PipeChat Digest #5090 - Saturday, January 15, 2005
 
Re: you light up my eyes while waiting like a lover
  by "Richard Hazelip" <rhazelip1@yahoo.com>
confusion! (was here i am waiting like a lover_
  by "Richard Hazelip" <rhazelip1@yahoo.com>
Dan Schutte's "Here I Am, Lord"
  by <BlueeyedBear@aol.com>
Re: "Here I Am, Lord"
  by "Scott Montgomery" <montre1978@yahoo.com>
RE: you light up my eyes while waiting like a lover
  by "Glenda" <gksjd85@direcway.com>
Re: "Here I Am, Lord"
  by "Young Organists Online" <youngorganistsonline@hotmail.com>
Re: "Here I Am, Lord"
  by "Charles Peery" <cepeery@earthlink.net>
RE: you light up my eyes while waiting like a lover
  by "jch" <opus1100@catoe.org>
Mendelssohn's Sonata No. 3 in A
  by "Glenda" <gksjd85@direcway.com>
What is "Quality?"
  by "Emily Adams" <eadams@cinci.rr.com>
Web Site update with MP3s and new photograph
  by <TubaMagna@aol.com>
Re: "Here I Am, Lord"
  by "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com>
Re: *ADMIN POST* re: Tonal Styles
  by "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk>
Re: What is "Quality?"
  by "Charles Peery" <cepeery@earthlink.net>
Interesting facts:
  by "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com>
"Here I Am Lord"
  by <RVScara@aol.com>
Anglican organist on the loose
  by "Peter Harrison" <peter@phmusic.co.uk>
PipeChat IRC this evening,
  by "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca>
Re: *ADMIN POST* re: Tonal Styles
  by "Young Organists Online" <youngorganistsonline@hotmail.com>
Self-centered worship (Re: What is "Quality?")
  by "Jan Nijhuis" <nijhuis@email.com>
Re: What is "Quality?"
  by "Jan Nijhuis" <nijhuis@email.com>
Alex and Colin
  by "bnorth" <bnorth@intergate.ca>
 

(back) Subject: Re: you light up my eyes while waiting like a lover From: "Richard Hazelip" <rhazelip1@yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 07:04:46 -0800 (PST)   Hey Randy: They are two different pieces. Schutte does not strike me as one who = would be so irresponsible to the person of Christ! If I am not mistaken = it's David Haas, but I am not certain. Richard   Randolph Runyon <runyonr@muohio.edu> wrote:   On Jan 15, 2005, at 12:12 AM, Richard Hazelip wrote:   > I also took issue with a line from one of the hymns published in > Glory and Praise 2, "Here I Am."   That's not the same as Dan Schutte's hymn "Here I Am, Lord," is it?   Randy Runyon     ****************************************************************** "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe:     --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard.
(back) Subject: confusion! (was here i am waiting like a lover_ From: "Richard Hazelip" <rhazelip1@yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 07:15:01 -0800 (PST)   Greetings good liturgical folk: When I initiated the discussion I assumed most folks knew that Here I Am, = Lord, and Here I Am are two different pieces. Sorry I did not make that = clearer. Here I Am is by David Haas (please correct me if I am mistaken!) = while Here I Am, Lord is by Dan Schutte. Like any good thinking person I = can find liturgical difficulties with either piece. The point I made = concerns the line "waiting like a lover" from the non-Schutte hymn. = (Maybe it's called I Am Here?). Anyway, I hope that has clarified some misconceptions. fwiw from Houston, Richard   --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.
(back) Subject: Dan Schutte's "Here I Am, Lord" From: <BlueeyedBear@aol.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 10:30:38 EST   i, too, dislike this song/hymn, but for a reason i haven't seen mentioned = on this list yet. when i'm playing it and i get to the refrain, here's what = i hear in my head:   "here i am, lord. is it i, lord? i have heard you calling in the night. all of them had hair of gold like their mother, the youngest one in curls."   and then i can just see the grid appear with all 8 bradys, and alice in = the middle. then the choir and congregation wonder why i have this huge grin = on my face every time we get to that part.   scot  
(back) Subject: Re: "Here I Am, Lord" From: "Scott Montgomery" <montre1978@yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 07:37:58 -0800 (PST)     Does anyone recognize the Brady Bunch theme song in "Here I Am, Lord?"     Here I am, Lord, is it I Lord, who was bringing up three very lovely = girls......       Scott Montgomery 619 W Church St Champaign, IL 61820 217-390-0158 www.ScottMontgomeryMusic.net  
(back) Subject: RE: you light up my eyes while waiting like a lover From: "Glenda" <gksjd85@direcway.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 09:38:42 -0600   The title was "You light up my life", if I am not mistaken. And the song spawned a movie by the same name, in which Debby Boone or a look-alike played a singer-songwriter who had a disastrous love affair and suddenly 'thunk up' the song.   I apologize that a previous post of mine wasn't plain text. And I apologize for igniting a debate. I bet if I looked hard enough, I could find a point in time where Sting hummed "Let there be peace on earth." As is often the case, the point is now lost forever. I was hoping for examples of how the early mystics of the church engaged in this amorous practice and whether they won any Grammys, but have kind of lost interest.   Thanks for the 'swan-song' info - Plato, indeed.   Glenda Sutton gksjd85@direcway.com   -----Original Message----- From: pipechat@pipechat.org [mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org] On Behalf Of Richard Hazelip Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 11:12 PM To: PipeChat Subject: you light up my eyes while waiting like a lover      
(back) Subject: Re: "Here I Am, Lord" From: "Young Organists Online" <youngorganistsonline@hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 09:44:42 -0600   Has anybody got Dan Schutte's Address??? He might be interested in = creating a parody, atleast before someone else does....   Landon   >From: Scott Montgomery <montre1978@yahoo.com> >Reply-To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> >To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> >Subject: Re: "Here I Am, Lord" >Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 07:37:58 -0800 (PST) > > >Does anyone recognize the Brady Bunch theme song in "Here I Am, Lord?" > > > >Here I am, Lord, is it I Lord, who was bringing up three very lovely >girls...... > > > >Scott Montgomery >619 W Church St >Champaign, IL 61820 >217-390-0158 >www.ScottMontgomeryMusic.net >   _________________________________________________________________ Don=92t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/    
(back) Subject: Re: "Here I Am, Lord" From: "Charles Peery" <cepeery@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 10:14:58 -0500   LOL, I said I knew my position was excessive, that it was a picky thing. Not to be Chicken Little about it, my point was that we are where we are because of a lot of little cave-ins such as this, where we don't really THINK about what the song says or does, we just say "We like it, it's pretty., what's the harm?" I'm not saying the song will make people jump off tall buildings, because, being God, they are invincible. Bad theology doesn't have such literal outcomes. But my point was: what outcomes DOES it have, and might it still not be harmful in the long run? Chuck Peery St. Louis     On Jan 15, 2005, at 9:57 AM, Alicia Zeilenga wrote: > Seriously, I've never heard of someone thinking that they are God > because they say "I the Lord" in a song. My sister did claim to be God > at breakfast this morning, but we weren't singing.    
(back) Subject: RE: you light up my eyes while waiting like a lover From: "jch" <opus1100@catoe.org> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 10:33:08 -0600   At 09:38 AM 1/15/05, you wrote: >And the >song spawned a movie by the same name, in which Debby Boone or a >look-alike played a singer-songwriter who had a disastrous love affair >and suddenly 'thunk up' the song.   Didi Conn was the actress who lip synced Debbie Boones singing.   Don't dump too hard on Debbie...after all daddy wore white bucks   jch        
(back) Subject: Mendelssohn's Sonata No. 3 in A From: "Glenda" <gksjd85@direcway.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 10:52:55 -0600   I know that this story has been discussed on the list and I have read it myself, about Felix writing this piece for his sister's wedding. However, Henderson relates an anecdote about Fanny that she composed her F-major prelude for her wedding when brother Felix failed to produce.   I really liked the first story, particularly because of the 'Aus tiefer Not/Noth' motif running through the middle (seems so fitting for a wedding!). Can anyone point me to a factual resolution?   Just curious.   Glenda Sutton gksjd85@direcway.com          
(back) Subject: What is "Quality?" From: "Emily Adams" <eadams@cinci.rr.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 12:08:04 -0500   Apropos of the current CCM vs traditional music discussion, how do we as professional musicians succinctly articulate to nonmusicians the = difference between "good quality" and "poor quality" music within the context of = church music?   I'm not talking about texts per se, or even about the relationship of = texts to music, but strictly about the music itself.   Emily A.    
(back) Subject: Web Site update with MP3s and new photograph From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 12:27:20 EST   Ladies and Gentlemen:   Some minor additions have been made to our website:   http://www.glucknewyork.com/alexander/alexander.html   will take you to the stoplist and photo page for Opus 8, Alexander Chapel, =   which has a link to the bottom that gets you to the CD listing and two = MP3s, one of Lubeck, one of Handel, each about six minutes long.   http://www.glucknewyork.com/projects/proj_compl_coldspring.html   will take you to the stoplist and photo page for Opus 10, Our Lady of Loretto, to which has been added an image of the new polychromed carving = above the keydesk.   All photographs on the site may be enlarged by clicking on them. Enjoy.   Sebastian M. Gluck New York City  
(back) Subject: Re: "Here I Am, Lord" From: "T.Desiree' Hines" <nicemusica@yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 09:29:12 -0800 (PST)   That one, "We Remember how You loved us" and all those others, I had = never heard of before looking at Catholic resources. One of my mentors = comented a few months ago "No one sings those but Catholics". Like I had never heard of those "songs" , It was a struggle to incorporate = such standard tunes like Foundation, Laudate Dominum (Perry) , and Kremser = without people saying "we don't know that...its new!". Even the clergy = could not understand how old standards could be called new. There's one in With One Voice ELCA companion that I did not like either. = "Come all You People" But the argument from some, as Charles Peery put it, = is "...It's pretty!"   Makes me wonder...Did some group sit down with a 500 Sheet pack of = Manuscript paper, at the piano, and start playing random notes and = thinking random words? (-gigglesnort) And seriously...the questions offered...why do you think the pastors = implement those into their worship? My boss says that IHHO, they do it = because thats the quickest thing they know available. He tells me all the = time, to keep him abreast of any thing new and tasteful that I find out = about. He will quickly say that if he does not know about the really good = music to enrich worship, of course he would go buy a pile of "just stuff". =   Back to drinking my morning mint tea...(Wachet Auf)   --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! =96 Get yours free!
(back) Subject: Re: *ADMIN POST* re: Tonal Styles From: "Colin Mitchell" <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 09:37:59 -0800 (PST)   Hello,   Now I'm cynical!   Whatever next? Guantanamo Bay or being stoned to death by a group of ill-mannered kids?   I don't think we have TOO many young organists in the UK who are this stupid.   Regards,   Colin Mitchell UK         --- Young Organists Online   > > Alex is very aggravated at what you've said.... > He is really not a rude kid, he > just needs time, > exposure, and no more of some of that cynicality > that he's gotten from Colin > and others     __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250  
(back) Subject: Re: What is "Quality?" From: "Charles Peery" <cepeery@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 11:47:12 -0500   If you had to just go on notes, I'd say that a melody having a good structure (and again, so much of this is personal taste.) But, say, consider "The Wedding Song" ("He is now to be among you at the calling of your hearts.."). I would not say the high proportion of repeated notes constitutes a balanced, well-written melody. I think it's hard to describe. There are a lot of C naturals in "A Mighty Fortress" (assuming you're in C), but I don't find the high proportion out of balance in that case. Craftsmanship is something else to consider. If the voice leading is careful, if the accompaniment is classy. If there is a personal musical language which allows you to pick up on that composer's unique voice, and that voice is saying something that illuminates. If the music places one in the proper perspective for worship, which takes me to my next point.   I'm afraid I like a more neutral approach for the music in worship. I don't think it's really a place for catharsis and wallowing in our all-too-human emotions. (Again, I realize how this makes me appear, so heartless... tsk tsk.) So I can't avoid the text, it's absolutely crucial in what I feel we can use and what we can't. To piggyback on the earlier "Here I Am, Lord" thing: I think the I-me-we vs. "THOU" proportion is off in so much praise music. I think there's a danger of worship becoming all about our feelings, our story. I guess that's one thing that sticks out. In, "Here I Am, Lord", the personal pronouns I, me, my are sung over forty times. Now, yes, half of those are when God is saying "I". But this is a red flag to me of what philosophy or style is at play. I just think it subliminally works against worship.   Look back at the vast body of traditional hymnody and see how many of them focus on MY feelings, MY reaction, MY needs, MY story. (And the point has been recently made that gospel or camp-style hymns also fall short in confronting God/Jesus with the awe and reverence which maintains a formal distance.) Contrasted with "I Just Want To Praise You", "I Will Call Upon The Lord", "Here I am to worship", traditional hymns focus more on telling God's story, as if He is the one to be focused upon and not ourselves. Maybe you can see why "Here I Am, Lord" just seems like too much to me. I think the congregation's role in worship is a more humble one. And I think a great deal of religious instruction is lost when congregational song is reduced to only "I Will Extol You", "I Love You, Lord", me, me, me.   There are contemporary pieces (even Praise songs) which DON'T set off my red flags, and I do use those! I'm not trying to come off as blindly rejecting everything current.   Chuck Peery St. Louis           On Jan 15, 2005, at 12:08 PM, Emily Adams wrote:   > Apropos of the current CCM vs traditional music discussion, how do we > as professional musicians succinctly articulate to nonmusicians the > difference between "good quality" and "poor quality" music within the > context of church music? > > I'm not talking about texts per se, or even about the relationship of > texts to music, but strictly about the music itself. > > Emily A. > > > ****************************************************************** > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> > List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> > List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org> >    
(back) Subject: Interesting facts: From: "Noel Stoutenburg" <mjolnir@ticnet.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 12:09:05 -0600   Coincidence, or not?   1) In a post Alex Hendrickson made to the Church Music Discuss list, on or about 28 December, 2004, he announced the formation of an msn group, writing, in part:   > The address for the group is.... > > http://groups.msn.com/YoungOrganistsOnline/ > > Thanks, > > Alex Hendrickson   2.) Alex's last post to pipe chat was on 1/13/05.   3.) On 1/14/05, a new poster, Landon, who has a user name which EXACTLY matches the name of Alex's group, and with a domain which, like the domain--hotmail--which is controlled by the same entity as controls msn groups, joins Pipechat, and begins defending Alex, with remarkable knowledge of Alex's personal life.   4.) Considering Landon's post of yesterday,   > I wasn't trying to get a reinforcement, I was just trying to tell you > that Alex is a good guy, I've known him for a long time, he's in my > Young Organists Group too, you probably were just being a bit too > serious with him. He's very intellectual and doesn't take insults from > anyone, and from what I can see, he didn't do anything to merit his > removal. Gosh, the kid needs someone to stand up for him..... Am I > alone???   I spent some time reviewing the messages and replies of the Young Organist's group on msn, and I don't find any evidence that Landon in a participant in that group, though there are lots of posts by the group owner, "YoungOrganistsOnline".   ns   P.S.:  
(back) Subject: "Here I Am Lord" From: <RVScara@aol.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 13:30:33 EST   Both Alicia and Dale using it tomorrow (as I read down my list of e-mails, = so far)...... Well, add me to that list. The (RC) Responsorial Psalm for tomorrow is "Here Am I Lord" so at least the words fit if using the Psalm response as = a "thread." I never know what the priests will be preaching on, so I look = at: the Psalm, the two Testament readings, the Gospel reading, particular Feast = the Sunday may be, and the liturgical season....then I choose hymns which = have words that relate to any, or all, of the above. Sometimes it all falls = into place and other times I have to punt. I agree with Alicia that the first part of "Here I Am Lord" must be considered "separate" from the Refrain response; but, how many people in = the pews actually scrutinize the words that closely or is it just the melody that grabs them? Look at the archaic wording in some of our "traditional = hymns" that makes one scratch his/her head in wonder at the meaning. The "punk = praise" is fading away. We just need composers who will write better music to replace it and, by that, I mean music the congregations will accept and = want to sing.  
(back) Subject: Anglican organist on the loose From: "Peter Harrison" <peter@phmusic.co.uk> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 18:44:51 -0000   I'm normally a fixture on my organ bench at Emmanuel, Holcombe, Lancs, = GB most Sundays. On Sunday 23rd Jan I'll be killing a weekend in Knoxville, Tennessee whilst there on non-organ related business. If there's any suggestions where I might usefully invest some organ related time, a = recital or perhaps a choir to be heard or whatever, I'd be glad to know.   Peter   Peter M Harrison P H M : P O Box 383 : Bury : BL8 4WX : GB tel 07799 62 1954 / 01204 887161 web: www.phmusic.co.uk   Emmanuel Church, Holcombe, Ramsbottom, GB www.emmanuel.rammy.com    
(back) Subject: PipeChat IRC this evening, From: "Bob Conway" <conwayb@sympatico.ca> Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 17:34:50 -0500   All members of PipeChat are invited to join us in the PipeChat IRC any Friday and Monday evening - beginning at 9.00 PM Eastern Time.   To find out more about the Chat room, or how to get into it, go to PipeChat-L web page at http://www.pipechat.org/   You will find out all you need to know to join us.   Tonight at 9.00 PM, - I hope that we will see you there.   Cheers,   Bob Conway     ****************************************************************** "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org>     ****************************************************************** "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org>      
(back) Subject: Re: *ADMIN POST* re: Tonal Styles From: "Young Organists Online" <youngorganistsonline@hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 13:58:10 -0600   Colin,   I'm sorry but I've about had it here, especially your language and = comments directed toward Alex, who did nothing at all to merit being banned.... Are =   David and Tim even watching???   Landon   >From: Colin Mitchell <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> >Reply-To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> >To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> >Subject: Re: *ADMIN POST* re: Tonal Styles >Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 09:37:59 -0800 (PST) > >Hello, > >Now I'm cynical! > >Whatever next? Guantanamo Bay or being stoned to death >by a group of ill-mannered kids? > >I don't think we have TOO many young organists in the >UK who are this stupid. > >Regards, > >Colin Mitchell UK > > > > >--- Young Organists Online > > > > > Alex is very aggravated at what you've said.... > > He is really not a rude kid, he > > just needs time, > > exposure, and no more of some of that cynicality > > that he's gotten from Colin > > and others > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more. >http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 > >****************************************************************** >"Pipe Up and Be Heard!" >PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics >HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org >List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org >Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org >List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> >List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> >List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org> >   _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! =   http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/    
(back) Subject: Self-centered worship (Re: What is "Quality?") From: "Jan Nijhuis" <nijhuis@email.com> Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2005 04:36:12 +0800   While I truly believe that the Holy Spirit moves people in modern churches,= the me-centerd songs do little to edify the Lord. I think that the "Frozen= Chosen" churches in both sermon and song place the focus on the addoration= of God, not how "I" feel about God.=20   That doesn't meand that hymns, choruses, songs, etc. can't have personal pr= onouns ... In 1864 William R. Featherstone penned "My Jesus, I Love Thee", = the song is one of God's assurance of salvation for us. Kathy Hankey's (188= 6) "I Love to Tell the Story" is both devotional and a fulfillment of our d= uty to disciple the nations. That traditon continues with songs like Darlen= e Zscheh's (1993) "Shout to the Lord" which starts by claiming Christ as my= personal savior, but the focus of the song is on the Lord.   This passage from Luke 18: provides an illustration.   10 "Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a t= ax collector.=20 11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, "God, I thank You that = I am not like other men--extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this = tax collector.=20 12 I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.'=20 13 And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise his= eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, "God, be merciful to me a sin= ner!'=20 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the ot= her; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles hi= mself will be exalted." (NKJV)   ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles Peery" <cepeery@earthlink.net> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Subject: Re: What is "Quality?" Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 11:47:12 -0500       > Look back at the vast body of traditional hymnody and see how many=20 > of them focus on MY feelings, MY reaction, MY needs, MY story.=20=20 > (And the point has been recently made that gospel or camp-style=20 > hymns also fall short in confronting God/Jesus with the awe and=20 > reverence which maintains a formal distance.) Contrasted with "I=20 > Just Want To Praise You", "I Will Call Upon The Lord", "Here I am=20 > to worship", traditional hymns focus more on telling God's story,=20 > as if He is the one to be focused upon and not ourselves. Maybe=20 > you can see why "Here I Am, Lord" just seems like too much to me.=20=20= =20 > I think the congregation's role in worship is a more humble one.=20=20 > And I think a great deal of religious instruction is lost when=20 > congregational song is reduced to only "I Will Extol You", "I Love=20 > You, Lord", me, me, me. >=20 > There are contemporary pieces (even Praise songs) which DON'T set=20 > off my red flags, and I do use those! I'm not trying to come off=20 > as blindly rejecting everything current. >=20 > Chuck Peery > St. Louis   -- Jan Nijhuis nijhuis@email.com   --=20 ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm    
(back) Subject: Re: What is "Quality?" From: "Jan Nijhuis" <nijhuis@email.com> Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2005 04:49:01 +0800   Quickly,   1. There's only so much "I-IV-V7" chrod progression that can be done over a= nd over and over and over and over and over again.=20   2. Straying from "I-IV-V7" all the way over to the "Em - B7" with a strong = back-beat to sound Jewish isn't the only alternate chord progression that e= xists.   3. Lilting schmalzy walzes .... I don't think so.   4. A drum kit dosn't add to the quality of the sound.   4a. Louder isn't better.   5. The progression of "Make me a Servant" sounds like the song belongs on t= he Muppet show. Really, it works well with a Kermit the frog voice, just no= t in church.   -- Gotta run, my daughter want's to play outside.     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Emily Adams" <eadams@cinci.rr.com> To: PipeChat <pipechat@pipechat.org> Subject: What is "Quality?" Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 12:08:04 -0500   > Apropos of the current CCM vs traditional music discussion, how do=20 > we as professional musicians succinctly articulate to nonmusicians=20 > the difference between "good quality" and "poor quality" music=20 > within the context of church music? >=20 > I'm not talking about texts per se, or even about the relationship=20 > of texts to music, but strictly about the music itself. >=20 > Emily A. -- Jan Nijhuis nijhuis@email.com   --=20 ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm    
(back) Subject: Alex and Colin From: "bnorth" <bnorth@intergate.ca> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 13:09:23 -0800     >>From: Colin Mitchell <cmys13085@yahoo.co.uk> " who are this stupid."   If you go back and read Alex's last post, he asked an interesting = question, but the last sentence was not appropriate. Tim is correct in removing him, =   at least for now. Mr Mitchell's comments are also not appropriate. This list is supposed to be for professional types interested in the pipe = organ. I think Mr Mitchell should appologise to the rest of the list for his inappropriate comments, then we should carry on and try and bring the tone =   of this site up to a standard all of us would like to see on PipeChat.