PipeChat Digest #5388 - Thursday, June 2, 2005 Re: Which organ is more noteworthy? by "Jan Nijhuis" <email@example.com> Re: Now about WHITE/Moller, and a merged church...confused by "Desiree'" <firstname.lastname@example.org> excellent small Moller in Mississippi by "Randy Terry" <email@example.com> St Mary the Virgin by "David Baker" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Re: Organ parts for Sale in NH by "Jan Nijhuis" <email@example.com> Re: excellent small Moller in Mississippi by "Desiree'" <firstname.lastname@example.org> RE: Ross's ideal small organ by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> RE: Large organs for big American Churches by "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> 2nd Mississippi Jewel by "Randy Terry" <email@example.com> Bach Erbarm dich by "Stephen Williams" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Exquisite New CD by "N. Russotto" <email@example.com> Re: Organ Literature Foundation...Still Alive, sorta...(X-Post) by "M Fox" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Re: St. Mary the Virgin by "M Fox" <email@example.com> Re: St Mary the Virgin by "Stephen Best" <firstname.lastname@example.org> St. Mary the Virgin and Ernest White by "David Scribner" <email@example.com>
(back) Subject: Re: Which organ is more noteworthy? From: "Jan Nijhuis" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 09:10:20 -0700 If you weren't strapped to Harrison-builts, there must be dozens of unremarkable (read: unknown) organs in smaller churches throughout the North-East that would be interesting to visit. On 6/2/05, Desiree' <email@example.com> wrote: > I just wanted to see which was more noteworthy among the New Yorkers. The= stoplist of the Smocky Mary organ looks like it may be more fun than the S= t Pauls organ. But The St Paul organ as one listed said in a different wayn= said, is what GDH intended it to be. > TDH And all this time I thought Martha wore the smock... :-) Luke 10 38 As Jesus and his disciples were on their way, he came to a village where a woman named Martha opened her home to him. 39She had a sister called Mary, who sat at the Lord's feet listening to what he said. 40 But Martha was distracted by all the preparations that had to be made. She came to him and asked, "Lord, don't you care that my sister has left me to do the work by myself? Tell her to help me!" 41 "Martha, Martha," the Lord answered, "you are worried and upset about many things, 42 but only one thing is needed. Mary has chosen what is better, and it will not be taken away from her." --=20 Jan Nijhuis firstname.lastname@example.org
(back) Subject: Re: Now about WHITE/Moller, and a merged church...confused From: "Desiree'" <email@example.com> Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 09:39:44 -0700 (PDT) I Decided to go onto the NYCAGO and see St Georges and Calvary Episcopal = churches. THEN if you search online, theres a merged church of = Calvary/StGeorges. St Geo. is where the big Moller (Ernest White) is. And Then St Georges is = where theere is an A-S. Are these the two that are merged, and now have two major organs, or no? TDH __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
(back) Subject: excellent small Moller in Mississippi From: "Randy Terry" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 09:50:40 -0700 When I was a high school student, I was a note-holder and go-fer for an organ tuner in my area, and most of what we worked on were not very = notable rebuilds by a regional "putter-togehter" who did far more damage to the things he messed with than good. But sometimes, there would be surprises. In New Albany Mississippi, their = was a small Moller from the 50's that had absolutely beautiful flutes, strings that purred, and excellent reeds. This is a very basic church organ, but the sound was what one *wants* to here when one thinks of a = full church organ sound. Only 18 ranks. It has a substantial 2 manual drawknob console with beautiful ivory = manuals: GREAT (enclosed): 8' Diapason 8' Bourdon 8' Dulciana 4' Octave 2-2-3' Twelfth 2' Fifteenth Tremolo SWELL: 16' Rohr-Bourdon (ext) 8' Viole de Gambe 8' Viole Celeste 8' Rohrflute 4' Principal 4' Koppelflute III Plein Jeu 8' Trompette 4' Oboe-Clarion Tremolo PEDAL: 16' Bourdon 16' Rohr-Bourdon (sw) 8' Octave 8' Bourdon 8' Rohrflute (sw) 4' Super Octave 4' Bourdon Full Couplers I don't know the condition at this time, and the organ is not a = "literature" organ, but for choral accompaniment and hymn playing it is pretty darn = good! Randy Terry _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! = http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
(back) Subject: St Mary the Virgin From: "David Baker" <email@example.com> Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 13:07:33 -0400 Having studied with McNeil Robinson at St. Mary's, I know that the practice organ upstairs was a 10 - 15 rank Casavant flower pot; no case for that, either. As to the basement, I'm sure there are former clergy who are grateful for your discretion! David Baker (now in Boston) On Jun 2, 2005, at 12:10 PM, PipeChat wrote: > > I'm not aware of an organ in the basement ever, but there was a > largeish practice instrument up on either the second or third > floor. I > never heard it, so I have no idea what it sounded like. I can't > really mention here what WAS found in the basement, that being more > suitable for another list....................
(back) Subject: Re: Organ parts for Sale in NH From: "Jan Nijhuis" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 10:08:25 -0700 Anyone know who's shop this was? Its way up there in New Hampshire, right near the Maine border and near the coast. I'd be interested in the service area, instrument's he/they serviced, installed, expanded and who now gets that business. Hmmm...I wonder what an endless supply of parts and pipes looks like. I reckon there are considerably fewer ... or is the endless pipe a hula-hoop found in the back of the shop. As for "near by" ... Andy Lawrence? On 6/1/05, Harry Martenas <email@example.com> wrote: > > >We purchased a building in NH with the contents which was a Organ repa= ir > > >business. So we have endless organ parts and pipes. > > >The Sale is Sat. June 11, 2005, 9 to 12 at 216 Spinney Road in Portsmo= uth, > > >NH. It will be CASH AND CARRY! > > >Thank you >=20 > I can only hope that there is a list member nearby NH this weekend to > pick up some real bargains. >=20 > This might be junk - or it might be valuable. The tools alone could > really be a steal - but impossible to say. --=20 Jan Nijhuis firstname.lastname@example.org
(back) Subject: Re: excellent small Moller in Mississippi From: "Desiree'" <email@example.com> Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 12:37:34 -0700 (PDT) Throw a 16' Trombone on the pedal and its a complete instrument capable of = playing some nice literature. TDH Randy Terry <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote: GREAT (enclosed): 8' Diapason 8' Bourdon 8' Dulciana 4' Octave 2-2-3' Twelfth 2' Fifteenth Tremolo SWELL: 16' Rohr-Bourdon (ext) 8' Viole de Gambe 8' Viole Celeste 8' Rohrflute 4' Principal 4' Koppelflute III Plein Jeu 8' Trompette 4' Oboe-Clarion Tremolo PEDAL: 16' Bourdon 16' Rohr-Bourdon (sw) 8' Octave 8' Bourdon 8' Rohrflute (sw) 4' Super Octave 4' Bourdon Full Couplers I don't know the condition at this time, and the organ is not a = "literature" organ, but for choral accompaniment and hymn playing it is pretty darn = good! --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM & more. Check it out!
(back) Subject: RE: Ross's ideal small organ From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2005 07:55:45 +1200 >Interesting, I think, Ross. Out of curiosity, what pitches would you advocate in the two-rank Mixture? Twelfth and Nineteenth? Or Nineteenth and Twenty-Second? In a small organ of the approx.dozen stops I was thinking of, I'd put the Mixture at (19.22) for the first four octaves, then beak it to (12.15) for the rest. I'd keep the 22nd a bit bolder but not much than the Quint, and make sure the whole stop was of good scale, low wide cut-up, and harmonically-rich so there'd be brilliance and richness but no flutiness = or screech. That's essential. If the building were live acoustically, the = 19th could be a little stronger, but still not as loud as the 22nd. If there = were a 12th instead of a 19th, that would give the chorus an unpleasant quinty fatness that would fall apart and remove much chance of silveriness. >I assume this organ is primarily for service-playing. If so, what would you advocate in the ideal small organ for playing repertoire? That would depend on the repertoire. For a small organ, I tend not to = think of repertoire as the organ's basic function (in my thinking) for such an instrument tends to be for accompanying congregational singing (and not = even choirs) and for playing simple voluntaries. For that reason, in such an instrument I'd choose the pieces to suit the instrument, rather thantry to make an instrument that would do everything. In other, my voluntaries = would tend to be pre-1800 German, Italian, Dutch and English, and some French if it sounded good. The whole subject of small organs tends to be a bit theoretical, of = course, unless we know of the building we're speaking of - how alive it is, its seating capacity, the kind of singing to be experienced there, where the organ is to go, its shape and cubic capacity and surface materials, and so on. This is where, I think, the skill of the organ consultant comes in, to make sure the instrument locks into the building. An enormous amount can = be achieved if the scaling etc. are specific to that building. In a dead building, for example, the 8ft Open might be of 6" scale at CC, yet an = alive building might need it to be only 5.5", or even 5.25". Similarly, in a = dead building the 16ft SubBass might need to be 9" by 8" at CCC, yet only 7" by 6.5" at CCC. Too, I'd not have very slight pressures, but keep it up to about 3" for a small building and up to 4" if the organ was to go into a larger building. Again, the pressure needs to be determined with a = specific building in mind, but if this little theoretical organ were to be of just = a dozen stops in a church seating 250 to 300 people, and fairly dead acoustically, then that pressure would not be too high at all if the = scaling and voicing methods of TCLewis were employed. Someone accused me of being doctrinaire the other day (or words to that effect), and I'm trying to be cautious here, but that would be my approach and devise the specification only after looking and listening carefully in the building, and then take great care in choosing scaling, pipe material, wind-pressures, voicing techniques and so on. My 3c worth. Ross
(back) Subject: RE: Large organs for big American Churches From: "TheShieling" <TheShieling@xtra.co.nz> Date: Fri, 3 Jun 2005 08:20:57 +1200 >I do think it has to do with the large, awkward, non-traditional volumes that are being built to house large church congregations these days. Acoustically, they are not traditional (nor on many other levels, either), and time-honored rules of organ design and placement do not always work in them. I'm sure this would be true, and that's why (in the posting I've just = sent) I stress that a building needs to be looked at, and listened to, very carefully when the organ is being designed, plus (of course) what the instrument is meant to achieve, i.e. its use. >And I can't say that I am an advocate for those large instruments that try to combine divisions that represent every school and period of organ building in the history of the world. You know, an English Romantic Swell, and a French Baroque Recit - all coexisting together with nine other manual divisions in the same instrument. I like a coherent, well-rounded instrument whose parts function well alone, and add up to a perfect whole. Yes, I do think sometimes organ designers try to make an instrument = achieve excellence for every organ piece ever written. That, to me, is musical suicide. You'd never put on the paid staff of an orchestra all the brass Wagner wants or the woodwind Berlioz wants, just for use once every 3 or 4 years or for just one piece of music. You'd, if you had any sense, try to design your orchestra for the kind of music that would be the staple in = that situation, and plain have to ignore some other things. Whatever the current philosophy may be concerning authenticity and condemning the eclectic organ design, I still believe an instrument can be designed that will play a great amount of the literature with great = musical aplomb and success, even if it's not exactly what was intended by a = composer long gone and thinking of only one kind of instrument. I'm sure TCLewis, = for example, did not have Bach in mind, but his instruments can nevertheless make musical sense of him. >That's NOT to say that I think an organ ought to be constructed as a period piece. I do think it's entirely appropriate to take lessons from all organ-building schools and periods. And probably, any organ designed today ought not to exactly emulate any of them, Yes, I'm sure you're right. >The room is acoustically dead, and the entire organ is buried in chambers. The Casavant is in a volumetrically large Catholic Cathedral that seats 400, and sits in a more or less open case (divided, on either side of the choir loft). The Casavant - apart from being absolutely stunning in it's voicing and tonal finishing, fills its room far better than the Austin. Apart from having to figure out how to play repertoire for three-manual instruments on it, its really a more exciting recital instrument. What I'm led to wondering is: how did the tradition of poor organ sites = and pitiful acoustics arise in the USA? Where did the stress on deep and = chancel chambers and complete lack of reverberation come from? And again, how did the church musicians let this happen without a tremendous fight? I'm not trying to be smart here, but am genuinely curious to know how it arose. = When talking with David Willcocks some years ago, he made the made the comment that you could hit the average American organist or choirmaster over the head with 4 seconds reverb and he/she wouldn't hear it as they've rarely = (if ever) experienced decent acoustics. We had this problem here in the Wellington RC Cathedral. The organ design and voicing just don't suit the building as the Dir.Music of the time was hearing in her head something = that didn't equate with what the cathedral actually was (and still is, years later after the organ rebuild she oversaw). How many church musicians have done battle with their parishes over acoustics and organ placement? How many have attempted to educate their clergy and church committees and take them on trips to hear and see good installations in good acoustics, irrespective of the size of the organ and the church? How many people have invited their clergy and senior laypeople to organ and choir conventions, or even to the local organists' associations? Here in NZ anyway, it just doesn't happen at all. Too, how many organists and choirmasters do their very best to teach = younger and less-experienced people about these things, and merely teach them the notes of the music? In other words, should the church musicians take some = of the blame for what has resulted? Here in NZ, yes. In your country, = probably also yes. >But when you have a well-designed organ (really, large or small) it's terribly exciting to see how each stop works on it's own and in relation to others. As an architect, I'm fascinated with small, efficient, and well-designed spaces. I'll always be impressed with large historic mansions and tall new sky-scrapers, but I suppose it's much the same for me as an organist. Exactly. To me, church musicians should read and study avidly in both architecture and acoustics, in the field as well as from books. >But when you get to the large fan-shaped "worshiptoriums" that are seemingly prevalent here in the U.S., it gets rather more difficult to deal with acoustics - if there are any. But that's not to say it hasn't been done. I've not experienced these, and I'm sure such places do engender very specific difficulties. >My original point was - and forgive me for straying - these large instruments are not always so much necessitated by ego and "keeping up with the Joneses" and greedy organists (although sometimes all of these play a part!) as they are by large rooms that are hard to fill with sound. Again, I'm sure that's true, and the skill of the consultant in specifying scaling, materials, voicing techniques etc. is terribly important, and = then the builder's ability to carry out those instructions. Mind you, that's = true for any organ in any building anywhere, of course. :-) Sorry to be so long-winded, folks. Do respond, noisily, to what I've = written in this and the other posting in response to Daniel: I've a thick skin! :-) Ross
(back) Subject: 2nd Mississippi Jewel From: "Randy Terry" <email@example.com> Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 13:43:29 -0700 The Methodist Church in New Albany Mississippi had a Kimball from the 30's = - 15 ranks. When I played this organ, I was shocked at the sound - it was broad, but the Octave was bright, and the Trumpet was not fat. I've never = played a large comprehensive Kimball, but I bet they are quite nice. I'm = not saying that I would be happy with the organ below, but add a Mixture and a = pedal reed, and it would be getting close! Oh, the strings were not scratchy, either, and the Geigen a dream... The Hohlflute (a Melodia in reality) and the great 4' Flute were the least successful. GREAT: 8' Diapason 8' Hohlflute 8' Gamba 4' Octave 4' Flute d'amour 8' Trumpet SWELL: 16' Liebelich Gedeckt (ext) 8' Geigen 8' Gedeckt 8' Salicional 8' Voix Celeste 4' Flute Harmonic 2' Flautino (ext) 8' Oboe 8' Vox Humana PEDAL: 16' Diapason (open wood) 16' Bourdon 16' Lieblich Gedeckt (sw) 8' Octave (ext) 8' Bass Flute (ext) 8' Gedeckt (sw) 8' Cello (swell Salicional) 4' Flute (ext) _________________________________________________________________ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee=AE Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3D3963
(back) Subject: Bach Erbarm dich From: "Stephen Williams" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 18:00:18 -0400 "John Seboldt" <email@example.com> wrote Thu, 02 Jun 2005 08:53:35: >I think the bigger question is whether the NBA's indication "manualiter" >for this piece is questionable or not. I have personally gravitated >toward doing it this way, with a nice 16-8-4 manual foundation So have I, absolutely, with manual(s) coupled to the pedal, creating a manuliter-sounding piece just the same. I agree that registering 16-8-(4) creates a haunting beauty, color, and warmth, without distorting the incredible harmonic progression, that is sort of vacant without the 16. = I'll have to wait to hear your recording when I go home this evening, and = thanks for that. Now about that tenor G-natural in the NBA's measure 11, I'm convinced it should be an F-sharp maybe from all the recordings I've heard with the F-sharp, as well as other editions with this "correction." Is = that what you play there, or as it is? Of course, I guess I'll find out later. Speaking of publisher goofs, there's a BIG one in the Toccata in E Major, (called Praeludium et Fuga in the NBA), Vol 6, p 50, m 225, beat 3, lh - should be an E instead of C-sharp, or you can just leave out the C-sharp altogether. Also a wonderful piece, bit longish first fugue, may or may = not be worth the extra sweat it takes to make the piece work . . dunno. Audiences love the opening couple of pages, tho. Now up to program #9, and today's unusual works I highly recommend a look through are: the ornamented chorale settings Christ lag in Todesbanden BWV 718, and Ein feste Burg BWV 720; as a set, Allein Gott in der Hoh BWV 716, 717, 715 (in that order); and the brilliant Allabreve in D Major BWV 587, = a wonderful postlude-type piece that's even worked as a grand wedding = closer! Incredible splash of color at the end. Another piece I absolutely adore is the Fugue in C minor BWV 575 (Vol 6, p. 26). Not easy, but worth the work = to experience the unbelievable spinning and weaving on this bizarre little subject. Again, not a bad tag at the end. Have a look! Stephen
(back) Subject: Exquisite New CD From: "N. Russotto" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 19:12:04 -0400 I was just given the Zarex recording of the Centennial Organ. It is=20 absolutely FABULOUS! Those of you who do not have it, get yourself a copy= =20 today! http://www.zarex.com NFR --=20 Nicholas F. Russotto Somers, Connecticut Organist, Holy Cross PNCC Enfield, Connecticut Moderator/Owner: Monarch of Music=20 http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/monarch_of_music/
(back) Subject: Re: Organ Literature Foundation...Still Alive, sorta...(X-Post) From: "M Fox" <email@example.com> Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 15:43:25 -0700 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Barone" <MBarone@MPR.ORG> > For your information, the Organ Literature Foundation is still > 'functional', insofar as they are selling present stock (at > discounts), though not obtaining any new materials. > > Needless to say, there is a lot of stock at hand. > > Contact them as per the usual: > >>The Organ Literature Foundation >>TEL 781-848-1388 >>45 Norfolk Rd >>Braintree MA 02184-5918 USA >>EMAIL Organlitfnd@juno.com And record collectors may want to know that all of the Organ Literature Foundation's inventory of organ LPs is now in the hands of Irvington Music 47575 SW Fluke Drive Gaston OR 97119 (503) 985-7335 http://www.irvmusic.com firstname.lastname@example.org Lots and lots of specialty stuff like Motette, Psallite, Priory, FY, = Rollin Smith's Repertoire Recording Society. Most of it is not yet catalogued, = but I think he'd be able to supply most stuff listed in recent Organ = Literature Foundation catalogs, undoubtedly at lower prices. MAF
(back) Subject: Re: St. Mary the Virgin From: "M Fox" <email@example.com> Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 14:32:21 -0700 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kenneth Potter" <firstname.lastname@example.org> >A number of comments have been made in the last couple of days about > St. Mary the Virgin, some of which are just not accurate. I sang in > the choir back in my student days, and being the organ nerd I was, I > did a lot of exploring etc. > The 32' euphone that someone mentioned came from a big auditorium > organ out in (I think I recall) Michigan. I think it was after > Harrison's time. It was a wonderful stop that sounded like a B-2 > bomber coming at you. I may never have hearder a louder 32' stop in my > life except for perhaps Notre Dame in Paris. Larry Trupiano removed > it and replaced it with a more useable Bombarde with wooden resonators > and a softer stopped 32. The euphone could never be used except for > final cadences of big pieces. Hoisting that euphone out of there must > have been impressive to watch. I miss it for it's extreme effect. It > was said at the time that the gallery couldn't support the new 32's and > the euphone too. I got to play St. Mary the Virgin once in about 1977. I remember that = McNeil Robinson was out of town and I was led to the instrument by a very = pleasant associate of his whose name I have completely forgotten (and who gave me a = 48-page booklet of the history of music at. St. Mary's that I treasure to this day). I remember that you had to clamber over benches and pews in the = loft to get down to the console, and it seemed like a rather perilous journey. And what I remember most vividly is that when I hit the tutti at the end of Langlais's Incantation for a Holy Day I involuntarily lifted hands and feet and shook my head wondering where so much power and brilliance could be coming from. (As I recall, there were nice Trompettes = in the Swell, no reeds on the Great, and some little guys on the Positif.) It = was just thrilling, right where thrilling almost crosses the border to devastating. The 32' reed was certainly support enough. What an = instrument. MAF
(back) Subject: Re: St Mary the Virgin From: "Stephen Best" <email@example.com> Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 20:40:00 -0400 What is a Casavant "flower pot"? Steve Best in Utica, NY David Baker wrote: > Having studied with McNeil Robinson at St. Mary's, I know that the > practice organ upstairs was a 10 - 15 rank Casavant flower pot; no > case for that, either.
(back) Subject: St. Mary the Virgin and Ernest White From: "David Scribner" <firstname.lastname@example.org> Date: Thu, 2 Jun 2005 20:25:40 -0500 Over the years there were a whole series of "studio" organs installed in the Parish House of St. Mary the Virgin. Someone on the list mentioned a "Casavant 'flower-pot'", whatever that might be. But prior to that Ernest White, who was the Director of Music at St. Mary the Virgin i had numerous "studio" organs in the Parish house, either in the Choir Room, which i gather was previously a gymnasium, or in his apartment. The earliest "recorded" organ was Aeolian-Skinner Opus 995 which was installed in his apartment on the top floor of the Parish house in 1939. originally a 2/9 that was enlarged to a 3/19. Ernest sold this organ to someone in London, Ontario, Canada for that person' apartment. This organ had a few more travels and additions and ended up in North Carolina. Supposedly this organ is still extant in Greensboro, NC. The next instrument was A/S Opus 1072 2/5 from 1945 that was installed in Ernest's Apartment. According to the "Aeolian/Skinner Opus List" edited by Sand Lawn and Allen Kinsey the entry reads: "Unit organ using old pipes supplied by Ernest White" The pipe work for this organ was the old Jardine ranks from the Chamber that still exists up over the "choir" in the church. As someone pointed out, it may have been Sebastian, this chamber is empty of any pipe work from the Jardine. 5 of the ranks went into this organ. I have no idea of the disposition of this one. The next came A/S opus 1080 from 1946 which was a 3/34 with the Swell divided into 2 boxes. This organ was in the Choir Room. In 1949 it was sold to Aeolian Hall in London, Ontario where it was damaged by fire. The next organ was by the Moller Company, Ernest had started a relationship with the Moller Company by that time. This organ dated from 1953 and was Moller Opus 8516, 3/39. this organ was installed in the Choir Room and originally started its life as as a 3 manual all exposed instrument that was built by the Moller Company for the 1952 AGO Convention. Following the Convention it was enlarged with the addition of two swell boxes, again a divided Swell, and installed in the Choir room of the Parish House. in 1956, which I think was the end of Ernest White's association with St. Mary's, the organ was sold to St. Paul and The Redeemer Church in Chicago where it was enlarged again and served there until some time last year. There is a possibility that the 1939 A/S was not the first of the "studio" organs that Ernest had at St. Mary's. The person that i got all of the above information from, who was associated with Ernest during these years, thinks that there might have been a WICKS unit organ installed in Ernest's Apartment but is not completely sure of that. This is probably more that some of you want to know about the history of organs at St. Mary The Virgin but I thought that some people would enjoy hearing about it. if anyone has any more information about some of these organs, especially the "supposedly" extant one in Greensboro i would appreciate getting that information to pass along to the friend, who was Ernest's associate, and gave me all of the above information. David