PipeChat Digest #5178 - Friday, February 25, 2005
 
RE: Ernest M. Skinner
  by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
RE: MOVEMENT IN CHURCH
  by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
PipeChat IRC this evening,
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca>
there have always been "orchestral" organs
  by "Randy Terry" <randy@peacham.homeip.net>
Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias??
  by <RVScara@aol.com>
Re: Blended Worship
  by <Keys4bach@aol.com>
Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias??
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
Isles
  by "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net>
Just way too Catholic
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
Re: Blended Worship
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
Organs and Organists online update Feb 26
  by "John Foss" <harkat@kat.forthnet.gr>
Re: June, 1988 "Diapason"
  by "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com>
Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias??
  by "Alicia Zeilenga" <azeilenga@theatreorgans.com>
Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias??
  by "firman1" <firman1@prodigy.net>
Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias??
  by "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com>
Re: MOVEMENT IN CHURCH
  by "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net>
Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias??
  by "Mura Kievman" <mkievman@nyc.rr.com>
Piece Search
  by <AEolianSkinner@aol.com>
RE: Piece Search
  by "Randy Terry" <randy@peacham.homeip.net>
Re: orchestral voices in the organ
  by "firman1" <firman1@prodigy.net>
Re: Piece Search
  by <AEolianSkinner@aol.com>
RE: orchestral voices in the organ
  by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz>
Re: orchestral voices in the organ
  by "firman1" <firman1@prodigy.net>
Odell In NYC on Clearing House?
  by <Oboe32@aol.com>
RE: Ernest M. Skinner and Bach
  by "Richard E. Malone" <remalone@btinternet.com>
 

(back) Subject: RE: Ernest M. Skinner From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:05:19 +1300   >=A0 His reasons for adding orchestral voices to the organ were purly = musical ones. The organ as an instrument has always been associated with the orchestra, even before Skinners time there were orchestral voices in the organ.=20   Sure there were vague imitations, but I'm not sure the organ should even = try to imitate orchestral voices. The organ predates the orchestra and has a particular genius of its own. Even the best organ voices are only an imitation of the real thing and it seems silly want to make an = imitation.   >Some people might say that this association between the organ and = orchestra is a stigma but I say that it is one of the instruments greatest assets. Many of the great composers of organ music wrote for the intrument = because of this asset.   Who, for example? =A0 >Now as for E.M and Bach, Skinner always said that if Bach were alive in Skinner's day he would have embraced the Skinner organ.=20   That's easy to say, but would be impossible to prove.   >He mentions that Bach was unsatisfied with the organ of his time and usually augmented it's sound with orchestral instruments.   Oh no. There were no Clarinets, Oboes, Cor anglais, French Horns, Tubas, Trumpets, strings etc.etc. as we know them and even as were in 18thC orchestras.   >it is a fact that Bach wasn't totally happy with the organ of his time. =     Again, I wonder how you say this.   If Skinner thought the organ lacked colour, then he nothing of the use = of mutations, short-length reeds, the Cornet, chorus mixtures and so on.=20   >Lastly, I just can't understand why organists can't be glad for the instrument they play on and adapt the music they play accordingly. Why = are we like this? Always wishing for something else.=20   That might be so for some but I, for one, would be very happy indeed = just to have even a 2m of 15 stops locally, instead of the 12-yr-old lousy electronic that everyone else thinks wonderful and which I play for = services several times a month for not a cent financial reward.=20   >You wouldn't go into an art museum and look at a Monet and say "gee, = that's nice but I wish it were a Gauguin instead".=20   Sure, much preferring Monet. On the other hand, I'd go and see a pile of Picassos and others like him and think, YUK, I'd better go somewhere = else as I can't stand this stuff as it reminds me of Stockhausen.   Ross    
(back) Subject: RE: MOVEMENT IN CHURCH From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:23:13 +1300   >"The sound of footsteps making their way to the altar ought to be considered a joyous event!"   Oh yes, vraiment! When we built a new church in my first parish and a = group wanted carpet "to soften the footfalls", I made the comment that the sound of entering feet is wonderful. The church was completed in 1983. There is still not a square inch of carpet, but instead thick ceramic tiles over 6 inches of concrete.   Ross    
(back) Subject: PipeChat IRC this evening, From: "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 15:24:51 -0500   All members of PipeChat are invited to join us in the PipeChat IRC any Friday and Monday evening - beginning at 9.00 PM Eastern Time.   To find out more about the Chat room, or how to get into it, go to PipeChat-L web page at http://www.pipechat.org/   You will find out all you need to know to join us.   Tonight at 9.00 PM, - I hope that we will see you there.   Cheers,   Bob Conway     ****************************************************************** "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org>    
(back) Subject: there have always been "orchestral" organs From: "Randy Terry" <randy@peacham.homeip.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 12:26:10 -0800       -----Original Message----- From: pipechat@pipechat.org [mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org] On Behalf Of TheShieling Sent: Friday, February 25, 2005 12:05 PM To: 'PipeChat' Subject: RE: Ernest M. Skinner   Sure there were vague imitations, but I'm not sure the organ should even = try to imitate orchestral voices. The organ predates the orchestra and has a particular genius of its own. Even the best organ voices are only an imitation of the real thing and it seems silly want to make an imitation. >>>>>>>   Hey Ross - organ builders HAVE been imitating orchestral instruments for years - Check the web for baroque organs by Trost - Maybe the Osiris Stoplist Archive.   Bach surely knew these Trost organs. They have strings that sound like a baroque 'Cello played non vibrato, they have glockenspiels, and flutes = that sound quite a bit like transverse flutes of the day.   Randy Terry :-)        
(back) Subject: Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias?? From: <RVScara@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 15:30:24 EST   Many R/Catholics are familiar only with the Schubert which is frequently requested for weddings and funerals. If I ask which they want (Schubert = or Bach-Gounod) most look puzzled. I prefer to sing the Bach but guest = soloists always pick Schubert, maybe because most cut if off at the end of the = first part. They memorize that verse but massacre the second. In my 57 years of =   playing I have not heard of any official prohibition to either since the = Latin words (at least in my editions) are similar and follow the Hail Mary = prayer pretty well. Some Ave Maria English language "translations" were not = faithful to the prayer words and that may have caused some individual clergyman to =   object.  
(back) Subject: Re: Blended Worship From: <Keys4bach@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 15:46:18 EST   In a message dated 2/25/2005 2:54:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, nijhuis@email.com writes:   "As the Deer" - Martin Nystrom - Psalm 42:1-2     nor is this truly a contemporary hymn any more.......it is included in = many a hymnbook. certainly a cont 'Style" song but not anything heard on CCM anymore. just adding fuel dale in Florida  
(back) Subject: Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias?? From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 15:55:51 +0000   On 2/25/05 5:42 PM, "Adrianne Schutt" <maybe@pipcom.com> wrote:   > "He said there are 2 Ave Marias, one by Schubert and one by someone = else, and > the catholic church only allows one of them,   One has tune by Gounod, built on a Bach accompaniment. Starts on mi: me, fa, fa, sol, re, me.   The other is Schubert. Starts on do: do, ti, do, me, re, do.   I can't imagine either being rejected by any Roman church. Non-Roman churches, in the West, generally avoid both (but many are the = exceptions)..   Alan      
(back) Subject: Isles From: "First Christian Church of Casey, Illinois" <kzrev@rr1.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 15:03:15 -0600   Terry said: Someone once said when discussing the virtues of [un]carpeted isles:   Terry--at least for tropical isles, I prefer them to have sandy beaches instead of carpet. For aisles in churches.................... ;>)   Dennis Steckley   "Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened."--Dr. Seuss        
(back) Subject: Just way too Catholic From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:31:22 +0000   On 2/25/05 7:31 PM, "Jan Nijhuis" <nijhuis@email.com> wrote:   > As for the stink-pots and candles; Oh, man, that's just way to Catholic..= .. =20 Reminds me of a two-liner that Pastor dropped into his sermon last Sunday (on John 3, "rebirth," you understand). He spoke of feeding time at our soup kitchen; there was a new volunteer helping with the serving.   Volunteer (to Pastor): =B3Are you born again?=B2 Pastor: =B3Oh, yes! When I was baptized.=B2 Volunteer: =B3Oh, that=B9s catholic!=B2 Pastor: =B3Yes MA=B9AM!=B2   Alan              
(back) Subject: Re: Blended Worship From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 17:20:30 +0000   On 2/25/05 7:53 PM, "Jan Nijhuis" <nijhuis@email.com> wrote:   > When you mix in your modern blended hymn, do you mention the scriptural = text? > (e.g. "As the Deer" - Martin Nystrom - Psalm 42:1-2)   Excellent advice and example, Jan. We try to do that just about all the time. Way to GO!   Alan  
(back) Subject: Organs and Organists online update Feb 26 From: "John Foss" <harkat@kat.forthnet.gr> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 00:30:41 +0200   We have updated http://www.organsandorganistsonline.com/ with music by Buxtehude (Prelude and Fugue in G minor) Bach (Heut Triumphiret Gottes = Sohn BWV 630) and the Trumpet Voluntary by John Stanley recorded on the = Wadsworth organ, now in St Peter's Collegiate Church, Ruthin but originally built in =   1898 for the Concert Hall of The Royal Manchester College of Music (to the =   design of Dr. James Kendrick Pyne). It remained there until 1938, when it was sold to Heaton Moor Congregational Church. St. Peter's Church, Ruthin, acquired the organ in 1998, Stephen Bicknell being appointed to design a new case for the organ and the contract for = the rebuilding of the instrument being awarded to Henry Willis & Sons Ltd, = under the Direction of David Wyld. The rebuilt organ was dedicated by The Bishop =   of St. Asaph on the 26th of July 2003 and opened on Friday 5th September 2003 by Olivier Latry, Organiste Titulaire de Notre-Dame de Paris. Philip Smith, Organist & Director of Music at The Church, plays music by Buxtehude, Bach and the John Stanley "Trumpet Voluntary." From 1990-94 Philip was Assistant Organist of St. Asaph Cathedral and as such, played = the organ for the enthronement of the 10th Archbishop of Wales. In November = 1994 he was appointed as Organist & Director of Music at The Collegiate Church = of St. Peter in Ruthin, and in 2002 he was awarded The Archbishop of Wales' Award for Church Music for services to Church Music in Wales. Another addition this week is a link to the website of St James Church, Sydney http://www.stjameschurchsydney.org.au/Music/index.asp Their weekly recital series starts on March 2nd with an organ recital by David Drury, Director of Music at St James. Hearing David play for the Sunday service at St James, and his riveting performance of the Toccata = and Fugue in D minor at Sydney Opera House last September to a full house = (some 3,000 people - repeated again in the evening) alongside Sarah Kim's spellbinding performance of Bach's 2nd Trio Sonata and Naji Hakim's = "Homage to Stravinsky" were amongst the musical highlights of my visit last year = to Australia. Sarah Kim is "organ scholar" at St James. Another organist playing in the series is Andrej Kouznetsov, who I met at = St Andrew's Cathedral and recorded playing the Reger Passacaglia and Fugue in = D minor for O & O O. Alas, the competition from the cleaners was such that = it has rendered the recording virtually unusable. Regrettable, as Andre is another outstanding young organist. Alistair Nelson is also amongst the recitalists to be heard. So if you are in Sydney don't overlook this fine weekly musical offering.   John Foss http://www.organsandorganistsonline.com/ http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/orgofftop/      
(back) Subject: Re: June, 1988 "Diapason" From: "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:44:59 -0600   Richard Ditewig wrote:   > does anyone out there have the June, 1988 issue of "The Diapason"? > I'm looking for a letter to the editor by William Wrenn, a student of > Claire Coci.   You can most likely get a photocopy of the letter by writing to the editorial office of the Diapason. I had success with this years ago, obtaining information on a then-new, but now defunct instrument, from the 1930's.   ns    
(back) Subject: Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias?? From: "Alicia Zeilenga" <azeilenga@theatreorgans.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:48:22 -0600   WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?!   I guess I missed the first post, but both are acceptible in the Catholic Church (as well as a whole schlew of others).   What MAY be the case is the use of a poem by someone, idr whom, as the text. It begins "Ave Maria, Listen to a Prayer."   I have heard of priests insisting that the "Sancta Maria" part be sung and not just the first half, but my church is pretty liberal about the whole thing.   Alicia Zeilenga "Santa Caecilia, ora pro nobis"     -----Original Message----- From: Alan Freed <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 15:55:51 +0000 Subject: Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias??   > On 2/25/05 5:42 PM, "Adrianne Schutt" <maybe@pipcom.com> wrote: > > > "He said there are 2 Ave Marias, one by Schubert and one by someone > else, and > > the catholic church only allows one of them, > > One has tune by Gounod, built on a Bach accompaniment. Starts on mi: > me, > fa, fa, sol, re, me. > > The other is Schubert. Starts on do: do, ti, do, me, re, do. > > I can't imagine either being rejected by any Roman church. Non-Roman > churches, in the West, generally avoid both (but many are the > exceptions).. > > Alan > > >      
(back) Subject: Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias?? From: "firman1" <firman1@prodigy.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:48:57 -0600   My Mom loved the Ave Maria that Andy Williams sang at Robert Kennedy's = funeral....she acquired a 45rpm record of it sold for charity. It was = Schubert's.=20 I requested the organist play it for her funeral.=20 Her protestant relatives were not amused by that or the rosary said = before Mass and said so. Fine Christians. Berley A. Firmin II
(back) Subject: Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias?? From: "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:53:28 -0600   Adrianne Schutt wrote:   > My grandfather-in-law died last Friday, and you know how dumb the > resulting whirlwind can make a person.   My condolences   > > The funeral home's liason was absolutely amazing, a truly gentle > man so suited for his job that I cannot say enough praise. During one > of the wakes, we were discussing music, and he mentioned a > conversation he'd had recently with the funeral director....quote: > "He said there are 2 Ave Marias, one by Schubert and one by someone > else, and the catholic church only allows one of them, but he didn't > know which."   There are considerably more than two, but the two solos mentioned by other posters are the two most common. The oldest surviving settings of the text generally are about half the length of later ones, setting only the biblical part of the Angelic salutation from St. Luke: "Hail Mary, full of grace: blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus". Theoretically, protestants should have little problem with that, as it is simply a statement from scripture. (Practical matters are, as we all know, sometimes not consistent with theory). Aroung the beginning of the sixteenth century, the Franciscans added what most think of as the "rest" of the Ave Maria, "Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death". A scriptural basis can be constructed for this, but most protestants would reject it.   Just to confuse things, there is a third devotion, customarily said at noon, which incorporates the scriptural text, generally called the Angelus, but sometimes, as by the choral group, Chanticleer, called "Ave Maria."   ns  
(back) Subject: Re: MOVEMENT IN CHURCH From: "Alan Freed" <acfreed0904@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 17:58:32 +0000   On 2/25/05 8:23 PM, "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> wrote:   > There is still not a square inch of carpet, but instead thick ceramic = tiles > over 6 inches of concrete.   Three cheers, and "Yes, Yes, YES!"   Alan    
(back) Subject: Re: Catholic vs non-catholic Ave Marias?? From: "Mura Kievman" <mkievman@nyc.rr.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 18:33:24 -0500   I've been a bit surprised to see some of the answers on this thread.   As a singer, I've often been asked to do the Bach-Gounod Ave Maria at funerals (also at weddings) -- at protestant churches. Never the = Schubert.   I know of an R.C. church in Brooklyn (NY) which had friends of mine = singing at weddings and funerals. The baritone did the funerals, the soprano did the weddings. Again, the Bach-Gounod was standard rep for them. They = sang it at every such service.   I am currently singing at a Dutch Reform Church in Brooklyn. While we do not make it a habit, no complaints have been made when we sing in latin -- =   we are more likely to do so in a piece where the English translation is just terribly awkward. We'll do it in English if it's feasible. But we also have been known to sing Ave Marias of various composers as well as a Magnificat or two.   When I sang at Episcopal churches in Manhattan, there never was a problem with latin ... but I was surprised to be in the same situation at the = Dutch Reform church in Brooklyn as well as the Presbyterian church, also in Brooklyn, where I sang previously.   I guess it can depend on the congregation.   By the way, our Dutch Reform Church also likes it when we sing in Hebrew.   Mura        
(back) Subject: Piece Search From: <AEolianSkinner@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 18:57:08 EST   Hey Guys, A few months ago, I put out a request for Maestoso in C Sharp Minor. = By: Louis Vierne and Arranged by Alexande Schreiner. Well, I finally got permission from Warner Brother's Publications to make a copy of it. So, = if any of yal have a copy that yal are willing to send through the internet or = xerox it and send it by snail mail, I would very very thankful. Thank you.   Best Regards, Gregory Hinson    
(back) Subject: RE: Piece Search From: "Randy Terry" <randy@peacham.homeip.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:13:44 -0800     ________________________________________ From: pipechat@pipechat.org On Behalf Of AEolianSkinner@aol.com Subject: Piece Search   =A0=A0=A0=A0A few months ago, I put out a request for Maestoso in C Sharp M= inor. By: Louis Vierne and Arranged by Alexande Schreiner.=A0 Well, I finally got permission from Warner Brother's Publications to make a copy of it.=A0 So, = if any of yal have a copy that yal are willing to send through the internet or xerox it and send it by snail mail, I would very very thankful.=A0 Thank yo= u.=20 =A0 Best Regards, Gregory Hinson =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D   I have that piece separately in "octavoish" form in my library, and I have never played it. I have inherited three music libraries from organist-teachers, and I bet I have duplicates. If you would like to have an original copy, I will gladly give it to you if you promise to learn it <hehe.> =20   If you will contact me privately to discuss the details, I would be delighted to see it go somewhere it will be enjoyed. I am blessed with a fabulously large library (I have a complete piano library and I am not a pianist other than to accompany!) and sometimes it is a weight around my neck. I feel like the only reason I keep a lot of stuff is so it won't end up in the landfill. Over the years I have also discovered a lot of cool stuff when the cover says "trash." I have volumes of stuff that gets playe= d on (early) American trackers as stuff that is contemporary with when those instruments were made. If any of you are seriously into that stuff contact me privately to see what you may need. =20   DON'T EVERYBODY contact me! I am not dumping off stuff. If there is a college undergrad out there I do have several complete Bach editions and a few other "must haves" that are duplicated and I would be happy to consider parting with some of this stuff - but if you want a complete edition, they are not all pristine, and for example, I know I have two of the Bach editions edited by Marcel Dupre and they would not be considered scholarly now. They were well put together from a quality standpoint.   Randy Terry      
(back) Subject: Re: orchestral voices in the organ From: "firman1" <firman1@prodigy.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 18:38:26 -0600   Lest we forget that Aeolian organs of the late 19th and early 20th = centuries were, in effect, orchestras, like the automatic mechanical music machines = we call "orchestrions" containing besides pipes imitating violins, flutes, trombones,etc., pianos, drums and other percussions. Aeolians were MADE to =   represent an orchestra in the homes of the very wealthy. My Aeolian cost $16,000 in 1912. That is when you could by a house for $1200. Berley A. Firmin II      
(back) Subject: Re: Piece Search From: <AEolianSkinner@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 20:15:28 EST   Hey Randy, If you have a original, that would be great if I could get it.   Best Regards, Gregory Hinson    
(back) Subject: RE: orchestral voices in the organ From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:25:09 +1300     >Aeolians were MADE to represent an orchestra in the homes of the very wealthy.   I think it possibly mo0re accurate to say that those instruments were made to substitute for an orchestra when none was available, just as our Town Hall's 4/57 Norman & Beard and many other concert hall organs throughout = the world. They do not represent an orchestra, but were substitutes for one = when one was not available.   Ross    
(back) Subject: Re: orchestral voices in the organ From: "firman1" <firman1@prodigy.net> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 19:29:41 -0600   Perhaps, Ross, but these people were well able to afford an orchestra. = Some employed them regularly, as well as famous organists. Maybe they preferred =   the automatic organs to the persnickety organists or orchestras...plus, = they could play the organs at any time and enjoy them in their underwear! BAF II      
(back) Subject: Odell In NYC on Clearing House? From: <Oboe32@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 20:46:29 EST   Hey Gang,   I've been quiet lately because things are so nutty at school. Our musical "Anything Goes" opens in two weeks, and its my first experience doing all = of the musical direction, so I have no life lately! Anyway...   The Organ Clearing House site has a couple interesting instruments up for sale! One is an Odell from NYC!? There is a very elegant drawknob console = with it. I've always loved Odell organs, large warm choruses, lots of charm. I = grew up listening to a wonderful 3 manual that has now been toyed with by a = local. At any rate, does anyone have any further info on the Odell offered for = sale!? I hope it stays intact!   There is also a large Wicks from Columbus, Ohio on the site. Can anyone = tell of these organs' stories?   -Peter Isherwood  
(back) Subject: RE: Ernest M. Skinner and Bach From: "Richard E. Malone" <remalone@btinternet.com> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 01:59:47 -0000   The Shieling says in response to   >it is a fact that Bach wasn't totally happy with the organ of his time<   With > Again, I wonder how you say this. <   In response I would ask: where is there a document written while he was alive, telling us what he played, how he registered, the response of the audience, and how many men he had to pay to supply wind?.   To the best of my, (and many others far more qualified) knowledge, no such document exists.   There were journals written and distributed at this time.   The other points are that: all organs were tuned to a temperament other = than equal, which did not come into general use for a further 25 years after Bach's death.   I can also say that many of the medium and large organs by Skinner, Harrison/Skinner, Austin and the Hook brothers in the first thirty years = of the twentieth century were tremendously versatile Instruments, capable of leading any service and able to earn their keep playing music in concert.   The Pinnacle was the Wanamaker organ, built to entertain, and has been = doing it every working day since it first played. It would be easier to make a list of international organists who did not play it than those who did. he present incumbent is following their lead with marvellous results. In "magic" which is a much better technical recording than the recent = second   I would also ask Randy, Can we have details of the DVD please?.   Regards to all,   Richard,