PipeChat Digest #4511 - Thursday, May 20, 2004
 
Re: putting Bach through the changes--or not
  by "Bill Raty" <billious@billraty.com>
Re: Suggestions for Centennial Celebration
  by "Bill Raty" <billious@billraty.com>
Re:  Violin
  by "Dr. Amy Fleming" <docamy@alltel.net>
Deprived in Boston
  by "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk>
Re: Violin
  by "Roy Redman" <rredman@imagin.net>
Re: changes in Bach
  by "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@swbell.net>
Ocean Swells (BWV565) (long and tedious)
  by "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk>
Re: Violin
  by <ContraReed@aol.com>
Re: Violin
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca>
Re: Violin
  by "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk>
Trip
  by <OMusic@aol.com>
Re: putting Bach through the changes--or not
  by <OMusic@aol.com>
Re: Deprived in Boston
  by "chemphill" <chemphill@wi.rr.com>
Juan Mesa's Junior Recital 5-18-04
  by "Malcolm Wechsler" <manderusa@earthlink.net>
Music progression through the church
  by <Pepehomer@aol.com>
 

(back) Subject: Re: putting Bach through the changes--or not From: "Bill Raty" <billious@billraty.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 04:38:41 -0700 (PDT)   That is truth!   Many thanks also for you kindly stated correction about the Voce Umana, Colin!   May I be so bold to suggest that any beautifully wrought instrument is also a great teacher? There are some from every period. St. Bavo's, the Gabler at Weingarten, and Boston's Churh of the Advent, to name three, all have that magical marriage of beautiful voices matched to and with sympathetic acoustic. When the notes pour out the magic begins.   Who needs carpeted aisle runners and padded pews when one is blanketed by sounds like that?   -Bill   --- Colin Mitchell <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > > So when we play original instruments, they act as the > great teachers that they are; giving us a unique > insight and "feel" for the period. >     =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D    
(back) Subject: Re: Suggestions for Centennial Celebration From: "Bill Raty" <billious@billraty.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 04:51:18 -0700 (PDT)   --- "Jeremy A. Korba" <jkorba@regentpromotions.com> wrote: > > We're approaching the centennial of our parish. We're putting > together a > large choir and an ensemble of some type (brass, percussion, > etc.) to > celebrate the Parish's 100 years. >   Just for humor's sake, one can do Ralph Vaughan Williams' Prelude on the Old Hundredth before service... But perhaps that is too much of an inside joke.       =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D    
(back) Subject: Re: Violin From: "Dr. Amy Fleming" <docamy@alltel.net> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 07:25:48 -0500   I have a inexpensive violin I have played fo 2 years. It is a Palatino. Paid $125 for it. The best thing I have done is replace the strings. The more expensive strings ($40) are easier to play. But until you get the = hang of the basics the best violin in the world will sound terrible <grin> I have played on my teacher's violins - he has several - and can't tell a = lot of difference at my level of playing. It is fun and a stress buster. Amy    
(back) Subject: Deprived in Boston From: "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 05:35:25 -0700 (PDT)   Hello,   Bill Raty, and others, have mentioned the Church of the Advent, Boston, and I always feel slightly deprived.   I spent weeks in the Boston area, met some wonderful people, some outstanding minds and, being young at the time, had an absolute ball kicking around Harvard and Boston itself.   Sadly, the only organs I played were the Flentrop at Harvard, and the then very new Fisk.   It was only when I had moved on to The Cape, then back to New York, then to Hertford and eventually back across the pond, that I began to regret certain things. I had visited a country with a unique organ culture and heard virtually nothing of it!!   When I told people I had been in Boston, they would say, "Did you hear the Church of the Advent?"   When I stated not, they gave me a sort of sad, pitying look.   In fact, the only real heavy wind I experienced was at the end of the Cape, where I hung on to a street lamp in the middle of the night (by choice) and felt the full force of a major hurricane.....that was very silly, but hugely enjoyable.   When I eventually fulfill an ambition to go "twister chasing," I shall, if I survive, make a point of hearing some PROPER heavy wind. If, on the other hand, you read a headline such as "Brit organist sucked into outer atmosphere," you'll know that I've been.....and gone!   Regards,   Colin Mitchell UK   --- Bill Raty <billious@billraty.com> wrote:   > That is truth! > > Many thanks also for you kindly stated correction > about the > Voce Umana, Colin! > > May I be so bold to suggest that any beautifully > wrought > instrument is also a great teacher?     __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Domains =96 Claim yours for only $14.70/year http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer  
(back) Subject: Re: Violin From: "Roy Redman" <rredman@imagin.net> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 08:01:42 -0500   Trying to learn to play on a bad violin is like, you know what. Find a = good violin repair shop, most of which will have many good and = inexpensive violins around that you can see and try, or have = demonstrated for you. Ask a competent player or teacher to recommend = such a shop near you. Violin prices are a little like organ prices. = Many years ago I took several violins to Mr. Rury in Dallas for = appraisal. I learned that if the violin can be identified by maker the = price is dependent on the prestige of that builder at a given time. So, = first is, who made it, second is condition and appearance, and third is = the actual sound. .The good repair shop will usually have many choices = for you in violins that are will adjusted for ease of playing and good = tone. Beware mail order, unless you absolutely know the reputation of = the seller, and they will guarantee satisfaction.. Roy Redman ----- Original Message -----=20 From: bnorth=20 To: PipeChat=20 Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 11:02 PM Subject: Violin     Yes, off topic, but I just wondered if anyone has any experience = buying a violin. I have some time on my hands and was thinking of buying = one and learning to play. Ebay has a number of inexpensive (OK, cheap, = I'm scottish) that seem to have the right features, but wonder at the = price, like $20 + shipping. I know you only get what you pay for, but = has anyone any experience with the cheap violins? Any advice appreciated.  
(back) Subject: Re: changes in Bach From: "John L. Speller" <jlspeller@swbell.net> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 08:10:04 -0500     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Koontz" <markkoontz@yahoo.com> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 9:20 PM Subject: Re: changes in Bach     > I am insufficiently educated in Baroque music to offer any credible opinion > about registrational changes one way or the other. What I have observed is > that constraints (self-imposed or otherwise) most often intensify an artistic > experience.   Often the constraints are more concerned with the playing ability of the organist rather than the limitations of the organ. I have been watching a video of Daniel Roth playing the organ at St. Sulpice (available from OHS http://www.ohscatalog.com/danrotschwei.html ). To watch him manipulating the stops of a 5 manual, 100 stop organ, almost entirely by hand is breathtaking and I don't think any solid state combination action, with however many levels of memory, stop sequencers, etc., would be able to achieve more.   John Speller      
(back) Subject: Ocean Swells (BWV565) (long and tedious) From: "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 06:19:20 -0700 (PDT)   Hello,   I'm going to try and be terribly serious and terribly scholarly for a moment or ten, but you'll all have to work at this to understand it.   James Nerstheimer mentioned the "ocean swells" in the BWV565 fugue.   For this, you will need certain things, as follows:-   1) An old copy of the BWV 565 2) A soft pencil 3) An eraser (better avoid the UK term "rubber")   Now class, get out your copies of the Bach D Minor (BWV565) and turn to the opening of the Fugue.   Now gaze at the first two bars, and what do we see?   We see a fugue subject which starts off the beat with a group of three semi-quavers followed by a group of four, then followed by eight notes commencing on a strong beat.   That opening establishes an important rhythmically consistent structure of the Fugue.......I think we can all agree on this.   We now mentally "listen" to our cyber fugue, as played on a Great Organ with 8,4 & 2ft stops drawn.   We eventually arrive at Bar no.29, where we have the first of the scalar descents.   At this point, I re-establish the opening rhythmic motif, by changing manuals on the Eb three semi-quavers before the end of bar 29, and change back to the original manual on the sixth "F" semi-quaver of bar 30, then once more echo this by changing manuals again on the G three semi-quavers before the end of bar 30.   By establishing the consistent rhtyhmic pattern it is possible (and sounds natural) to play the "ocean waves" commencing on Bar 36 in a different way to that which we normally hear. Normally, those ocean waves just sounds like on-beat arpeggios, which IMHO are not in keeping with the rhythm of the fugue subject.   Here's what we do......   Bar 36, whatever manual we find ourselves on at this point, we stay on until the B of the 9th semi-quaver .....an F. On the next note, a G, we swap manuals until the first semi-quaver of bar 37. On the second semi-quaver G of bar 37, we change manuals again.   We imitate this by staying on this manual until the Bb 9th semi-quaver, and then changing manuals again on the next G (10th semi-quaver).   You get the idea by now, hopefully.   However, this means that in bar 43, we have to pick upo the idea again by changing manuals on the A which marks the tenth semi-quaver; runing this through to the C# which marks the first note of bar 44. On the second semi-quaver of bar 44, an A, we change manuals again as before.   This pattern continues until bar 52, and if done right, we should be on a secondary chorus until bar 55 and the dramatic upward scale of D minor, where we move to a now more powerful pleno registration.   Working exactly as previously described, this treatment is given to the "ocean swells" of bars 85 - 89 in exactly the same way.   At bar 90, we are on familiar territory and making that glorius push towards the end, immdiately after the solo pedal entry of the subject.   IMHO, this approach, whilst unconventional, is firmly within the spirit of baroque performance practice, where the symmetrical details of rhythm and phrasing are just as important as the actual dots.   Anyway, just to get the soap commercial in, I am in good company. I was stunned to discover that Stephen Cleobury at King College, Cambridge, does much the same thing; though I hesitate to suggest that "great minds think alike," because he's a whole lot brighter than me!!   Give it a whirl!   Let us know what you think!   Regards,   Colin Mitchell UK     --- James Nerstheimer <enigma1685@yahoo.com> wrote: >   > Now, what fun do all you have with those "ocean > swells" in the D-minor Fugue (BWV 565)?     __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Domains =96 Claim yours for only $14.70/year http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer  
(back) Subject: Re: Violin From: <ContraReed@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 09:20:15 -0400   In a message dated 5/20/2004 12:02:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time, = bnorth@intergate.ca writes:   > Yes, off topic, but I just wondered if anyone has any experience buying = a violin. I have some time on my hands and was thinking of buying one and = learning to play. Ebay has a number of inexpensive (OK, cheap, I'm = scottish) that seem to have the right features, but wonder at the price, = like $20 + shipping. I know you only get what you pay for, but has anyone = any > experience with the cheap violins? Any advice appreciated.   First: find a local teacher who can give you advice on both learning how = to play (bad habits learned early on are difficult to break later), on = getting a violin. Second, go to a local band/orchestra instrument store = are luthier (NOT a guitar/drum or electronic organ store) and inquire = about rental programs. This way you'll have a decent student level = instrument to start on, and you won't have wasted your money on an = unplayable instrument from a far-away dealer. Then, if you and the violin = really get along fabulously, you can trade in the student model for a = better one.   If there are no local stores which rent violins, there are a couple of = mail-order places which have good reputations amoung string = players/teachers. E-mail me off list and I'll give you the names of some.   I've had students come with 'bargains' from E-Bay, and the set-up of the = instruments makes them extremely difficult to play (not enough curvature = of the bridge - makes it hard to play on the different strings; strings to = close together - hard to place finger on just one; strings too far from = fingerboard - makes it hard to press them down; bow/instrument of poor = quality - impossible to get a pleasing tone from it; badly fit pegs - = makes getting it in tune and keeping it in tune difficult; etc., etc., = etc. Local repairpeople won't even look at these instruments because the = cost of trying to fix them would be greater than the value of the = instrument. It's a pity so much wood is wasted on inferior instruments.   Richard Spittel Baltimore, MD    
(back) Subject: Re: Violin From: "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 09:24:42 -0400   At 12:02 AM 5/20/2004, BobN wrote: >Yes, off topic, but I just wondered if anyone has any experience buying a =   >violin. I have some time on my hands and was thinking of buying one and >learning to play. Ebay has a number of inexpensive (OK, cheap, I'm >scottish) that seem to have the right features, but wonder at the price, >like $20 + shipping. I know you only get what you pay for, but has anyone =   >any experience with the cheap violins? Any advice appreciated.   Many years ago when my daughter was learning to play the violin, we had a family "hand-me-down" violin. She was told by her teacher that it was not =   worth trying to learn on it, and he recommended that we buy her a better = one.   It so happened that I was taking evening classes in violin making, (although I was actually building a viola), and the instructor worked for one of the reputable violin makers in London. It was he who found a suitable instrument for her, that was in a rather sorry state of repair. The price was 100 pounds, which was a lot to me at the time, but it was worth it. He supervised my repair work personally, and eventually it became a worthy instrument.   The instrument was a copy of a German Stainer violin, with a high bridge and my daughter took to it immediately, - eventually she became Leader of the London Schools Orchestra, while she was a student at the London School =   of Music.   My advice is not that you should attempt to repair a good violin, but that =   a cheap one is really not worth even E-Bay prices. There is a lot of frustration that goes with a violin that is difficult to play.   Bob Conway      
(back) Subject: Re: Violin From: "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 06:25:07 -0700 (PDT)   Hello,   Violins are not off topic....Bach, Mendelssohn, Bruhns etc etc.   Better still, try and find a violin with a Wurlitzer label inside the belly......could be expensive though!!   Regards,   Colin Mitchell UK           __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Domains =96 Claim yours for only $14.70/year http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer  
(back) Subject: Trip From: <OMusic@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 09:57:35 EDT   We are taking a trip next week, going through Colorado to Salt Lake City, = to Salem, OR. We are coming back through California to LA and then to = Phoenix, through NM and to El Paso and back to Denton. We are taking 13 days to do =   this. If you know of some great pipe organs along these ways, please let = us know. Keith did install and voice some organs along the way, which we will stop = to see. Please let us know of any sites of interest on these areas. (Yes, = we will see the Temple and Tabernacle in Salt Lake City). We are leaving = Monday and will return a week from the next Saturday. Lee    
(back) Subject: Re: putting Bach through the changes--or not From: <OMusic@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 10:05:21 EDT   I have done some of my best playing on very small, lacking presets, less = than 4 rank organs because I have to think creatively to register such a small linstrument and get the best from it. Recently I played a 3 rank self = contained Wicks, no pedals, for a funeral. It had a "stop" that made the lower = notes sound like a 16 foot pedal note. Playing for the congregational singing = on "full" organ was sufficient to lead the people who came. When I have all = the manuals, ranks, presets, and pedals, I tend to rely on the combinations, = rather than thinking so hard to make it sound good. I even played some Bach on = it. Lee    
(back) Subject: Re: Deprived in Boston From: "chemphill" <chemphill@wi.rr.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 09:06:16 -0500   Dear Colin,   I know a tornado chaser in Texas when you are ready.   Tina Hemphill chemphill@wi.rr.com   ----- Original Message ----- From: "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 7:35 AM Subject: Deprived in Boston     > Hello, > > Bill Raty, and others, have mentioned the Church of > the Advent, Boston, and I always feel slightly > deprived. > > I spent weeks in the Boston area, met some wonderful > people, some outstanding minds and, being young at the > time, had an absolute ball kicking around Harvard and > Boston itself. > > Sadly, the only organs I played were the Flentrop at > Harvard, and the then very new Fisk. > > It was only when I had moved on to The Cape, then back > to New York, then to Hertford and eventually back > across the pond, that I began to regret certain > things. I had visited a country with a unique organ > culture and heard virtually nothing of it!! > > When I told people I had been in Boston, they would > say, "Did you hear the Church of the Advent?" > > When I stated not, they gave me a sort of sad, pitying > look. > > In fact, the only real heavy wind I experienced was at > the end of the Cape, where I hung on to a street lamp > in the middle of the night (by choice) and felt the > full force of a major hurricane.....that was very > silly, but hugely enjoyable. > > When I eventually fulfill an ambition to go "twister > chasing," I shall, if I survive, make a point of > hearing some PROPER heavy wind. If, on the other hand, > you read a headline such as "Brit organist sucked into > outer atmosphere," you'll know that I've been.....and > gone! > > Regards, > > Colin Mitchell UK > > --- Bill Raty <billious@billraty.com> wrote: > > > That is truth! > > > > Many thanks also for you kindly stated correction > > about the > > Voce Umana, Colin! > > > > May I be so bold to suggest that any beautifully > > wrought > > instrument is also a great teacher? > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70/year > http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: mailto:requests@pipechat.org > >    
(back) Subject: Juan Mesa's Junior Recital 5-18-04 From: "Malcolm Wechsler" <manderusa@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 11:23:11 -0400   Western Connecticut State University, Department of Music Presents:   Juan A. Mesa, Organist, Student of Prof. Stephen Roberts, in his Junior Recital.   St. Peter's Church, Danbury, Connecticut, May 18th, 2004 - 8:00 p.m.   Dear Lists and Friends,   There were many things about the above-mentioned recital that caused it to be a really important event for different people in different ways. It = was, perhaps first in importance, a milestone, something of a rite of passage = for Juan. It was a way of taking stock after the Junior year at Western Connecticut State U., and saying: "This is what I have accomplished." In this school, a very close-knit community, people tend to support one another. There were music students, of course,\ and other students, many friends of Juan, who attended, and were hearing possibly their very first Organ recital. They were seeing also, as the console is, for concerts, in full view. To say they were somewhat spellbound is not saying too much. At the last piece on the program, which will be revealed to you in due = course, they were wild with the excitement of discovery. Present also were members of the faculty and of the administration. Having an Organ department is a new experience for this school, and Juan proved to be an important = emissary to them, carrying the news that an Organ department can be, dare I say, a "class act." They all know that Stephen Roberts, an oft-contributing = member of the Pipe Organ List, is attracting students and building a department, but now, if they doubted any of it, they know that the tuition the = students are getting is of the highest order. So Juan, who thought he was just playing a recital, now discovers that he is also part of a movement, = lending credibility to the Pipe Organ as a serious and exciting concert medium. Thank you, Juan, for that.   The recital began with the Bach Fantasia in G Minor (542), following some historical precedent in programming only the Fantasia, which he (also following precedent,) ended with a G Major chord. The performance had lots of drive and assurance, and set everyone up for alert listening to what followed.   In the second piece, the Schuebler Choral "Wachet Auf," Juan had to = contend with something that old Bach never had to worry about. All but the Cantus needed to be played on the front Organ, with the Cantus using a strong Trumpet in the back, easily 100 feet or more away. I have a terrible = feeling that someone is now going to report on a Silbermann Organ somewhere with = 100 foot trackers running off to a gallery, and a "Fern Trompette" that Bach used constantly. We won't hold our breaths. Seriously, I thought for just = a short moment that Juan was a bit jinxed by this, but it was indeed a short moment, and was a wonderful performance. The lazy way is to do as I have done, when I ask my choir to sing the cantus, complete with some ornamentation, while I play the rest. There were several of us at this concert that would have been happy to perform this service, but we were clearly not on the agenda!   Bang! From Bach to Reger - Introduction and Passacaglia in D Minor. If the audience had not yet been apprised of the power both of this Organist, and of the Organ repertoire, Max did it to the max. A splendid strong performance.   As is the case with perhaps eight or ten special pieces of music, the = Vierne Scherzo from the Second Symphony is one of which I well recall my first hearing. That was at Oberlin, in the old, and to me, lamented Warner = Concert Hall. What wonderful music - a scherzo indeed. At the very beginning of = the performance, I thought Juan was in a bit of trouble, with the fluty bits = on the west end Organ, and the rest in the chancel with the console. And then = I wondered if it was only what I, three quarters of the way back in the building, was hearing - the west end a bit ahead. About two bars in, all = was togetherness, and we were synchronized all the rest of the way. Vierne, = like Bach, had neither the curse nor the luxury of playing the music of one = hand over 100 feet away. Juan did confirm afterwards that he had a moment's confusion which evaporated instantly. It looked like he was playing this piece from memory, and indeed he was, although there was a very much = reduced score on the music desk for safety. He never once looked up. You work so hard to learn to play the notes of this clever piece, it is clearly worth going the extra distance to commit it to memory. It was good, and I know most of the audience was hearing it for the first time. Perhaps they will always remember that moment!   When I was conducting a large boys' choir in Canada more than a few years ago, Rock and Roll was making serious headway amongst the young. Somehow, = in some free time, one of the boys enthused about some Rock and Roll piece, = and was quickly put down by some of the other boys. "Who needs that stuff. = It's boring. We do Britten, Mathias, Sowerby, and what's that other thing - Oh yea, Bryan Kelley." Well, I know there are those who would say that the fastest way to turn an audience off would be to offer them some Messiaen. Well, in the hands of Juan Mesa, I swear to you that "Dieu Parmi Nous" had everyone's attention thoroughly riveted in place. It was so powerful and wonderful, that no one, even someone unused to dissonance, could miss the magnificence of that music. It was the greatness of the music and the commitment of the performance that made it happen. Our friend Stephen Roberts said several times afterwards that "Tonight, we made lots of new friends for the Organ." I thought so, but he is in an even better position to be sure about that, because he knows the community, and who many of the people attending were, and possibly what experience, if any, they might = have had with an Organ recital.   Those of you attending the AGO National Convention in Los Angeles later = this summer will have a chance to hear Juan Mesa, so do watch for that name and try to get there. Once the convention ends, he will have a chance to go = home to Chile to be with his family. Many around here will look forward to his Senior Recital.   Cheers,   Malcolm Wechsler www.mander-organs.com      
(back) Subject: Music progression through the church From: <Pepehomer@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 11:30:36 -0400   Just came upon a very humorous segment on Prairie Home Companion, about = the progression of music directors in a fictional (I think!) church.   http://prairiehome.publicradio.org/performances/2004/05/15/   Go to segment 6. It's titled "150th Anniversary"   Justin Karch Organist, Holy Trinity LCMS Rome, GA