PipeChat Digest #5443 - Monday, July 4, 2005
 
An organ for WestConn (part one; long! Cross posted)
  by "Stephen Roberts" <sroberts01@snet.net>
Sampling question
  by "Jason M. Taylor" <Jason.M.Taylor@verizon.net>
Re: Sampling question
  by "Jarle Fagerheim" <jarle_fagerheim@yahoo.co.uk>
Re: Standing ovations and lefity at Organ Recitals
  by "Stan Yoder" <vze2myh5@verizon.net>
Re: Sampling question
  by "Paul Valtos" <chercapa@enter.net>
Re: Conference Center Organ, Salt Lake
  by <AEolianSkinner@aol.com>
Re: Standing ovations and leftitifity at Organ Recitals
  by "Paul Smith" <kipsmith@getgoin.net>
German reed maker in 19th. century Paris
  by "Stephen Roberts" <sroberts01@snet.net>
Re: German reed maker in 19th. century Paris
  by "Paul Smith" <kipsmith@getgoin.net>
Re: German reed maker in 19th. century Paris
  by "nelson denton" <ndenton@cogeco.ca>
 

(back) Subject: An organ for WestConn (part one; long! Cross posted) From: "Stephen Roberts" <sroberts01@snet.net> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 14:13:58 -0700 (PDT)   Dear List Friends: Some of you long time members may remember a posting of mine a couple of = years back in which I announced that the State of Connecticut had decided = to build a new Fine Arts Center at the university where I teach, Western = Connecticut State University in Danbury. The funding for the design = phase of the new 65 Million dollar building was approved over a year ago, = and the search for an architect began. Though I do not recall the name of = the architectural firm that was awarded the contract, I know that = discussions are underway between the department chairs of the departments = involved (art, drama, and music), the university administration, and the = architects. I can also tell you that despite my hopes for commissioning a = significant new organ for the concert hall, those hopes were dashed, and I = was told that there simply was not enough money for an organ. The best I = could hope for was for space to be provided for an organ, in the hope that = funding could be found later, or a potential donor came forth. As is the case with most such projects, the initial = plans had to be pared down significantly to fit the budget. I was told = that if we had gotten everything we had asked for, the cost of the project = would have been a whopping $125,000,000! All that was allotted for the = organ department in the end was 220 square feet of space--a paltry amount. = More about that later. Things began to change when our new university President, James Schmotter, = arrived in the fall. When President Schmotter met me for the first time, = however, and was told that I was the organ teacher, he has said, "Organs = are very expensive. I doubt if we'll be able to find the kind of money = needed to build a new concert hall organ." So things looked pretty bleak = at the beginning of the academic year. Shortly thereafter, however, I got = word that the congregation of Immanuel Lutheran Church in Danbury, a = Missouri Synod congregation, were planning to sell their mid-19th. century = building and move to a much larger church, which in turn had been vacated = by a rapidly growing evangelical congregation. The building that the = Lutherans had occupied for the past 95 years--an important number for = Lutherans, ha!-- had formerly been the Second Congregational Church. That = congregation had been absorbed into the First Congregational Church around = 1910. Danbury composer Charles Ives had been the organist for this church for several years right before that time. = Ives had played the then-new organ by William Johnson and Son, which had = been installed in the 1890's. This organ had been altered by Charles = McManis around 1950, but was completely rebuilt by M.P. Moller in 1973 as = their Opus 10,844. We had used this organ for a hymn playing workshop by = Martin Jean during a Pipe Organ Encounter some years before, and I had = been struck at the time by the fact that to my ears it sounded much better = than most Moller work of the same period. I did not know at the time that = the organ contains much pipework from the previous organ by Johnson. The organ committee of Immanuel Lutheran Church had recommended to the = congregation that the organ be dismantled, enlarged and revoiced, and = reinstalled in their new church building. The congregation, however, had = other ideas: they voted to purchase a large custom electronic organ = instead. Meanwhile Danbury Lighthouse Ministries, an evangelical = congregation, contracted with the Lutherans for the purchase of their old = building. DLM made it clear, however, that they did not intend to use the = pipe organ, nor did they want it, and the Lutherans decided to offer it = for sale. Because of the associations of the building and the original Johnson organ = with Charles Ives, local historians and town officials were determined to = keep the organ in Danbury. A movement began in the community and the = university to have the organ installed in our new Fine Arts Center. If = the organ had not had those historical associations, there would not have = been support for this idea. The idea of Immanuel's donating the organ to = the university was discussed, and the Immanuel organ committee voted to = recommend to the congregation that the organ be given to WestConn, should = no buyer come forth in the meantime. I was told that they were "99% = certain" that the congregation would vote to give the organ to the = university. I said at the time it was that remaining 1% that worried me, = and my fears turned out to be well founded. The university seemed to be = delighted about the idea of having the organ for the new building, and the = university administration (especially President Schmotter) were solidly behind the plan. It looked as if we would have = an organ in our new hall after all. The date for the congregational vote was set for Sunday, May 1. On Friday = afternoon, April 29, I got a call from the organ committee chair, who told = me that a Lutheran church in Virginia had made a full price offer for the = organ ($10,000) and that they expected that the congregation would vote to = accept the offer. I could see that once again, my dream of having a = recital organ on campus would go up in smoke. Since I was not told about = this development until late in the day of a Friday, it would have been = impossible for me to get in touch with the university administration, let = alone get them to agree to purchase the organ on such short notice. I was = really down. But then, I began to think, "What is keeping us from getting = this organ? $10,000. I decided to make an offer for the organ out of my = own funds in order to keep the idea of a recital organ alive. I called up = the Lutherans and told them of my plan. This would mean that the organ = would stay in Danbury, where their parishioners could continue to enjoy it. That Sunday the Lutherans voted = to accept my offer on behalf of the university, and it looked as if we = would have an organ after all. Of course, it also meant that I would be = $10,000 poorer, but it meant that much to me to have an organ for my = students to play. The WestConn Foundation came to my rescue, and they generously decided to = buy the organ, instead of my having to buy it myself. After some very = delicate negotiations with the officials of Danbury Lighthouse Ministries, = the evangelical group who are buying the building, we worked out an = agreement whereby the university would pay rent to them in order to leave = the organ in place. Finally last Friday, July 1, the sales agreement was = signed, and the organ was sold to WestConn. We will now definitely have = an organ for our new building, which is scheduled to be finished around = the year 2009. HOORAY! What did we get? The organ is a two manual instrument with complete = choruses on Great and Swell. The new concert hall will be small, as such = halls go. It will seat only 800 people, and in terms of cubic volume it = will only be about 1/3 larger than the church in which the organ = presently stands. The organ is small for a concert hall, but with a few = additions and changes, it should be just enough. It has a very nice = drawknob console, which will be rebuilt and retained. My plan is to add a = few stops, mostly in the Great and Pedal, and perhaps to rescale the = principal chorus to make it bigger by a couple of notes. The chests will = be releathered, the console will be rebuilt with a solid state combination = action, and the switching and cabling replaced with modern equipment to = conform to the present electrical codes. Here is the stoplist as it is now: GREAT 8' Principal 8' Rohrfloete 4' Octave 4' Flute 2 2/3 Twelfth 2' Fifteenth Mixture IV SWELL 16' Gedackt 8' Gedackt (ext of 16) 8' Viole de Gambe 8' Viole Celeste 4' Spitzprinzipal 2 2/3 Nazard 2' Waldfloete 1 3/5 Tierce Scharff III-IV 8' Trompette (parallel shallots) 4' Rohrschalmei (prepared, but never added. Thank God for that.) PEDAL 32' Resultant 16' Bourdon 16' Gedackt (Swell) 8' Principal 8' Bourdon (12 pipes; extension of 16' Bourdon) 4' Octave (12 pipes; extension of 8') 4' Flute (12 more pipes; extension of 16/8 Bourdon) 16' Contre Trompette (ext. of Swell Trompette) 8' Trompette (Swell) 4' Trompette (from Swell 8') Is this what I would have wanted in a perfect world, given an unlimited = budget? Of course not! But it is A LOT better than the alternative, = which would have been no organ at all. Stay tuned for my plans to rebuild = and enlarge the organ to suit the new space. I hope to post them later. Happy Fourth of July! Stephen Roberts Western Connecticut State University, Danbury, CT USA  
(back) Subject: Sampling question From: "Jason M. Taylor" <Jason.M.Taylor@verizon.net> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2005 18:17:24 -0400   Previous Comment: "Again you have a problem with ownership. Once you sell a product to an organization or a user, you cannot tell him what to do with it."   Reply: Sorry, your position is not defendable.   I bought a townhouse in Reston, VA years ago. To my surprise, a few = months later I was told that my door was painted the wrong color for the approved cluster pallet. The ruling most certainly was enforceable against me.   Any time you by a recording, you are buying the right to play it for your own personal entertainment. If you believe that you can re-record the content and sell it to someone else, you will be found to be expensively mistaken. That is why there are copyright laws!.   The same legal logic that covers recordings, computer software, and = digital sampling in organs can most certainly be applied to your organ purchase.   If you use the purchased samples to produce and record music for any = reason, that is an approved usage. If you specifically record individual samples with the intent of selling them in any form for any reason, it is a copyright infringement.   Those of you who persist in thumping your chests with the "I own it, and I will do anything I want with it...", are being both naive and prone to an expensive lesson.   Jason Taylor      
(back) Subject: Re: Sampling question From: "Jarle Fagerheim" <jarle_fagerheim@yahoo.co.uk> Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2005 00:56:48 +0200   Jason M. Taylor wrote: > Any time you by a recording, you are buying the right to play it for = your > own personal entertainment. If you believe that you can re-record the > content and sell it to someone else, you will be found to be expensively > mistaken. That is why there are copyright laws!.   If you own the recording, you're free to do whatever you want with it, save killing people and that obvious stuff. However, as Jason points out, "buying" a recording is (in most cases) actually buying the right to play it in certain circumstances and a means (a CD, for example) to do so.   > The same legal logic that covers recordings, computer software, and = digital > sampling in organs can most certainly be applied to your organ purchase.   Not quite sure about that one. If the organ purchase contract reads something like "the Church is buying the Right to use the Organ according to the Builder's guidelines" rather than "the Church is buying the Organ from the Builder", the recording logic can be applied. I've never heard of a case like that, but I might just be totally ignorant about the latest developments in Organ Law!   -- Beste helsing / Best wishes / Beste Gr=FC=DFe / Bestu kvedjur   Jarle Fagerheim   jarle_fagerheim@yahoo.co.uk www: http://jarle.moo.no  
(back) Subject: Re: Standing ovations and lefity at Organ Recitals From: "Stan Yoder" <vze2myh5@verizon.net> Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2005 19:33:39 -0400   It seems that st. ovations are becoming almost obligatory in our culture. = Every event I attend that features children or young people ends with an S.O. Perhaps the ovators(?) = don't want to risk damage to the perceived fragile self-esteem of the ovatees.   I think "exceptional" is the key word, though mileage will vary in how = broadly it is applied. I recall *willingly* SO-ing for very few events, e.g., Paul Hindemith = conducting the CSO in Bruckner's 7th in the 60s, Klauss Tennstedt the PSO and the Schubert 9th. I say = *willingly* because, if you don't stand, you can't see anything (but the a--e in front of you.)   My .02,   Stan Yoder Pittsburgh  
(back) Subject: Re: Sampling question From: "Paul Valtos" <chercapa@enter.net> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 19:41:31 -0400   I think we've beaten this horse to death but a parallel can be made with=20 organ pipes. If let us say Aeolian Skinner were still active and someone wa= s=20 rebuilding an opus of theirs, could they say that whoever is rebuilding=20 their organ would have to revoice their pipes as to use their pipes in a=20 rebuild and put the rebuilders name on the organ would be an infringement o= f=20 the original sound of the Aeolian Skinner voicing and the rebuilder could= =20 not therefore reuse their pipes.??? These ideas can be carried to lunacy.= =20 Organ voicing is not copyrighted, nor their sound. They are not soft ware= =20 nor are they not allowed to be recorded. Otherwise you would never hear a= =20 recording of anyone's concert but would have to go to the live act=20 only.Course that would increase the number in attendance at concerts.Not a= =20 bad idea. Paul ----- Original Message -----=20 From: "Jarle Fagerheim" <jarle_fagerheim@yahoo.co.uk> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 6:56 PM Subject: Re: Sampling question     > Jason M. Taylor wrote: >> Any time you by a recording, you are buying the right to play it for you= r >> own personal entertainment. If you believe that you can re-record the >> content and sell it to someone else, you will be found to be expensively >> mistaken. That is why there are copyright laws!. > > If you own the recording, you're free to do whatever you want with it,=20 > save killing people and that obvious stuff. However, as Jason points out,= =20 > "buying" a recording is (in most cases) actually buying the right to play= =20 > it in certain circumstances and a means (a CD, for example) to do so. > >> The same legal logic that covers recordings, computer software, and=20 >> digital >> sampling in organs can most certainly be applied to your organ purchase. > > Not quite sure about that one. If the organ purchase contract reads=20 > something like "the Church is buying the Right to use the Organ according= =20 > to the Builder's guidelines" rather than "the Church is buying the Organ= =20 > from the Builder", the recording logic can be applied. I've never heard o= f=20 > a case like that, but I might just be totally ignorant about the latest= =20 > developments in Organ Law! > > --=20 > Beste helsing / Best wishes / Beste Gr=FC=DFe / Bestu kvedjur > > Jarle Fagerheim > > jarle_fagerheim@yahoo.co.uk > www: http://jarle.moo.no > > ****************************************************************** > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> > List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> > List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org> > >=20     >  
(back) Subject: Re: Conference Center Organ, Salt Lake From: <AEolianSkinner@aol.com> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 20:03:07 EDT   Hey All, The the Conference Center organ is a truly amazing organ. Since it = is almost have the size of the Tabernacle, it is filling a space that is = about four times the amount the Tabernacle fills up which is truly remarkable. = It has a nice warm sound that blends with just about anything it has to = accompany and also fulfills the job that it is intended to do and then some. I had = the rare chance to climb into the organ and see how everything was placed. = The engineers didn't wasn't any space. That's for sure. All the placement = of pipes were amazing to see that large instrument in the small space. It = is also voiced louder to project into the conference center. If I remember = right, I was told that the loudest tuba was voiced at about 25 inches. Its a fantastic organ and I love hearing it. But for me, the Tabernacle Organ = is hands down the better of the two.   Best Regards, Gregory Hinson    
(back) Subject: Re: Standing ovations and leftitifity at Organ Recitals From: "Paul Smith" <kipsmith@getgoin.net> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 20:54:33 -0500   AMEN! from Missouri. I attend about every organ program of any kind in the =   smallish city of Springfield, MO. It is a rare program that doesn't end = with the best friends of the performer jumping to their feet at the conclusion = of the last number. Sometimes these are the same people who clapped enthusiastically between movements for the first half of the concert, thinking the rest of us were being rude not to clap every time the organ noise ended. It takes alot of nerve to sit through the adulation. It grows =   irritating, most certainly. = Kip Smith     ----- Original Message ----- From: <TubaMagna@aol.com> To: <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 9:55 AM Subject: Re: Standing ovations and leftitifity at Organ Recitals     > Standing ovations are NOT a requirement at fine recitals. > They happen spontaneously following exceptional performances. > > If all recitalists expect a standing ovation, the act becomes = meaningless. > Making the special commonplace demeans the honor and the honoree. > > Imagine if every organ, no matter how small, had a 32' reed. > That would rob them of their splendor and specialness, and they would = grow > irritating. > > ****************************************************************** > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> > List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> > List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org> > > >      
(back) Subject: German reed maker in 19th. century Paris From: "Stephen Roberts" <sroberts01@snet.net> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 19:31:23 -0700 (PDT)   Dear List, Colin Mitchell challenged Sebastian Gluck to name the German who made = reeds for Cavaille-Coll. I know that Seb is probably out watching the = Fourth of July fireworks display from his apartment balcony now, so he = probably isn't prepared to respond to Colin's challenge at the moment. I = receive my mail from this list in digest form; if someone has posted about = this already, please forgive the duplication. Since Sebastian hasn't = risen to Colin's challenge, however, I will pick up the gauntlet for him. =   I'm not an expert about this subject at all, but I do know that a German = reed maker in Paris named Zimmermann supplied reeds to many distinguished = 19th. century organ builders, including Cavaille-Coll and the Hook = Brothers here in the USA. For example, the Vox Humana in the Hooks' = famous organ in Holy Cross Cathedral in Boston is made in Dom Bedos = style, and it is stamped "Zimmermann Paris", as are some reeds in = Cavaille-Coll organs in France. Just as firms like Giesecke make reeds in = different styles for builders all over the world today, Zimmermann = apparently did the same in the 19th. century. Zimmermann's reeds are = beautifully made, and were highly regarded then. We should remember that = through trade fairs like the Crystal Palace Exhibition and the Paris = World's Fair of 1900, builders who exhibited became familiar with the work = of other builders from other countries. Things were not quite so = parochial then as we might imagine. The builders then exchanged = information and talked shop among themselves, just as builders do today. As for Colin's taunt that Seb knew something that no one else did about a = German making reeds for Cavaille-Coll, the fact that Zimmermann of Paris = made reeds for many builders (including the French master) is really a = rather well known bit of information for those who are knowledgeable about = 19th. century organ building. This is not something that Sebastian = imagined or made up; it is an established fact, and to cognoscenti a = relatively well known one at that. Apparently Colin doesn't know = Sebastian personally; if he did, he would know that though Sebastian works = as an organ builder, he also holds advanced degrees--I believe that his = professional training is in architecture-- from very distinguished = universities here. Blue collar? Only in the sense that he works as an = organ builder by his own choice, and out of a sense of dedication to our = instrument. I also happen to know that Sebastian comes from a family of = eminent Jewish scholars, many of whom hold doctorates and have published a number of books. The Gluck family are highly cultured, = erudite, sophisticated, and well traveled people. Peasants? Hardly. Stephen Roberts  
(back) Subject: Re: German reed maker in 19th. century Paris From: "Paul Smith" <kipsmith@getgoin.net> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 21:48:16 -0500   That wasn't a "challenge"! It was a question. Sebastian has a way of = blowing up in hysterical ways when no offence was intended. Please don't make it worse. How anyone could read what Colin wrote as referring to any modern builder is beyond any reason. Please read what was written and settle = down, drink a beer and watch the fireworks.   = Good night!     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Roberts" <sroberts01@snet.net> To: "PipeChat" <pipechat@pipechat.org> Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 9:31 PM Subject: German reed maker in 19th. century Paris     > Dear List, > > Colin Mitchell challenged Sebastian Gluck to name the German who made > reeds for Cavaille-Coll. I know that Seb is probably out watching the > Fourth of July fireworks display from his apartment balcony now, so he > probably isn't prepared to respond to Colin's challenge at the moment. = I > receive my mail from this list in digest form; if someone has posted = about > this already, please forgive the duplication. Since Sebastian hasn't > risen to Colin's challenge, however, I will pick up the gauntlet for = him. > > I'm not an expert about this subject at all, but I do know that a German =   > reed maker in Paris named Zimmermann supplied reeds to many = distinguished > 19th. century organ builders, including Cavaille-Coll and the Hook > Brothers here in the USA. For example, the Vox Humana in the Hooks' > famous organ in Holy Cross Cathedral in Boston is made in Dom Bedos > style, and it is stamped "Zimmermann Paris", as are some reeds in > Cavaille-Coll organs in France. Just as firms like Giesecke make reeds = in > different styles for builders all over the world today, Zimmermann > apparently did the same in the 19th. century. Zimmermann's reeds are > beautifully made, and were highly regarded then. We should remember = that > through trade fairs like the Crystal Palace Exhibition and the Paris > World's Fair of 1900, builders who exhibited became familiar with the = work > of other builders from other countries. Things were not quite so > parochial then as we might imagine. The builders then exchanged > information > and > talked shop among themselves, just as builders do today. > > As for Colin's taunt that Seb knew something that no one else did about = a > German making reeds for Cavaille-Coll, the fact that Zimmermann of Paris =   > made reeds for many builders (including the French master) is really a > rather well known bit of information for those who are knowledgeable = about > 19th. century organ building. This is not something that Sebastian > imagined or made up; it is an established fact, and to cognoscenti a > relatively well known one at that. Apparently Colin doesn't know > Sebastian personally; if he did, he would know that though Sebastian = works > as an organ builder, he also holds advanced degrees--I believe that his > professional training is in architecture-- from very distinguished > universities here. Blue collar? Only in the sense that he works as an > organ builder by his own choice, and out of a sense of dedication to = our > instrument. I also happen to know that Sebastian comes from a family of > eminent Jewish scholars, many of whom hold doctorates and ha > ve > published a number of books. The Gluck family are highly cultured, > erudite, sophisticated, and well traveled people. Peasants? Hardly. > > Stephen Roberts > > ****************************************************************** > "Pipe Up and Be Heard!" > PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs & related topics > HOMEPAGE : http://www.pipechat.org > List: mailto:pipechat@pipechat.org > Administration: mailto:admin@pipechat.org > List-Subscribe: <mailto:pipechat-on@pipechat.org> > List-Digest: <mailto:pipechat-digest@pipechat.org> > List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:pipechat-off@pipechat.org> > > >      
(back) Subject: Re: German reed maker in 19th. century Paris From: "nelson denton" <ndenton@cogeco.ca> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 22:51:03 -0400   My only claim to nobility is that one of my ancestors was Sir Robin Hood = and another one was the Noble Lady who poisoned him.   My family did live near the Bronte Sisters and went to church with them, however.   Nelson