PipeChat Digest #5174 - Thursday, February 24, 2005
 
Seeking the Wisdom of the Knowledgeable
  by "dont_b_flat88@juno.com" <dont_b_flat88@juno.com>
Re: Seeking the Wisdom of the Knowledgeable
  by <RonSeverin@aol.com>
RE: Allen Organ Advertisment
  by "William` Chapman" <wmgrantchapman@msn.com>
RE: WurliTzer Hour at Radio City Music Hall
  by "Will Light" <will.light@btinternet.com>
Re: Finances
  by "Merry Foxworth" <m.foxworth@verizon.net>
Re: Allen Organ Advertisement
  by "Richard Huggins" <huggins88@yahoo.com>
Bach and Skinner
  by "Charlie Lester" <crl@137.com>
Karg-Elert Chorale
  by "Daniel Hancock" <dhancock@brpae.com>
Re: Finances
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca>
RE: Bach and Skinner
  by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
Re: Bach & Skinner
  by <SWF12262@aol.com>
RE: Bach & Skinner
  by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
Clarity - it's in the ear of the beholder
  by "Randy Terry" <randy@peacham.homeip.net>
Blended worship music
  by "Randy Terry" <randy@peacham.homeip.net>
 

(back) Subject: Seeking the Wisdom of the Knowledgeable From: "dont_b_flat88@juno.com" <dont_b_flat88@juno.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:38:27 GMT     I am new to pipechat and am living in Montana.   I am more into piano tuning and pipe organ tuning; have done a little = repair.   Two questions:   1. Who do I contact to or what basic book can I purchase to learn more = about the wiring of pipe organs?   2. I have a client who had their pipe organ console moved. The people = moving it didn't do things correctly. (a) When you turn the organ on, all the stops play as you press the = crescendo? (right) pedal (the left pedal opens the shudders). This is = even with the stops off. You can hear the stops clicking as you press the = pedal (which is attached to a cylinder with a brass/metal plate and brass = "feelers." (b) The chimes no longer play from the keyboard; however, their is = power to the switch box and I can play the tones pushing on the switches. = The power for the chimes is connected to a rotatry switch on the console. 3. (a) What do I do to reverse the situation in paragraph 2a above? My = analytical-logial mind says that I only have to switch the power wires = mounted on a cross brace in the back of the organ. However, wisdom tells = me to ask those with more knowledge than I.   (b) Once (a) above is corrected, will this allow the chimes to be = played or will I have to replace the rotary switch or do some other simple = "I-never-thought-of-that" correction?   Thanks,   D. Eason, Jr. Eason's Piano & Pipe 2975 Bishop Court Helena, MT 59602 (406) 439-1323 (Cell)   ___________________________________________________________________ Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand. Now includes pop-up blocker! Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!    
(back) Subject: Re: Seeking the Wisdom of the Knowledgeable From: <RonSeverin@aol.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 16:57:31 EST   Don:   If I understand you're 1a QUESTION correctly the stops come on when you open the Crescendo pedal on the right. If this is the case the organ is working properly there. You don't touch the Cresc. pedal except to make sure it is in the off position (Closed) then there shouldn't be any stops sounding.   The Chime question is simple. Check to see if the chime cable to the manual (usually the Great) has been cut. If it has no matter what you turn on they won't play until reconnected.   If the console was involved in a move, colored 50 pair cable may have been used. You do have to know which pair is 1 and 2, 3 and 4 up to 100. If you don't know that leave the organ alone until a qualified person in the organ repair business can make time to look into it. Cotton coated cable has been outlawed for reconnection.   Shouldn't the church recall the original people involved in moving the console? I would think so. This has gotten more than one wanabe organ man into real hot water. If you are that new to this, leave well enough alone. Touching up a rank or two of pipes is one thing, but I think you are way over your head here.   Ron Severin    
(back) Subject: RE: Allen Organ Advertisment From: "William` Chapman" <wmgrantchapman@msn.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:22:03 -0500   From all the dust that has been kicked up about an advertisement some say = is from Allen I am left wondering why nobody has pointed out that Allen owns:   Legacy Audio and Allen Audio. http://www.allenaudio.com/Pages/About_Allen_Audio.html     Grant   >From: "Stanley Lowkis" <Lowkis@theatreorgans.com> >Reply-To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> >To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org>, "Dominic >Scullion"<dominicscullion@email.com> >Subject: RE: Allen Organ Advertisment >Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:28:34 -0600 > >-----Original Message----- >From: "Dominic Scullion" <dominicscullion@email.com> >To: "'PipeChat'" <pipechat@pipechat.org> >Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:45:07 -0000 >Subject: RE: Allen Organ Advertisment > > > I don't think that day will ever come. > > DS > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: pipechat@pipechat.org [mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org] On Behalf = Of > > ScottFop@aol.com > > > > > > We don't need to do that. In time, when they are selling less and = less > > organs and people only want speakers and input boxes, they'll get the > > hint. > >How about using guitar amps and speakers for the Allen Organ? >Would it be cheaper and have the organ blend better with the ensemble? > >http://www.fender.com/products/show.php?seek=3Dbassamplifiers_rumbleseries=   > >These look pretty good. > >Stan Lowkis > >a Fender/Allen? > > > >****************************************************************** >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> >List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> >List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org> >   _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! =   http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/    
(back) Subject: RE: WurliTzer Hour at Radio City Music Hall From: "Will Light" <will.light@btinternet.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:27:46 -0000   Glad you enjoyed hearing the Radio City Wurlitzer in concert. One thing = in your report puzzled me though. When I took my family to the last = performance of the Christmas Show on January 2nd, both of the consoles were working = OK. Did they not use both at the concert?   Will Light Coventry UK   -----Original Message----- From: pipechat@pipechat.org [mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org] On Behalf Of mack02445 BIG SNIP! Thank you Thank you NYTOS=20 and Radio City Music Hall for making this day memorable for me, at=20 least. I only hope it will not be another 26 years before we hear the=20 organ solo again and hopefully both consoles will be working then.   Cheers, Mack From Boston      
(back) Subject: Re: Finances From: "Merry Foxworth" <m.foxworth@verizon.net> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:46:34 -0500   They say over 50% of bankruptcies are a result of medical bills. It is an absolute travesty in the US that people are sent into bankruptcy because of medical bills they can't pay. This is different from ordinary credit card debt. This would not happen in practically any other country.   The banks and mortgage companies are far too powerful. They get away with many, many ways of ripping off the consumer because Congress allows it. We should all contact our congresspeople and urge them to pass legislation tha= t is fair to the consumer for a change.   Merry     =B4=A8=A8)) -:=A6:- =B8.=B7=B4 .=B7=B4=A8=A8)) ((=B8=B8.=B7=B4 ..=B7=B4 -:=A6:-   An excerpt from Robert Giddings "Musical Quotes and Anecdotes", published in Longman Pocket Companions: "There let the pealing organ blow, To the full-voiced choir below, In service high, and anthems clear, As may with sweetness, through mine ear, Dissolve me into ecstasies, And bring all Heav'n before mine eyes". John Milton - Il Penseroso (1632).   Merry Foxworth Open Door Realty Boston, MA 02131 617 469-4888 x207 877 865-1703 toll free http://www.opendoorrlty.com/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Baker" <dgb137@mac.com> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Monday, February 21, 2005 6:05 PM Subject: Finances     > In addition to practicing music, I practice law. My primary emphasis > is consumer bankruptcy. Organists/choir masters and people who work > for religious institutions (or otherwise rely on them financially in > some fashion) often live close to the line, financially speaking > (right, Bud?). For them, and for thousands of people in all walks of > life, the American bankruptcy system has provided a lifeline that has > helped them save their homes from foreclosure and get a "fresh start" > on their financial life. > > I tend not to pay too much attention to what's happening in Congress > because my philosophy is to cope with whatever is presented. Presently > pending before Congress, however, is a major overhaul of the bankruptcy > system that has been foisted on Congress - and all of us - by the big > credit card companies. If the present bill is passed, it looks like it > could be the end of a fair and equitable system - one that balances the > needs of consumers to get financial help, with that of creditors who > justly want to be paid what they legally are entitled to be paid. One > commentator has suggested that the pending bill would push the country > towards a major depression, if not actually into one. > > If you have financial problems or know someone who does, you need to > learn about this bill and decide for yourself whether to get involved > and let your congressman know. The religious foundation of bankruptcy > is surely familiar to us all - check out Deuteronomy 15 - so I hope > this posting is not too far off topic. > > I should say - as a matter of full disclosure - that while I think the > bill is probably a bad thing, one good thing that might come out of it > is that my fees would skyrocket! That, of course, is both good and > bad. I don't mind charging higher fees; on the other hand, the bill > might result in truly needy people being forced to do without the legal > relief that they need. > > Just thought the list should be made aware of this issue. Anybody with > questions is free to email me off list. > > David Baker > > > ****************************************************************** > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> > List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> > List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org> > >     >  
(back) Subject: Re: Allen Organ Advertisement From: "Richard Huggins" <huggins88@yahoo.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 13:01:19 -0800 (PST)   I guess I'm the op-ed opinion, but ...   I use my small Allen Renassiance in this very way. The dealer came out and installed special audio-in jacks that Allen provides, and I have a Yamaha S-80 that I run through the organ audio. On most occasions I play it from one of the organ's manuals, via the MIDI In capabilities that today's church organs have. Doing things this way addresses several important issues:   + organ audio in almost any church (from the leading mfgrs, anyway) is superior to the sanctuary audio + it is stereo + it dosn't require the sound operator to turn the system on (or for me to learn it) just so the synth can be heard (or I can practice) + the sound operator can't screw with the volume levels; my adjustingthe synth to mix well with organ sounds is easier + via MIDI I can control the synth volume with the organ's swell or great pedals + some beautiful orchestral sounds that the organ doesn't have are available, such as slow strings, an awsomely realistic flute, the tympani we don't have, and so on. It also has the pop sounds that are very useful for when we sing the contemporary music (mine's a Baptist church).   I'm classically trained and appreciate the finer organ literature and a traditional service as much as anyone. But given both the demands of some of the music we sing and given that my Allen, while excellent, is smaller than I wish, I'm glad to have the extra capabilities that the synth provides.   --Richard Huggins        
(back) Subject: Bach and Skinner From: "Charlie Lester" <crl@137.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:28:04 -0800   Those who would state that Bach cannot be played on an E. M. Skinner surely must never have played one of his instruments. Or else, just don't know how to play - period.   Sorry to be blunt, but such a statement as that is a totally ludicrous and ill-informed condemnation of his instruments.   ~ C      
(back) Subject: Karg-Elert Chorale From: "Daniel Hancock" <dhancock@brpae.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:31:10 -0600   Does anyone know where I can quickly obtain a copy of Karg-Elert's "Chora= le" or "Koral" for organ? =20 Daniel Hancock Springfield, Missouri  
(back) Subject: Re: Finances From: "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 21:00:04 -0500   Hi Merry and all our American friends.   I think that what you are seeing is the result of "The American Dream". Your legislators are all tarred by the same brush, "The Bottom Line" is the be all and end all.   Here in Canada we have a much better way, it is called Medicare. I think that it would be too revolutionary for your Congress to even think about = it.   Bob Conway     At 07:46 PM 2/23/2005, Merry wrote: >They say over 50% of bankruptcies are a result of medical bills. It is = an >absolute travesty in the US that people are sent into bankruptcy because = of >medical bills they can't pay. This is different from ordinary credit = card >debt. This would not happen in practically any other country. > >The banks and mortgage companies are far too powerful. They get away = with >many, many ways of ripping off the consumer because Congress allows it. = We >should all contact our congresspeople and urge them to pass legislation = that >is fair to the consumer for a change.      
(back) Subject: RE: Bach and Skinner From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:19:21 +1300   >Those who would state that Bach cannot be played on an E. M. Skinner surely must never have played one of his instruments. Or else, just don't know how to play - period.   No, neither of those, believe me.   >Sorry to be blunt, but such a statement as that is a totally ludicrous and ill-informed condemnation of his instruments.   Where are Skinner's clarity? Balanced Principal choruses? Clear mutations? Schnarrwerck reeds? Low pressures? Sensitive action? Clear Pedal divisions that don't need coupling? Casework to focus the sound? Crisp voicing? An understanding of Mixtures?   I could go on but, unless I've been very sadly misinformed by what I've seen, read and heard, these are just some of the aspects of Skinner organs that don't exist. G.Donald Harrison, as I understand it, made some vast improvements, but (again as I understand it) the organs were no longer Skinners but Aeolian-Skinners.   Of course it's physically possible to play Bach on any instrument where = the compass is adequate, but that's not what I was talking about.   Ross        
(back) Subject: Re: Bach & Skinner From: <SWF12262@aol.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:00:53 EST   >I wonder if the same is true in the USA? From my own very limited experience of American instruments, I >wonder if Skinner has been grossly over-rated tonally? He certainly contributed nothing to ordinary organs >for the classical music of the organ, as far as I can judge, but tried to create something symphonic of >very little real musical use, orchestral if you like but hopeless for Bach or even for accompanying choirs >or congregations.   Dear Ross, I would recommend to you the CDs of the IV/65 Opus 327 Skinner at St. = Luke's Episcopal Church, Evanston, Illinois. _http://www.stlukesevanston.org/6_music/6_5_organ.html_ = (http://www.stlukesevanston.org/6_music/6_5_organ.html) While it is certainly not the ideal instrument for playing Bach with historically accurate registrations, it accompanies the choir and = congregational singing exceedingly well. I took lessons on this organ in the late 1970s = and early 1980s, before "she" was restored, and playing there was always the = high point of my week! The instrument was completely restored in the 1990s, = and sounds better than ever. By the way, Opus 327 is named Lucille! Best regards, Steve Steven Weyand Folkers St. Lambert RC Church Skokie, IL  
(back) Subject: RE: Bach & Skinner From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 18:39:34 +1300   >I would recommend to you the CDs of the IV/65 Opus 327 Skinner at St. Luke's Episcopal Church, Evanston, Illinois.=A0=20   I'm happy to be convinced...............   >While it is certainly not the=A0ideal instrument for playing Bach with historically accurate registrations, it accompanies the choir and congregational singing exceedingly well.=A0   Ah, but that's a different thing................ Here, too, I know some instruments that have some fine and useful stops, but even so the organ remains pretty hopeless for all but a very limited repoertoire. I can = think of the IV/57 Norman & Beard from 1906 in our Wellington Town Hall. Magnificent for full-blast Lemmens, Meyerbeer et al., but utterly = hopeless for Bach except the soft flutes and they very quickly become exceedingly boring in recital as they are so quiet.=20   Ross    
(back) Subject: Clarity - it's in the ear of the beholder From: "Randy Terry" <randy@peacham.homeip.net> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 21:47:41 -0800     -----Original Message----- From: pipechat@pipechat.org [mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org] On Behalf Of TheShieling Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2005 6:19 PM To: 'PipeChat' Subject: RE: Bach and Skinner     Where are Skinner's clarity? Balanced Principal choruses? Clear mutations? Schnarrwerck reeds? Low pressures? Sensitive action? Clear Pedal divisions that don't need coupling? Casework to focus the sound? Crisp voicing? An understanding of Mixtures?   Ross _______________________________________________   Having played several large pre GDH Skinners, these instruments do indeed possess a real clarity upon which one can play Bach without apology.   As a matter of fact, one could play a Bach fugue on the 3/15 Skinner at my home church with the only stops above 8' being two pitiful excuses for 4' flutes, and each voice could be heard clearly. I'll admit that to do so = is to torture one's ears for obvious reasons, but nevertheless, Bach fugues could be accurately rendered.   The larger Skinner instruments such as St. Luke's in Evanston are in a totally different league and while you can't get them to sound like a neo-baroque or neo-classic organ (who'd want that, anyway, when those instruments abound in various degrees of quality,) you can play Bach = pieces with reasonable, exciting authenticity. I've heard lots of recordings of instruments associated with Bach, and organ builders provided the = organists of the day with very telling tierces both as individual stops and in the mixtures, and they used them liberally! These instruments are a far cry = from the lean, clean, sounds I was taught were appropriate for Bach in college.   In regard to the pasted text above, I think I understand the point, but = I'd be interested in knowing where the author's tonal interests are and how = much they play into his comments.   My point is that clarity of tone comes in many different forms - just because an EMS ensemble is a far cry from a proper neo-classic one doesn't mean the clarity doesn't exist. Just my opinion!!     +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Randy Terry Music Minister The Episcopal Church of St. Peter Redwood City, California        
(back) Subject: Blended worship music From: "Randy Terry" <randy@peacham.homeip.net> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:06:57 -0800   Richard Higgins wrote: I'm classically trained and appreciate the finer organ literature and a traditional service as much as anyone. But given both the demands of some of the music we sing and given that my Allen, while excellent, is smaller than I wish, I'm glad to have the extra capabilities that the synth provides. ___________________________   I just want to thank you for being willing to accept/embrace/admit the = fact that not all of us find contemporary church music to be totally terrible = and only offer it under duress!   I am a confirmed Episcopalian, and have worked almost exclusively in Episcopal churches. I am finding lately that I am greatly enjoying exploring the resources of our supplement to our official 1982 Hymnal, = LEVAS II. It includes many American gospel and contemporary songs, and many = hymns and spiritual songs from the African-American tradition. I've enjoyed reading the prompts about the improvisatory nature of the music and how to elaborate from the printed notation to provide a more stylistically = accurate performance.   I am familiar with many of the songs from hearing them as a child in my grandmother's country church, but it is as though a fresh breeze has found me and improving my skills at performing in a style that is different from the Anglo-American skills I have practiced for so long is great. Last Sunday I did a very traditional "Anglican" service as far as the music = goes, and I was quite bored during my run-throughs getting ready. This week we are doing some old gospel favorites and I will use the piano, and it is a lot more interesting practicing these than what I know so well. I don't want to dump my beloved Anglican traditional music, but I sure as h*** = want to expand on it!   +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Randy Terry Music Minister The Episcopal Church of St. Peter Redwood City, California