PipeChat Digest #4790 - Monday, September 27, 2004 Music of Ramon Noble by <RMB10@aol.com> Re: What did you play today? by <DERREINETOR@aol.com> What did you play today by <RMB10@aol.com> Re: What did you play today? by "Paul Opel" <email@example.com> OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! by <RMB10@aol.com> Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! by "Andy Lawrence" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! by "T.Desiree' Hines" <email@example.com> TV Advertisement by "David Baker" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! by "John L. Speller" <email@example.com> Re: What did you play today? by "Alan Freed" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! by <KurtvonS@aol.com> Skinner organs and 16' Waldhorns by "Daniel Hancock" <email@example.com> Re: organ and choral music of Richard Purvis by "M Fox" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Congrats, Beau! by <DERREINETOR@aol.com> slighty OT: fradulent paypal "phishing" by "Liquescent" <email@example.com> Re: WAS what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! by <RonSeverin@aol.com> hurricane report from Mulberry, FL by "Liquescent" <firstname.lastname@example.org> stoplist fee? by <BlueeyedBear@aol.com> RE: stoplist fee? by "Daniel Hancock" <email@example.com>
(back) Subject: Music of Ramon Noble From: <RMB10@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 07:06:32 EDT Robert Lind mentions that he played the Divertimento by Ramon Noble yesterday in church. I became introduced to the music of Noble while in = college when Prof. Noble came to my college with his Balet Folklorico de Mexico which = he conducts (this was in 1990, I guess). He is the music director for the group. He and my organ professor became friends, and my professor (Dr. = James Welch), also being an editor, ended up editing all of Noble's works, thus = the start of the Mexican Composers for Organ Series that Vivace Press = publishes. Small world, isn't it. I just played the Toccatina in an AGO program = last weekend, I also love the El Flautista Allegre, both in vol. 1. Monty Bennett Friendship Baptist Church Charlotte, NC
(back) Subject: Re: What did you play today? From: <DERREINETOR@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 07:21:01 EDT SJE, Boston: (BCP lectionary) Prelude: "Adoro te devote"--Titcomb (by request from a parishioner, really = non-topical lectionary-wise) Hymns: Tell out, my soul (Birmingham), O holy city, seen of John (Morning Song), Where cross the crowded ways of life (Gardiner Mass: Mathias (Credo: Plainchant, mode V) Psalmody and antiphons: Plainchant Communion: Improvisation Postlude: "Festival Voluntary"--Peeters Bill H. St. John the Evangelist, Boston
(back) Subject: What did you play today From: <RMB10@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 07:57:35 EDT Friendship Missionary Baptist Church Charlotte, NC Sunday, Sept. 26, 2004 7:30am, 9:15am, 11:15 am Prelude: Prelude on Abide With Me--Robert Hebble Opening Hymn: They Will Know We Are Christians By Our Love Congregational Song ("old time Gospel"): The Feast of the Lord Prayer Chant after Altar Prayer: Abide With Me (this has been the theme = of this month's sermon series) Anthem: 7:30 (Church Choir) Amazing Grace arr. Evelyn Simpson-Curenton (newly published as part of GIA's African American Choral Series--great arrangement!) 9:15 (Male Chorus) Send Me, O Lord (I forgot composer, published by = Hinshaw) 11:15 (Ladies Choir) I've Prayed About It (and God Still Answers = Prayers) Offertory: normally choral, but I played today 7:30 Immortal, Invisible, God Only Wise --Michael Burkhardt 9:15 & 11:15 Toccata on We Will Glorify --Fred Bock 9:15 (Male Chorus-following offering) I Can Bear It--Edwin Hawkins Invitation Hymn: 7:15 Blessed Assurance 9:15 & 11:15 He's Sweet I Know Postlude: Prelude and Fugue in E Major--Vincent Lubeck Yesterday was an interesting Sunday. The first service was preached by a = guest minister from South Africa. No one could really understand him = because of his heavy accent except when he said Jesus or Hallelujah. We did pick = up that he spoke 10 languages, but English was his weakest one. Good thing = that he only spoke for about 25 minutes! I couldn't tell you what the sermon = was about. The early service is always the most traditional, catering to the = more "elderly" and it gets younger as the services go on. I played the offertories today, instead of the choirs singing, just for a change, so I = wanted some hymn based pieces...At the last two services, those Fred Bock pieces had them on their feet shouting. Pastor Jones preached the last two = services, but the Spirit hit during the last service and it brought me back memories of = my old Pentecostal church. I didn't even get to play a postlude at the = final service--people were praying at the altar, so it was not appropriate to = do so, so since I played the final hymn on the Hammond (horrors!) and the choir hummed backup to the the Pastor during the Benediction, I just stayed = there and did some soft "Gospe-ly" mood music running the Leslies up and down--it = was fun, but I was emotionally wiped out. For those of you who have never experienced a Pentecostal or emotionally charged Baptist service, you = need to try it--your hearts will never be the same. Monty Bennett Friendship Baptist Church Charlotte, NC
(back) Subject: Re: What did you play today? From: "Paul Opel" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 08:38:41 -0500 Well, Saturday evening I got a call from the church I subbed at yesterday, saying that the church had been hit by lightning, and the Alien took a power surge. The tech had come on Friday, but didn't have enough spare parts, so I was on the piano. When I got there, the Wurlitzer (organ content-barely) spinet was so out of tune that the bass played different notes from the treble. Fortunately, I had my tuning hammer in the car, and was able to whack the thing into submission in a half-hour or so; not the cleanest tuning, but bearable. So: Prelude: Mozart, Variations in A, K. 331 (the first movement of the sonata which includes the Turkish Rondo) Offertory: Satie, Air du Grand Prieur from the Sonneries de la Rose + = Croix Postlude: Haydn, Allegro con brio from the Sonata in D, Hob. XVI/37 The choir did their usual God-awful happy-crappy anthem; the one saving grace was the new choir director, a semi-competent but very easy on the eyes young woman, replacing the minister's son, who is off at Westminster Choir College (where he will, with luck, learn that there is choral music of much higher quality than what he has been teaching the choir for the last few years). Then off to the Vermont AGO Chapter organ crawl, where we heard six different organists playing 7 different organs, from an 1864 2/21 Hook to = a 1998 3/69 Russell, with assorted Austins, a Wilhelm, and the marvelous French Fisk at UVM in between. More on this event in another posting to come! A different sort of day! Paul http://www.sover.net/~popel/agomain.html
(back) Subject: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! From: <RMB10@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 08:42:21 EDT >Now, the Skinner is nice, but has glitches from the redo. To cancel registrations, one must >sit and press contiunously the cancel button, = some of the notes are dead because of >electrical faulty. The stops...there is one 16 = reed knob on the pedal for the hugue 16' >trombone, which made me think "now there should be a borrow from the swell 16 Waldhorn >to give some pedal = reed variety" I did not want to have the roar of the biggest reed from >start = to finish. The swell Battery..the Long res. reeds sounded like Tuba = Mirabili. I mean >those B.....were BIG! There was, in the spring, a very nice 8' Chamade added, Very full and >round, smooth. Things...just did not seem = so...Ernestine or Skinneresque guess I could >say. I can say that a bit mor etime at that organ would have been nice. It not like the >Skinner at First Unitarian = Church Chicago, which is just amazing. It sounds like the tonal >output was = altered when they redid the organ, and there are definately stops that were = >moved. They couldhave atleast left a knob for the 16 waldhorn on the pedal for = one to be FF >and another to be FFFF. A couple of thoughts here... Just because the organ was "rebuilt" doesn't mean that everything was rebuilt. Some companies toss around the word rebuilt, meaning just a = general cleanup of the organ, cleaning dust out of chambers, cleaning reed = tongues, etc., other companies mean a complete restoration, others mean new console, new = chests, etc. and the only thing that remains are the original pipework. = The word is ambiguous. Was the console rebuilt when the work was done? Who = did the work? That could be a problem right there. If a second rate company did = the work--problems will ensue. Regarding the stops, this is where musical and artistic judgement come = into play from the organist. One does not always have to have the "Swell = Battery" on at all times. How does that old expression go..."Discretion is the better part of valor" Or something to that effect. It's amazing in a = good room on a good organ, how just by adding a couple of stops, the whole color of = the organ can change. Also, use the Swell shades-that's what they're there = for. Nothing beats the sound of the "caged rage" of full Swell roaring away behind thick shades that just muffle the sound away to nothing. As to = the reed stops, a Swell division, in E. M. Skinner style or G. D. H. style is = going to be based on long resonator reeds. I don't think that either one of them = ever used short resonator reeds in the Swell. I could be wrong, because = there's an exception to every rule, but GENERALLY, in the early days, the reed = chorus was going to have Trumpets at various pitches and an Oboe, or a Waldhorn = for the 16, maybe a Basson, except for maybe an experimental organ would it = have had anything short length in the Swell. (Am I off base here???) I know of a church locally that rebuilt their Aeolian -Skinner, but when = it was done, the organist wouldn't let any additional knobs be added to the console. There were a few tonal changes made, borrowing the Swell 16' = reed to the pedal, making the Swell 16' Basson play at 8' pitch, etc., so the Mt. = Carmel rebuild may have been a similar type thing when the work was done. = I would not be surprised if the 16' Trombone in the Pedal was original to the design. That's why there is a Swell to Pedal coupler. Designs like that = make you get creative and test a musician's creativity. The thing that gets me is why organ companies build three manual organs = with the cornet and the Cromorne on the same manual. Why do organists allow this? It goes against performance practice. If they want to put the = Cornet decompose in the Choir box, fine...borrow it to the Great or to the = Swell. How does one do a dialogue if all the stops are on the same manual? That's impossible. We would all love to have everything everywhere at every pitch, but we don't. You make up suitable alternatives by using the musician's best friends--the ears and the brain, the most unused parts of the body when a = musician plays. Most organists just sit down hit a piston and play--they don't = listen to how anything sounds or think about what they do. They just go on = autopilot. The philosophy is "if it's loud it's good, if it's louder it's better, = and if it's fast it's got to be really great!" What happened to musicianship? Part of it is genetic, but why do schools not try to hone this skill? OK, off my soap box now.... Monty Bennett
(back) Subject: Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! From: "Andy Lawrence" <email@example.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 07:54:32 -0500 A few quick thoughts: > Now, the Skinner is nice, but has glitches from the redo. Did you ever play it as EM Skinner left it? Just like all other builders, = he had some very successful organs, and some not so successful organs. > To cancel > registrations, one must sit and press contiunously the cancel button, > some of the notes are dead because of electrical faulty. This certainly could be the fault of the most recent builder... maybe. = How recent was the restoration? Was it really a restoration, or were the = reeds cleaned? If the electrical system was replaced in the last five or even = ten or fifteen years, and it is now acting up, then perhaps there's some = shoddy workmanship. But perhaps at the time the electrical system was working = well and just needed a little contact cleaning. Perhaps that's all it needs now. Just yesterday I heard a presentation by a church saying the organ = had been restored. They had the builder get up and speak and it turns out = what actually happened was a pedal reed stop was added, the pipes were cleaned, = and a new rectifier was installed. Hardly a restoration. But it was all the organ needs right now. > The > stops...there is one 16 reed knob on the pedal for the hugue 16' > trombone, which made me think "now there should be a borrow from the > swell 16 Waldhorn to give some pedal reed variety" This might not be very easy to accomplish. The Waldhorn would have to be placed on unit action, major work done to the console (though perhaps not = if it now has an easily-added-to solid state system). Anything can be done, but it might not be as easy as stuffing a knob onto the console. The only other question is, did you listen to the organ from the pews as well as from the console? I've found myself dissing many an organ for sounding too harsh or out of balance or whatever, and then been reminded that you have to hear it from the listeners ears, for whom the organ was designed. In most cases, I've found out that its just right from down = there. > So what gives? Why do builders get a good organ with a good history > and make it unbearable? I'm sure this happens from time to time (and I have seen it), but more = often I think builders take a an organ that has been around long enough to understand its weaknesses, and try to find economical ways of improving on = the weaknesses without taking away the strengths. The A-S at the mormon tabernacle being a good example. The recent renovation changed that organ = around quite a bit. I've never heard it in person before or after, but everyone seems happy. > > Desiree' > > >From Desiree' > T. Desiree' Hines > Chicago, IL 60610 > ---------------------------- > For Compositions by Desiree' > Frog Music Press > www.frogmusic.com > ------------------------------- > FOR CONCERTS BY DESIREE' > http://concertartist.info/bios/hines.html > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com A.B.Lawrence Pipe Organ Service PO Box 111 Burlington, VT 05402 (802)578-3936 Visit our website at www.ablorgans.com
(back) Subject: Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! From: "T.Desiree' Hines" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 06:22:02 -0700 (PDT) Ok Ok Dont get me wrong, its a beautiful instrument, on which I had 30 minutes = to play before the service, in order to get things set up. And I do think = a second rate company did the work. They will remain nameless here. I = actually had no time to test the registrations to see what they sounded = like. So, time or lack of, did not foster the ability to sit and really = see what blended. And ofcourse, a swell battery will always be long resonator reeds, usually = complete at 16, 8, 8, 4, but what I was noticing was that the LR's on this = swell were very powerful...VERY. And that battery was indeed based on a 16 = waldhorn, which in many cases is beautiful smooth and just right, as in = the organ at First Unitarian Church Chicago. As far as putting the 16 Waldhorn on the pedal, what I did was use the = swell to pedal coupler and used the swell to great 4' coupler, so it would = play at the desired pitches on both, along with the swell 8 4 2 stops. Both organs at Mt Carmel are beautiful. The Visser is just still my = favorite. Its just sumptuous! The 16 fagott on the pedal has so much = beauty and soars thru the room with a beautiful gravitas. And the strings! = OMG! the Skinner is also very beautiful and I like it. Its just a true = Skinner complete with a harp and celesta that takes a few hours to test = the tonal intricacies. From Desiree' T. Desiree' Hines Chicago, IL 60610 ---------------------------- For Compositions by Desiree' Frog Music Press www.frogmusic.com ------------------------------- FOR CONCERTS BY DESIREE' http://concertartist.info/bios/hines.html --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today!
(back) Subject: TV Advertisement From: "David Baker" <email@example.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 09:40:06 -0400 The outside is St. Bartholomew's on Park Avenue in NYC. The interior is not the main church but may be a chapel; it looks much too small to be the main church. I suspect the organ music is in fact the mighty Aeolian Skinner. David Baker > Subject: Tv advertisement > From: "Daniel Hopkins" <firstname.lastname@example.org> > Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2004 10:00:28 -0300 > > does anyone know what church is used for the new tv advertisement > for the Royal Bank of Scotland > at first it shows a fairly nice church Exterior then it goes inside > with what seems like a fairly nice sounding pipe organ( it sounds > = real) > then the ceremony takes place as the groom goes off on his own > explanation of what" I do "means > > anyone know what church this is at? > > Danielwh
(back) Subject: Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! From: "John L. Speller" <email@example.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 08:51:16 -0500 It would have been normal for Skinner to borrow the Waldhorn onto the = Pedal, and I suspect it may have been that way originally. It is very = difficult, however, to add additional drawknobs to an original Skinner = console, so unless they have gutted the whole thing and solid stated it, = they would probably have kept the number of knobs the same. If they = wanted to make tonal changes, they might therfore have used the Waldhorn = knob for something else -- a Pedal 4ft. stop or something like that -- = that they wished to add. =20 John Speller ----- Original Message -----=20 From: T.Desiree' Hines=20 To: PipeChat=20 Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 8:22 AM Subject: Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe = organs?! And ofcourse, a swell battery will always be long resonator reeds, = usually complete at 16, 8, 8, 4, but what I was noticing was that the = LR's on this swell were very powerful...VERY. And that battery was = indeed based on a 16 waldhorn, which in many cases is beautiful smooth = and just right, as in the organ at First Unitarian Church Chicago.=20 As far as putting the 16 Waldhorn on the pedal, what I did was use the = swell to pedal coupler and used the swell to great 4' coupler, so it = would play at the desired pitches on both, along with the swell 8 4 2 = stops.=20
(back) Subject: Re: What did you play today? From: "Alan Freed" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 11:03:24 -0400 On 9/26/04 10:17 PM, "Beau Surratt" <Beau.Surratt@theatreorgans.com> = wrote: > I've been wanting a position in a liturgical church for a long > time and I got this one through some connections I have. The organ is a > brand new Rodgers 927 3 Manual which I am actually enjoying playing. The > acoustics in the church are very favorable. The parish is a very active, > vibrant ELCA parish that sticks to a very traditional liturgy- straight > from the LBW. Congratulations on the new bench; I hope your enjoyment is immense. Alan www.stlukesnyc.org
(back) Subject: Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! From: <KurtvonS@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 11:12:09 EDT In a message dated 9/27/04 8:53:58 AM US Eastern Standard Time, email@example.com writes: It would have been normal for Skinner to borrow the Waldhorn onto the = Pedal, and I suspect it may have been that way originally. I remember playing the fine Skinner, and the Swell 16' Waldhorn was not borrowed into the Pedal. I thought it unusual at the time....
(back) Subject: Skinner organs and 16' Waldhorns From: "Daniel Hancock" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 10:28:17 -0500 There is an altered 1926 Skinner organ south of Springfield near Branson, Missouri in the Williams Memorial Chapel on the College of the Ozarks campus. The organ has been rebuilt more than once, but retains much of it's original specification and character. You can compare the original and current specification from the Jonathan Ambrosino webpage at http://homepage.mac.com/glarehead/ambrosino/p-pointlookout.html. From this link, click on "Stoplist" to see both specifications. =20 In both specifications, the 16' Waldhorn is present int the swell, but never in the pedal. However, if a smaller 16' reed is desired, there are enough tonal resources otherwise to use the Swell as a pedal division extension. =20 Daniel H. Springfield, Missouri =20 -----Original Message----- From: email@example.com [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org] On Behalf Of KurtvonS@aol.com Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 10:12 AM To: email@example.com Subject: Re: OK...what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipeorgans?! =20 In a message dated 9/27/04 8:53:58 AM US Eastern Standard Time, firstname.lastname@example.org writes: It would have been normal for Skinner to borrow the Waldhorn onto the Pedal, and I suspect it may have been that way originally.=20 I remember playing the fine Skinner, and the Swell 16' Waldhorn was not borrowed into the Pedal. I thought it unusual at the time....
(back) Subject: Re: organ and choral music of Richard Purvis From: "M Fox" <email@example.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 09:18:09 -0700 I can't resist adding The Ballad of Judas Iscariot, a Cantata for solo voices, mixed chorus, organ, violin, two harps and celesta. (Elkan-Vogel, 1949). I have the choral/organ score, wherein Purvis suggests accompanying = with organ and piano, the pianist taking the harp/celesta parts. I've = never heard it performed, but the third movement starts with the biggest, = warmest tune Purvis ever wrote. MAF
(back) Subject: Congrats, Beau! From: <DERREINETOR@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 12:26:51 EDT Beau wrote: "I've been wanting a position in a liturgical church for a long time" Congratulations, Beau. Enjoy yourself and enjoy the Liturgy. Pax, Bill H. SJE, Boston.
(back) Subject: slighty OT: fradulent paypal "phishing" From: "Liquescent" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 09:45:22 -0700 Listlings, I received in my business email this morning a deceptive notice supposedly from PayPal, asking me to "confirm" my account status by filling in account details, including credit card numbers etc. etc. etc. Only problem is, I don't have a PayPal account. Some on the list might, or may have in the past. Clicking on the link brings up a page that, for all purposes, is identical to PayPal's and even includes links to other, legitimate, PayPal sites. The only way I could tell something was amiss was by the web URL; when I tried to go to the home page of the address, it asked if I wanted to download the required Korean character set to read the page (!). If you're not familiar with this kind of scam , it's known as "phishing" and is unfortunately becoming more and more widespread. There are even reports of malicious scripts that can be loaded on top of legitimate web pages to send information such as credit card numbers and passwords to Internet thieves. Anyway, be really suspcious of *anyone* asking for credit card information by email. Also, any legitimate site asking for such data will have an "https:" (for secure) in the web address or URL. Just thought I'd pass this along. I know Bud uses PayPal and wouldn't want anyone taken in by this. Jim Stanley Church of the Angels Pasadena CA USA ----
(back) Subject: Re: WAS what about Pipe organ builders messing up good pipe organs?! From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 12:45:50 EDT Dear Monty: You are soooooo right about the way some organists play, fast faster, loud louder but miss the neuances of accents which is at the very heart of musicallity. This seems to be a by product of the exuberance of youth but not always, some just never grow up. Builders not only should take great care in the correct placement of resources such as mutations but also the balance of mixture work to the plenum. Even great builders occasionally get the composition and balance of these wrong. I know time is money, but an extra day or two is time well spent getting it = right. To err on the softer side is better than the otherway around. I've heard too many of these blow away the plenum. Mixtures should make their presence known for sure, but they don't need to scrape images off tiffany glass windows. Live accoustics also is an asset not a liability to good organ and choral music. I hate dead rooms with a purple passion. off the soap box, Ron Severin
(back) Subject: hurricane report from Mulberry, FL From: "Liquescent" <email@example.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 10:44:02 -0700 From my sister (they own the major drug store in Mulberry): "We're O.K. No damage at home, but the roof is off the drug store, so it is a mess. Of course there are no roofer available. Everything is wet, computers, cash registers, prescriptions, etc. So we're kinda busy right now." Mulberry also lost their sewage-treatment plant, and had raw sewage in the streets, so that's a real health hazard, and is going to be a mess to clean up. Prayers requested ... she and her husband are both in their seventies, and still working full-time at the drug store. Bud
(back) Subject: stoplist fee? From: <BlueeyedBear@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 13:58:18 -0400 i recently contacted a large organ building company requesting a stoplist = of an organ they installed in the 1920s. i just received a reply stating = they will send it if i send them $50. this seems abnormally high to me. = is this the going rate for a photocopy of something in their archives? scot
(back) Subject: RE: stoplist fee? From: "Daniel Hancock" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 13:14:02 -0500 I recently obtained a copy of the contract and specification for a Reuter organ of 1923--free of charge--and they mailed it to me. The president of the company addressed the issue. =20 If it costs them $50 in labor to go dig those records out and mail them to you, then their archives ought to be better organized. Surely they could email you a pdf file, too, for not much effort. Daniel H. Springfield, Missouri -----Original Message----- From: email@example.com [mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org] On Behalf Of BlueeyedBear@aol.com Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 12:58 PM To: email@example.com Subject: stoplist fee? i recently contacted a large organ building company requesting a stoplist of an organ they installed in the 1920s. i just received a reply stating they will send it if i send them $50. this seems abnormally high to me. is this the going rate for a photocopy of something in their archives? scot