsid=3D11= 0002   Most of the settings of the hymn tunes are voluntaries or fantasies rather than "chorale preludes," as the uninformative blurb might lead one to believe. There are relatively easy 2-page pieces up to involved, toccata-like 8-page pieces. Styles vary: Frescobaldi-inspired (Picardy) to Purcellian and late Baroque (Elegy) to Rococo (Was Gott tut) to late 19th-century martial (Battle Hymn) to late Romantic. Everything is listener-friendly but not condescending.   Another recent publication, which includes settings of "Quem pastores" and "Love Unknown," comes from Paraclete Press:   http://www.paracletepress.com/webstore/search.php   This should be the final item as one scrolls to the bottom of the web = page. If anyone would like more information, please contact me privately at lindr@core.com   Many thanks for your consideration.   Robert Lind    
(back) Subject: Anglican Church and music rubrics From: <quilisma@cox.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:27:15 -0800   It's interesting that the western denomination with (historically) some of the finest music has virtually NO *official* rubrics governing same.   Sadly, neither Ritual Notes nor The Parson's Handbook have any official standing ... Ritual Notes is basically an Anglican adaptation of Fortescue & O'Connell's "The Ceremonies of the Roman Rite Described," which used to be the definitive book in English for Roman Catholics.   The Parson's Handbook was Percy Dearmer's (misguided?) romantic attempt to revive a Use that existed for a very short time in the Church of England ... that of the 1662 Book of Common Prayer when it was first issued, before various "anti-papist" rubrics were added to it.   The Parson's Handbook very briefly did battle with Ritual Notes in the 1920s, at the height of the Anglo-Catholic Revival ... Ritual Notes being an accurate (if somewhat over-the-top) Ultramontanist book (read: "more Catholic than the pope") ... but Ritual Notes swept the field, and Dearmer is little more than an historical curiosity today, although some of his ideas HAVE crept into post-Vatican II RC usages.   What few rubrics there WERE in the Book of Common Prayer concerned themselves MAINLY with permitted and forbidden TEXTS, rather than musical settings OF those texts.   In former times, ONLY texts from Holy Scripture, the Book of Common Prayer (by common consent, that included the Anglican Missal and the Anglican Breviary, although neither were official books), or an approved Anglican hymnal could be sung.   I remember the Dean of St. Luke's Cathedral in Orlando admonishing me about that when I was practicing with a soloist for a wedding ... the bride had asked for something non-scriptural, and he wouldn't allow it.   Cheers,   Bud              
(back) Subject: Re: "Sound of Music" Processional From: <ProOrgo53@aol.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 18:34:27 EST   How funny! How Cute! It must be absolutely delightful to hear!   Cheers!   D Rider Independence, MO, USA    
(back) Subject: Re: The whole "marching" thing From: "F. Richard Burt" <effarbee@verizon.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:39:20 -0600   Hello, Charlie, Bud, et al: I noticed that about a month ago there was a huge Bridal Exhibition here in Dallas that ran for two days in one of the Market Center exhibit halls. There were literally thousands of moms, daughters, and brides-to-be, and, maybe their reluctant men attending this thing. To me, what is worse than the enormous commercialization of the prospective event for some young women is the development of a new breed of "wedding coordinators" who are oriented toward the financial aspects of the event; . . . and maybe not even at all sympathetic with the meaning of Christian marriage as we view it within the church. If P. T. Barnum was right, " . . . we aint' seen nothing yet." It will get worse until the next big recession hits to bring most us back to our financial senses, and a few will fall on their knees in gratitude that God restores what is really important in and about a wedding. F. Richard Burt ..    
(back) Subject: Re: The whole "marching" thing From: "Ray Ahrens" <Ray_Ahrens@msn.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:46:35 -0600   Jealous? Always a bridesmaid...   Yes, I guess I DO live in a dream world where GOD, the CHURCH, and the =   SACRAMENT of Matrimony ARE more important than brides' egos and = bride's=20 daddies' bank accounts.      
(back) Subject: Re: Josh Grobin: "You Raise Me Up" From: "Erik Johnson" <the_maitre@hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 18:58:47 -0500   Could not copy the message to the digest, there was no plain text part
(back) Subject: Re: Chicago Cathedral From: "F. Richard Burt" <effarbee@verizon.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 18:00:48 -0600   Hello, Paul, et al:   You wrote:   * * *   > There was a program on the radio this morning about an > alarming increase in asthma. The rate of this disease in > Philadelphia schoolchildren is now 20-25%. Nobody > knows exactly why, but cockroaches, dust, and air pollution > are widely suspected. It's rather incredible that a carpet > with heavy traffic can last a generation-- they must have > spent a fortune replacing parts of it-- but if not, obviously > the carpeting in Holy Name Cathedral has now accumulated > a generation's worth of grime. Perhaps an appeal to cleanliness > and public health can forestall the proliferation (prodeatheration?) > of such a frivolous amenity, when all other arguments have failed.   Could we connect breathing problems with polluted air? . . . to carpet contaminated with cleaning materials and excessive collections of irritants? . . . in a way that asbestos was determined to be dangerous to our health?   Good lawyers make fortunes chasing issues like this in the public interest. Who would we have to convince it is worth taking to the courts? . . .even in the face of public opinion?   F. Richard Burt     ..      
(back) Subject: Re: The whole "marching" thing From: <quilisma@cox.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 16:16:34 -0800   Um, not QUITE. I've been partnered for thirty years (grin).   Cheers,   Bud   Ray Ahrens wrote:   > Jealous? Always a bridesmaid... > > Yes, I guess I DO live in a dream world where GOD, the CHURCH, and = the > SACRAMENT of Matrimony ARE more important than brides' egos and = bride's > daddies' bank accounts. >      
(back) Subject: Re: How much for a wedding? From: <OMusic@aol.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 19:29:30 EST   The bride and groom haven't hit the ground yet, either. The Preacher had very good ideas about the Processional, which were much more logical than = what is generally used.    
(back) Subject: RE: Chicago Cathedral From: "Emmons, Paul" <PEMMONS@wcupa.edu> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 19:31:53 -0500   > Good lawyers make fortunes chasing issues like this in the > public interest. Who would we have to convince it is worth > taking to the courts? . . .even in the face of public opinion?   Suage is a horrible fate-- I wouldn't want it to come to that. But I = remember reading about this matter in either Pipechat or Piporg-L a = couple years ago, and at the time was duly surprised as well as = impressed. Scientific investigations (and they probably don't have to = be anything very profound) have revealed that scarcely is there any such = thing as a clean carpet. There are a lot of dirt and germs in them. = Neither carpet manufacturers nor vacuum-cleaner manufacturers want us to = know this (in the latter case, they'd have us think that their machines = remove all dirt effectively). =20   Women, especially mothers, bless their hearts, tend to be very fussy = about cleanliness. The amount of bad stuff in a carpet in a public = place, even one regularly vacuumed, is such that it is not advisable to = allow small children to play on it. One can only conclude, from the = fact that babies and toddlers do play on carpets in nurseries routinely, = that their mommies do not know the truth. If they did, they would gasp = in horror. =20   It is in our interest, as opponents of carpeting in church, to inform = them. That is as far as I'd like to go for now-- and perhaps, as in = other ways, the truth will set us free.   If you search the archives, I hope that you can find this information = when it was discussed before.    
(back) Subject: Re: The whole "marching" thing From: <OMusic@aol.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 19:32:32 EST   My grandfather was the "Marrin' Sam of his area and once officiated at a wedding in a wagon pulled by a horse with the father of the bride holding = a rifle aimed at all of them. Lee    
(back) Subject: Re: Wedding Processionals From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 19:41:24 -0600   My wife and I also had the Bach Eb Prelude and Fugue at our wedding, in = St. Paul's, Nantucket, Massachusetts, 27 years ago. (We had suggested around = a dozen pieces to the organist, and this is the one she chose.) I think the "St. Anne" is probably the most popular wedding piece among organists.   John Speller   ----- Original Message ----- From: "MusicMan" <musicman@cottagemusic.co.uk> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 4:17 AM Subject: Re: Wedding Processionals     Congratulations ! My wife and I (well, we needed to be together, or we wouldn't have been = able to have been married !) had the 'St. Anne' for her entry into the churchHarry [MusicMan] Grove -----Original Message----- From: OMusic@aol.com <OMusic@aol.com> To: pipechat@pipechat.org <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: 14 March 2004 20:34 Subject: Re: Wedding Processionals     When Felix played for our wedding, the Processional was Prelude and Fugue (St. Anne) in Eb Major by Bach. Then the Congregation sang "O God = Our Help in Ages Past."        
(back) Subject: Re: Wanted: Used small, Kimber-Allen DE Magnets From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@mindspring.com> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 19:47:10 -0600   Why not try Kimber-Allen? http://www.kimberallen.8m.net/   They have been making them for 60 years and I don't imagine they are more than a few dollars each.   John Speller   ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douglas Roger Dexheimer" <whistles73@earthlink.net> To: "Pipechat List" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 10:20 AM Subject: Wanted: Used small, Kimber-Allen DE Magnets     > > We are looking for about 37 small Kimber-Allen electro-mechanical organ > magnets. These are the smaller variety of the typical Reisner, Wicks, > Justin Matter, etc magnets. A variety of magnet resistances were made, for > different WP's. Please advise where a supply of these can be obtained. > Thanks: Bill Stephens/Doug Dexheimer > > > > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > > >    
(back) Subject: Re: The whole "marching" thing From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:24:44 -0500   On 3/15/04 7:32 PM, "OMusic@aol.com" <OMusic@aol.com> wrote:   > My grandfather was the "Marryin' Sam=B2 of his area and once officiated at = a > wedding in a wagon pulled by a horse with the father of the bride holding= a > rifle aimed at all of them.   I really do love it! Well, that was reality in them (really real) days. Should be now too, quite a few times! Thanks a huge BUNCH! Terrific tale=8Band FAR from unique! (At least in terms of the need.)   Big smooch, my dear!   Alan